/tg/Station 13

So we've got mechs for mining, firefighting, medical care, combat, and honking but we don't really have one centered around construction and repair so let's fix that.
This particular mech would essentially be meant to repair those gaping holes that engineering is just too damn lazy to fix. The construction mech would be lightly armored (using it in combat would be kind of a joke really), move fairly fast, and have thrusters designed to allow it to operate in zero g and space. It would also feature a decent sized cargo hold. In addition, there'd be a few mountable tools unique to it.

The first would be a sort of multipurpose tool. Think of it as a full toolbelt. With this piece of equipment mounted you would be able to cycle between a welder, screwdriver, wirecutters, wrench, crowbar, and multitool.

The second piece of equipment would be a claw. Think of it as a more dexterious hydraulic clamp. With it you'd be able to load and unload items from your cargo hold. Having specific things in the cargo hold would also allow it to do special tasks as well. Glass, metal plates, rods, etc. would allow you to use the claw to build with them as you would if you were holding them with the benifit of being able to fit a shit ton of these things in your cargo hold. In addition, you could load certain pieces of equipment to perform more complex tasks. Loading a pipe dispenser in the hold for example, would allow you to place pipes instantly. Needless to say this would be much faster than dragging the pipe dispenser around, wrenching and unwrenching it and waiting for it to print off each individual pipe. You could also use it to slash at people for a decent amount of damage if you're backed into the corner or just really want to kill someone.

Jacough wrote:So we've got mechs for mining, firefighting, medical care, combat, and honking but we don't really have one centered around construction and repair so let's fix that.
This particular mech would essentially be meant to repair those gaping holes that engineering is just too damn lazy to fix. The construction mech would be lightly armored (using it in combat would be kind of a joke really), move fairly fast, and have thrusters designed to allow it to operate in zero g and space. It would also feature a decent sized cargo hold. In addition, there'd be a few mountable tools unique to it.

The first would be a sort of multipurpose tool. Think of it as a full toolbelt. With this piece of equipment mounted you would be able to cycle between a welder, screwdriver, wirecutters, wrench, crowbar, and multitool.

The second piece of equipment would be a claw. Think of it as a more dexterious hydraulic clamp. With it you'd be able to load and unload items from your cargo hold. Having specific things in the cargo hold would also allow it to do special tasks as well. Glass, metal plates, rods, etc. would allow you to use the claw to build with them as you would if you were holding them with the benifit of being able to fit a shit ton of these things in your cargo hold. In addition, you could load certain pieces of equipment to perform more complex tasks. Loading a pipe dispenser in the hold for example, would allow you to place pipes instantly. Needless to say this would be much faster than dragging the pipe dispenser around, wrenching and unwrenching it and waiting for it to print off each individual pipe. You could also use it to slash at people for a decent amount of damage if you're backed into the corner or just really want to kill someone.

What you're looking for is a ripley with RCD, Cable layer, and clamp.

I'd rather see it have just an RCD and pipe dispensers, as well as wires / tools to remove constructions.

cedarbridge wrote:

Jacough wrote:So we've got mechs for mining, firefighting, medical care, combat, and honking but we don't really have one centered around construction and repair so let's fix that.
This particular mech would essentially be meant to repair those gaping holes that engineering is just too damn lazy to fix. The construction mech would be lightly armored (using it in combat would be kind of a joke really), move fairly fast, and have thrusters designed to allow it to operate in zero g and space. It would also feature a decent sized cargo hold. In addition, there'd be a few mountable tools unique to it.

The first would be a sort of multipurpose tool. Think of it as a full toolbelt. With this piece of equipment mounted you would be able to cycle between a welder, screwdriver, wirecutters, wrench, crowbar, and multitool.

The second piece of equipment would be a claw. Think of it as a more dexterious hydraulic clamp. With it you'd be able to load and unload items from your cargo hold. Having specific things in the cargo hold would also allow it to do special tasks as well. Glass, metal plates, rods, etc. would allow you to use the claw to build with them as you would if you were holding them with the benifit of being able to fit a shit ton of these things in your cargo hold. In addition, you could load certain pieces of equipment to perform more complex tasks. Loading a pipe dispenser in the hold for example, would allow you to place pipes instantly. Needless to say this would be much faster than dragging the pipe dispenser around, wrenching and unwrenching it and waiting for it to print off each individual pipe. You could also use it to slash at people for a decent amount of damage if you're backed into the corner or just really want to kill someone.

What you're looking for is a ripley with RCD, Cable layer, and clamp.

The ripley is not fast moving. It's more or less a joke mech...

Think like an odysseus but for construction. Hell, it would be much, much less lethal than an odysseus because it can't launch plasma at people it doesn't like. Or maybe give it randomly stupidly lethal options...

This sounds pretty close to those construction pods that Goon(?) have or had. We actually have the sprites for them in our code still.

Sounds like a p cool idea, though.

Raven776 wrote: The ripley is not fast moving. It's more or less a joke mech...

It's not really intended to be, and I wish it was used more. It was already woefully underused before by most miners because it's just too slow for them, and with newmining and monster and shit it's even more crap. Definitely needs working on, but I imagine we'd just end up with a combat mech with a drill and ore storage.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with a combat mech with drill and ore storage...

Or just up the ante and make the ripley mine out larger areas. 5x1 or 3x3 would be neat. And higher brute resist in a vacuum, or more brute resist from goliath plates/more capacity for them?

cedarbridge wrote: What you're looking for is a ripley with RCD, Cable layer, and clamp.

What Raven and Fleure said basically sums up what I was thinking of when it comes to this mech. What I had in mind was sort of an Odysseus capable of maneuvering in space but with special equipment focused on extensive repairs (i.e. massive hull breaches) and construction. The idea of repairing a huge hull breach with a ripley just sounds painfully tedious.

Ripley:
-Mech RCD
-Cable Layer
-Mech jetpack (why is this not added yet? we've had three years to make the sprites for it)

I think it might be interesting to add actual round start mechs to the game if only for the novelty.

Aside from the obvious fact people will rush to it (restrict its access to the head of staff?), it would not be horribly unbalanced considering that Security now has access to a Ion Gun, a dedicated anti-mech weapon.

fleure wrote:
It's not really intended to be, and I wish it was used more. It was already woefully underused before by most miners because it's just too slow for them, and with newmining and monster and shit it's even more crap. Definitely needs working on, but I imagine we'd just end up with a combat mech with a drill and ore storage.

Ripley actually got a bit of a buff, as you can layer goliath plating on it similar to the miner's rig suit for added protection. Most mining mobs become a complete joke against a ripley with a drill and a couple goliath plates, as all you gotta do after fighting one is hop out and do quick repairs before hopping back in. A non-armored ripley should be able to take on a goliath and still have around >60% integrity.

Still agree with how underused they are, which is pretty sad considering they're actually not half bad with newmining.

Do autoscanners work inside of Ripleys?

Autoscanners work inside ripleys, yeah.

If you want to have a construction version of the ripley, give it an RCD that can lay floors/walls 3x1, like the mining ripley mines them out.

iyaerP wrote:If you want to have a construction version of the ripley, give it an RCD that can lay floors/walls 3x1, like the mining ripley mines them out.

>RIPLEY that can instantly wall off a hallway
yes please that would be extremely balanced

Violaceus wrote:lol, you can do it with regular RCD as well

You can construct multiple walls at once with an RCD? Neat, learned something new.

Make it chunky when walking around like a ripley, but able to move like a jetpack while in space.

Give it a special FORGE module that's like a super RCD. In addition to walls and floors it should be able to crank out machinery like air alarms, APC's, light fixtures, etc. as well as disposal pipes.

Some kind of arc manipulator attachment that can function as a welder, wrench, or crowbar.

EDIT: A GODDAMN WRECKING BALL. Hell yeah. Blows through a wall and any adjacent walls. Fuck walls.

It should be absolute garbage in combat. It's role is coming in to a totally wrecked/depressurized area of the station, rebuilding the bones and workings, then leaving the finishing details like running cables and atmos pipes to on-foot workers who have the manual dexterity to do that stuff.

Making an exosuit that can tear up/build up parts of the station have any kind of staying power in a fight is horrible balance, since you could potentially just wall off any threat to you and leave them until the cavalry arrives.

Likewise, making it able to do everything by itself means one guy in one of these things makes the whole rest of engineering/atmos useless. A team of one of these things and 2-3 other guys in hardsuits should be working together so that you blink and suddenly all that damage that mad bomber did is undone.

Having something like this available would cut down on a lot of "ITS FUCKED LETS GO" shuttle calls because there's a decent hole in some place and nobody can be assed to spend 45 minutes tearing down the walls to re-route the pipes and cables. As someone who plays engineer a lot I would say that's the worst part of repairing something THE RIGHT WAY: all the time you have to spend tearing so much shit apart to rebuild it.

Having an exo that could come in and do that shit for you while you make progress on the actual rebuild would be great.

Fuck I'd be happy if it was just a wrecking ball I could drive around to smash all these walls down that have all the burst pipes and severed wires under them. Having a bomb break pipes through walls and under the floor is the worst.

MrPerson I think said it would be easy to fix that...

Probably as simple as checking:
Did I destroy the turf?
If Yes
-Run checks on tile's contents
If no
-Ignore stuff on tile
Goto next item in loop.

I'm really tired of people complaining about this possibly being a combat mech... Everything can be a combat mech. Hell, even a Ripley can be a combat mech if you've got a spacelubed tile to stun someone long enough to drill them into oblivion (mech drill seems to bypass brute resistance. I told another miner to drill me to brag about my goliath plated hull armor. It fucked me up).

An odysseus has possibly the greatest kill potential of any mech, and even a honk can be used as a tool for destruction...

Should the construction mech be better than a Gygax? Not if you don't allow roboticists to strap weapons onto it. Just make a quick moving odysseus type mech for construction...

Why not make Ripleys faster and call it a day?

Edit: Or make other mechs as slow as a ripley

If we are really concerned a Roboticist is going to sneak in and slap on some Armour and Weapons to a construction mech, do what Mechwarrior does and assign Weapon and Armour slots to all mechs that dictate how much of each you can put on a mech.

For example, a Gygax could have two weapon slots and one armour slot. A Ripley would have zero weapon slots and one armour slot.

You could go further and add in Energy Weapon/ Ballistic Weapon/ Missile Weapon slots.

Raven776 wrote:I'm really tired of people complaining about this possibly being a combat mech...

...and I'm equally tired of people not seeing the crossover potential for neat things they add to be used in other ways.

It's not impossible to make something a terrible terrible choice for a fight by making it fragile, slow, and preventing different weapons or modifications from working on it.

Steelpoint wrote:If we are really concerned a Roboticist is going to sneak in and slap on some Armour and Weapons to a construction mech, do what Mechwarrior does and assign Weapon and Armour slots to all mechs that dictate how much of each you can put on a mech.

For example, a Gygax could have two weapon slots and one armour slot. A Ripley would have zero weapon slots and one armour slot.

You could go further and add in Energy Weapon/ Ballistic Weapon/ Missile Weapon slots.

Alternatively what Anon suggested could work if I'm reading what he said correctly

Make it chunky when walking around like a ripley, but able to move like a jetpack while in space.

While grounded it's pretty damn slow and not all that maneuverable. When it's in zero g environments or in space (Is there a way to check if something's on a space tile without being too costly?), it can move relatively fast. So basically unless it's attacking from space it'd be a joke combat wise. Unless it's attacking from somewhere outside the station or a breach inside the station (where it'd be easy to surround by guys in hardsuits), it's going to be a joke to take down.

I also like An0n3's idea of it being designed to repair more of the skeleton of the station to some degree. Going off what Anon suggested:
- It would be able to replace stuff an RCD wouldn't be able to replace (reinforced walls and reinforced windows)
- It's be able to remove destroyed pipes and floor tiles
- It wouldn't be able to replace air alarms and other electronics though
- It wouldn't be able to replace broken pipes (Maybe it can however, go into a "deployed" state that prevents it from doing anything but allows it to put a pipe and disposal dispenser next to it allowing people on foot to dispense that shit and lay it out?)
- If possible it can lob grenades that create temporary pockets of air and heat, allowing atmos techs

Bam, you've got a mech that can do major repairs but still leaves the more complex work like replacing pipes for atmos techs, engineers, etc. It'd essentially be a big advantage to engineering department but not a replacement for the guys on foot.

Raven776 wrote:I'm really tired of people complaining about this possibly being a combat mech...

Shit man it's been like four days

Not a fan of this.

A) We already have something like this with the Ripley + RCD + Cable + Clamp
B) Mechs a shit
C) We have a problem with robotics already being a superpower with a ridiculous amount of influence on the station already
D) Why the hell wouldn't we just buff engineers ability to actually repair the station instead, which might influence some of them to actually do their fucking jobs

Ergovisavi wrote:Not a fan of this.

A) We already have something like this with the Ripley + RCD + Cable + Clamp
B) Mechs a shit
C) We have a problem with robotics already being a superpower with a ridiculous amount of influence on the station already
D) Why the hell wouldn't we just buff engineers ability to actually repair the station instead, which might influence some of them to actually do their fucking jobs

Give me some kind of jackhammer that blows down walls so I can fix all those goddamn pipes and wires and I'd be just as happy.

Alternatively make it so pipes and wires don't break if the walls or floor tiles don't break.

Destruction should go

Machines on a tile -> wall panels on a tile -> wall on a tile -> floor tiles on a tile -> cables on a tile -> gas pipes on a tile -> disposal pipes on a tile -> floor plating on a tile -> girders on a tile

Instead it's just some random lottery of destruction where you see an R-wall standing there just fine, but all the pipes and cables under it are blown the fuck up and you need to tear it all down to fix it.

Then one of two things is likely to happen:

1) The engineers are such scrublords they don't even know that happens and don't know wiring/piping layouts in the first place, so they just put floors down and walls down again and say they're done.
2) The engineers who know what they're doing see this huge fucking mess, know it's going to take 45 minutes to tear everything apart and fix (because some asshole has already stolen the RCD), the guy who works here is probably already dead, and five minutes after you finish fixing all of this the shuttle is going to get called anyway...

...so you just put floors down and walls down again and say they're done.

If we had some way of tearing walls down that people weren't constantly trying to steal because >tater (like the RCD) or because >asshole (like the fire axe) that would allow us to expedite the slowest part of the repair process.

EDIT: make it piss poor at combat, like you have to press it against someone and you get a message that "so and so is lining up the jackhammer on so and so" before it actually hits them or blows a wall down so nobody will want to steal it for combat.

Actually no fuck that people will just use it with a stun prod. Just make it smash walls but be so unwieldly it only does like 10 brute damage and takes two hands to use and nobody will want to take it.

That's really important anything you add you have to make sure it's terrible as a weapon otherwise the people who want to hang out and fix the station will never get their hands on it.

Drills will take down walls.


But yeah, making it so pipes and shit dont get destroyed under walls should be a thing.
Probably should be considered a bug and fixed in this feature freeze.

Singulo also shouldn't rip anchored objects up either, that does apparently cause a shit ton of run times and weirdness, as well as making engineers go "fuck it"

You mean exo drills.

Fat fucking lot of good that does anyone in engineering.

The only time anyone in a yellow jumpsuit gets near a Ripley is when its trying to clamp us.

No, hand drills

Done!
https://github.com/tgstation/-tg-station/pull/6114

I forgot how 'fun' coding for ss13 is.

Coded a change and had no idea why it wasn't working.
Turns out theres two ways for explosions to be calculated....

Malkevin wrote:Done!
https://github.com/tgstation/-tg-station/pull/6114

I forgot how 'fun' coding for ss13 is.

Coded a change and had no idea why it wasn't working.
Turns out theres two ways for explosions to be calculated....

Seriously? If this works as described being an engineer or an atmos tech just got 1,000,000 times easier thank you man.

     .

Intigracy wrote:His fix isn't getting merged, but Razharas already fixed it in his explosion code rewrite that was already merged.

*cough* I fixed it first then Raz panicked and jammed in a different fix into his new explosion system to do a similar thing

It's the thought that counts.