make antags retain clumsiness as clown, and pacifism as pacifist

[imsxz]

maybe let clown revheads use flashes properly via snowflake but otherwise ehh.

pacifism speaks for itself. dont take it if you really care about winning as an antag for whatever reason. it's +2 quirk points and gets removed outright when you roll antag, meaning you might have extra quirks with no downside. not a huge deal but small advantages add up quickly. it's an opt-in debuff, there's also plenty of ways to work around it even if you're tryharding. i say this as someone who takes pacifism on a character regularly.

clown antags should retain clumsiness for some of the same reasons mentioned above. you can opt out of rolling clown as well via selecting other jobs or requesting a job ban if you really really hate clown antag, I did the same with curator because I kept getting curator antag. Clowns that get converted to antag still retain their clumsiness, it's not unbearable. It defeats the point of the role to take away their clumsiness when they roll roundstart antag.

[wesoda25]

FUCK FRIENDLY ANTAGS FUCK FUCK FUCK

also imsxz you’re actually stupid disable random job its not hard

[zxaber]

It would be nice if you could sorta have an antag trait list and a non-antag list also, since people might want to take pacifism for the memes without ruining their own antag rounds.

I suppose you could use it to sorta metagame if a person is antag by if they don't have their default trait list, but you could do the same if a person is in a role you know they'd never choose. And anyway, can't you do that at the moment with pacifism being removed? Does pacifism get removed if you're converted to antag (cult, revs), or just if you're a roundstart antag?

[Hathkar]

Pacifism is removed if you're a roundstart antag, or get converted to one.

[Dr_bee]

Fun fact, you can still murder the station like crazy as a pacifist, you just have to do so via indirect means. There really is no reason to remove the trait besides giving antags a lazy out and 2 free trait points.

[imsxz]

It would be nice if you could sorta have an antag trait list and a non-antag list also, since people might want to take pacifism for the memes without ruining their own antag rounds.

I suppose you could use it to sorta metagame if a person is antag by if they don't have their default trait list, but you could do the same if a person is in a role you know they'd never choose. And anyway, can't you do that at the moment with pacifism being removed? Does pacifism get removed if you're converted to antag (cult, revs), or just if you're a roundstart antag?

That's already how it works. Get a health HUD and examine someone that normally has pacifism, if they don't they're an antag(or just removed pacifism for whatever reason).

[imsxz]

FUCK FRIENDLY ANTAGS FUCK FUCK FUCK

also imsxz you’re actually stupid disable random job its not hard

I do have random jobs off, it gives you a random role regardless if you have on "return to lobby" and fail to get a job you wanted with antagonist.

[zxaber]

It would be nice if you could sorta have an antag trait list and a non-antag list also, since people might want to take pacifism for the memes without ruining their own antag rounds.

I suppose you could use it to sorta metagame if a person is antag by if they don't have their default trait list, but you could do the same if a person is in a role you know they'd never choose. And anyway, can't you do that at the moment with pacifism being removed? Does pacifism get removed if you're converted to antag (cult, revs), or just if you're a roundstart antag?

That's already how it works. Get a health HUD and examine someone that normally has pacifism, if they don't they're an antag(or just removed pacifism for whatever reason).

Alternatively, if Pacifism is removed upon conversion like Hathkar says, you could periodically examine someone who had pacifism before to see if you can still trust them during cult/revs. Though, I would guess that in practice, acting on that knowledge might grant you an audience with an admin.

The real question is why are traits even visible on a health monitor? Most of them have little bearing on anyone else and I would suspect almost no one decides how they're going to attack or interact with a person based on what traits the person has. Visible to ghosts is one thing, but why should anyone care that I took heavy sleeper?

[imsxz]

out of the scope of this thread. any reasons that antags shouldn't keep pacifism? kinda silly that they lose an opt-in debuff. Clown antag is a bit more questionable given you can random fill into it and might get cucked but I think it's a necessary evil to stop the wretched gunclown menace.

[PKPenguin321]

out of the scope of this thread. any reasons that antags shouldn't keep pacifism? kinda silly that they lose an opt-in debuff. Clown antag is a bit more questionable given you can random fill into it and might get cucked but I think it's a necessary evil to stop the wretched gunclown menace.

>want to play as a pacifist doctor
>turn on the pacifism trait and set doctor to high
>luck does not go my way and instead i get librarian
>i also keep the pacifism trait so now ive basically wasted a traitor roll on a job that cant do anything remotely traitorous
that is why antags should lose pacifism

[Dr_bee]

out of the scope of this thread. any reasons that antags shouldn't keep pacifism? kinda silly that they lose an opt-in debuff. Clown antag is a bit more questionable given you can random fill into it and might get cucked but I think it's a necessary evil to stop the wretched gunclown menace.

>want to play as a pacifist doctor
>turn on the pacifism trait and set doctor to high
>luck does not go my way and instead i get librarian
>i also keep the pacifism trait so now ive basically wasted a traitor roll on a job that cant do anything remotely traitorous
that is why antags should lose pacifism

Oh no, youll have to figure out how to do your objectives with CREATIVITY instead of just toolboxing your way to victory.

You can kill people as a pacifist, if you dont want to deal with pacifism dont take the trait.

[Fatal]

I'd say this would work well for traitors, but as long as they don't get given assassinate objectives along with it to balance it out

Sorta hard to see how people being converted to cult could still be pacifists though

[somerandomguy]

out of the scope of this thread. any reasons that antags shouldn't keep pacifism? kinda silly that they lose an opt-in debuff. Clown antag is a bit more questionable given you can random fill into it and might get cucked but I think it's a necessary evil to stop the wretched gunclown menace.

>want to play as a pacifist doctor
>turn on the pacifism trait and set doctor to high
>luck does not go my way and instead i get librarian
>i also keep the pacifism trait so now ive basically wasted a traitor roll on a job that cant do anything remotely traitorous
that is why antags should lose pacifism

Oh no, youll have to figure out how to do your objectives with CREATIVITY instead of just toolboxing your way to victory.

You can kill people as a pacifist, if you dont want to deal with pacifism dont take the trait.

>want pacifism as nonantag
>too bad you have to have it as antag too

[datorangebottle]

better idea.

quirks shouldn't show up on medical scanners.