What techwebs was supposed to be

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oranges
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What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby oranges » Sun Feb 23, 2020 7:42 pm #545273

There's no point to this thread I just wrote a big spiel about this in discord and I didn't want to lose it because I think people still didn't understand the goals of techwebs

[08:27] oranges: techwebs was fixing a more concrete issue that didn't really even have much to do with science at all
[08:28] oranges: which was we had very limited ways to gate content globally across all depts
[08:28] oranges: that is the exact issue that techwebs solves
[08:28] oranges: and combined with the protolathes
[08:28] oranges: it stopped science hogging all the late game stuff
[08:28] oranges: techweb was never designed to fix issues with the old RnD
[08:28] oranges: it was taking old RnD and fixing a bigger systematic issue
[08:28] oranges: that's part of why it was so controversial
[08:29] oranges: we basically eliminated a job slot
[08:31] oranges: it was setup such that it would be easy to allot every dept a percentage of the points budget
[08:31] oranges: because the whole point was to NOT have science drive the goddamn thing
08:31] oranges: it just never got finished because people were super toxic to the developer
[08:31] oranges: so now it's stuck in a weird place where the console is nominally in science but it supposed to be on dept head's pda's
[08:32] oranges: and depts are supposed to have their own sub trees and unlocks and progression
[08:34] oranges: it was supposed to be a two "points" system
one is the techweb points themselves, which flow in at a steady rate, allowing us to generate base assumptions about at what point N in a round a tech is available.

the second "points" system was supposed to be a series of experiements, that unlock specific goal nodes that open up a new branch of research
[08:34] oranges: each dept would have dept themed experiments



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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby XivilaiAnaxes » Sun Feb 23, 2020 10:51 pm #545344

Tbh that sounds pretty cool.

Rnd is either irrelevant because some guy speed runs the 50 billion research bomb or gets hamstrung because "you gotta research the mining gear!" Making departments responsible for their own gamer gear is a much better idea

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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby NoxVS » Sun Feb 23, 2020 11:31 pm #545357

This makes sense. Explains a lot of how awful science is. Science should just be killed off entirely and just distribute everything it has to offer between the other departments

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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby deedubya » Mon Feb 24, 2020 1:22 am #545380

I dunno. I think that techwebs, the ore silo, and departmental lathes were kind of shit in terms of making things overly convenient and and reducing interdepartmental cooperation. It doesn't help that it basically eliminated a decent job as well.

Sure, you had retards like fwoosh who would refuse to hand out shit to the crew and batoned anyone that tried to get past him, but I think it'd be fine today, with the focus going more towards MRP. You should have to get materials from cargo, you should have to get new toys from science, you should have to get upgrades from engineering or science.
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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby oranges » Mon Feb 24, 2020 7:01 am #545459

deedubya wrote:basically eliminated a decent job as well.
decent job
decent job
decent job
decent
decentdecentdecentdecent
decent
decent
decent
decent

:P :P :P :P :P :P :P

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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby deedubya » Mon Feb 24, 2020 7:37 am #545464

it was better than cookie clicker
Galatians 4:16 "Have I now become your enemy by telling you the truth?"
hey imma teegee admeme compliment me on my appearance here

flattering compliments people have given me:
Spoiler:
oranges wrote:honestly holy shit deedubs you're a dent head

wesoda25 wrote:deedub is one of the people that makes me wish i could block users on forums

IkeTG wrote:every post from deedubya is worrying behavior

Super Aggro Crag wrote:you're a poo head!!!!!

TheMythicGhost wrote:You're a moron, but that's really nothing new since you're Deedubya, and really at this point I'm just playing an instrument by speaking since your head is so goddamn empty these words are resonating as they pass through.

Lazengann wrote:What's interesting about deedubya is the guy has no reading skills or comprehension and his ADHD is so severe he can't read through a single thread but he shows up to argue anyway

annoyinggreencatgirl wrote:you really are almost superhumanly retarded dude, holy smokes.

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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby angelstarri » Mon Feb 24, 2020 7:42 am #545465

R&D was never good to begin with. Techwebs has been the most interactive science addition so far I really don't have a problem with it, especially now that we have several other ways of adding points to the techweb system such as using the EXPERIMENTOR or the use of research nanites.
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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby cacogen » Mon Feb 24, 2020 7:58 am #545470

Love doing R&D, upgrading things across the station with a BPED and collecting the good items as I go around. Feels broken, but it's fun. I usually repair and maintain the station after that. Maybe it feels broken because it's fun and easy? Because it's not gated behind a lot of tedium and clunky controls/UI like a lot of the job content? Waiting for research points to generate can take awhile, but you have things to build or upgrade or other jobs in science to do while you wait.

Putting R&D on head tablets is a stupid idea. It should be on a shared console where everybody in that department can access it. Probably a few airlocks away from the hall.
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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby Vekter » Mon Feb 24, 2020 6:34 pm #545575

This is effectively what I'm doing in my R&D rework but with points staying in, as I want to still gate exactly what can and can't be afforded with a certain amount of effort.
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Spoiler:
Reply PM from-REDACTED/(REDACTED): i tried to remove the bruises by changing her gender

PM: Bluespace->Delaron: Nobody wants a mime's asscheeks farting on their brig windows.

PM: REDACTED->HotelBravoLima: Oh come on, knowing that these are hostile aliens is metagaming

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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby PKPenguin321 » Mon Feb 24, 2020 8:38 pm #545615

oranges wrote:
deedubya wrote:basically eliminated a decent job as well.
decent job
decent job
decent job
decent
decentdecentdecentdecent
decent
decent
decent
decent

:P :P :P :P :P :P :P

^
throwback to the guide: https://pastebin.com/4k4v5R73
imagine not doing this and getting fired for being off-meta
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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby Vekter » Tue Feb 25, 2020 9:12 am #545804

PKPenguin321 wrote:throwback to the guide: https://pastebin.com/4k4v5R73
imagine not doing this and getting fired for being off-meta


This is legitimately why we stopped using tech nodes to begin with - there was a very specific set of items you could use to rush end tech and get everything on the list. This happens as well now but it's even more braindead because you just have to wait for enough points.

cacogen wrote:Putting R&D on head tablets is a stupid idea. It should be on a shared console where everybody in that department can access it. Probably a few airlocks away from the hall.


Por que no los dos? I see no problem with having both an NTOS app for it and having it on a console. The head of the department should have the ability to override and choose what they want to research, but the crew should be able to do so as well.

Tl;dr every department will have their own tech nodes where certain things will be required to unlock further progress, not everything will be available every round, you will have to make meaningful choices as to how you want to progress. Does Engineering supercharge the engine and sell back the extra power, or focus more on expanding the station or making things more efficient? Does Research pour effort into perfecting an insane super-soldier serum or developing high-end nanites? Does Cargo help Mining STRIKE THE EARTH or work on more efficient ways to move goods between departments?

I don't want R&D to be developed around the game. I want the game to be developed around R&D. Give people rewards for actually doing their job and they'll actually fucking do it.
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Spoiler:
Reply PM from-REDACTED/(REDACTED): i tried to remove the bruises by changing her gender

PM: Bluespace->Delaron: Nobody wants a mime's asscheeks farting on their brig windows.

PM: REDACTED->HotelBravoLima: Oh come on, knowing that these are hostile aliens is metagaming

[17:43] <Aranclanos> any other question ping me again
[17:43] <Vekter> Aranclanos for nicest coder 2015
[17:44] <Aranclanos> fuck you

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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby confused rock » Tue Feb 25, 2020 2:44 pm #545824

Not like most jobs aren’t a checklist.
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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby deedubya » Tue Feb 25, 2020 8:21 pm #545863

PKPenguin321 wrote:
oranges wrote:
deedubya wrote:basically eliminated a decent job as well.
decent job
decent job
decent job
decent
decentdecentdecentdecent
decent
decent
decent
decent

:P :P :P :P :P :P :P

^
throwback to the guide: https://pastebin.com/4k4v5R73
imagine not doing this and getting fired for being off-meta

Basically every job can be boiled down to a specific checklist once you're good enough at it, and we don't lynch other jobs for being off-meta.
Galatians 4:16 "Have I now become your enemy by telling you the truth?"
hey imma teegee admeme compliment me on my appearance here

flattering compliments people have given me:
Spoiler:
oranges wrote:honestly holy shit deedubs you're a dent head

wesoda25 wrote:deedub is one of the people that makes me wish i could block users on forums

IkeTG wrote:every post from deedubya is worrying behavior

Super Aggro Crag wrote:you're a poo head!!!!!

TheMythicGhost wrote:You're a moron, but that's really nothing new since you're Deedubya, and really at this point I'm just playing an instrument by speaking since your head is so goddamn empty these words are resonating as they pass through.

Lazengann wrote:What's interesting about deedubya is the guy has no reading skills or comprehension and his ADHD is so severe he can't read through a single thread but he shows up to argue anyway

annoyinggreencatgirl wrote:you really are almost superhumanly retarded dude, holy smokes.

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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby Tlaltecuhtli » Tue Feb 25, 2020 8:29 pm #545865

that guide isnt good, you get ultimate techs with ody healbeams

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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby PKPenguin321 » Tue Feb 25, 2020 9:07 pm #545877

deedubya wrote:
PKPenguin321 wrote:
oranges wrote:
deedubya wrote:basically eliminated a decent job as well.
decent job
decent job
decent job
decent
decentdecentdecentdecent
decent
decent
decent
decent

:P :P :P :P :P :P :P

^
throwback to the guide: https://pastebin.com/4k4v5R73
imagine not doing this and getting fired for being off-meta

Basically every job can be boiled down to a specific checklist once you're good enough at it, and we don't lynch other jobs for being off-meta.

aside from NTSL, what you said is not true. none of our other jobs have a pastebin that is the ONLY viable thing to do like old R&D had. link one to prove me wrong.
i play Lauser McMauligan. clown name is Cold-Ass Honkey
i have three other top secret characters as well.
tell the best admin how good he is
Spoiler:
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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby XDTM » Wed Feb 26, 2020 7:37 am #545978

PKPenguin321 wrote:
deedubya wrote:snip

aside from NTSL, what you said is not true. none of our other jobs have a pastebin that is the ONLY viable thing to do like old R&D had. link one to prove me wrong.

Virology tends to crystallize around the most effective healing symptoms with little variation, but that mostly means that it needs a rework as well.
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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby PKPenguin321 » Wed Feb 26, 2020 9:09 am #545993

XDTM wrote:
PKPenguin321 wrote:
deedubya wrote:snip

aside from NTSL, what you said is not true. none of our other jobs have a pastebin that is the ONLY viable thing to do like old R&D had. link one to prove me wrong.

Virology tends to crystallize around the most effective healing symptoms with little variation, but that mostly means that it needs a rework as well.

But it does in fact have variation
i play Lauser McMauligan. clown name is Cold-Ass Honkey
i have three other top secret characters as well.
tell the best admin how good he is
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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby cacogen » Wed Feb 26, 2020 2:57 pm #546056

Vekter wrote:Por que no los dos? I see no problem with having both an NTOS app for it and having it on a console. The head of the department should have the ability to override and choose what they want to research, but the crew should be able to do so as well.

Both wouldn't have the issues resulting from putting it in an object that belongs to one person (e.g. incompetence, loss, theft, death, disappearance, going AWOL, etc.)
technokek wrote:Cannot prove this so just belive me if when say this

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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby Cobby » Sat Feb 29, 2020 6:11 pm #546466

you would get beat up or at least moonlighted for not following duke's, it was pretty trash.
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Re: What techwebs was supposed to be

Postby CDranzer » Sun Mar 01, 2020 11:30 pm #546628

The closest thing science has to a "job" is upgrading borgs and pulling off a good toxin bomb, the latter being trivial if you know what you're doing, and the former being trivial even if you don't.
Everything else is Fuckabout territory.


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