/tg/Station 13

One that actually mines and one that fights fauna. The mining job can work for exploration better and still handle small fauna while the monster hunter ones take care of the big boys. Then we don't have to balance everything in Mining around combat only.

what stops me from going to kill fauna anyway when I don’t get the fauna killer roll

splitting job fixes nothing

How are you not gonna balance everything in monster hunters around combat?

Iatots wrote:How are you not gonna balance everything in monster hunters around combat?

could jus maake the basically miner a cargo tech with a pickaxe and keep hunters with the standard miner shit lol

its a bad idea either way we have the public mining dock could use that idk

Iatots wrote:How are you not gonna balance everything in monster hunters around combat?

The shaft miner currently has better gear then the captain.
This was okay, at a time when you would reliably get one piece of gear in a shift. This ceases to work when it is the same few people, getting multiple pieces of gear, consistently, and being consistently the most strong player in combat, back on the station.

Vekter wrote:One that actually mines and one that fights fauna. The mining job can work for exploration better and still handle small fauna while the monster hunter ones take care of the big boys. Then we don't have to balance everything in Mining around combat only.

I hate this idea because mining isn't fun

Edit: and by this I mean, it's like you mine to gain epic gamer gear that'll prevent you from dying like the jaunter to prevent chasms from gibbing you, the pocket fire extinguisher, jump boots, survival pens and stabilizing serums.

The whole reward in mining is to have a better chance at surviving the big bad megafauna

So if you split the rewarding aspect into a whole different job and just leave the boring monotonous chore aspect. You're creating Janitor levels of get fucked.

splitting mining is extremely dent head thinking my dude, Miners often provide minerals needed, cargo can literally print and buy the tools they need to gather more ore and there's the public mining area for literally anyone to mine and get ores with.

bad take that doesn’t get any better upon being regurgitated by someone new

split the game to "interesting" and "cookie clicker" ? i m all in for removing all the "cookie clicker" out of the game and keep the interesting part in so making megafauna spit ores when they die and removing click ore adventure is a better solution

Tlaltecuhtli wrote:split the game to "interesting" and "cookie clicker" ? i m all in for removing all the "cookie clicker" out of the game and keep the interesting part in so making megafauna spit ores when they die and removing click ore adventure is a better solution

The problem is that section of the game is becoming more and more seperated from the game.
When we still had asteroidmining, it was a natural extension of the game. Mechanics could easily translate from one section to another. An white suit you stole from EVA would have many of the same protections, and you could accidentally end up on mining when traveling through z-levels. Now it has become more distant through lavaland, and finally if you make the job of a shaft miner hunting monsters exclusively, rather then presumably mining, you'll have destroyed the job entirely

I mainly suggested it as a way to address how miners basically finish mining by the first 20 minutes and then fuck off for the rest of the round. I want to find a solution for this that isn't just "make you have to mine more".

Potential idea: heavily nerf the amount of minerals inside rock walls, and make the rarer ones not spawn there altogether.
Instead, place several 'underground veins' which are marked by one or multiple floortiles, upon which miners or cargo techs can build a mining extractor providing a steady trickle of that mineral (it could directly beam them through bluespace, or it could require to manually pick it up until an upgrade is researched).

Ideally the balance would incentivize trying to explore the surface to try and set up as many extractors as possible.

Miners would then pretty much turn into explorers/hunters. While they go looking for tendrils and bosses, they can mark mineral veins to exploit by using beacons, or set the drills up themselves if they want to give up some inventory space to carry the materials to make them.

That way, there is no mind-numbing mining job left to do, and miners are constantly if indirectly involved with the acquisition of minerals.

I can think of one easy way to encourage exploration and actually prevent miners from speedrunning fauna/tendrils.

Remove GPS signals from fauna and tendrils. This way you mine a lot of shit, while exploring, and you don't just rush the G A M E R L O O T

XDTM wrote:Potential idea: heavily nerf the amount of minerals inside rock walls, and make the rarer ones not spawn there altogether.
Instead, place several 'underground veins' which are marked by one or multiple floortiles, upon which miners or cargo techs can build a mining extractor providing a steady trickle of that mineral (it could directly beam them through bluespace, or it could require to manually pick it up until an upgrade is researched).

Ideally the balance would incentivize trying to explore the surface to try and set up as many extractors as possible.

Miners would then pretty much turn into explorers/hunters. While they go looking for tendrils and bosses, they can mark mineral veins to exploit by using beacons, or set the drills up themselves if they want to give up some inventory space to carry the materials to make them.

That way, there is no mind-numbing mining job left to do, and miners are constantly if indirectly involved with the acquisition of minerals.

I... actually like this idea. A lot. Holy shit, okay. Drop those mining extractors down, someone (probably the QM) gets notifications if they run dry. I could imagine it requiring you to bring shit back until you can upgrade it to bluespace.

I like mining fr ore and getting my job stolen by people who fuck off and get killed by megafauna roundstart make me sad. I'd really really appreciate if the megafauna fights got a different job so I can mining and hill more.

Jack7D1 wrote:I like mining fr ore and getting my job stolen by people who fuck off and get killed by megafauna roundstart make me sad. I'd really really appreciate if the megafauna fights got a different job so I can mining and hill more.

gamer i am generally curious

what about making rock go poof is fun!!!!

Shadowflame909 wrote:

Jack7D1 wrote:I like mining fr ore and getting my job stolen by people who fuck off and get killed by megafauna roundstart make me sad. I'd really really appreciate if the megafauna fights got a different job so I can mining and hill more.

gamer i am generally curious

what about making rock go poof is fun!!!!

minecraft came out before he was born he hasn't had the chance to enjoy rock go poof yet

It's relaxing frankly. It's nice to get the luxery bar and relax in your space bar with friends.

XDTM wrote:Potential idea: heavily nerf the amount of minerals inside rock walls, and make the rarer ones not spawn there altogether.
Instead, place several 'underground veins' which are marked by one or multiple floortiles, upon which miners or cargo techs can build a mining extractor providing a steady trickle of that mineral (it could directly beam them through bluespace, or it could require to manually pick it up until an upgrade is researched).

Ideally the balance would incentivize trying to explore the surface to try and set up as many extractors as possible.

Miners would then pretty much turn into explorers/hunters. While they go looking for tendrils and bosses, they can mark mineral veins to exploit by using beacons, or set the drills up themselves if they want to give up some inventory space to carry the materials to make them.

We can also shove the megafauna down a level on lavaland with the rarer resources. With the shuttle able to choose between upper level mining and lower level mining. This might even ensure less mining teamwipes.

Let cargo techs set up the drills, it'll give them extra stuff to do. It's not a whole job worth of content but it'll freshen up a different job

and we let robotics build those mechs to use those drills

you did remember that lavaland shall be kaiju fights only? remember?

Honestly there's a lot of real estate that could come from extractors on Lavaland's surface that beam stuff back to the station- you could expand it out to resources for chemistry, something to extract seeds to send up to botany, that sort of stuff.

there is no reason to split mining into 2 jobs, this will cause the actual new miner job to have nothing to do except do the most boring stuff in the game and the explorer to just treat rocks as barricades to shoot through to get to every target on the map

Fikou wrote:there is no reason to split mining into 2 jobs, this will cause the actual new miner job to have nothing to do except do the most boring stuff in the game and the explorer to just treat rocks as barricades to shoot through to get to every target on the map

Unless we give them new jobs, like setting up extractors. If we make a new job that has nothing to do, we can give them jobs to do

more extractor ideas:

you can turbo it for extra resources but it ll start spawning mobs around you "attracted by the noise" and you have to defend it
ashliggers get a pinpointer to it

>i like mining just for mining

you are in the minority sorry, asteroid was pretty dead and iirc stats say the staton on average gets more ore now than it did then.

making a miner job will generally just result in less ore unless the explorers can mine as well, fat chance if you nerf the ore too.

>remove gps signals / nerf ores / etc

nothing about this is going to stop people from killing mobs you are just going to get less ore, science directly interacting with mining through beaming up ores sounds cool though.

>miner gets better gear than the captain consistently!

yeah it does, and so do other jobs, most more consistently than the miner who has the chance of permadeath.

mechs, xenobio, genetics, atmos techs, botany, all pretty consistent and strategized powerhouses.

>mining is disconnected from the station

do you have a problem with space ruins too? what about the atmos techs hiding in maint ignoring the conflict of the round to focus on research?

what about this bothers you so much, that they appear out of nowhere with op shit? what about people who build mechs in the robotics maintenance area does that bother you too?

mining is really not that much different from existing jobs other than the fact that they frequently interact with the combat mechanics so they are pretty much automatically more robust than you. there’s a reason the most robust players are miners and continue to be robust even when not playing miner.

I hate Atmos techs who do fusion every round. It makes me sad because they make tons of radiation and burn all our oxygen :(

Removing GPS signals actually wouldn’t be a bad idea.

well we gotta do something

Mining won't stop being "GAMER GEAR" without said gear being harder to access. I actually liked Orange's pitch ages ago that mechs were for murdering ridiculously strong monsters.

What if -> Mechs get reworked to be more agile but at the same time a lot more fragile/vulnerable so they're balanced on station.
Mining Monsters get buffed to be basically unkillable on foot (I'm thinking bullet-hell style challenge)

Miners have to directly feed robotics if they want to get gamer gear
Mechs that get produced early will probably be looted by miners and wont kill all antags on station
Mechs get to be based more on pilot skill than "I am 1000hp Durand fear me!"

So basically, turn mining into factorio.

Let's do it.

icebox has a good idea for this, despite the flaws icemoon has.
the lower you go, the more dangerous it gets, but the better the ores become. more ores = more heals = more gamer loot.
the lowest level of icemoon has monsters that pose an actual threat if you're not careful. demonic watchers and ash drakes can actually fuck you up if you're not careful. compare that to lavaland, which, aside from megafauna, is only dangerous if you get chaingrabbed by like 3 goliaths.
tl;dr: make mining more dangerous or at least change it up if you don't like expert miners rushing ash drake armor 10 minutes in.

remanseptim wrote:the lowest level of icemoon has monsters that pose an actual threat if you're not careful. demonic watchers and ash drakes can actually fuck you up if you're not careful. compare that to lavaland, which, aside from megafauna, is only dangerous if you get chaingrabbed by like 3 goliaths

demonic watchers are easy to kill by just crushing them with PKC and dodging their lasers, ice whelps are easy to kite

Helios wrote:

Fikou wrote:there is no reason to split mining into 2 jobs, this will cause the actual new miner job to have nothing to do except do the most boring stuff in the game and the explorer to just treat rocks as barricades to shoot through to get to every target on the map

Unless we give them new jobs, like setting up extractors. If we make a new job that has nothing to do, we can give them jobs to do

not gonna lie, chief, "setting up extractors" doesn't sound like a fun job to do, especially if the megafauna hunters are still gonna be getting cool loot and stuff.

like, jimmy mchunter just dueled a goddamn dragon and turned its hide into armor, and meanwhile you're sitting there with your extractor on a vein going "boy, I hope those lads in the science department appreciate the materials I'm mining! their satisfaction is enough of a reward for me!".

nobody is going to do mining analogue of plumbing, ESPECIALLY when it doesn’t personally reward you with anything

chemists get grenades bath salts and other stupid shit, you commit a lot of time and you are rewarded for it, but what would extractor miners get?

oranges wrote:well we gotta do something

"But if you gotta do something, gotta do something
Believe in yourself, yourself, yourself! Hey!" Keiko Utoku - Cosmic Eternity

Flatulent wrote:nobody is going to do mining analogue of plumbing, ESPECIALLY when it doesn’t personally reward you with anything

chemists get grenades bath salts and other stupid shit, you commit a lot of time and you are rewarded for it, but what would extractor miners get?

this 100 times for every time someone tries to turn mining into coal miner simulator

have fun with your minimum wage paycheck and lung disease what invigorating gameplay

It's all a conspiracy, by effectively still leaving a "mining" job. The lavaland portion of it becomes a "This has no purpose to exist anymore, since we have now entirely separated it from the actual valuable to the station part. GUT IT NOW IT TAKES UP TOO MUCH CPU"

Because "your fun" on lavaland is valueless compared to Bar RP.