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Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 6:00 pm
by Jzoid
Don't you just love wasting half of the round getting implants, only to find out once it's done shuttle gets called?
This suggestion makes it so some implants (Surgery ones) such as Revival, Toolbelt arms, Nutrient Pumps, HUDS, all that good stuff stays on you the following round.
It'd be good for miners and you can have a safe time knowing your time didn't get wasted.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 6:16 pm
by calzilla1
Sounds like a good or a HOLY SHIT WHAT THE FUCK, TYRONE GET IT TOGETHER idea.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 6:48 pm
by Slettal
Bad idea, would lead to powrgaming every round to get implants
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 10:28 pm
by PKPenguin321
yeah, implants are only balanced by being super lategame.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 10:30 pm
by Saegrimr
nah
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 10:37 pm
by ShadowDimentio
Why do you powergaming faggots want things to carry over from rounds so badly? No. Stop.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 10:39 pm
by Gun Hog
I do not believe that this would be wise. Round persistance should only support harmless, silly things, like cat-sploding the CMO, or having Poly chant arcane languages from when the CE was culted.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 10:43 pm
by Saegrimr
There's a weird trend of turning SS13 more and more into an MMO.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 10:58 pm
by oranges
it's because the rounds don't last long enough for the high level content to be properly used like it was intended.
Possibly fixable but it would require a lot of hugboxing
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 3:16 am
by Dagdammit
I dunno about potent ones like revival and chem implants, but I'd support it for general utility things like toolset implants, nutrient pumps and Medical HUD on a couple conditions:
-It only carries over if you escape alive as non-antag. I like the idea of having a little more at stake to make you want to survive.
-It carries over for ONE round, if you want a carryover to the next better make a fresh one and install THAT. Call it maintenance.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 6:54 am
by Armhulen
this is grade a slippery slope material
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 1:01 pm
by Screemonster
okay so if my miner Pick Diggerson gets himself implanted and then escapes, for some reason next round my security officer Vlad Hunter is mysteriously tooled up with implants?
Or would the implants only carry on to the same character? What if Pick Diggerson joined sec next round? What if I randomname? What if I roll silicon?
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 3:07 pm
by Cobby
I think a better way to tackle this issue is to provide progression surgery tools that do their job faster so you can more easily implant others [since the biggest problem is the time revolving around doing the surgery], but still have to rely on someone else doing the surgery on you.
Maybe I'll get around to it :^)
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 3:25 pm
by Dagdammit
Armhulen wrote:this is grade a slippery slope material
I definitely think that this is... a direction in which we oughtta tread cautiously. For example, are there ways sec can check for integrated toolset implants before they permabrig someone?
Also, don't smuggler's satchels potentially do something along these lines?
Screemonster wrote:okay so if my miner Pick Diggerson gets himself implanted and then escapes, for some reason next round my security officer Vlad Hunter is mysteriously tooled up with implants?
Or would the implants only carry on to the same character? What if Pick Diggerson joined sec next round? What if I randomname? What if I roll silicon?
Good questions. My first thought is "you need to be same species." Second thought is that requiring you to keep the same char (at least in terms of major variables like species and name) does alter the balance, since someone can say "hey he got implanted last shift." Not sure I like how that latter scenario plays out rp-wise though.
In my head one notable upside to all this is that it gives post-R&D sci another thing to do that's of interest to station in general (and occupy a bored medbay). Wellll no, actually the major upside in my head is that it should significantly improve the number of interested responses when a medbay or sci traitor says "WHO WANTS WELDING SHIELD IMPLANTS", providing a nifty stock of victims for inventive surprise cavity implants or what have you.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 3:29 pm
by Okand37
Health analyzers can be used to detect cybernetic implants and augmentations, generally.
I don't really like the idea of anything being round consistent besides minor, non gameplay effective things or secret satchels/blackbox. I'd rather see surgery tools be able to be researched from RnD that can do surgery faster, maybe.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 4:39 pm
by Gun Hog
Screemonster wrote:okay so if my miner Pick Diggerson gets himself implanted and then escapes, for some reason next round my security officer Vlad Hunter is mysteriously tooled up with implants?
Or would the implants only carry on to the same character? What if Pick Diggerson joined sec next round? What if I randomname? What if I roll silicon?
If I were to code this, I would have it work like this:
- Injected implants are not kept, only cybernetic organs (the ones that require surgery to implant)
- Cybernetic organs carry over only to the same character. They will be indicated on your character page. If you edit the character, you risk losing the implants (for bug fixing reasons)
- If you roll silicon or anything not humanoid, your cybernetic organs will be saved for your next humanoid round.
- You must escape alive (pod or shuttle), in the same body, to keep your cybernetic organs.
- You would be limited somehow, so you are not Adam Jensen at roundstart.
I do not think it is a good idea, but that is how I think it should work if it were made.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 4:21 am
by kevinz000
or you can get good so you don't get them in ONLY when the shuttle gets called :^)
and yeah this'll never get past the "science-balance review board" gg
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 4:45 am
by Kel-the-Oblivious
First, we need more implants for all parts of the body, and upgraded augment parts. Let people go full MEC from X-Com.
Second, make the implants you are mentioning MUCH easier to make. Just glass and metal for things like nutrient pumps, toolset arms, simple eye implants. Make it so you can potentially get these minor buffs with only a little bit of work right off the bat. Maybe add an "Exotic" resource or two, like giving Nutrient pumps a chemical cost of... Nutriment. Not that hard to get real quick. Make the "Hard" to get implants, which are still frankly pretty lack luster (Oh, you got X-Ray implants? Well, the geneticist found that 20 minutes ago and has been handing it out like candy) a bit easier to make, and get a third tier of REALLY good implants that are have a 6-7 tech level requirement, and are pretty damn good.
Also, make an auto implanter table a thing. An upgraded, hard to make, and manually operated table that you feed implants or augments to, and then tell it where to put them from a linked console. Still needs two people to operate, but cuts a ton of the grind out of implanting/augmenting, and is a good reward for high level research.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 8:05 am
by kevinz000
Kel-the-Oblivious wrote:First, we need more implants for all parts of the body, and upgraded augment parts. Let people go full MEC from X-Com.
Second, make the implants you are mentioning MUCH easier to make. Just glass and metal for things like nutrient pumps, toolset arms, simple eye implants. Make it so you can potentially get these minor buffs with only a little bit of work right off the bat. Maybe add an "Exotic" resource or two, like giving Nutrient pumps a chemical cost of... Nutriment. Not that hard to get real quick. Make the "Hard" to get implants, which are still frankly pretty lack luster (Oh, you got X-Ray implants? Well, the geneticist found that 20 minutes ago and has been handing it out like candy) a bit easier to make, and get a third tier of REALLY good implants that are have a 6-7 tech level requirement, and are pretty damn good.
Also, make an auto implanter table a thing. An upgraded, hard to make, and manually operated table that you feed implants or augments to, and then tell it where to put them from a linked console. Still needs two people to operate, but cuts a ton of the grind out of implanting/augmenting, and is a good reward for high level research.
as much as i like everything science you're really overestimating how powerful implants can be versed against genetics.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2016 3:27 am
by Dagdammit
Hey, is there any guide breaking down implant functions, i.e. of Nutrient Pump vs. Nutrient Pump Plus? Or should I just start looking through github? Would like to make a list of the implants that are more "enjoyable minor convenience" than "significant player power increase".
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2016 7:09 am
by Ezel
Why did we add surgery time again
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2016 1:54 pm
by Gun Hog
Dagdammit wrote:Hey, is there any guide breaking down implant functions, i.e. of Nutrient Pump vs. Nutrient Pump Plus? Or should I just start looking through github? Would like to make a list of the implants that are more "enjoyable minor convenience" than "significant player power increase".
Welding Shield
- Welder and flash protection.
Breathing Tube
- No mask required for internals, will not take oxygen damage from chokeholds.
Toolset Arm
- Powered borg tools you can activate in your hand. They are NODROP, just like the borg module.
Medical HUD
- Medical HUD eye implant.
Security HUD
- Security HUD eye implant. You cannot have both HUD implants at the same time. (But you can wear the HUD glasses)
X-Ray implant
- Gives you x-ray vision. (For best results, wear something with night vision) You cannot have Xray and thermal implants at the same time. (But you can have a HUD and shield)
Thermals implant
- Gives you thermal vision (See mobs through walls + night vision).
CNS Rebooter
- Caps the maximum duration of weakened and stunned statuses to two 'BYOND seconds' (The long game ticks that take longer than normal seconds)
Anti-Drop
- Applies NODROP to held items, meaning they are not removed when you are stunned, stripped, or disarmed.
Nutriment pump
- Injects nutriment when you begin to enter "starving" status, preventing the slowdown from starvation.
Nutriment pump PLUS
- Same as normal pump, except it injects right before you get the "hungry" alert instead of "starving". The difference is insignificant.
Reviver
- Slowly attempts to heal you if you fall unconscious (including crit). It heals oxygen loss very well, not so well on brute/burn, and slowest on toxins.
Thrusters set
- Implanted jetpack. If you are using it indoors (zero gravity), it will run off the surrounding air. If you are in space, it will use your internals (watch your tank carefully!). Special note: If you are a Xeno hybrid, you can also use your internal plasma as fuel.
Most of these implants have a weakness to EMP. What is harmless to other humans will crippling or even fatal to you.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2016 3:41 pm
by Professor Hangar
Well, going with the precedent of Smuggler's Satchels, make em limited; you gotta escape alive on the shuttle as a non-antag; they have to be surgical implants, not injected; and even then there's only a random chance of retaining them. And things like X-Ray implants and even thermals and revivers may be a bit much.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2016 4:39 pm
by Dagdammit
Gun Hog wrote:Welding Shield
- Welder and flash protection.
Breathing Tube
- No mask required for internals, will not take oxygen damage from chokeholds.
Toolset Arm
- Powered borg tools you can activate in your hand. They are NODROP, just like the borg module.
Medical HUD
- Medical HUD eye implant.
Security HUD
- Security HUD eye implant. You cannot have both HUD implants at the same time. (But you can wear the HUD glasses)
Nutriment pump
- Injects nutriment when you begin to enter "starving" status, preventing the slowdown from starvation.
Nutriment pump PLUS
- Same as normal pump, except it injects right before you get the "hungry" alert instead of "starving". The difference is insignificant.
Most of these implants have a weakness to EMP. What is harmless to other humans will crippling or even fatal to you.
I propose it carry over for these implants. (possibly not sec hud if there's a scenario where that's unbalanced, don't use it enough to say)
What's the current easiest solution(s) if the warden knows someone headed for permabrig has the toolset arm implant?
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2016 5:16 pm
by Ezel
Cut his arms off
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2016 5:34 pm
by lzimann
Between rounds persistance is not good imo, we already have more than enough of these.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2016 5:34 pm
by Cobby
Persistence is a dumb meme, the only good persistence features are poly, bags, and medals [which no one uses except that one guy who supposedly metagrudged some other guy because they weren't as high as them on the leaderboards or something stupid]
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2016 6:25 pm
by Aloraydrel
Can we not have more memey persistence stuff please?
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 9:55 pm
by Slignerd
ExcessiveCobblestone wrote:I think a better way to tackle this issue is to provide progression surgery tools that do their job faster so you can more easily implant others [since the biggest problem is the time revolving around doing the surgery], but still have to rely on someone else doing the surgery on you.
Maybe I'll get around to it :^)
Just add nuke op autoimplanter as a printable thing tbh.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 10:04 pm
by PKPenguin321
never ever. part of the reason behind them getting in was that they wouldnt get added to science
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 10:06 pm
by Cobby
have no fear, my upgradable surgery tool PR is coming soon [tm] so you will no longer fear about wasting half your round on a surgery table.
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2016 8:07 pm
by Atticat
Aloraydrel wrote:Can we not have more memey persistence stuff please?
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2016 11:05 pm
by Dagdammit
lzimann wrote:Between rounds persistance is not good imo, we already have more than enough of these.
What do we have besides smuggler's satchels? Library books and Poly?
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2016 11:50 pm
by PKPenguin321
Dagdammit wrote:lzimann wrote:Between rounds persistance is not good imo, we already have more than enough of these.
What do we have besides smuggler's satchels? Library books and Poly?
slippery slope in action
Re: Some implants stay with you on the following round
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2016 11:53 pm
by Armhulen
Armhulen wrote:this is grade a slippery slope material