On the subject of assistants.

[Cobraman202]

On many occasion when joining a game mid round, I am often greeted by a job select screen where many jobs that are important to the station, such as doctors or scientists, number just one or two, if any, even though the server has 60+ people on it, while assistants are often above 15 people. I would recommend putting a cap on assistants, so that other jobs get more people.

[Bluespace]

YOU'RE TOO LATE FRIEND!

[ShadowDimentio]

Yes how dare those players opt to have unrestrained fun as an assistant than be tied to a job and it's responsibilities when they don't want to

Remove fun 2k15, we seriousstation now

[LiamLime]

Medical doctor is an assistant tier job, personally I think it shouldn't be capped to begin with. Scientist is the special snowflake job where each person has dominion over the whole of the science department, not any one specific lab.

So with scientists, you can have one player who gets everything done, or the whole job cap used up and nothing getting done. Medical doctors are mechanically useless, so their count doesn't matter.

I however understand your point. I do wonder if what you propose would have the desired effect though. I mean sure, initially there would be outcry and people would select valuable jobs instead to "prove the point" that the restriction is removing valuable jobs from getting done - or whatever. But eventually things would settle down. I however wonder whether the players who currently play assistant would either suddenly become useful crew members, or whether they would opt not to play on rounds when assistant is taken, or whether the "rebellion state" would continue indefinitely, where people would select the more valuable jobs and then fuck around even after the "change rebellion" stage passed, with that becoming the norm and expectation.

I think what I'm saying is...

Spoiler:

BRING BACK TOURIST JOB

Also, personally I really don't think your suggestion would solve the problem you presented.

[PKPenguin321]

assistants did have a cap for a while and it was pretty shitty
id rather not see it back

[Cheimon]

assistants did have a cap for a while and it was pretty great
id love to see itback

[oranges]

this just puts the people who would normally take an assistant job and fuck around into another job where suprise, they precede to fuck around, except now with more access.

[Steelpoint]

oranges has it, if people want to fuck around they'll fuck around, though usually people who want to fuck around play as Assistant, remove that and they'll just fuck around in whatever role they were forced into.

[Saegrimr]

Since the OP suggestion was already tried and removed, lets move on to other uses for assistants.

Someone mentioned an engine powered by the blood of assistants in the "things to port" thread.

[Incomptinence]

Allow security to hunt assistants for meat.

Use every part of the animal.

[TheNightingale]

Jobban anyone who messes around as assistant. It's not an important job anyway - like how you'd droneban a drone for something minor, assistantban an assistant for being bad.

Problem solved, now we only have helpful assistants that actually assist!

[LiamLime]

I think it was Urist who talked about making a monkey powered engine, where monkeys ran on treadmills or in hamster wheels. Replace with assistants and you have a use for the little buggers.

[Oldman Robustin]

Assistants being useless assholes is the lifeblood of SS13.

I would like to see more "perks" for taking a "serious" job though, right now useful progression in a job is limited to science and genetics/viro.

[DrPillzRedux]

Rename assistants to tourists with cameras and flower shirts. Make them get the clowns clumsyness thing so they can't vigilante.

[Drynwyn]

Rename assistants to tourists with cameras and flower shirts. Make them get the clowns clumsyness thing so they can't vigilante.

if you can't vigilante with clumsyness you won't accomplish anything as a vigilante anyway

[MMMiracles]

Make jobs have actual benefits corresponding to their position so they'd be more efficient than the standard assistant with a toolbelt and medkit.

Engineers build/deconstruct faster
Doctors heal more effectively/get more uses out of patches.
Miners are more rugged in general so maybe a slight brute resistance and/or melee damage output (working in a hardsuit swinging a pick for a living makes you SWOLE)
Bartender is much harder to get intoxicated and takes less toxin-based damage (liver of steel)
Botanists have a natural green thumb and are more likely to get more out of a harvest

Shit like that doesn't nullify an assistant's ability to become some sort of jack-of-all-trades, but it becomes more appealing to take an actual job that should be innately better at something than the grayshirt.

Also yes add tourists with hawaiian t-shirts and cameras with guest IDs (no access). Give service an excuse to actually prepare large amounts of food for something other than sitting on a counter to be slowly eaten away by the crew.

inb4powergaymrs ruin everything

[Cheimon]

The advantage jobs get is the proper access to all their gear. The idea that any person, properly equipped, can do a job as well as anyone else is generally a good one. What differs is that you expect an engineer to know how to set up the engine, a doctor to know their medicines, that sort of thing. They also get the advantage that, having that job, people trust them to know it. Normally. Doctors are a bit of an exception given how slow many of them seem to be.

There are a couple of job specific things though, like how bartender can't spill drinks, the mime can't talk, the clown is clumsy, that sort of thing.

[MMMiracles]

Exactly the problem, the only difference between any job and an assistant right now is the determination of the assistant and their uniform.

I'm not suggesting that others become less effective at doing a job, just that those who round start into that should have some sort of innate benefit over the average assistant, because there currently isn't.

[Scones]

role based stats are bad for ss13

[LiamLime]

role based stats are bad for ss13

I remember a heated thread on one of the old forums. A suggestion was made to create an ingame "character sheet" type interface, which could help players specify their characters more. Some sections included tool familiarity, including tools the person doesn't know how to use IC. This was a purely fluff thing, aimed at promoting roleplay, but some people mistook it as an attempt at making people in various jobs do these jobs faster, or making things like medical doctor unable to construct, etc. Long story short, a heated thread later, the idea was dropped even at that level.

[PKPenguin321]

assistants did have a cap for a while and it was pretty great
id love to see itback

fuk u

[lumipharon]

Just remove maint access from assistants (and sec officers) again. Shit was great, maint was actually quiet, as opposed to the most readily accessible parts of the station that had an sort of restrictions on them.

If people want to fuck around and do nothing, that's ok, but they don't need maint access that the majority of the crew don't have, for that (and it's only a hop line away anyway).

[Zilenan91]

I wouldn't mind removing assistant maint. They really don't need it since assistants don't do anything.


Sec maint is needed though.

[Cheimon]

assistants did have a cap for a while and it was pretty great
id love to see itback

fuk u

no u

[oranges]

I wouldn't mind removing assistant maint. They really don't need it since assistants don't do anything.


Sec maint is needed though.

FUCK YOU

[ShadowDimentio]

I wouldn't mind removing assistant maint. They really don't need it since assistants don't do anything.


Sec maint is needed though.

FUCK YOU

[Incomptinence]

Assistants should keep their freedom and access but their superiors should have in game allowance to randomly cull them. Just like kangaroos.

[invisty]

Spawn all assistants as non-human races and let them roll for antag. Force random identities on all of them, too.

[PKPenguin321]

Spawn all assistants as non-human races and let them roll for antag. Force random identities on all of them, too.

or you could just identityban greytiders for being shit, so that the people who play assistant when they're tired of playing vital high-maintenance roles every round can take a break now and then. it's a responsibility-less role that gives people like me the ability to have a chance to play the game without having to worry about getting shot by nuke ops or making sure the singulo doesn't get loose now and then.

if the problem is greytiders, ban the greytiders. it's not hard

[TheWulfe]

I have no problem with a role being no pressure for those who want relax.

A big problem, however, are that the majority of assistants don't pick assistant for that function. A large chunk of Munchkin players are just career assistants for the free antag roll while contributing nothing to the station/server for the benefit of other players, a la a massive 'fuck you' to anyone but themselves.

If we're going to make assistants the fuck around role, remove their maint access to make it less viable as the powergaming choice so we can make it as intended.

[ShadowDimentio]

I have no problem with a role being no pressure for those who want relax.

A big problem, however, are that the majority of assistants don't pick assistant for that function. A large chunk of Munchkin players are just career assistants for the free antag roll while contributing nothing to the station/server for the benefit of other players, a la a massive 'fuck you' to anyone but themselves.

If we're going to make assistants the fuck around role, remove their maint access to make it less viable as the powergaming choice so we can make it as intended.

What the fuck are you talking about? Removing maint access from assistants wouldn't do shit. It's handed out like candy from every competent HoP.

Also who cares if assistants don't do anything. Other players aren't here for you, they're here for THEM.

[Konork]

Also who cares if assistants don't do anything. Other players aren't here for you, they're here for THEM.

The problem isn't the people that pick assistant to not have resposibilities, it's the people who pick assistant and think they deserve anything besides whatever they get at roundstart

[DrPillzRedux]

Removing maint from assistants was already done once. Let's not repeat that mistake.

[Atticat]

Jobban anyone who messes around as assistant. It's not an important job anyway - like how you'd droneban a drone for something minor, assistantban an assistant for being bad.

Problem solved, now we only have helpful assistants that actually assist!

I was under the impression the majority of drone bans comes from violating their silicon laws that (are supposed to) govern their behavior. Assistants aren't held to this because they aren't programmed, they're humans; also drones can enter the round with OOC knowledge gained from ghosting, which is pretty major imo.

[TheNightingale]

Drones who metaknowledge things get real-banned as well, I think. But you make a good point...
... so let's give Assistants laws.

Wait, don't they already get a "You are the Assistant! Your job is to assist people, your supervisors are literally everyone"? Make that like silicon laws - they break it and bad things happen.

[Incomptinence]

Assistants will just group together and start ordering each other to grey tide.

[MMMiracles]

Assistants will just group together and start ordering each other to grey tide.

The tide moves as one solid hivemind, destroying all in it's wake under a common goal of griff.

[Not-Dorsidarf]

I like the idea that assistants have to be lizard people

I like the idea of assistants being capped and having an uncapped Tourist job funnier.

[Cheimon]

It would certainly give a more realistic idea of the expectations in the role. And it fits the setting, too: why wouldn't Nanotrasen show off their premier research and technology station to outsiders?

[rdght91]

What about departmental-assigned assistants? Because we've nerfed all the insta-stun-silence->c4 stuff for the traitors, people don't really fear being alone in a workstation with one other person who didn't also start as a full member of the department like the game used to be. And Heads now can easily promote the more competent/hardworking assistants assigned to their department or kick out the shit ones.

[Steelpoint]

>departmental assistants

I think any real code base that ever tried that in short order reverted that since ultimately you are just giving a Assistant higher access from round start, or making the primary job redundant as someone with no obligations can take your stuff and do whatever.

[ShadowDimentio]

Assistants are the element of chaos that exists to spice things up when the wizard is being friendly or the lings are too afraid to bump anyone because their skills are shit and they'd die.

And that job they perform very well. Assistants are either some of the least robust or most robust players. The greytide is a force to be reckoned with.

Attempting to remove them is shit. Forcing them to do things will only result in you getting tabled and disposal'd. Stop.

[Screemonster]

>departmental assistants

I think any real code base that ever tried that in short order reverted that since ultimately you are just giving a Assistant higher access from round start, or making the primary job redundant as someone with no obligations can take your stuff and do whatever.

Bay has them as alternative job titles you can pick. No extra access, but you get to be a "medical intern" and go and assist medbay or whatever.