ERP unbanning 3: Oh God It's Still Happening

bandit · Post by **bandit** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 5:27 am #135352

So as everyone warned everyone else would happen, the minute ERP was unbanned the same three fucking lizards started to fuck every goddamn round, having to be muted, singularitied or otherwise taken care of, wasting admins' time and annoying the shit out of everyone who doesn't want to be in the middle of three people's extended gay furry cybersex session.

I feel that this needs to be revisited, and for good this time.

Zilenan91 · Post by **Zilenan91** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 5:35 am #135354

They're still doing it? Also how is it a bad thing, they just get gibbed and it's over. It's not really a waste of time if it takes 2 seconds.

Also they hardly do it every round

Lovecraft · Post by **Lovecraft** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 8:53 am #135387

How can one community be so undecided on something?
Either allow and encourage it's consequences or disallow it and ban it on sight. The fact that this has been a reoccurring story for years finally allowed me to see how stupid this is.

InsaneHyena · Post by **InsaneHyena** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 9:03 am #135389

Ban ERP, ban Salts, remove lizard race. It will only do good.

Grazyn · Post by **Grazyn** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 9:50 am #135395

Lovecraft wrote:How can one community be so undecided on something?
Either allow and encourage it's consequences or disallow it and ban it on sight. The fact that this has been a reoccurring story for years finally allowed me to see how stupid this is.

There is a vocal minority against erp. The vast majority of the playerbase support it, as shown by the forum polls, in game polls, and even singulo strawpolls. If admins don't like it they can ban it but they shouldn't make it like it's some sort of controversial issue that splits the playerbase.

imblyings · Post by **imblyings** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 9:57 am #135399

>wasting admin time
>people who already choose to spend their time adminning a 2d spessmen game

ha good one

Void Slayer · Post by **Void Slayer** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 9:58 am #135400

Was ERP a problem before these three lizards? If not we might have found the real issue.

Or just ban it I do not really care, but I guess most people who support ERP might be for removing those who abuse it so much it gets banned.

A very tailored and well crafted rule like "Stop fucking every god damn round or you'll eat a rule 1 ban, assholes."

firecage · Post by **firecage** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 11:54 am #135422

Void, rule 0, not rule 1.

Bluespace · Post by **Bluespace** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 12:08 pm #135423

Have you considered these people are ERP'ing because of the reaction it gets.
Validsalad them.

TheNightingale · Sun Nov 22, 2015 12:57 pm

Drop an ERP ban on them. Problem solved.

bandit · Post by **bandit** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 1:14 pm #135432

because validsalading people has ever discouraged behavior

see: woody got wood, ian killing, etc

Post by **MMMiracles** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 2:01 pm #135438

Emote bans were added not long ago.

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 2:55 pm #135440

excuse the reaction image from a terrible anime, but i told you guys that unbanning ERP would just start the cycle of shit anew, even if you turn it into free game for admins

bandit · Post by **bandit** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 3:32 pm #135442

ERP bans are only useful if they are ever used, otherwise the cancer of the rotating cast of interchangeable lizard metawhores will metastasize

tedward1337 · Post by **tedward1337** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 4:03 pm #135445

imblyings wrote:>wasting admin time
>people who already choose to spend their time adminning a 2d spessmen game

ha good one

kek

Cheimon · Post by **Cheimon** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 4:08 pm #135447

If people are just doing it to get attention, have you considered not bothering to give them that attention? Let the players sort it out, I don't give a shit if two people are going for it in the dorms and admins aren't obliged to come up with interesting ways to kill them either.

Scones · Post by **Scones** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 4:17 pm #135449

You've made your bed, now lie in it.

DemonFiren · Post by **DemonFiren** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 5:06 pm #135451

Rare that I agree with Scones, but Scones has it right.

Jacough · Post by **Jacough** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 6:56 pm #135459

bandit wrote:So as everyone warned everyone else would happen, the minute ERP was unbanned the same three fucking lizards started to fuck every goddamn round, having to be muted, singularitied or otherwise taken care of, wasting admins' time and annoying the shit out of everyone who doesn't want to be in the middle of three people's extended gay furry cybersex session.

I feel that this needs to be revisited, and for good this time.

Rule 0 ban them and tell them to take their furfaggotry elsewhere.

It's really that simple.

DemonFiren · Post by **DemonFiren** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 7:04 pm #135462

Scalefaggotry, technically, be correct.

ShadowDimentio · Sun Nov 22, 2015 7:52 pm

bandit wrote:So as everyone warned everyone else would happen, the minute ERP was unbanned the same three fucking lizards started to fuck every goddamn round, having to be muted, singularitied or otherwise taken care of, wasting admins' time and annoying the shit out of everyone who doesn't want to be in the middle of three people's extended gay furry cybersex session.

I feel that this needs to be revisited, and for good this time.

Question one: Why do you care

Question two: Why are you so assblasted about it

Question three: Why can't you bring yourself to look away

People trying to get ERP banned always go through the same three fucking points and expect the argument to just resolve itself. Stop bitching and accept it.

Scones · Post by **Scones** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 7:55 pm #135474

But don't call it a grave.

It's the future you chose.

Cik · Post by **Cik** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 8:51 pm #135487

i have literally never encountered ERP in hundreds of hours of play

unless i am megaoutlier it is really not a problem who cares

invisty · Post by **invisty** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 9:16 pm #135492

memes.

rdght91 · Post by **rdght91** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 9:48 pm #135497

I got boinked for murdering ERPers.

DrPillzRedux · Sun Nov 22, 2015 10:37 pm

I assume you're talking about me but no, I've only done it about 7 times since the unban and no one bitches about whatever they get.

You're just trying to stir drama for the sake of it.

lzimann · Post by **lzimann** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 11:40 pm #135546

Just ignore. It's that simple.

Mon Nov 23, 2015 6:37 am

bandit wrote:the minute ERP was unbanned the same three fucking lizards started to fuck every goddamn round,

ignore them/ban them?
if it's three people taking a part of the game that can cause massive hilarity for everybody and ruining it for all the other players, then why should they get to stay here?

Post by **oranges** » Mon Nov 23, 2015 6:38 am #135643

http://www.oranges.net.nz/~oranges/webm ... g_now.webm

Post by **Atlanta-Ned** » Mon Nov 23, 2015 3:19 pm #135727

People are ERPing?

Xhuis · Post by **Xhuis** » Mon Nov 23, 2015 10:18 pm #135819

People get way too upset over this game. We've all gotten angry over it. Let people enjoy typing out lewd messages as their pixelated avatars are in the same 32x32 pixel space.

ShadowDimentio · Mon Nov 23, 2015 11:28 pm

Xhuis wrote:People get way too upset over this game. We've all gotten angry over it. Let people enjoy typing out lewd messages as their pixelated avatars are in the same 32x32 pixel space.

Excuse me sir I only get upset when my pixelated avatar is put in timeout for ten minutes

WJohnston · Post by **WJohnston** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 12:56 am #136165

Stop whining about it. Play the game and do your own thing. You have to be purposefully looking for ERP to find it, and it's not that common even then.

Pascal123 · Post by **Pascal123** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:09 am #136209

Oooooor, you could just go to a server like Bagil where ERP is non-existent and live a care-free life away from these guys.

Lol.

Aloraydrel · Post by **Aloraydrel** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 5:46 am #136221

Xhuis wrote:People get way too upset over this game. We've all gotten angry over it. Let people enjoy typing out lewd messages as their pixelated avatars are in the same 32x32 pixel space.

you don't understand the meta of competitive space station friend

Post by **oranges** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:05 am #136229

Pascal123 wrote:Oooooor, you could just go to a server like Bagil where ERP is non-existent and live a care-free life away from these guys.

Lol.

yeah non existent because there's only ever one player online

kosmos · Post by **kosmos** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:06 am #136230

Jesus F Space Christ how is this stuff still going on? It's not that complicated.

How to solve this for everyone:

Allow ERP only if:
* They're a non-head and have done their job if it's an important role.
* They're doing in a private place so it won't bother anyone else.

And if someone spots them ERPing, just ignore them, or join in, whatever, just don't have them be valid, that will only encourage people to do it for attention.

Pascal123 · Post by **Pascal123** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 8:28 am #136239

oranges wrote:yeah non existent because there's only ever one player online

You just gotta come around at the right time. Unfortunately life among other things prevents us from being there 24/7.

LiamLime · Post by **LiamLime** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 12:36 pm #136259

My opinion basically boils down to this:

Allowing ERP adds nothing to the game. Banning it denies no rights or scenarios from players which would reasonable be expected by default. Like, if you joined a random Garry's mod roleplay server, I'd default to the expectation that ERP is not allowed on it, even if it's not made explicit in the rules. Same applies here, so keeping it banned is essentially status quo, not a breech of expected freedom.

On the other hand, keeping ERP banned makes it relatively easy to police - the only point of discussion being where the border between ERP and non-ERP is. Defining this can be relatively easy though. Allowing ERP however brings up way more complications, such as which situations make it appropriate, what does "out of the public eye" mean, which jobs can ERP, what does "done your job before ERPing" mean, how can admins react to ERP, when does it stop being fun and creepy, what is the consent protocol, etc. I mean for fuck's sake, we have 11 core rules, 3 of which are ERP related: Rule 3, rule 9 and rule 10 either directly relate to ERP or are the result of it.

Because allowing ERP is such a pain and such an endless well of "where the line is" decisions, plus it has such a negative impact on TGS' reputation, as well as many people quite simply not enjoying this sort of stuff... I simply don't think there is any reasonable argument to be made to allow it. It adds nothing except numerous negative effects.

DrPillzRedux · Wed Nov 25, 2015 1:52 pm

Except the last time I saw someone erp was over a week ago and that was in primetime hours.

Quit blowing this out of proportion.

Grazyn · Post by **Grazyn** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 2:01 pm #136265

LiamLime wrote:Allowing ERP however brings up way more complications, such as which situations make it appropriate, what does "out of the public eye" mean, which jobs can ERP, what does "done your job before ERPing" mean, how can admins react to ERP, when does it stop being fun and creepy, what is the consent protocol, etc. I mean for fuck's sake, we have 11 core rules, 3 of which are ERP related: Rule 3, rule 9 and rule 10 either directly relate to ERP or are the result of it.

Because allowing ERP is such a pain and such an endless well of "where the line is" decisions, plus it has such a negative impact on TGS' reputation, as well as many people quite simply not enjoying this sort of stuff... I simply don't think there is any reasonable argument to be made to allow it. It adds nothing except numerous negative effects.

The ERP rules are described here, as you can see there are no job restrictions, even though the issue is not exclusive to ERP: if you're a head you're expected to get involved with the round, a captain running off to explore space or to build an autism fort is as bad as a captain fucking a medbay stutterwhore in his office, and one can argue that the latter is even more roleplay-ish. All your other issues are overinflated or just made up, it's obvious what "out of the public eye" means (and there's no rule about that), consent is pretty straighforward too, and the server rules you mention are actually just 2, since rule 10 isn't related to ERP (players had to be 18+ even when ERP was banned). Rule 3 just says no rape and rule 9 just says ERP is allowed and valid to admins.

And the last thing about TG's reputation... allow me to giggle. TGstation is already considered the cesspit of all mainstream ss13 servers, its reputation ran into the ground long ago. Old friends I used to play with blush and cough nervously every time I mention I play on tg, and call me a creepy weirdo behind my back. I mean, tgstation home-fucking-page has CAT PEOPLE written in all caps on bagil server banner, come the fuck on. Reputation, pssh.

The truth is, the community already voted at least 5 times about this issue, everytime polls showed a clear majority in support of ERP, and the only attempts at banning ERP were individual initiatives by non-elected headmins/hosts and caused tons of drama. I guess all people still trying to fight against ERP should stand down for a minute and realize that maybe it's just not the right community for them.

TheNightingale · Wed Nov 25, 2015 2:59 pm

"Out of the public eye" is difficult when we have public logs and ghosts. It seems the only way to ERP without people watching would be to, say, do it somewhere actually private, like in IRC or pager... somewhere that isn't on the server.

Oh, there's an idea - we let people do what they like outside the server, but they leave the poorly-written hemipenises at the door.

DemonFiren · Post by **DemonFiren** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:18 pm #136273

What about properly-written hemipenes?

DrPillzRedux · Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:29 pm

Toggle ghost sight like most sane people.

Enjoy.

ShadowDimentio · Wed Nov 25, 2015 8:03 pm

DrPillzRedux wrote:Toggle ghost sight like most sane people.

Enjoy.

Instructions too complex, spaced the clown

LiamLime · Post by **LiamLime** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 10:51 pm #136332

Grazyn wrote:The ERP rules are described here, as you can see there are no job restrictions, even though the issue is not exclusive to ERP: if you're a head you're expected to get involved with the round, a captain running off to explore space or to build an autism fort is as bad as a captain fucking a medbay stutterwhore in his office, and one can argue that the latter is even more roleplay-ish. All your other issues are overinflated or just made up, it's obvious what "out of the public eye" means (and there's no rule about that), consent is pretty straighforward too, and the server rules you mention are actually just 2, since rule 10 isn't related to ERP (players had to be 18+ even when ERP was banned). Rule 3 just says no rape and rule 9 just says ERP is allowed and valid to admins.

I can't respond to much in here, since you consider many things cut and dry, when they are really not. ERP enforcement is hard, and there are hurt feelings every time an admin acts, and every time an admin doesn't act.

The 18 or older rule was made because of ERP being allowed. Your reasoning comes from it not being removed when ERP was later banned. Sure, it should have been removed with ERP was removed. The fact that it wasn't doesn't prove your point since it'd've never existed had ERP never been allowed.

Grazyn wrote:And the last thing about TG's reputation... allow me to giggle. TGstation is already considered the cesspit of all mainstream ss13 servers, its reputation ran into the ground long ago. Old friends I used to play with blush and cough nervously every time I mention I play on tg, and call me a creepy weirdo behind my back. I mean, tgstation home-fucking-page has CAT PEOPLE written in all caps on bagil server banner, come the fuck on. Reputation, pssh.

I care about what new people think. TGS' seems to have hit a point of stagnation about a year ago and the player counts are much lower today than a year ago at the same time. Here are the new player numbers for tgstation: (meaning that on that month, that number of players were first seen:

You are free to ignore the first few months of data gathering, since the players who were active at the time were all "first seen" at the same time, hence why the first few months' numbers are inflated. But if you look at the 2013 > 14 > 15 trend for each month.... it's down... You might think TGS is doomed, but there are people here who don't, people who care to reverse this trend of insufficient new players joining.

And no, I'm not saying ERP is "the one cause of this". It is however a contributing factor.

Grazyn wrote:The truth is, the community already voted at least 5 times about this issue, everytime polls showed a clear majority in support of ERP, and the only attempts at banning ERP were individual initiatives by non-elected headmins/hosts and caused tons of drama. I guess all people still trying to fight against ERP should stand down for a minute and realize that maybe it's just not the right community for them.

When it comes to touchy subject, if 60% of the community voted in favour of something and 40% against, enacting it is still a dumb idea. The benefit to the 60% is minimal, the cost to the 40% is much higher. Essentially what you do there is split the community on a globally irrelevant issue. Sure, if you have a 90% majority, go ahead. But at 60-40, it's nowhere close enough to be worth splitting the community over. Especially when it's something irrelevant, which gives no tangible benefits, which complicates enforcement, has lots of other negative side effects, is perceived very negatively by a non-ignorable portion of the population, and most importantly isn't even an expected thing by default. Allowing ERP makes no reasonable sense.

Post by **oranges** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 11:18 pm #136337

Puritans on suicide watch

DrPillzRedux · Wed Nov 25, 2015 11:54 pm

Actually the percentage after votes were cleaned was 74% for it.

Pascal123 · Post by **Pascal123** » Thu Nov 26, 2015 12:35 am #136355

LiamLime is the Voice of Reason.

People should listen to him more often.

DrPillzRedux · Thu Nov 26, 2015 12:44 am

He's a guy that says the playercount is in trouble when the server hits 90+ in primetime.

No.