Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Discussing the mapping/spriting/coding efforts involved in creating a version of SS13 that takes place on a planet surface. Will be finished Soon(TM)
User avatar
MisterPerson
Board Moderator
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 4:26 pm
Byond Username: MisterPerson

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by MisterPerson » #266676

Bottom post of the previous page:

Luke Cox wrote:If this is meant to be a total overhaul, the playerbase will never accept it.
I've long since learned to stop presuming what the playerbase will or will not accept.
I code for the code project and moderate the code sections of the forums.

Feedback is dumb and it doesn't matter
User avatar
Steelpoint
Github User
Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2014 6:37 pm
Byond Username: Steelpoint
Github Username: Steelpoint
Location: The Armoury

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Steelpoint » #266688

This idea certainly has merit.

However this is a 'all in' idea. It can't be half done with our current space station being propped up on one server and this left to rot on another.

Either we fully commit to this design document, and we make it work. Or we forget about it.

There is no in between.

Edit: Over dramatisation post above, ignore for more reasonable post below.
Last edited by Steelpoint on Mon Mar 13, 2017 7:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
Image
User avatar
Luke Cox
Joined: Sat Dec 06, 2014 8:52 am
Byond Username: NocturnalQuill
Location: Prisoner Transfer Room

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Luke Cox » #266692

MisterPerson wrote:
Luke Cox wrote:If this is meant to be a total overhaul, the playerbase will never accept it.
I've long since learned to stop presuming what the playerbase will or will not accept.
They'll accept small changes. People hate single radical changes.
Image
User avatar
captain sawrge
Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2014 6:13 pm
Byond Username: Sawrge

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by captain sawrge » #266693

Luke Cox wrote:
MisterPerson wrote:
Luke Cox wrote:If this is meant to be a total overhaul, the playerbase will never accept it.
I've long since learned to stop presuming what the playerbase will or will not accept.
They'll accept small changes. People hate single radical changes.
Then they get over themselves or go play on another codebase
Image
Incomptinence
Joined: Fri May 02, 2014 3:01 am
Byond Username: Incomptinence

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Incomptinence » #266698

Would rather have an established planet base rather than crash scenario but eh.
onleavedontatme
Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 10:26 pm
Byond Username: KorPhaeron

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by onleavedontatme » #266699

The crash is just a deep lore excuse to explain why you need to work to leave and why there is a loot field to strip for science research, the map itself will still feel established.
User avatar
Kel
Joined: Sun Aug 10, 2014 1:04 am
Byond Username: Jaraxxus

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Kel » #266700

this is starting to sound more like a L4D map than a round of SS13 in my honest option.
Image
onleavedontatme
Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 10:26 pm
Byond Username: KorPhaeron

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by onleavedontatme » #266702

Kel wrote:this is starting to sound more like a L4D map
You might be imagining the monsters as way more numerous and aggressive than I am then.
onleavedontatme
Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 10:26 pm
Byond Username: KorPhaeron

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by onleavedontatme » #266704

Rimworld and Dwarf Fort both have outside pressure while the interior drama goes on and I don't think either of those games are remotely comparable to L4D
User avatar
Luke Cox
Joined: Sat Dec 06, 2014 8:52 am
Byond Username: NocturnalQuill
Location: Prisoner Transfer Room

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Luke Cox » #266705

captain sawrge wrote:
Luke Cox wrote:
MisterPerson wrote:
Luke Cox wrote:If this is meant to be a total overhaul, the playerbase will never accept it.
I've long since learned to stop presuming what the playerbase will or will not accept.
They'll accept small changes. People hate single radical changes.
Then they get over themselves or go play on another codebase
And I'd really rather not have the latter occur
Image
User avatar
Haevacht
Joined: Sat Apr 19, 2014 1:08 am
Byond Username: Capital_H

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Haevacht » #266706

You have what little i can provide for this, Kor.

Which is low-tier onmob sprites and hacky coding attempts.
1% of a coder, 2% of a spriter, 97% >:3c

Random name on Bagel, usually assistant.
User avatar
Armhulen
Global Moderator
Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2016 4:30 pm
Byond Username: Armhulenn
Github Username: bazelart
Location: The Grand Tournament

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Armhulen » #266709

One of the stronger monsters the tendrils should make should be deformed flesh beings that have to kidnap humans and drag them kicking and screaming into the darkness, as well as spreading the negative light weed
onleavedontatme
Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 10:26 pm
Byond Username: KorPhaeron

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by onleavedontatme » #266712

Kor wrote:Update with people who said they would help:

-LeoZ coding
-Xhuis coding
-Iamgoofball coding
-Ausops spriting(?)
-WJ spriting/mapping
-Lexorion spriting
-Haevacht spriting

Here is my almost realistic idea, in bullet points before the autistic paragraphs

-The crew has crashlanded on a planet

-There is a hostile wilderness, and an ancient alien (the ones who built the gateway) structure that crew have built the station/base around, using parts from their ship (everyone spawns here with the base already more or less constructed). There is a larger, fancier gateway in the center of their base.

-The crew has no means of calling an escape shuttle. They either activate their gateway (by powering it up) or they have to accept defeat and detonate the nuke.

-At the very edges of the map there is the lavaland tendril corruption shit. It will spread inwards towards the base as the game progresses. Tendrils will grow (while spitting out stronger monsters depending on their stage). On the last stage, they will reproduce, seeding new weaker tendrils etc. The tendrils will also now produce some sort of alien weed equivalent around them which has negative lighting, so darkness will literally be closing in on the station.

-If the monsters reach and attack the gateway enough times, it becomes corrupted. Game over.

-Periodically there would be waves of monsters or ash lizards sent that attempt to assault the base itself

-There would be alien structures in the base that required an enormous amount of power to activate, which engineering would have to choose to direct power to to use (slowing down powering on the gate).

-The gate power on sequence would be the finale replacing the shuttle, with a final wave of monsters sent to overrun the base as people escape to centcomm. A cooldown between each person escaping could add some tension and infighting and drag it out a bit.

How this map would impact the different jobs
Spoiler:
Security: Would be tasked with defending the perimeter in addition to beating the clown.

Miners: They've been preparing for this for a while now

Cargo: Probably wouldn't exist.

Engineering: Repairing defenses, building turrets, pushing the engine to the limit to get the gate powered, power on a bluespace cannon to shoot at a tendril, etc. Turn off medbay to direct power to temporarily using the alien turrets around the base when you're getting overrun.

Assistants: Hopefully all die in the wilderness

Medical: There should be plenty of work for them to do in such a hostile environment.

Genetics: Probably gone. Cloning will be handled by the alien DNA vault, which again, requires diverting power to use.

Research: Same deal. Turn the minerals brought back into weapons for the crew. Unlike vanilla SS13, the crew would have something to use it on.
How this would effect game modes:
Spoiler:
Rev: Unchanged.

Nuke: Unchanged for the most part. Escaping on the ops shuttle could be an alternate round end though.

Wizard: Unchanged for the most part. Maybe give the wizard an ability to channel at the gateway to escape back to his den, ending the round just in case he kills too many people.

Cult: Can we just remove cult already

Clock Cult: They also want the gate turned on, but they want to hijack it to bring ratvar instead. More or less the same.

Traitor: This might be the most difficult. Given our current rules and balance it'd be very easy to just kill a bunch of random people and make sure the escape is never completed. They'd obviously screw themselves over doing this, but I don't think many traitor players care about death. Ideally traitors would impact the round through sabotage or shooting people in the back during base defenses rather than just outright killing everyone themselves.
Other map features:
Spoiler:
The crashed ship. The ship wreckage would be out in the wastes, waiting to be scavenged for things to help the crew.

The ruin system.

The Necropolis, or whatever it will be called. The source of all the evil spooky shit. This will either be the far corner of the map, or on the subterranean Z level. Maybe one day destroying the Necropolis boss (concept art soon(TM)) will be an alternate win condition.

Alien pylons that can hold back the growth of the corruption when activated.

*Two Z levels hopefully! Remie is working on being able to see the z level below you, so it'd be very cool if lavaland existed below, and a new biome was outside the station. You could see down into the lava and corruption.

Super stretch goal: Seasons. Much later on if this exists at all I think cycling through one season a week of real time would be fun and keep things fresh. Last week of the month its winter around the base, etc.
Biggest challenges/reasons why this won't work:
Spoiler:
-Scaling will be difficult. The rate of power generation vs gateway consumption, the rate that monsters move towards the station and how many of them do so, etc.

-The amount of work, obviously. This really isn't something I want to do without other people onboard coding and spriting (and most importantly mapping because I hate mapping).

-Change in coding culture. There would obviously have to be way tighter balance if the PVE threats and goals were to make any sense for longer than a week. I think this would be a big sticking point.

-People mad we're not in space anymore

-General resistance to change and loss of some of the sandbox in favour of gameplay that will keep people engaged past waiting for admins to hit the meteor button

-By making jobs important, its going to make low pop pretty miserable and make people extra mad if people screw around and ignore things.

-I can't really articulate why I think admins would probably do something wrong but I can't pass up an opportunity to complain about them anyway.
Reasons why I think this is worth it:
Spoiler:
-People will stop being bored and murdering each other if they have monsters to murder

-Jobs will have goals and purpose

-Antags can tip the scales in existing drama without having to be the entire story themselves.

-Solves the 20 minute shuttle problem.
Shitty map I drew when I assumed this would be lavaland base, but I dont think lavaland as the base z level would make people happy. Could still have an ocean though, oceans are cool. It's obviously a bit different than I described in this thread, but this was drawn a while ago.

http://i.imgur.com/mD5ff5v.png

I'm most interested to hear from maintainers and the host because none of this matters if nobody wants to work on it or have it available to play.
User avatar
Armhulen
Global Moderator
Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2016 4:30 pm
Byond Username: Armhulenn
Github Username: bazelart
Location: The Grand Tournament

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Armhulen » #266716

I don't like the idea of a lava sea, darkness should be creeping in on every side.
User avatar
Luke Cox
Joined: Sat Dec 06, 2014 8:52 am
Byond Username: NocturnalQuill
Location: Prisoner Transfer Room

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Luke Cox » #266721

Reading through the comments, I think that Kevinz hit the nail on the head. "Validhunting" is a shitty meme that's preventing us from focusing on what makes the game fun. People don't like to fight other humans because of "validhunting", they like to fight other humans because humans are smart and require actual thought to be put into fighting them instead of just memorizing attack patterns and dodging them. Lavaland is a great addition to the base game, but making the entire game revolve around that kind of gameplay is a train wreck waiting to happen. What you're proposing sounds like alien Left 4 Dead, and is fundamentally incompatible with both the codebase and the playerbase. People don't want this, and shoving a drastic change like this down their throats is a great way to kill the server. If you really want to pursue something of this sort, fork the codebase and work on your own server. As others have pointed out, this will turn us from one of the biggest SS13 servers into a niche offshoot. You haven't thought the practicalities and implications of this through. For the love of god, don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.
Image
Bombadil
Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2014 12:23 am
Byond Username: Kromgar

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Bombadil » #266724

Armhulen wrote:I don't like the idea of a lava sea, darkness should be creeping in on every side.
Its explained that lavaland would be the subterranean area. The original map was made with the thought process of lavaland.



@Kor

So i really really love this idea. But i think we should make Ashwalkers into eldritch horrorfleshblobs.

Honestly i think we should make it part of map rotation. If people come to/learn to enjoy it then we can increase its weighting.


Everything you've ever made for this game Kor i've thoroughly enjoyed i'm 100% with you.

Question: How are you expected to get to the megafauna and rare mineral deposits if there are chasms in the way?

So with the cargo not being a thing at all will we be able to craft new explorer suits and what not? Will there be a crafting expansion for the survivalist theme of this new map.


Also i'd love it to be junglestation on the surface. We can slowly have the jungle turn fleshy and horrible. So like is lategame monster rushes eventually going to be megafauna attacking the station?
Planet Station Best Station

Vote Planetstation and Kor Phaeron 2017
User avatar
Armhulen
Global Moderator
Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2016 4:30 pm
Byond Username: Armhulenn
Github Username: bazelart
Location: The Grand Tournament

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Armhulen » #266725

Bombadil wrote:
Armhulen wrote:I don't like the idea of a lava sea, darkness should be creeping in on every side.
Its explained that lavaland would be the subterranean area. The original map was made with the thought process of lavaland.
http://i.imgur.com/mD5ff5v.png
There's a lava sea the station has a dock to.
User avatar
Qbopper
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:34 pm
Byond Username: Qbopper
Github Username: Qbopper
Location: Canada

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Qbopper » #266729

I don't know if you'd need help with designing but I'd be interested in that
Limey wrote:its too late.
User avatar
D&B
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2016 2:23 am
Byond Username: Repukan
Location: *teleports behind you*

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by D&B » #266731

If there's a way for me to help with shekels add me to the screenshot too.
Spoiler:
[20:26:02]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Welp. It was just a prank bro isn't a very good excuse when it comes to unprovoked nonantag murder, but since this is your first time doing it and you seem to understand the problem instead of a bannu I'm just going to leave you with a warning. Please PLEASE don't do this again in the future, as funny as crackhead broken bottle memes can be. Alrighty? Do you have any input on this?
[20:26:39]ADMIN: PM: [censored]->[censored admin]: Alright, no problem. I have some input. Fuck my boy pussy.
[20:27:06]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Okay then. Have fun.
[20:31:29]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Excuse me?
J_Madison wrote: that's a stupid fucking stat
you don't play, you've never played
lying little shit with your bullshit stat
fuck you
ColonicAcid wrote:and with enough practise i too could blow my own dick so well that only the gods know how it feels.
Bombadil
Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2014 12:23 am
Byond Username: Kromgar

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Bombadil » #266737

Armhulen wrote:
Bombadil wrote:
Armhulen wrote:I don't like the idea of a lava sea, darkness should be creeping in on every side.
Its explained that lavaland would be the subterranean area. The original map was made with the thought process of lavaland.
http://i.imgur.com/mD5ff5v.png
There's a lava sea the station has a dock to.
Reading Comphrension! READING COMPREHENSION! DID YOU READ IT MOTHERFUCKER

Shitty map I drew when I assumed this would be lavaland base, but I dont think lavaland as the base z level would make people happy. Could still have an ocean though, oceans are cool. It's obviously a bit different than I described in this thread, but this was drawn a while ago.

http://i.imgur.com/mD5ff5v.png

I'm most interested to hear from maintainers and the host because none of this matters if nobody wants to work on it or have it available to play.
Planet Station Best Station

Vote Planetstation and Kor Phaeron 2017
User avatar
Luke Cox
Joined: Sat Dec 06, 2014 8:52 am
Byond Username: NocturnalQuill
Location: Prisoner Transfer Room

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Luke Cox » #266743

If we really are serious about doing this, putting it on the third server and listing it on the hub is the smart thing to do. They're different enough to the point where they might as well be their own games. Someone previously argued that it shouldn't be put on the third server because it's "irrelevant", which is retarded. Bagil was also "irrelevant" until it was listed on the hub. If we absolutely must use two only, scrap Bagil and Sybil and make it Planetary Station and Space Station instead.
Image
User avatar
kevinz000
Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2014 8:41 am
Byond Username: Kevinz000
Github Username: kevinz000
Location: Dorm Room 3

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by kevinz000 » #266757

captain sawrge wrote:
Luke Cox wrote:
MisterPerson wrote:
Luke Cox wrote:If this is meant to be a total overhaul, the playerbase will never accept it.
I've long since learned to stop presuming what the playerbase will or will not accept.
They'll accept small changes. People hate single radical changes.
Then they get over themselves or go play on another codebase
This is the codebase where so many SS13 codebases indirectly or directly come from, infact, almost every one of them! That logic doesn't apply unless you want to make TG an offshoot itself instead of a base!
User avatar
danno
Joined: Wed Apr 16, 2014 5:07 pm
Byond Username: Dannno
Location: e-mail me if you want a pizza roll

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by danno » #266761

Semantics.
Hornygranny wrote: wtf i like danno now
Image
I don't even play ss13 anymore, pretty much due to dannos stupid bullshit
User avatar
kevinz000
Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2014 8:41 am
Byond Username: Kevinz000
Github Username: kevinz000
Location: Dorm Room 3

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by kevinz000 » #266762

danno wrote:Semantics.
I simply don't see what's preventing us from doing the "include all files in one list and include that list as a compile option, while making travis check both sides to make sure there's no incompatibility". Yes, it'd probably bloat the code more when you compile with the switch off as there'll be extra files, but it wouldn't completely toss vanilla out and turn us into ANOTHER GAME USING SS13'S ENGINE AKIN TO LIFEWEB(extreme case)/CM/FTL. No, I'm not saying those servers/codebases/communities are bad, but why would you turn TG into one of them when for so long other servers have based off TG SS13 code?
User avatar
danno
Joined: Wed Apr 16, 2014 5:07 pm
Byond Username: Dannno
Location: e-mail me if you want a pizza roll

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by danno » #266763

Not sure why you are directing that question at me.
Hornygranny wrote: wtf i like danno now
Image
I don't even play ss13 anymore, pretty much due to dannos stupid bullshit
User avatar
Luke Cox
Joined: Sat Dec 06, 2014 8:52 am
Byond Username: NocturnalQuill
Location: Prisoner Transfer Room

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Luke Cox » #266773

I just can't believe people are seriously considering dumping everything we have and making a new game. Kor's thought process seems to be "Lavaland works well in the context of mining, so let's scrap everything and remake the entire game around lavaland"
Image
User avatar
Okand37
Joined: Sat Feb 20, 2016 5:37 pm
Byond Username: Okand37

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Okand37 » #266774

I didn't really read a lot of the ensuing conversation, but it seems interesting. If you need a(nother) mapper feel free to holler.
Are you being the neighbour Mr. Rogers would've wanted you to be?
User avatar
PKPenguin321
Site Admin
Joined: Tue Jul 01, 2014 7:02 pm
Byond Username: PKPenguin321
Github Username: PKPenguin321
Location: U S A, U S A, U S A

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by PKPenguin321 » #266775

Luke Cox wrote:I just can't believe people are seriously considering dumping everything we have and making a new game. Kor's thought process seems to be "Lavaland works well in the context of mining, so let's scrap everything and remake the entire game around lavaland"
I also kind of wanted to say this. The game being described doesn't really sound like SS13 to me, even if it works on the same engine and code. Consider making this a separate project, maybe?

I still think it could work as a map.
i play Lauser McMauligan. clown name is Cold-Ass Honkey
i have three other top secret characters as well.
tell the best admin how good he is
Spoiler:
Image
User avatar
Steelpoint
Github User
Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2014 6:37 pm
Byond Username: Steelpoint
Github Username: Steelpoint
Location: The Armoury

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Steelpoint » #266784

Being serious.

While this is a good idea, I think it should not permanently replace the space station.

I think it would be better suited to be tied to one server permanently.

We simply can't just abandon the Space part of Space Station 13 altogether, but that doesn't mean this can't be viable even if we keep the standard game we all know on one server.
Image
User avatar
NikNakFlak
In-Game Admin
Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2014 5:08 pm
Byond Username: NikNakflak

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by NikNakFlak » #266798

D&B wrote: No more dates with Suki without Chad Lizardcock breaking into genetics and kidnapping her.
Not everyone valid hunts and gets banned for it like you, someone of us like to do our jobs and play the game however the fuck we want.


I'll write a long essay about my reasonings and what not when I'm not super tired at 2:00am, but the general gist of some of the stuff I might regurgitate is that I mostly share bgobandit and pkpenguin's opinion.
User avatar
MisterPerson
Board Moderator
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 4:26 pm
Byond Username: MisterPerson

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by MisterPerson » #266800

Steelpoint wrote: We simply can't just abandon the Space part of Space Station 13 altogether...
Is that a fact or an opinion?
I code for the code project and moderate the code sections of the forums.

Feedback is dumb and it doesn't matter
User avatar
Steelpoint
Github User
Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2014 6:37 pm
Byond Username: Steelpoint
Github Username: Steelpoint
Location: The Armoury

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Steelpoint » #266802

Was about to respond but honestly there's no point to it.

There's no way this idea will get off the ground or even onto the server. Only time something like this happened was NT station and that crashed and burned.

Good luck.
Image
User avatar
XDTM
Github User
Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2016 8:38 pm
Byond Username: XDTM
Github Username: XDTM
Location: XDTM

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by XDTM » #266804

I support the idea, having ground instead of space makes external threats vastly more viable, and external threats means that the shiny new weapon i got from completing xenobiology is not wasted because i am not an antag (And if i was an antag i wouldn't risk my antag roll on doing xenobio since the shuttle may get called before i'm done).
a.k.a. Duke Hayka

Coder of golems, virology, hallucinations, traumas, nanites, and a bunch of miscellaneous stuff.
User avatar
Razharas
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 8:55 pm
Byond Username: Razharas

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Razharas » #266824

Nice try startoad but your disguise is really obvious i can see right throught you
onleavedontatme
Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 10:26 pm
Byond Username: KorPhaeron

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by onleavedontatme » #266875

Steelpoint wrote:Only time something like this happened was NT station and that crashed and burned.
Which is exactly why I'm not going to do this unless the maintainers are on board. I know I can't keep up with or compete with /tg/ development.
onleavedontatme
Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 10:26 pm
Byond Username: KorPhaeron

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by onleavedontatme » #266876

Luke Cox wrote:I just can't believe people are seriously considering dumping everything we have and making a new game. Kor's thought process seems to be "Lavaland works well in the context of mining, so let's scrap everything and remake the entire game around lavaland"
What is being scrapped exactly? The only thing I explicitly said would be missing was cargo, and cargo is literally just pressing a button on a computer and having guns fall out.
Scott
Github User
Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 1:50 pm
Byond Username: Xxnoob
Github Username: xxalpha

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Scott » #266886

WHY are you focusing on PVE combat?
confused rock
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2015 12:18 am
Byond Username: The unloved rock

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by confused rock » #266889

I sorta like the concept, but not of the whole crashed thing with a mission part. Just make it a regular base.
Image
Image
Image
Image
User avatar
Qbopper
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:34 pm
Byond Username: Qbopper
Github Username: Qbopper
Location: Canada

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Qbopper » #266890

Kor wrote:
Luke Cox wrote:I just can't believe people are seriously considering dumping everything we have and making a new game. Kor's thought process seems to be "Lavaland works well in the context of mining, so let's scrap everything and remake the entire game around lavaland"
What is being scrapped exactly? The only thing I explicitly said would be missing was cargo, and cargo is literally just pressing a button on a computer and having guns fall out.
yeah I don't see how "hey let's make a new map that is radically different but still is the game" has become "let's abandon tgstation and make a new thing"
Limey wrote:its too late.
onleavedontatme
Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 10:26 pm
Byond Username: KorPhaeron

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by onleavedontatme » #266891

Our rules and culture clearly can't handle exclusively PVP combat. It's just endless arguing over who can kill who with more restrictions on it by the year.

And having PVE doesn't mean you're focusing on it. There are still traitors in barotrauma despite the giant prawns. You have to watch your back in Dead of Winter to make sure the other players don't screw you over despite the dwindling supplies and zombies. There are raids/sieges in Rimworld/Dwarf Fortress but that doesn't mean the internal drama of mental breaks/tantrums is irrelevant. Outside pressure doesn't replace internal pressure, and I think it makes both more fun to deal with.

If PVE is overemphasized in the OP its because we already have most of our PVP work done, it'd take very little work to have our existing game modes function on a planet station.
User avatar
Qbopper
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:34 pm
Byond Username: Qbopper
Github Username: Qbopper
Location: Canada

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Qbopper » #266893

Kor wrote:Our rules and culture clearly can't handle exclusively PVP combat. It's just endless arguing over who can kill who with more restrictions on it by the year.

And having PVE doesn't mean you're focusing on it. There are still traitors in barotrauma despite the giant prawns. You have to watch your back in Dead of Winter to make sure the other players don't screw you over despite the dwindling supplies and zombies. There are raids/sieges in Rimworld/Dwarf Fortress but that doesn't mean the internal drama of mental breaks/tantrums is irrelevant. Outside pressure doesn't replace internal pressure, and I think it makes both more fun to deal with.

If PVE is overemphasized in the OP its because we already have most of our PVP work done, it'd take very little work to have our existing game modes function on a planet station.
the more you post the more I want this
Limey wrote:its too late.
Scott
Github User
Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 1:50 pm
Byond Username: Xxnoob
Github Username: xxalpha

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Scott » #266895

I don't see it. You can lose the round by PVE but you don't focus on PVE? And you can still have traitors fucking shit up? It's as if you had giant spiders every round regardless of what mode it is.
User avatar
Qbopper
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:34 pm
Byond Username: Qbopper
Github Username: Qbopper
Location: Canada

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Qbopper » #266902

Scott wrote:I don't see it. You can lose the round by PVE but you don't focus on PVE? And you can still have traitors fucking shit up? It's as if you had giant spiders every round regardless of what mode it is.
The outside threat provides motivation for the crew to do something beyond focus on antags, so when an antag fucks something up, it makes the round way more interesting

Obviously if you're playing, to continue the above analogy, Dwarf Fortress, if you just sit there and do nothing of course you'll lose the game, but if you play the game it gets to the point where the only things that can actually kill you are internal tantrum spirals or whatever and outside threats are laughably irrelevant thanks to your death pit and various traps/fortifications

I don't see how your last sentence is true at all, the threat is external, not inside the station and able to ventcrawl around and kill people willy nilly
Limey wrote:its too late.
Scott
Github User
Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 1:50 pm
Byond Username: Xxnoob
Github Username: xxalpha

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Scott » #266906

Space carp then.

There has to be a focus in automated defense systems so you can involve engineering and science as much as combat grunts.

Edit: Also how long are you planning rounds to be? This sounds like it would only work with lengthy rounds and we all know how that works out in current tg.
User avatar
XDTM
Github User
Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2016 8:38 pm
Byond Username: XDTM
Github Username: XDTM
Location: XDTM

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by XDTM » #266920

Space is limiting when doing PVE due to it being unhospitable to humans, which would mean that humans would either have a small force with spacesuits or have to shoot with lasers over windows, which is far less interesting than having hunting teams and ground combat.

A criticism i see a lot about this is that mobs are not fun to fight against: first off we'll probably improve the AI a bit if we go through with this, and additionally there could be elite monster/pack leader roles that could be taken by plaers to give some creativity to the assaults, and some challenge for the local powergamers.
a.k.a. Duke Hayka

Coder of golems, virology, hallucinations, traumas, nanites, and a bunch of miscellaneous stuff.
User avatar
bandit
Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:35 pm
Byond Username: Bgobandit

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by bandit » #266923

I just realized what this reminds me of -- it's basically Rimworld
"I don't see any difference between ERP and rape." -- erro

admin feedback pls
User avatar
Qbopper
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:34 pm
Byond Username: Qbopper
Github Username: Qbopper
Location: Canada

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Qbopper » #266933

Scott wrote:Edit: Also how long are you planning rounds to be? This sounds like it would only work with lengthy rounds and we all know how that works out in current tg.
why does this pop up in every ideas thread

if the idea is to create longer rounds by changing the way the game works why say "it'll make rounds longer" like it's a negative
Limey wrote:its too late.
Scott
Github User
Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 1:50 pm
Byond Username: Xxnoob
Github Username: xxalpha

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Scott » #266934

The negative is the mentality of the userbase to end rounds asap, personally I prefer hours long rounds.
User avatar
Alipheese
Joined: Sun May 01, 2016 12:56 pm
Byond Username: Daturix
Github Username: Daturix

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Alipheese » #266936

Read half of the thread before it became the same thing over and over.

Great idea. Won't ruin the game, isn't a new game. IT'S JUST A NEW MAP. 11/10.

Screenshots.
Spoiler:
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Quotes.
Spoiler:
PKPenguin321 wrote:holy shit that engineering setup
that man deserves a medal
Anonmare wrote:Gee Engie, why does your mom let you have TWO singulos?
The Legend of Scrubs, MD
You are a traitor!
Your current objectives:
Objective #1: They mocked you in life, a lesser janiborg they said. Now they shall know terror.
Objective #2: Hijack the shuttle to ensure no loyalist Nanotrasen crew escape alive and out of custody.
Cuboos wrote: > That god damn engineer who let the singularity loose was a traitor and the only reasonable person on that whole entire station.
User avatar
XDTM
Github User
Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2016 8:38 pm
Byond Username: XDTM
Github Username: XDTM
Location: XDTM

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by XDTM » #266941

Add me to the "coders who would help" list, i'd love coding for this.
a.k.a. Duke Hayka

Coder of golems, virology, hallucinations, traumas, nanites, and a bunch of miscellaneous stuff.
Bombadil
Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2014 12:23 am
Byond Username: Kromgar

Re: Planetary Station """""design""""" document

Post by Bombadil » #266942

I think people are too caught up in the PvE aspect of it and that it's on a planet.


So here's an idea for a space version instead the station is based around a teleporter gate IN SPAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACE. Cosmic horrors and shite attacking the station. The nearby planet is lavaland

oh my god its exactly like space station 13.
Planet Station Best Station

Vote Planetstation and Kor Phaeron 2017
Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users