Moderators: MisterPerson, Code Maintainers
Vaina wrote:Chemistry is getting castrated and there's nothing we can do about it. Give up while you can.
Luke Cox wrote:Because coderbus clearly knows how to play the game better than you despite hardly ever playing, you fucking plebian
Luke Cox wrote:Because coderbus clearly knows how to play the game better than you despite hardly ever playing, you fucking plebian
SaveVatznick wrote:Vaina wrote:Chemistry is getting castrated and there's nothing we can do about it. Give up while you can.
It was castrated a while ago when they changed how chems were packed into plants/max capacity and removed custom nettles. This change just removes even more of the fun stuff you used to be able to do with the reagents you have available.
I'm waiting until they remove hypodermic prickles because "I notice I die to those a lot after we got rid of bomb plants"
Luke Cox wrote:Because coderbus clearly knows how to play the game better than you despite hardly ever playing, you fucking plebian
Shadowflame909 wrote:This is not a democracy, It's merely an Obligarchy.
wesoda25 wrote:Shadowflame909 wrote:This is not a democracy, It's merely an Obligarchy.
Was that a joke or do you mean oligarchy.
Yakumo_Chen wrote:Being able to carry 100 ied lances in a small item is pretty fucking stupid you have to admit
wesoda25 wrote:SaveVatznick wrote:Vaina wrote:Chemistry is getting castrated and there's nothing we can do about it. Give up while you can.
It was castrated a while ago when they changed how chems were packed into plants/max capacity and removed custom nettles. This change just removes even more of the fun stuff you used to be able to do with the reagents you have available.
I'm waiting until they remove hypodermic prickles because "I notice I die to those a lot after we got rid of bomb plants"
Luke Cox wrote:Because coderbus clearly knows how to play the game better than you despite hardly ever playing, you fucking plebian
Holy fucking shit it’s almost as if things that are overpowered and put you at a significant advantage over others despite minimal work aren’t fair and get removed. What the heck????? Mods?!????
By your argument current singletank bombs should stay because it’s fun for me to bomb the station into oblivion after 5 minutes of work. If its fun for me, its fun for everyone else, right?
wesoda25 wrote:Holy fucking shit it’s almost as if things that are overpowered and put you at a significant advantage over others despite minimal work aren’t fair and get removed. What the heck????? Mods?!????
By your argument current singletank bombs should stay because it’s fun for me to bomb the station into oblivion after 5 minutes of work. If its fun for me, its fun for everyone else, right?
Yakumo_Chen wrote:Botany is easily the most overlooked department in the game despite being public facing. They grow grief plants every shift and are usually given a grief pass because botany is too useful for the crew, and nobody complains about bananas or slip tomatoes enough to lynch them.
On the other hand they can easily disguise their activities and there's no outward way to tell if the pineapples they're growing are going to inject 50u deathchems when thrown or if they're just going to be used for pizza.
Add to the fact none of security has botany access and it's a recipe for easy antagging
Vaina wrote:If you get robusted by a botanist, you deserve it.
Vaina wrote:It takes a skilled and knowledgeable botanist to produce anything that could be considered overpowered within a reasonable window.
oranges wrote:why would it.
And the PR was merged because 4dplanners argument for why it should be merged made sense.
PKPenguin321 wrote:Vaina wrote:It takes a skilled and knowledgeable botanist to produce anything that could be considered overpowered within a reasonable window.
no
4dplanner wrote:Length of a reply does not a detailed justification make. You said all the steps that we already know go into making exploding plants, then effectively said "and these take a long time, and so you deserve to be killed by them". None of these steps require skill or even really that much knowledge. Again, the length of your reply mostly comes from simply listing the steps and stating your own opinion.
wesoda25 wrote:Oh my lord vaina shut up.
The ol’ reliable argument of x exists so why shouldn’t y is stupid.
wesoda25 wrote:Its ironic how you call max caps OP and use the “knowledge” argument at the same time.
Vaina wrote:PKPenguin321 wrote:Vaina wrote:It takes a skilled and knowledgeable botanist to produce anything that could be considered overpowered within a reasonable window.
no
I gave detailed justification and reasoning like you enquired, and the most I get out of it is a "no"? You're not going to acknowledge my other points? You're not going to extend the same courtesy of a thought-out reply?
I'm a little disappointed; I expected something more adult. Oh well.
PKPenguin321 wrote:When the entirety of the longest point of your argument relies on a statement that is inherently false, you get a "no"
4dplanner wrote:Just to confirm Vaina, I should be nerfing more things so it's not half-assed?
Because I'm not done yet
Nerfing is, in general, poor by design.
oranges wrote:Nerfing is, in general, poor by design.
The /tg/station playerbase in one sentence
Vaina wrote:PKPenguin321 wrote:When the entirety of the longest point of your argument relies on a statement that is inherently false, you get a "no"
The lengthy step-by-step process illustrates why it's far from "inherently false." Is it simple once you learn it? Of course. Anything is. Relative to the other trades, it's one of the most demanding and involved for the player. Compare getting good explosive holy melons to a cargo tech ordering null crates with the station budget--it's basically effortless with cooperation. A Durand with crew-sweeping weaponry: you push a few buttons on a research console, wait so you can push more buttons, collect minerals you didn't work for, and assemble as indicated on the wiki. Sepia and gold slimes: feed monkeys until you reach your desired outcome--all you require here is a little patience. Do you want department-destroying valves? You can do it in less than three minutes.
The only other trades comparable to botany in terms of involvement and diligence are virology and genetics. Yes, it takes a certain degree of knowledge and, most of all, precious time and patience to make good botany. Whatever power botany acquires is well-earned and well-deserved. You saying "no" doesn't change that.4dplanner wrote:Just to confirm Vaina, I should be nerfing more things so it's not half-assed?
Because I'm not done yet
Thanks for showing your spiteful colours. It'll really endear the community towards you as a "contributor."
PKPenguin321 wrote:*follows the pastebin guide to make instakill plants in 5 minutes*
wesoda25 wrote:Mutagen argument is a joke, you need one bottle tops, which I’ve never had an issue of getting from chemistry.
Yakumo_Chen wrote:Being able to carry 100 ied lances in a small item is pretty fucking stupid you have to admit
Dr_bee wrote:Hypodermic needles and liquid contents can now trigger on slip, giving botany the ability to make chemical landmines, taking away their ability to make reliable fucking explosives was a good thing to take away after that buff.
Vaina wrote:oranges wrote:Nerfing is, in general, poor by design.
The /tg/station playerbase in one sentence
Even your biggest nerf in recent memory--slips no longer stunning--had a net positive, which was the crawling feature--and it was great. Genetics was shafted in many ways with the nerf to hulk, but its mechanics were made more interactive, and given fascinating new powers to make up for the loss. The number of thumbs down on this PR is telling. Very telling.
What benefit does botany reap from this? Is anything planned to counteract the nerf (Of course not. 4d only varedits)? Anything fun or interesting in its stead to compensate?
MisterPerson wrote:I'm just saying sometimes nerfs and removals are necessary, even if they're unpopular. I'm not saying it was necessary in this exact case, I'm just strongly disputing the notion that "nerfs are bad and to be avoided" which is just nonsense.
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