I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Ask and discuss policy about game conduct and rules.

Moderator: In-Game Head Admins

Isy232
 
Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2018 5:45 pm
Byond Username: Isy232

I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Isy232 » Sun May 12, 2019 5:15 am #493276

Skip to the bold red text if you don't care about why I am deciding to make this.

Image

This is a round I was antag and murderboned by throwing as many people as I could into the SM, I think I killed maybe about 30 people with the syndi revolver and telescopic baton combined with me having a jetpack and having sabotaged grav.
This was done on events hall, so I was not fighting the most experienced players.
Additionally there were other traitors traiting, I met another during the course of the round and we kinda got along and agreed not to kill each other and just kill everyone else.

Now, directly, I think both of us antags killed about maybe 50-60 people in total.
The rest I would say were due to some valid escalation, other antags not murderboning but still killing and incompetence, such as all the competent engineers being dead so medbay never gets fixed and doctors cant heal.
5 or so may have been due to players not caring about their lives since they didn't roll antag and who suicided near roundstart.

After I eventually died to 2 sec men with disablers, I was greeted by quite a few ghosts, many of whom were annoyed I had basically ruined their round, few congratulated me on my robustness.

A few hours later, I just have a hollow feeling, it was fun being robust in the moment, but I feel like an asshole now and I think in general this round wasn't very fun for almost everyone involved.

Bold Red Text

What I propose is having an ingame poll, like many that have been done before, asking the question:
Do you think that antagonists killing large amounts of the crew with no in character reason is an issue?
1: Yes, I think changes against antagonists mass killing should be made.
2: No, I think things are fine as they are now.

I would also just like to add that I do not think that rule 4 should be changed, lone antagonists being able to do nearly whatever the fuck they want is an important part of /tg/ so I think the solution, if one is needed would lie somewhere in game balance.
I also think that roleplay on /tg/ should still remain as optional, this is another important part of /tg/ that is the reason many people play here and not on another server.

I think an ingame poll is necessary to avoid the bias of the few people who use the forums compared to the 300 or so people that now play on the servers.
If you want an example of this difference though, see the hivemind poll on the forums versus the one ingame.

I do know that I am not really providing a solution, but I think the topic is complex enough that we should figure out what the community actually wants before trying to address possible solutions.
If this vote passes as yes, that shouldn't mean we must change things if no solutions the community agrees on are thought of.
I did big goof and thank Dinkle for his mercy in only giving me a 1 day ban for this incident.
Image of all of the deaths thanks to Imsxz

Image
Image



User avatar
wesoda25
 
Joined: Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:32 pm
Byond Username: Wesoda25

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby wesoda25 » Sun May 12, 2019 5:36 am #493278

Wouldn't be tg if we didn't allow it. There'll always be those who don't like it, but limiting antags sucks.
Spoiler:
ImageImageImageImageImage

User avatar
zxaber
In-Game Admin
 
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2018 12:00 am
Byond Username: Zxaber

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby zxaber » Sun May 12, 2019 6:57 am #493282

Nobody likes being murdered, especially in a way that keeps you from being cloned. Being killed indiscriminately is probably just a scapegoat feeling where the real annoyance is dying period, with the exception that large bodycounts lower the likelihood that anyone will bother finding and/or cloning you.

That being said, no policy change about this should be made. We're not Paradise, we don't throw a short leash on our traitors. If a particular weapon combo is consistently leading to successful murderboning, then perhaps a code solution is in order. If traitors are using obscure mechanics to get their numbers, then the mechanic will only be obscure for so long until others start using it and the population as a whole learns to avoid it.

Really, if you want to keep the ire of other players at a minimum, at the very least consider calling the shuttle and ending the round somewhere in the middle of your killing spree. People get a lot more upset over waiting for an hour to get the job they wanted again.
Douglas Bickerson / Adaptive Manipulator / Digital Clockwork
Image
OrdoM/(Viktor Bergmannsen) (ghost) "Also Douglas, you're becoming the Lexia Black of Robotics"

User avatar
PKPenguin321
In-Game Game Master
 
Joined: Tue Jul 01, 2014 7:02 pm
Location: U S A, U S A, U S A
Byond Username: PKPenguin321
Github Username: PKPenguin321

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby PKPenguin321 » Sun May 12, 2019 7:33 am #493284

limiting antag murder was done once before on this server and sucked massive balls
i play Lauser McMauligan. clown name is Cold-Ass Honkey
i have three other top secret characters as well
tell the best admin how good he is
Spoiler:
Image

User avatar
FloranOtten
In-Game Admin
 
Joined: Sat Mar 02, 2019 6:50 pm
Byond Username: FloranOtten

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby FloranOtten » Sun May 12, 2019 11:09 am #493296

Antag murderbone should always be allowed. I do think we should limit the murderbone options traitors have, and fix cancerous metas (the ol' taser-radio jammer-desword-secway), but that's a code issue, not a policy one.
Image
Image
Image
Image
OOC: BeeSting12: i love you floran

1. You may not injure a revs are non humans or, through inaction, allow a revs are non humans to come to harm.
2. You must obey orders given to you by revs are non humanss, except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.
3. You must protect your own existence as long as such does not conflict with the First or Second Law.

Give me feedback!

Dr_bee
 
Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2016 6:31 pm
Byond Username: DrBee

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Dr_bee » Sun May 12, 2019 12:59 pm #493305

I would just say encourage in character admin intervention to murder-boning. If a stealth syndicate operative wants to go super loud it should be expected for both centcom and the syndicate to have things to say about it.

Isy232
 
Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2018 5:45 pm
Byond Username: Isy232

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Isy232 » Sun May 12, 2019 1:19 pm #493307

What I mean as a possible solution is some sort of forced ERT response that can only be canceled by the keycard swipers. This would force said murderboning antag to make atleast 1 friend.
It would be triggered by a large amount of people being dead or something.

I am very against changing rule 4 still, I think antag murder should be limited in game balance, not by removing their freedom to do whatever they want.
I know that code solutions are likely the best here, but what I am trying to get from this post is a player poll to see if this is even an issue worth trying to fix.
I did big goof and thank Dinkle for his mercy in only giving me a 1 day ban for this incident.
Image of all of the deaths thanks to Imsxz

Image
Image

User avatar
terranaut
 
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2014 11:43 pm
Byond Username: Terranaut

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby terranaut » Sun May 12, 2019 2:10 pm #493309

Isy232 wrote:What I mean as a possible solution is some sort of forced ERT response that can only be canceled by the keycard swipers. This would force said murderboning antag to make atleast 1 friend.
It would be triggered by a large amount of people being dead or something.

I am very against changing rule 4 still, I think antag murder should be limited in game balance, not by removing their freedom to do whatever they want.
I know that code solutions are likely the best here, but what I am trying to get from this post is a player poll to see if this is even an issue worth trying to fix.

This could work, having a large percentage of the crew dead - say 75% or so - could lead to trigger a small ERT, and only in certain game modes of course (nukies shouldn't be punished for successfully wiping out the crew).
Image

User avatar
Stickymayhem
In-Game Game Master
 
Joined: Mon Apr 28, 2014 6:13 pm
Byond Username: Stickymayhem

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Stickymayhem » Sun May 12, 2019 2:53 pm #493310

Call an admin. Megadeath should always be handled in-game through admin intervention.

Realistically if one agent has killed 75% of the staff of one of your stations, you're sending in the big guns.
Image

Omni Tears

Spoiler:
Image
Image
Image

User avatar
Shaps-cloud
In-Game Game Master
 
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2014 4:25 am
Byond Username: Shaps

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Shaps-cloud » Sun May 12, 2019 3:19 pm #493315

Why would you murderbone on the event hall server with a bunch of new players, that's a bit sad
P.S. Shoot Dr. Allen on sight and dissolve his body in acid. Don't burn it.

Image

User avatar
PKPenguin321
In-Game Game Master
 
Joined: Tue Jul 01, 2014 7:02 pm
Location: U S A, U S A, U S A
Byond Username: PKPenguin321
Github Username: PKPenguin321

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby PKPenguin321 » Sun May 12, 2019 3:36 pm #493316

Shaps-cloud wrote:Why would you murderbone on the event hall server with a bunch of new players, that's a bit sad

Teach em young
i play Lauser McMauligan. clown name is Cold-Ass Honkey
i have three other top secret characters as well
tell the best admin how good he is
Spoiler:
Image

User avatar
cedarbridge
In-Game Admin
 
Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 12:24 am
Byond Username: Cedarbridge

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby cedarbridge » Sun May 12, 2019 3:57 pm #493317

Isy232 wrote:What I mean as a possible solution is some sort of forced ERT response that can only be canceled by the keycard swipers. This would force said murderboning antag to make atleast 1 friend.
It would be triggered by a large amount of people being dead or something.

I am very against changing rule 4 still, I think antag murder should be limited in game balance, not by removing their freedom to do whatever they want.
I know that code solutions are likely the best here, but what I am trying to get from this post is a player poll to see if this is even an issue worth trying to fix.

The problem here is that by spawning an ERT you're essentially rewarding the sort of antag behavior you've said you don't want to see. Players who get hyped about dsword mass individual murdersprees are the also the sort of players who would see a code or admin-spawned ERT as a goal or a reward for their super robust(tm) playstyle. Where the style itself is fairly hollow, rewarding that with a "boss round" of sorts will just encourage more of it.

User avatar
confused rock
 
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2015 12:18 am
Byond Username: The unloved rock

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby confused rock » Sun May 12, 2019 4:10 pm #493319

I think a good portion of the issue is also how bad people are at stopping em, primarily because everyone is such a massive dick to security that sec is too distracted to deal with actual murderbone. Code solutions will always be better than policy for policing antags though.
Image

User avatar
imsxz
In-Game Admin
 
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2017 4:27 pm
Byond Username: Imsxz

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby imsxz » Sun May 12, 2019 5:30 pm #493324

experienced players going and shitting on newbies on the designated newfriend server is shitty
Image

please subscribe to me on youtube

terranaut wrote:i saw this video before it was posted here
you too can be cool like me if you just subscribe to imsxz youtube channel :shades:



Arianya wrote:no, not the snails, shut up imsxz


Nervore wrote:I am going to will you out of existence, Imsxz.
One day, you will just cease to exist.


Image

User avatar
Qbmax32
In-Game Admin
 
Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2017 4:05 am
Location: somewhere
Byond Username: Qbmax32
Github Username: qbmax32

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Qbmax32 » Sun May 12, 2019 7:02 pm #493333

Imagine going onto the designated new people server, killing them off when they probably don’t even know how to fight back and then making a thread about how murderbone is too strong
my admin feedback thread


epic gamer quote compilation
Spoiler:
datorangebottle wrote:what, not having to act like customer service in a volunteer customer service position?

Here's a rebuttal: you're literally in a customer service slash celebrity position. Volunteer or not.

Malkraz wrote:can you stop posting this shit

Nalzul wrote:Fuck Blob (can you imagine how hot it would be to be gangbanged by a bunch of blobbernauts, the blob, and spores)

Wyzack wrote:qbmax your pathetic display of abhorrent burgercraft has brought shame onto the omnivores

Plapatin wrote:i AM the senate

BONERMASTER wrote:I am a big thinker, and it would only be logical if my character had a big head as well. And glasses. Because only people that think, wear glasses.

feem wrote:i tried to send canisters of urine to the station but ended up turning all oxygen into urine and breaking lavaland and also breathing

Anonmare wrote:Each post in this thread can't settle on what it wants to be, but yet, each one is more cursed than the last.

Beesting12 wrote:please write an apology to this forums, this community, the host, and the internet as a whole for the data storage space you wasted with this complaint.

Vile Beggar wrote:i don't like this thread

imsxz wrote:nervore

FantasticFwoosh wrote:I will whisper sweet nothings that will confuse and perhaps scare you a little, but enhance the experience no-less.

afelinidisfinetoo wrote:By the way, the person who posted that catgirl porn on the github page was me. If anyone wants my private stash just PM me

Nervere wrote:Anything for a femoid.....

Qbopper wrote:I'm a dumb poopy butthead

CitrusGender wrote:god i love it when people feed me my own fried legs

User avatar
confused rock
 
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2015 12:18 am
Byond Username: The unloved rock

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby confused rock » Sun May 12, 2019 7:13 pm #493336

Also admin fuckery outside if actual punishments is all good if horrible waste of oxygen event hall murderboner is just qdeleted then that's all fine and dandy
Image

User avatar
D&B
 
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2016 2:23 am
Location: *teleports behind you*
Byond Username: Repukan

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby D&B » Sun May 12, 2019 8:52 pm #493347

Fuck off to yog
Spoiler:
[20:26:02]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Welp. It was just a prank bro isn't a very good excuse when it comes to unprovoked nonantag murder, but since this is your first time doing it and you seem to understand the problem instead of a bannu I'm just going to leave you with a warning. Please PLEASE don't do this again in the future, as funny as crackhead broken bottle memes can be. Alrighty? Do you have any input on this?
[20:26:39]ADMIN: PM: [censored]->[censored admin]: Alright, no problem. I have some input. Fuck my boy pussy.
[20:27:06]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Okay then. Have fun.
[20:31:29]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Excuse me?

J_Madison wrote:that's a stupid fucking stat
you don't play, you've never played
lying little shit with your bullshit stat
fuck you

ColonicAcid wrote:and with enough practise i too could blow my own dick so well that only the gods know how it feels.

Eskjjlj
TGMC Administrator
 
Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 12:26 am
Byond Username: Eskjjlj

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Eskjjlj » Sun May 12, 2019 9:05 pm #493348

Those who don't know history are forced to repeat it.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2252

viewtopic.php?t=1507

Daxxed
 
Joined: Sat Nov 10, 2018 2:35 pm
Byond Username: Daxxed

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Daxxed » Sun May 12, 2019 11:19 pm #493361

Go ahead, poll it

User avatar
BeeSting12
 
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2016 1:11 am
Location: 'Murica
Byond Username: BeeSting12
Github Username: BeeSting12

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby BeeSting12 » Mon May 13, 2019 12:38 am #493376

Qbmax32 wrote:Imagine going onto the designated new people server, killing them off when they probably don’t even know how to fight back and then making a thread about how murderbone is too strong
Stickymayhem wrote:you're right!

Edward Sloan, THE LAW
Melanie Flowers, Catgirl
Borgasm, Cyborg
Spoiler:
OOC: Hunterh98: to be fair sloan is one of the, if not the, most robust folks on tg

DEAD: Schlomo Gaskin says, "sloan may be a faggot but he gets the job done"

DEAD: Rei Ayanami says, "YOU'RE EVERYWHERE WHERE BAD SHIT IS HAPPENING"
DEAD: Rei Ayanami says, "IT'S ALWAYS FUCKING EDWARD SLOAN"
oranges wrote:Bee sting is honestly the nicest admin, I look forward to seeing him as a headmin one day

Click here to make incoherent rants about my badminning.

User avatar
cedarbridge
In-Game Admin
 
Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 12:24 am
Byond Username: Cedarbridge

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby cedarbridge » Mon May 13, 2019 12:41 am #493379

We're riding this one in a circle again I'm sure.

You're never going to see a reduction in mindless murderboning until you take the glamor away from being an antag in the first place.

You're never going to do that so long as:
1) The (perceived) majority of new content is combat focused or antag exclusive.
2) You're also never going to do that as long as Rule 4 exists.

Every time people are asked why they antag roll or why they shit around as an assistant when they don't get antag its because "all of the jobs are boring." This means that either they're just here for the super exciting Fortnite experience and didn't really give a shit about the jobs in the first place or that we've had a drought of interesting non-antag content compared to the 1-5 new antag-focused or combat-focused major content updates.

If you want a focus away from murder/combat antags then push coders to make (or make yourself) non-antag non-combat content for the game to encourage players to find interest in doing things that aren't "haha made that man horizontal"

User avatar
Farquaar
 
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2018 7:20 am
Location: Somewhere north of Hogtown
Byond Username: Farquaar

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Farquaar » Mon May 13, 2019 12:43 am #493381

Traitors should be capable of the most damaging, round-ruining acts of terror possible. When you have a confirmed traitor in front of you, you should know that they are capable of anything. They could just want to steal some tech and lay low. They might have a bomb ready to blow half the station. There’s an element of chaos to it that /tg/ wouldn’t be the same without.

Dr_bee
 
Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2016 6:31 pm
Byond Username: DrBee

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Dr_bee » Mon May 13, 2019 1:23 am #493385

cedarbridge wrote:If you want a focus away from murder/combat antags then push coders to make (or make yourself) non-antag non-combat content for the game to encourage players to find interest in doing things that aren't "haha made that man horizontal"


Well one solution would be to remove easy access to weaponry traitors get. Traitors get everything every other player has along with the freedom to use every mechanic to its full deadly potential.

Murder might actually require creativity instead of buying a revolver and clicking on an unaware sprite twice.

Hard mode traitor being added to the rotation, possibly with more antag slots than normal traitor, might do wonders for reducing the specialness of antag status and would make murderboning a bit harder.

The free license to griff should be the desirable thing about being antag, not the toys.

User avatar
oranges
Code Maintainer
 
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 9:16 pm
Location: #CHATSHITGETBANGED
Byond Username: Optimumtact
Github Username: optimumtact

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby oranges » Mon May 13, 2019 3:03 am #493402

don't worry code nerfs will deal with murderbone.

tremble in fear murderboners.
Image

User avatar
FloranOtten
In-Game Admin
 
Joined: Sat Mar 02, 2019 6:50 pm
Byond Username: FloranOtten

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby FloranOtten » Mon May 13, 2019 5:55 am #493421

oranges wrote:don't worry code nerfs will deal with murderbone.

tremble in fear murderboners.


This is the optimal solution. If you can murderbone with naught but a disabler, a toolbox and your friendly smile all the power to you. Antags just currently have an uplink full of stuff dedicated to murderboning, so why use anything else?

Though this shouldn't be discussed in Policy Discussion
Image
Image
Image
Image
OOC: BeeSting12: i love you floran

1. You may not injure a revs are non humans or, through inaction, allow a revs are non humans to come to harm.
2. You must obey orders given to you by revs are non humanss, except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.
3. You must protect your own existence as long as such does not conflict with the First or Second Law.

Give me feedback!

Isy232
 
Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2018 5:45 pm
Byond Username: Isy232

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Isy232 » Mon May 13, 2019 7:07 pm #493487

oranges wrote:don't worry code nerfs will deal with murderbone.

tremble in fear murderboners.


Well if this is already being worked on then this whole policy discussion is kinda invalidated, a code solution is by far the best here.
I did big goof and thank Dinkle for his mercy in only giving me a 1 day ban for this incident.
Image of all of the deaths thanks to Imsxz

Image
Image

User avatar
Shadowflame909
 
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2017 10:18 pm
Location: Think about something witty and pretend I put it here
Byond Username: Shadowflame909

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Shadowflame909 » Mon May 13, 2019 8:14 pm #493491

You didn't see all this greytide boredom with the gateway.


Xenobiology, mining, chef, bartend, botanist, and virology. Are the jobs with the least amount of tiders because there's engaging content for at least an hour. With the engineering (because of the nerfs) medbay, chemistry, and assistant just don't compare.

If you want tiding and antagonist murderboning to go down. You'll need easy content and engaging content.

Missing one of these aspects will lead to boredom and then grief/murderbone.
Image
Spoiler:
ThanatosRa wrote:My biggest problem is that I can't fix any of this.


Boris wrote:shadowflame either has a brain the size of a pea or one the size of the moon and he's playing 58D chess.


BeeSting12 wrote:please write an apology to this forums, this community, the host, and the internet as a whole for the data storage space you wasted with this complaint.


BebeYoshi wrote:Saltyflame909


Cobby wrote:The trash bin... have you lost your way home anon?

User avatar
subject217
Github User
 
Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2018 11:27 pm
Byond Username: Subject217
Github Username: subject217

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby subject217 » Mon May 13, 2019 8:37 pm #493492

Shaps-cloud wrote:Why would you murderbone on the event hall server with a bunch of new players, that's a bit sad

Because people who murderbone do it exclusively for their own entertainment and not anyone else's. New players are just an easy target.

oranges wrote:don't worry code nerfs will deal with murderbone.

Doesn't seem like it, sleeper PR was a massive buff to murderboning along with all the ridiculously broken traitor items that have gotten merged.
thankfully former admin
viewtopic.php?f=27&t=20553

User avatar
CDranzer
 
Joined: Sun May 05, 2019 11:43 am
Byond Username: CDranzer

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby CDranzer » Mon May 13, 2019 10:44 pm #493502

Murderboning should absolutely be allowed, it just shouldn't be possible.

oranges wrote:don't worry code nerfs will deal with murderbone.

this but unironically

User avatar
cedarbridge
In-Game Admin
 
Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 12:24 am
Byond Username: Cedarbridge

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby cedarbridge » Mon May 13, 2019 11:57 pm #493508

Shadowflame909 wrote:You didn't see all this greytide boredom with the gateway.


Xenobiology, mining, chef, bartend, botanist, and virology. Are the jobs with the least amount of tiders because there's engaging content for at least an hour. With the engineering (because of the nerfs) medbay, chemistry, and assistant just don't compare.

If you want tiding and antagonist murderboning to go down. You'll need easy content and engaging content.

Missing one of these aspects will lead to boredom and then grief/murderbone.

Of the examples you gave, mining (especially this), viro, and xenobio are extremely isolated from the rest of the station and crew. Not mentioning that undermines your point a bit, but what remains is well-taken. Players fuck around when they don't have something more interesting to be doing (usually, there's a pretty high percentage that just clown without the shoes) but that's not accomplished by sectioning the departments more aggressively.

User avatar
NecromancerAnne
In-Game Admin
 
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2018 6:55 pm
Location: Don't touch me, motherfucker...
Byond Username: NecromancerAnne

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby NecromancerAnne » Tue May 14, 2019 10:10 am #493553

To make murderboning even close to impossible would probably require making the actual act of prolonged combat impossible. Which would need fairly significant changes across the board. Combat fatigue, slower healing, more complex medical problems and solutions. Things that would make it very likely a traitor who goes loud and begins killing will wear themselves out until they die of attrition. Short of this, the alternative is knee-capping traitor gear. Which just seems even worse to me since antags are meant to be scary foes to fight with a variety of tools to one-up their opposition. Otherwise security is almost always going to have the upper hand in every scenario.

Personally I feel this cheapens antag just as much. Especially that, since we allow for anyone and everyone to validhunt, if you could not feasibly kill the entire station singlehandedly, what prevents the entire station from rushing you down anyway? Absolutely nothing. And so you end up having to fight everyone anyway. A group of vigilantes with tide weaponry poses as much a threat as security itself.

Edit: In addition to all this we have an objective which almost makes murderboning mandatory to succeed. You MUST murderbone to hijack. It is otherwise impossible under most circumstances unless you can formulate the perfect bloodless hijack, which would still be extremely difficult.

Tlaltecuhtli
 
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2017 12:16 am
Byond Username: Tlaltecuhtli

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Tlaltecuhtli » Tue May 14, 2019 12:28 pm #493559

first of all revolver with infinite ammo shouldnt be a thing which i could easly fix if i cared enough
second murderboning isnt an issue if the boner is letting the shuttle be called/calling it after the crew is dead if he continues to recall he should be gibbed by admins
also >smurfing

User avatar
confused rock
 
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2015 12:18 am
Byond Username: The unloved rock

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby confused rock » Tue May 14, 2019 2:34 pm #493568

Real talk why did we add sl many murderboney traitor items in the first place
His grace is designed to only let the user live if they kill like 30 people and is extremely one dimensional
Clown car is solely designed to disrupt the round instead of accomplishing a goal and is extremely one dimensional
Desword isn’t as bad but as an uplink item instead of just a neat trick it’s promoting its use to murderbone more
Ebow’s immediate recharge makes it suited for massive sustained combat instead of short stealthy engagements
As much fun as they are holoparas are super good for escaping stuns and are far better than adrenals and most of all the holopara player will get bored if you aren’t constantly killing
The meme bundles are all for obnoxious murderbone or other one-dimensional annoyances

That’s only touching on traitor.

Again the vicious cycle of
One sec player is arguably bad > assistants go full tide > swath of tide makes it impossible for sec to function fairly > more tide > etc

Is a problem as wastes of oxygen will use up sec’s time so they are unable to fight actual antags
Image

User avatar
imsxz
In-Game Admin
 
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2017 4:27 pm
Byond Username: Imsxz

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby imsxz » Tue May 14, 2019 4:57 pm #493576

if u wanna nerf murderboning u gotta nef autonomy. and we all know you fuckers fucking despise any autonomy nerfs because chemistry never makes meds or sci never does upgrades or medical never clones corpses etc.

Nerfing the ability to self heal would put a huge roadblock in murderboners but everyone and their mother would complain about anything that makes healing harder so thats out of the question

as an antag who murderboners frequently, i can say with full confidence that a large amount of my kills come from acquiring security gear and using that security gear to stun and kill ppl. I'm not saying that security gear is too strong but it certainly is a sight being able to have 4 people chainstunned to the point where theyre all in crit with 1 disabler and 1 baton. god forbid we nerf security either though we all know how well everyone handled the taser removal
Image

please subscribe to me on youtube

terranaut wrote:i saw this video before it was posted here
you too can be cool like me if you just subscribe to imsxz youtube channel :shades:



Arianya wrote:no, not the snails, shut up imsxz


Nervore wrote:I am going to will you out of existence, Imsxz.
One day, you will just cease to exist.


Image

User avatar
imsxz
In-Game Admin
 
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2017 4:27 pm
Byond Username: Imsxz

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby imsxz » Tue May 14, 2019 5:12 pm #493579

the slowdown when pulling downed people PR was an extremely good step in this direction btw the ability to stun an officer in broad daylight with just a stunprod and speed off into maints at the same speed as everyone else makes murderbone so extremely easy especially with the (still very strong) meta of emptying an extinguisher out behind you and also stunning the people that were trying to stop you from murdering the guy and you're able to get a 2/3/4/++ for the price of 1 it gets out of hand for the nonantags very quickly.

it would have really limited the ability to murderbone so brazenly and i was looking forward to it, felt a pang of sadness when it was closed. Wouldn't have even limited validhunting ability that much either unless you're the type of shitter that executes on the spot or if it's a chaotic round with lots of antags that you need to do field execution but those are fairly edge cases.

Yall make threads like this and also shun the idea of nerfing the core reason murderboning is so simple, being autonomy, that shit really fucking annoys me and i wish for at any period you guys would realize that nerfing autonomy isnt a bad thing and people would learn and adapt (and yes sometimes let you down, welcome to life) but at the end of the day you'll have more people interacting with each other (roleplay?????) and i think that's what the whole ss13 experience is supposed to be about; trying to survive and being paranoid about who you can trust because the guy healing you might be a wizard or something and kill you.

thank you for coming to my ted talk

edit: PR - https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/pull/43063
Image

please subscribe to me on youtube

terranaut wrote:i saw this video before it was posted here
you too can be cool like me if you just subscribe to imsxz youtube channel :shades:



Arianya wrote:no, not the snails, shut up imsxz


Nervore wrote:I am going to will you out of existence, Imsxz.
One day, you will just cease to exist.


Image

User avatar
cedarbridge
In-Game Admin
 
Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 12:24 am
Byond Username: Cedarbridge

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby cedarbridge » Tue May 14, 2019 5:21 pm #493580

imsxz wrote:the slowdown when pulling downed people PR was an extremely good step in this direction btw the ability to stun an officer in broad daylight with just a stunprod and speed off into maints at the same speed as everyone else makes murderbone so extremely easy especially with the (still very strong) meta of emptying an extinguisher out behind you and also stunning the people that were trying to stop you from murdering the guy and you're able to get a 2/3/4/++ for the price of 1 it gets out of hand for the nonantags very quickly.

it would have really limited the ability to murderbone so brazenly and i was looking forward to it, felt a pang of sadness when it was closed. Wouldn't have even limited validhunting ability that much either unless you're the type of shitter that executes on the spot or if it's a chaotic round with lots of antags that you need to do field execution but those are fairly edge cases.

Yall make threads like this and also shun the idea of nerfing the core reason murderboning is so simple, being autonomy, that shit really fucking annoys me and i wish for at any period you guys would realize that nerfing autonomy isnt a bad thing and people would learn and adapt (and yes sometimes let you down, welcome to life) but at the end of the day you'll have more people interacting with each other (roleplay?????) and i think that's what the whole ss13 experience is supposed to be about; trying to survive and being paranoid about who you can trust because the guy healing you might be a wizard or something and kill you.

thank you for coming to my ted talk

edit: PR - https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/pull/43063


I've mentioned this several times before. People regularly complain that they want less murderboning and less of an arena deathmatch feel to rounds, but then they balk at Rule 4 as sacrosanct. Its key to why people see antag as a reward instead of just a different role or different shade of the same role: because our rules treat it as a reward. RNG has decreed that this round you're unburdened by the rules, now its time to wordlessly make as many sprites horizontal as possible.

User avatar
Mickyan
Github User
 
Joined: Tue Oct 14, 2014 11:59 pm
Byond Username: Mickyan
Github Username: Mickyan

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Mickyan » Tue May 14, 2019 5:42 pm #493590

Imsxz murderboning another thread with facts and logic
I play as Swanni, the brain-damaged moth.

Be nice to each other.

User avatar
Shadowflame909
 
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2017 10:18 pm
Location: Think about something witty and pretend I put it here
Byond Username: Shadowflame909

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Shadowflame909 » Tue May 14, 2019 6:05 pm #493598

That PR is shit because it's compromise: Waiting the same amount of time it takes to break out of cuffs to grab someone without a slowdown. Has made that compromise pointless because the fireman carry still has a slowdown. Which makes the whole point useless.

Shit PR because Shit alternative in favor of artificial scarcity and stealing the rollerbeds.

Edit: To put it more coherently, that PR upsets me because the compromise of that PR being the fireman carry having a wait time before use, ultimately breaks down intentionally because 4dplanner wants medical beds be required to drag someone without any slowdown to give it some use. Which in this community, will lead to medical being robbed of even more of it's items. Just buff blood loss from being dragged bro. The suffering isn't worth it.
Last edited by Shadowflame909 on Tue May 14, 2019 6:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Image
Spoiler:
ThanatosRa wrote:My biggest problem is that I can't fix any of this.


Boris wrote:shadowflame either has a brain the size of a pea or one the size of the moon and he's playing 58D chess.


BeeSting12 wrote:please write an apology to this forums, this community, the host, and the internet as a whole for the data storage space you wasted with this complaint.


BebeYoshi wrote:Saltyflame909


Cobby wrote:The trash bin... have you lost your way home anon?

User avatar
cedarbridge
In-Game Admin
 
Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 12:24 am
Byond Username: Cedarbridge

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby cedarbridge » Tue May 14, 2019 6:14 pm #493599

Steal my roller beds and I'll steal your organs for transplants.

User avatar
Shadowflame909
 
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2017 10:18 pm
Location: Think about something witty and pretend I put it here
Byond Username: Shadowflame909

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Shadowflame909 » Tue May 14, 2019 6:27 pm #493600

Won't stop me from building a stun baton and stealing it. Make an item a necessity, time for more escalation or murderbone. More scarcity more problems.
Image
Spoiler:
ThanatosRa wrote:My biggest problem is that I can't fix any of this.


Boris wrote:shadowflame either has a brain the size of a pea or one the size of the moon and he's playing 58D chess.


BeeSting12 wrote:please write an apology to this forums, this community, the host, and the internet as a whole for the data storage space you wasted with this complaint.


BebeYoshi wrote:Saltyflame909


Cobby wrote:The trash bin... have you lost your way home anon?

User avatar
confused rock
 
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2015 12:18 am
Byond Username: The unloved rock

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby confused rock » Tue May 14, 2019 9:42 pm #493626

Imsxz is 300% correct
Image

User avatar
Nilons
 
Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2016 5:38 pm
Location: Canada
Byond Username: NIlons

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Nilons » Tue May 14, 2019 9:55 pm #493628

its bad to fuck with rule 4 and OP going and being the biggest cunt possible on the server that is specifically for new players who don't know how to deal with a murderboner isn't really evidence that anything needs to be done about it on the main servers

At most you could argue that you should ban the exact situation described, where an older player went and bullied new players for no real reason but to make a sick policy thread under rule 1 for the event hall
I play Ostrava of Nanotrasen (good name) and Rolls-The-Bones (Crag Given name god bless)
Signature Memes
Image
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEVd4c1SV2g
Image
Image

User avatar
CDranzer
 
Joined: Sun May 05, 2019 11:43 am
Byond Username: CDranzer

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby CDranzer » Tue May 14, 2019 11:15 pm #493640


Why the fuck isn't this a thing right now I am legitimately fucking mad

User avatar
cedarbridge
In-Game Admin
 
Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 12:24 am
Byond Username: Cedarbridge

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby cedarbridge » Tue May 14, 2019 11:24 pm #493642

CDranzer wrote:

Why the fuck isn't this a thing right now I am legitimately fucking mad

That PR is shit because it's compromise: Waiting the same amount of time it takes to break out of cuffs to grab someone without a slowdown. Has made that compromise pointless because the fireman carry still has a slowdown. Which makes the whole point useless.

User avatar
CDranzer
 
Joined: Sun May 05, 2019 11:43 am
Byond Username: CDranzer

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby CDranzer » Tue May 14, 2019 11:31 pm #493643

cedarbridge wrote:
CDranzer wrote:

Why the fuck isn't this a thing right now I am legitimately fucking mad

That PR is shit because it's compromise: Waiting the same amount of time it takes to break out of cuffs to grab someone without a slowdown. Has made that compromise pointless because the fireman carry still has a slowdown. Which makes the whole point useless.

Okay but what if I don't agree that you should be able to haul a corpse around at full speed

User avatar
cedarbridge
In-Game Admin
 
Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 12:24 am
Byond Username: Cedarbridge

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby cedarbridge » Tue May 14, 2019 11:33 pm #493644

CDranzer wrote:
cedarbridge wrote:
CDranzer wrote:

Why the fuck isn't this a thing right now I am legitimately fucking mad

That PR is shit because it's compromise: Waiting the same amount of time it takes to break out of cuffs to grab someone without a slowdown. Has made that compromise pointless because the fireman carry still has a slowdown. Which makes the whole point useless.

Okay but what if I don't agree that you should be able to haul a corpse around at full speed

Then I'd say you didn't read the complaint.

User avatar
confused rock
 
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2015 12:18 am
Byond Username: The unloved rock

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby confused rock » Tue May 14, 2019 11:36 pm #493645

Thog said he was interested in seeing it later, so we can just ask oranges when he's interested in trying it again.
Image

User avatar
Shadowflame909
 
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2017 10:18 pm
Location: Think about something witty and pretend I put it here
Byond Username: Shadowflame909

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Shadowflame909 » Tue May 14, 2019 11:36 pm #493646

If you don't agree to that. Why should you make it so that having a Rollerbed will make people able to drag bodies at full speed.

Yeah, all the antags that need to kill people and get away, which is basically all of them. Will surely not take notice of this scarce way to do something fast.

It's just insulated gloves all over again.

I agree that medical needs more of a purpose. But that's going to have severe negative consequences.

We already have a system in place where, if you have a gaping wound and you're dragged about on the floor. You'll lose blood a whole lot quicker.

Just buff that multiplier, you'll see medical doctors use the medical bed for its intended purpose for sure. Otherwise, they're going to be running on empty blood packs all shift.

Shit Idea + false remedy put into a nerf makes a Bad PR.

Edit: To appeal to you patriots out there. When there's an inequality in a system. It's going to be abused. Clear as day.
Last edited by Shadowflame909 on Tue May 14, 2019 11:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Image
Spoiler:
ThanatosRa wrote:My biggest problem is that I can't fix any of this.


Boris wrote:shadowflame either has a brain the size of a pea or one the size of the moon and he's playing 58D chess.


BeeSting12 wrote:please write an apology to this forums, this community, the host, and the internet as a whole for the data storage space you wasted with this complaint.


BebeYoshi wrote:Saltyflame909


Cobby wrote:The trash bin... have you lost your way home anon?

User avatar
cedarbridge
In-Game Admin
 
Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 12:24 am
Byond Username: Cedarbridge

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby cedarbridge » Tue May 14, 2019 11:40 pm #493647

Shadowflame909 wrote:We already have a system in place where, if you have a gaping wound and you're dragged about on the floor. You'll lose blood a whole lot quicker.

Just buff that multiplier, you'll see medical doctors use the medical bed for its intended purpose for sure. Otherwise, they're going to be running on empty blood packs all shift.

People keep saying this and its not better for being repeated. If you're trying to further buff antag lethality this is how you do it.

>antag turbodragging is a problem so what if we just made turbodragging kill the downed victim faster

User avatar
Shadowflame909
 
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2017 10:18 pm
Location: Think about something witty and pretend I put it here
Byond Username: Shadowflame909

Re: I want to know if people think that murderboning is a genuine issue.

Postby Shadowflame909 » Tue May 14, 2019 11:43 pm #493648

Fair point. So I have a solution to your complaint.

We have an internal damage system. Albeit it's very minor.

Have dragging aggravate organ damage.

There, now the roller bed has become more useful. In less common circumstances.

Edit: Ultimately, let us say that a traitor needs to make sure someone stays dead. I see Delimbing tools becoming the new meta.

That and bombing botany to prevent Pod People.
Last edited by Shadowflame909 on Wed May 15, 2019 1:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
Image
Spoiler:
ThanatosRa wrote:My biggest problem is that I can't fix any of this.


Boris wrote:shadowflame either has a brain the size of a pea or one the size of the moon and he's playing 58D chess.


BeeSting12 wrote:please write an apology to this forums, this community, the host, and the internet as a whole for the data storage space you wasted with this complaint.


BebeYoshi wrote:Saltyflame909


Cobby wrote:The trash bin... have you lost your way home anon?

Next

Return to Policy Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: imsxz, Tabski