[Brotemis] omnitricks - What the heck?

[omnitricks]

Byond account and character name: omnitricks (forum because there is no where to make forum complaints that I can see)
Admin: Brotemis
Time incident occured: http://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=1045
Detailed summary:
Brotemis said that this did not follow the FNR posting rules. Used proper template, had all relevant facts. Considering Brotemis own history (a word you admins so much like to pull out of your ass) against players and no proper reasoning and also no sign of yet another proper "investigation" into the facts and proper adherence to the rules I want to see this dealt with properly because as I said, the way you treat this bans as "oh kills = bans" more than anything else is absolute nonsense.

[Ikarrus]

Not that I agree with the rule, but Brotemis was likely referring to

http://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic. ... =44#p17399

in relation to

Yet another fucking bullshit ban by hugbox admins that look at "oh someone that isn't antag died" as a basis of bans rather than the rules and the circumstances of what happens. Seriously, what the heck are your so called "investigations" for when all you do is see if someone dies and decides "oh that is a ban right there!" rather than the actual facts?

and

Your standards in bans along with the methods you use to justify them are flawed and abhorrent to say the least of all. You have a solid set of rules and yet you rely on your shitty subjective rule and admin herd mentality to justify your moral values instead of how things are laid out to be.

and now

history (a word you admins so much like to pull out of your ass)

[Bluespace]

Ask for a headmin to deal with it, not another admin.

[Brotemis]

New Ban Appeals subforum policy, which I call the Pasikonik Doctrine:

If you act like a whining, screaming, hyper-aggressive man-child baby over a ban you got on a 2D atmospheric simulator with people, your appeal will be rejected summarily. I don't mean using a naughty word or implying the admin is stupid, I mean throwing a tantrum and being aggro and expecting to put us on the back foot or something. If you have to wonder if you're near the line of this new 'Pasikonik Doctrine', you're over the line. Back up and approach it with a more neutral tone.

It's long been defacto, or shadow, policy that somebody acting like a bitch will get smacked like a bitch, specific rules or no, (that is Rule 1 anyhow) but we're going to codify it here. Just act reasonable and you're fine. You don't have to beg and scrape, just don't demand the banning admin be deadminned and/or call him a fagt. At least in your appeal.

Generally you'd have to be pretty over the top to fall foul of this.

Not just that, but sticky denied the appeal as well and it would require a game admin or higher to over turn it

[omnitricks]

Then that post should be editted into the first post so people can read all the rules that are applicable all at once. Other than that to the relevant stuff of the complaint

Stuff posted in that thread were still relevant, and still as always ignored in favor of admin subjective ruling rather than actual rules and facts. If you want to talk about the incendiary remarks this is all I have to do is point out the fact that Brotemis is one of the best examples of it.

Furthermore I am not pissed off about a game. I am pissed off about the time I put into it and the subsequent treatment by people that fail to work to the expectation of their responsibilities and expect that their rank is enough to justify belittling those responsibilities. As I have pointed out time and time again, you admins see nonantag kills and deaths as a basis for bans rather than the actual rules that have been laid out as well as facts that have been explained only to be ignored resulting in people getting pissed off in order to justify your widely abused subjective powers. Not to mention witnessing double standards at work because for the same reason of rules and such, they are ignored because of your own illconcieved standards founded on that very same subjective powers.

TL: DR of the above paragraph, you admins are so horribly inconsistent with your interpretations of your rulings, how to apply them and who to apply them to that it is ridiculously atrocious. A few months ago, I wouldn't even bother requesting bans for other people because I see things as "shit happens" especially in a game advertised as "paranoia-laden" unless I am obviously griefed but now I dare do it even for the small things just to see how skewed things are towards your own interest. And really, the bans you have put on me for the past few weeks that are not even against the rules and more because of your subjective rule 1 and the subsequent "history" laden with those flawed views just pisses me off even more.

Frankly the 24 hour nonsensical bans are never really worth contesting because they are so trivial unless it just annoys a player to no end but I see now it is necessary and you should advice all players to do it even if they only have something minute against it since all you admins are so set in the shit records that come from it.

Oh and if you didn't lock that thread so fast with Sticky's obviously flawed reasoning I could have pointed him to the laid out rules that:

3. You are playing a game where you are not fully in control of everything. You will be put into situations beyond your control, which will result in some rounds being ruined for you. Man up and deal with it. However, if you are obviously griefed, be sure to report it to administrators by using the ‘adminhelp’ verb.

4. ........
Randomly murdering people is generally considered to be ruining someone’s fun and poor form in roleplay. If you don’t have a solid IC reason for murder, you may be removed.

Obviously griefed? No. Solid reason? Yes. All laid out there in the facts. Of course as Sticky said it was not a matter of rules and facts as usual but something subjective like "Taking history into account here. The notes are piling up.." which is further evidence that EVERY player should be contesting all those little rule 1 power exercised on them whenever they get banned instead of going to bed and continuing the next day which was what I used to do until you horribad admins start pointing out your equally horribad notes out.

But obviously everything in this post is going to be ignored just like every other rules and facts that are always presented to all you admins by anyone.

[Stickymayhem]

You created a lynch mob for someone on basically no evidence because you fucked up. It wasn't a changeling round where the kill was evidenced but confused, you saw a random person, checked their name against the crew manifest and took what you saw as evidence that they needed to die. So you were fully responsible for a random murder. This boils down to you making a mistake in reading the crew manifest, and while inexperience isn't punished, incompetence leading to people's rounds being ruined is. And that is what occurred here.

Take some time off the game, find some calm because no one needs to get this worked up about a 24 hour ban for an obvious mistake, and move on. Please.

[omnitricks]

No evidence? Hah just listen to yourself. Further proof that admins do not even bother to read jack in order to see events in the light that can satisfy their banboner the most and their twisted ideals.

No Evidence?:
1. Unless you want to deny that there was actually a stealthops among the ops themselves (Whoever was playing Max)
2. Unless you want to deny that the AI was subverted (Which has so much evidence if you actually bothered to READ properly)
3. Unless you want to deny that the bridge was a hotbed for the two above (Which I know for a fact is because Max was charging his many guns in front of the borgs)
4. Unless you want to deny that Sven was wearing the same stealthops gear as Max and was not outright destroyed by the silicons when he was in the bridge (as I was)
5. Unless you want to go against the practice that crewmembers wearing nukeops gear do not do so at their own risk. Even the stealthops gear (the swat helmets and black suits are recognizable unless you are captain)
6. Unless you want to say its impossible under stressful circumstances to get things like names mixed up (you probably think that as an admin you don't make mistakes which would be why you would refuse to recognize this fact)

Fact of the matter is, I wanted to say it was Max that was the stealthops. Heck one of the things I told you after you bwoinked me is something along the lines of me wanting to say it was Max but Sven's name got stuck in my head after because of his suspicious circumstances and similar appearance and actions with Max. Obviously you are unable to comprehend anything that would not be able to allow you to satisfy your banboner eventhough it is supported by facts and rules. Facts that have been laid out to you which also supports the circumstances that there was evidence and it was following the rules to be anything but random.

By your logic, we shouldn't even be doing anything against people in syndicate/ops/tator gear in any round unless they actually attack us or something because they just might be another crewmember which looted the stuff off the actual owners. By the time they actually do it, it would be too late. Of course you don't really care about that based on the history of how you actually handle things.

[Stickymayhem]

By your logic, we shouldn't even be doing anything against people in syndicate/ops/tator gear in any round unless they actually attack us or something because they just might be another crewmember which looted the stuff off the actual owners.

This is kind of what I mean. Obviously not your extremist strawman version of it, but yes. When you see what could be a crewmember wearing nuke ops gear, you do not open fire and kill them. Neither do you form a lynch mob to kill them for you. If you ran around killing every chucklefuck with a swat helmet on you would be banned a day for each one. You killed one and you got banned a day.

The issue is you were so desperate to win that you fucked up. You were a scientist, not a head or security. You don't even need to be directly involved, but you took it upon yourself to use the announcement system to kill someone, and you got it wrong.

I understand it was a legitimate mistake in a stressful situation, but mistakes that get people unfairly killed without appropriate reasoning get punished for.

Now clearly this thread is going to go nowhere and the appeal denial by Brotemis was fully valid based on established precedent of closing tantrums masquerading as ban appeals so I'm done here.

[omnitricks]

Extremist strawman version? obviously because you are an admin and call the shots no matter how flawed they are you think you are in the right.

Read sequence of events again. It was not only the syndicate equipment which was the main reason I identified him as a possible syndie. It was also the fact that the subverted silicons did not outright murder him (like they did me) in the nuke ops base of operations which is the bridge which I was stuck in for 10 minutes to see EVERYTHING that you fail to or deliberately ignore to see through the facts. And what I saw was he was treated THE SAME WAY as another syndie stealthops person.

Looks like an ops through equipment and concealment, treated like an ops by obviously subverted silicons, acted like an ops by being in their impromptu base of operations therefore shouldn't be complaining that he is an ops. You admins should show some fucking consistency like your shitty judgement of allowing crewmembers to be outright murdered for no reason during a revolution round for no particular reason other than "looking and acting" like a revolutionary when they didn't. It is the same situation here.

Desperate to win? Its not about winning. This is not like not allowing tators to steal sensitive items in the station for their greentext. This is not about murdering everyone suspected of being a cultist to prevent their escape objective. This is not about killing non implanted people just because they might be a rev during a rev round. This is about pointing out suspected nuke ops in the station whose only objective is to blow the shit out of the entire station, when the shuttle is not even called for a chance of anyone escaping and no one that has ever been in the bridge even bothered to call because 1. they were ops and 2. the subverted silicons were not allowing anyone not ops in.

Go learn your own fucking rules and how to actually investigate facts properly before you try and strongarm people into your views with your very stupidly subjective rules to get your fucking banboners on.

[Steelpoint]

Even if you are right, no admin will unban you if your going to throw a hissy fit at every opportunity.

Seriously, do people think that acting smug and throwing a "in your face" attitude is going to win admins over or did I just miss the latest trends?

[Stickymayhem]

Even if you are right, no admin will unban you if your going to throw a hissy fit at every opportunity.

Seriously, do people think that acting smug and throwing a "in your face" attitude is going to win admins over or did I just miss the latest trends?

Agreed.

I see the logic for this being that if you, in a completely controlled situation which serves to benefit you and only you, with practically indefinite time to formulate a response, can't keep your emotions in check to write a forum post; how the hell can you do so in a chaotic situation such as SS13 where you often have seconds to make a decision that could result in a ban?

Just calm down.

Also this: http://tgstation13.org/wiki/Guide_to_avoiding_bans

[omnitricks]

Even if you are right, no admin will unban you if your going to throw a hissy fit at every opportunity.

Seriously, do people think that acting smug and throwing a "in your face" attitude is going to win admins over or did I just miss the latest trends?

And yet we have admins like Brotemis setting a nice example for everyone.

Frankly I used to be a very nice and patient especially when putting in my ban/unban requests but after experiencing the double standards, the inconsistencies, the admin agendas, the ignorance and the inability to properly conduct their responsibilities there is so much patience that a person can have. Everytime you admins refuse to follow your own rules, to look at facts and use your stupid retarded subjective standards there is no way for you to be reprimanded. Oh on the rare occasion you would say "oh I'm sorry" but that shit doesn't cut it when banning takes away a players play time.

And that shitty link you gave?

1. HOW LONG IS THE BAN? IF IT'S LESS THAN A DAY, WHY THE FUCK WOULD YOU EVEN APPEAL IT? IT MAKES YOU LOOK LIKE A FUCKING COLICKY INFANT SHITTING ALL OVER THE BOARD AND TRYING TO STIR UP A FIGHT. SIT OUT OF SPACEMANS FOR A COUPLE HOURS, YOU TITHEAD (or join another server).

Because the admin has fucking records of their useless standards that don't even follow the rules that other admins use as a basis for bans instead of the rules themselves. And the stupid cycle continues because, badmins.

That stupid point would be acceptable in regards to minute 24 hour bans if only admins show consistency and proper adherence to rules when they actually issue their 24 hour bans or lack of but unfortunately that seems too much to expect from them.

[Brotemis]

You keep tripping over the "Don't sperg out, you sperglord."

[ColonicAcid]

His posts stink of trying to get popular support.
Literally nobody cares about this tbh shouting out to the unvoiced majority doesn't do much because this isn't a democracy.