Easier Colossus?

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Vile Beggar
 
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Easier Colossus?

Postby Vile Beggar » Tue Jun 19, 2018 5:12 pm #419108

So, by far, Colossus IS the hardest megafauna to beat.
The fight is possible, I've done it on a locally hosted server, but by God, the amount of precision you need for it is pretty damn high, not to mention most of the time, your game is going to be lagging it's arse out with 200-250ms ping, and the game stuttering like crap. It's with that kind of situation that the fight becomes impossible.

It works in concept, but with what BYOND is, most of the time it is impossible.

Right now, people just cheese it, either with the hierophant trophy or sand golems, and that's not fun at all.

I don't have much ideas for how to ease the fight up without just making it a different boss fight in general; less projectiles? Less health?

So that's why I've come here to ask your opinion on this, personally I've never seen someone fight the colossus without cheesing it in some way.
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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby D&B » Tue Jun 19, 2018 5:17 pm #419111

Get good
Spoiler:
[20:26:02]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Welp. It was just a prank bro isn't a very good excuse when it comes to unprovoked nonantag murder, but since this is your first time doing it and you seem to understand the problem instead of a bannu I'm just going to leave you with a warning. Please PLEASE don't do this again in the future, as funny as crackhead broken bottle memes can be. Alrighty? Do you have any input on this?
[20:26:39]ADMIN: PM: [censored]->[censored admin]: Alright, no problem. I have some input. Fuck my boy pussy.
[20:27:06]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Okay then. Have fun.
[20:31:29]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Excuse me?

J_Madison wrote:that's a stupid fucking stat
you don't play, you've never played
lying little shit with your bullshit stat
fuck you

ColonicAcid wrote:and with enough practise i too could blow my own dick so well that only the gods know how it feels.

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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby Vile Beggar » Tue Jun 19, 2018 5:23 pm #419112

D&B wrote:Get good


man you're right
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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby Jarek » Tue Jun 19, 2018 5:31 pm #419113

He's right it's not that hard after you learn it's patterns come on man
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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby Vile Beggar » Tue Jun 19, 2018 5:42 pm #419116

Jarek wrote:He's right it's not that hard after you learn it's patterns come on man


patterns aren't hard but my poor pc can't handle that many projectiles so it usually shits itself mid-battle, if it was just for me I'd ignore it but it seems like everyone has this problem of not being able to beat it due to lag or something, I mean why would people constantly cheese it instead of fighting it normally
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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby D&B » Tue Jun 19, 2018 6:35 pm #419124

If people are cheesing it that means they aren't getting good to beat it normally.

Nothing should be made easier just to accommodate people that play in outdated machines. It might sound like an asshole thing to say but if you keep adding compensation for older rigs then those with standard and better rigs get to reap the benefits of it as well, which ends as a buff
Spoiler:
[20:26:02]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Welp. It was just a prank bro isn't a very good excuse when it comes to unprovoked nonantag murder, but since this is your first time doing it and you seem to understand the problem instead of a bannu I'm just going to leave you with a warning. Please PLEASE don't do this again in the future, as funny as crackhead broken bottle memes can be. Alrighty? Do you have any input on this?
[20:26:39]ADMIN: PM: [censored]->[censored admin]: Alright, no problem. I have some input. Fuck my boy pussy.
[20:27:06]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Okay then. Have fun.
[20:31:29]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Excuse me?

J_Madison wrote:that's a stupid fucking stat
you don't play, you've never played
lying little shit with your bullshit stat
fuck you

ColonicAcid wrote:and with enough practise i too could blow my own dick so well that only the gods know how it feels.

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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby Deitus » Tue Jun 19, 2018 6:52 pm #419127

coll is mostly fair once you learn the patterns except for the shotgun blast attack, in my experience there's no way to effectively and consistently dodge that

also the loot for it sucks tbqh, wish the VoG could be used in-hand rather than surgery and the anomalies are usually just interesting oddities at best
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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby Vile Beggar » Tue Jun 19, 2018 7:09 pm #419134

guess those are fair points, also, yeah I wish the VoG was use in-hand too, it's not really fun when the MD runs off with the cords when you ask them to put it in you
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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby Not-Dorsidarf » Sun Jul 01, 2018 6:31 pm #423020

Vile Beggar wrote:guess those are fair points, also, yeah I wish the VoG was use in-hand too, it's not really fun when the MD runs off with the cords when you ask them to put it in you


if the MD runs off with your vog, abduct them and drag them out to a lavaland hideyhole where you explain medical trust to them with a pickaxe.
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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby kevinz000 » Mon Jul 02, 2018 4:53 pm #423501

which one is the hardest is subjective but i really don't think colossus needs to be nerfed in its attack
however, I do think VoG should have some extra functions, as right now its only use is healing (which is weak) and a full screen stun.

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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby XDTM » Mon Jul 02, 2018 5:19 pm #423507

When coding VoG i worried about balance, if colossus is apparently really hard and rarely killed it might be worth a buff
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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby D&B » Mon Jul 02, 2018 11:49 pm #423688

It's not hard, and not everything needs to excel to be good.
Spoiler:
[20:26:02]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Welp. It was just a prank bro isn't a very good excuse when it comes to unprovoked nonantag murder, but since this is your first time doing it and you seem to understand the problem instead of a bannu I'm just going to leave you with a warning. Please PLEASE don't do this again in the future, as funny as crackhead broken bottle memes can be. Alrighty? Do you have any input on this?
[20:26:39]ADMIN: PM: [censored]->[censored admin]: Alright, no problem. I have some input. Fuck my boy pussy.
[20:27:06]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Okay then. Have fun.
[20:31:29]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Excuse me?

J_Madison wrote:that's a stupid fucking stat
you don't play, you've never played
lying little shit with your bullshit stat
fuck you

ColonicAcid wrote:and with enough practise i too could blow my own dick so well that only the gods know how it feels.

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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby EagleWiz » Tue Jul 03, 2018 5:16 am #423768

Do tell, is your issue that you believe the colossus is not more difficult to defeat (without silly shenanigans like golems or a magic staff) then the other megafauna, or is there some other objection to making the colossus less difficult? Can someone look up the stats for what percent of players have managed to kill the various megafauna?

Because I gotta say, its a rather telling group of people who showed up to immediately shut down the suggestion that content only a tiny fraction of the playerbase will ever manage to do (and get the ingame rewards for) is in no way poorly balanced,and actually its a perfectly fine thing that its as difficult/arcane/requires-hours-and-hours-of-trial-and-error-to-figure-out as it is.

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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby Shadowflame909 » Tue Jul 03, 2018 5:31 am #423772

Voice of God has a whole lot of long cooldowns for effectively useless commands. Unless you're a cultist, I guess. Might have the longest cooldowns in the game.

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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby XDTM » Tue Jul 03, 2018 8:46 pm #423847

Cultists/other modifiers affect the power levels, not the cooldown, so it's high for everyone. It got this way because someone had to ruin it and use it to murderbone with stun words.
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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby D&B » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:34 pm #423855

EagleWiz wrote:Do tell, is your issue that you believe the colossus is not more difficult to defeat (without silly shenanigans like golems or a magic staff) then the other megafauna, or is there some other objection to making the colossus less difficult? Can someone look up the stats for what percent of players have managed to kill the various megafauna?

Because I gotta say, its a rather telling group of people who showed up to immediately shut down the suggestion that content only a tiny fraction of the playerbase will ever manage to do (and get the ingame rewards for) is in no way poorly balanced,and actually its a perfectly fine thing that its as difficult/arcane/requires-hours-and-hours-of-trial-and-error-to-figure-out as it is.


It's not more difficult to defeat than bubblegum, legion or the miner. It's almost more paragraphed than the drake and its shots always follow the same pattern (sans shotgun.)
Spoiler:
[20:26:02]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Welp. It was just a prank bro isn't a very good excuse when it comes to unprovoked nonantag murder, but since this is your first time doing it and you seem to understand the problem instead of a bannu I'm just going to leave you with a warning. Please PLEASE don't do this again in the future, as funny as crackhead broken bottle memes can be. Alrighty? Do you have any input on this?
[20:26:39]ADMIN: PM: [censored]->[censored admin]: Alright, no problem. I have some input. Fuck my boy pussy.
[20:27:06]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Okay then. Have fun.
[20:31:29]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Excuse me?

J_Madison wrote:that's a stupid fucking stat
you don't play, you've never played
lying little shit with your bullshit stat
fuck you

ColonicAcid wrote:and with enough practise i too could blow my own dick so well that only the gods know how it feels.

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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby EagleWiz » Tue Jul 03, 2018 11:15 pm #423917

D&B wrote:It's not more difficult to defeat than bubblegum, legion or the miner. It's almost more paragraphed than the drake and its shots always follow the same pattern (sans shotgun.)


The colossus is the least killed megafauna. It spawns at about the same rate as bubblegum, but according to statbus is killed a quarter as often if that - some months only have 7 recorded colossus kills.

According to the megafauna kills scorecard there are 292 players with at least one bubblegum kill, 694 with at least one drake kill, 157 with at least one Hierophant kill (and note that the hierophant was added considerably later then the colossus - in months where both are extant the Hierophant is killed more often), 186 with at least one Legion kill, and only 133 players with a colossus kill.

While personal difficulty might be subjective, we can objectively say that the colossus is the megafauna that is least often killed, and that the colossus is the megafauna that the smallest number of players have been able to kill.

also not more difficult than the miner? seriously? the miner can be defeated every single fight by running, not stopping or turning around, and attacking behind you

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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby D&B » Wed Jul 04, 2018 12:06 am #423930

You also gotta look at the drops as well.

Bubblegum and others have drops that you can use from the get go without any outside help. A direct buff to the person.

Colossus gets a weird piece of junk and the VoG only.
Spoiler:
[20:26:02]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Welp. It was just a prank bro isn't a very good excuse when it comes to unprovoked nonantag murder, but since this is your first time doing it and you seem to understand the problem instead of a bannu I'm just going to leave you with a warning. Please PLEASE don't do this again in the future, as funny as crackhead broken bottle memes can be. Alrighty? Do you have any input on this?
[20:26:39]ADMIN: PM: [censored]->[censored admin]: Alright, no problem. I have some input. Fuck my boy pussy.
[20:27:06]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Okay then. Have fun.
[20:31:29]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Excuse me?

J_Madison wrote:that's a stupid fucking stat
you don't play, you've never played
lying little shit with your bullshit stat
fuck you

ColonicAcid wrote:and with enough practise i too could blow my own dick so well that only the gods know how it feels.

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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby Shadowflame909 » Wed Jul 04, 2018 12:09 am #423933

Y'know what'd make it useful. A colossus bolt wizard spell that has a 3 minute cooldown. You shoot 1 bolt like fireball, it ignores armor damage and all that jazz like a regular colossus bolt. Yet everytime you use it you have to wait 3 whole minutes to use it again, and there's a whole lot of jazz that can happen in 3 minutes. Considering rounds only last 45 at most.

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ThanatosRa wrote:My biggest problem is that I can't fix any of this.


Boris wrote:shadowflame either has a brain the size of a pea or one the size of the moon and he's playing 58D chess.


BeeSting12 wrote:please write an apology to this forums, this community, the host, and the internet as a whole for the data storage space you wasted with this complaint.


BebeYoshi wrote:Saltyflame909


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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby Karp » Wed Jul 04, 2018 7:27 am #424021

just use range upgrades if youre bad/laggy at killing the colossus like me, it's super easy to dodge outside of its shotgun blasts but shooting at it from max range makes it a joke to dodge

I used to use speed pens against the colossus to avoid the risk of lagging and dying but those got removed so rip

Colossus still has gamebreakingly powerful loot and it just takes a semi intelligent player to understand how to abuse it

wont ever spoil how that works though because it'd remove the only fun thing the colossus has
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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby DemonFiren » Wed Jul 04, 2018 11:03 am #424040

don't they still only have memenomalies and vog?
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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby EagleWiz » Wed Jul 04, 2018 11:52 am #424045

Karp wrote:Colossus still has gamebreakingly powerful loot and it just takes a semi intelligent player to understand how to abuse it

wont ever spoil how that works though because it'd remove the only fun thing the colossus has


you know, the attitude of "you're all idiots for not figuring out how to abuse broken mechanics, but also these broken mechanics are actually a good thing because only non-idiots like me can take advantage of them, and we will never spoil how to break the mechanics to the bads, so is ok" never ceases to be a delightful one coming from the admin team. Really reassures us all that you guys have the goal of making the game a fun place for the playerbase as a whole.

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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby Saegrimr » Wed Jul 04, 2018 11:56 am #424046

EagleWiz wrote:
Karp wrote:Colossus still has gamebreakingly powerful loot and it just takes a semi intelligent player to understand how to abuse it

wont ever spoil how that works though because it'd remove the only fun thing the colossus has


you know, the attitude of "you're all idiots for not figuring out how to abuse broken mechanics, but also these broken mechanics are actually a good thing because only non-idiots like me can take advantage of them, and we will never spoil how to break the mechanics to the bads, so is ok" never ceases to be a delightful one coming from the admin team. Really reassures us all that you guys have the goal of making the game a fun place for the playerbase as a whole.


Yeah what kind of codebase would do something like hide super broken chemistry recipes from the players. Real shit move.
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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby EagleWiz » Wed Jul 04, 2018 12:09 pm #424047

Saegrimr wrote:Yeah what kind of codebase would do something like hide super broken chemistry recipes from the players. Real shit move.


Broken chem recipes are another issue altogether, but yes, it kinda is? A better codebase would treat broken mechanics as a problem to be fixed in the code. This server tends to treat broken game mechanics that aren't commonly known as more of a hidden game feature to be kept only to a circle of friends in order to preserve a competitive advantage, and in the case of super broken chemistry recipes someone not in anyone important's circle of friends was in fact banned for "abusing" them to become obnoxiously robust.

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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby DemonFiren » Wed Jul 04, 2018 12:15 pm #424048

I still believe that SS13 shouldn't be treated as competitive game and anyone who does (cough, validhunters, cough, murderboners) needs to be removed.
This way competitive balance is a non-issue and shit that is overpowered but fun can stay in.
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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby Karp » Wed Jul 04, 2018 10:39 pm #424162

I have absolutley zero desire to abuse or exploit these mechanics and I think everyone who wants to treat space station 13 like esports deserves to get ass cancer and die

the thing too is that if I just posted them they would be heavily abused to the point of rendering a lot of rounds unplayable or retarded and if I tried removing them I would likely receive flak for trying to remove a feature that nobody really uses that could be fun.

Though the more underused things are, the more enjoyable it is to see then when they come out and are used. Xenos can be fun if it happens once in a few months, but a daily occurrence of xeno rounds can become horribly unfun due to how powerfully broken and awful they can be to deal with. Just look at traitorling unintentionally spawning 8 changelings on 80-90 pop rounds, or double agents spawning twice the amount of traitors a traitor round did. Those rounds were intolerable as a result of excess and had people screaming about removals as a result.

Part of the game should be a learning experience anyways and learning/experimenting makes the game fun. Secrets are nice as this "Hey, here's this cool little interaction I found." style of thing people can develop on their own. Don't complain about others having the will/drive to experiment and find out weird and new interactions in the game that nobody else understands
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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby oranges » Wed Jul 04, 2018 10:43 pm #424163

Guys these megafauna are pretty much optional content, you don't have to engage with them unless they somehow get on station, which is why only antags can do that.

If you don't want to engage in the level of skill required to fight them, run away when they come near you.

Don't attack other people for reaching the skill level required to take on these bosses either, that doesn't make any sense.

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Re: Easier Colossus?

Postby oranges » Wed Jul 04, 2018 10:45 pm #424165

Oh also, a lot of the argument here is between people who live close to the server vs those who have higher ping.

Believe me it's impossible to beat the colossus where I am because the ping makes it impossible to dodge the attack patterns easily.

However I just avoid it when I'm about rather than trying to enter an unwinnable situation because again it's optional content and there's plenty else for me to do.


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