Singletank Bombs

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Hathkar
 
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Singletank Bombs

Postby Hathkar » Sat Dec 22, 2018 3:36 am #464037

Is there a reason these need to exist? I thought canister bombs were removed for a similar reason.

You can spend 10 minutes making your bomb mix, then print as many plasma tanks as you need from a lathe for practically infinite maxcap bombs.
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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby wesoda25 » Sat Dec 22, 2018 3:49 am #464038

Hathkar wrote:Is there a reason these need to exist? I thought canister bombs were removed for a similar reason.

You can spend 10 minutes making your bomb mix, then print as many plasma tanks as you need from a lathe for practically infinite maxcap bombs.

Pretty sure canister bombs still exist. No one uses them because you can’t escape on time.
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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby obscolene » Sat Dec 22, 2018 5:34 am #464047

ided
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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby Denton » Sat Dec 22, 2018 10:21 am #464083

I'm pretty sure the reason for this post was when Lexia made about 8 singletank maxcaps in 10 minutes and used them to absolutely demolish a cult base.

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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby Morris » Tue Dec 25, 2018 6:56 am #464543

I ded
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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby imsxz » Wed Dec 26, 2018 10:00 pm #464788

not ided, i used them because theyre too efficient and simple to not do. not having a good soft limit on maxcaps is bad design. 1 syndicate bomb (3,9,12 boom) is enough to derail around. the 6 TTV's in toxins are enough to end one. Atmos you can carry 20 on your person with roundstart gear (duffelbag on back full of plasma tanks, duffelbag in hand full of plasmatanks), and is enough to delete the station with ease.
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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby lmwevil » Thu Dec 27, 2018 1:07 am #464826

as an atmos main i can agree with imsxz that they are braindead easy to make if you know how and their potential for damage is even worse. give us back canister bombs and remove singletank thank

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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby Cobby » Thu Dec 27, 2018 4:21 pm #465014

The fact you can make theoretical 40K bombs or whatever shows there’s a need to redo the bomb formula that rewards use of tiered gasses.
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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby somerandomguy » Thu Dec 27, 2018 6:44 pm #465036

Cobby wrote:The fact you can make theoretical 40K bombs or whatever shows there’s a need to redo the bomb formula that rewards use of tiered gasses.

As well as the fact that tiered gases are useless for anything but points

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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby kevinz000 » Wed Jan 02, 2019 4:35 pm #466541

https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/ ... mb.dm#L144
How do you even maxcap with these things? They only take plasma/oxygen in one tank and requires atleast 373.15K to even go off, with dev. radius only happening at 673.15K
((2533)*(70))/((8.314)*(273.15+400)) calculates to ~31.6 moles maximum at 673.15K with a /15 fuel_moles divisor assuming full plasma no oxygen as it only counts plasma and oxygen without even checking for combustion = 2 dev/4 heavy/6 light
The mixture is never reacted (so it's not going to the primary check proc which is how toxins maxcaps work), it's never even adjusted in temperature (so there shouldn't BE any reactions anyways), it's just the initial gas + temperature that's being checked for.
Infact the code is even more stupid because at 373.15K plasma/oxygen will probably already be burning so why is it checking for plasma + oxygen? Pretty sure singletanks are some very, very old code.
How the hell are these maxcapping or am I fundamentally reading the code wrong here?

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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby Hathkar » Wed Jan 02, 2019 7:29 pm #466570

Ask Imsxz, I didn't write down the mix and temperatures required for the singletank maxcaps.
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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby Electronics » Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:26 pm #466744

kevinz000 wrote:https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/blob/master/code/modules/assembly/bomb.dm#L144
How do you even maxcap with these things? They only take plasma/oxygen in one tank and requires atleast 373.15K to even go off, with dev. radius only happening at 673.15K
((2533)*(70))/((8.314)*(273.15+400)) calculates to ~31.6 moles maximum at 673.15K with a /15 fuel_moles divisor assuming full plasma no oxygen as it only counts plasma and oxygen without even checking for combustion = 2 dev/4 heavy/6 light
The mixture is never reacted (so it's not going to the primary check proc which is how toxins maxcaps work), it's never even adjusted in temperature (so there shouldn't BE any reactions anyways), it's just the initial gas + temperature that's being checked for.
Infact the code is even more stupid because at 373.15K plasma/oxygen will probably already be burning so why is it checking for plasma + oxygen? Pretty sure singletanks are some very, very old code.
How the hell are these maxcapping or am I fundamentally reading the code wrong here?


I think the singletank bombs that people are using are just from letting a mix reach TANK_FRAGMENT_PRESSURE at which point react is called 3 times before exploding.
https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/ ... ks.dm#L234

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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby Whoneedspacee » Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:21 am #467686

Electronics wrote:
kevinz000 wrote:https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/blob/master/code/modules/assembly/bomb.dm#L144
How do you even maxcap with these things? They only take plasma/oxygen in one tank and requires atleast 373.15K to even go off, with dev. radius only happening at 673.15K
((2533)*(70))/((8.314)*(273.15+400)) calculates to ~31.6 moles maximum at 673.15K with a /15 fuel_moles divisor assuming full plasma no oxygen as it only counts plasma and oxygen without even checking for combustion = 2 dev/4 heavy/6 light
The mixture is never reacted (so it's not going to the primary check proc which is how toxins maxcaps work), it's never even adjusted in temperature (so there shouldn't BE any reactions anyways), it's just the initial gas + temperature that's being checked for.
Infact the code is even more stupid because at 373.15K plasma/oxygen will probably already be burning so why is it checking for plasma + oxygen? Pretty sure singletanks are some very, very old code.
How the hell are these maxcapping or am I fundamentally reading the code wrong here?


I think the singletank bombs that people are using are just from letting a mix reach TANK_FRAGMENT_PRESSURE at which point react is called 3 times before exploding.
https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/ ... ks.dm#L234


Tanks in general react 3 times before exploding, and it's instant reactions so it doesn't slow an explosion at all. It's just to make sure something that immediately exceeds the pressure amount like a 2.7 kelvin mix going into a 1,000,000 kelvin mix actually reacts before calculating the explosion range.

If you want the wait time the method is abusing tritiums burn rate of being slow and then ramping up extraordinarily once it reaches a 50-50 split. Shown in this video I made a bit back, method leaked bois.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8spS95IChI

Also none of these use the actual single-tanks it's just a tank. We call them singlecaps to differentiate from them generally. Single-tanks have snowflakey code and only explode from plasma and oxygen not anything else.
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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby Tlaltecuhtli » Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:53 am #467689

@kevin we are talking about singlecaps ( max cap with trit in 1 plasma tank) not tankbombs (the one you linked to

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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby granpawalton » Wed Jan 16, 2019 1:46 am #469244

Toxins is very powerful as it is without this, if we wanted this to be in it should be time locked at like 1 hour not 10 minutes

To get rid of this we could just change the tritium formula not to be piecewise and spike when it reaches the formula when the oxygen out weighs the tritium

The plasma fire formula has been stood really strong all these years and a similiar formula would be a safe replacement and be generally better for many reasons

If we wanted to keep in "timed singlecaps" we could make a similiar gas to hyper-nobilium with the reaction suppression but have it decay into another gas over time and that could gate it behind a later point in the round

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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby kevinz000 » Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:14 pm #470281

Tlaltecuhtli wrote:@kevin we are talking about singlecaps ( max cap with trit in 1 plasma tank) not tankbombs (the one you linked to

Ah, neato.
How exactly do you ignite them I've never trained myself in anything but TTV and tankbombs

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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby wesoda25 » Mon Jan 21, 2019 6:30 am #470423

kevinz000 wrote:
Tlaltecuhtli wrote:@kevin we are talking about singlecaps ( max cap with trit in 1 plasma tank) not tankbombs (the one you linked to

Ah, neato.
How exactly do you ignite them I've never trained myself in anything but TTV and tankbombs

Trit combusts with oxygen and does it itself. Normal its an instantaneous explosion, but you can scale the moles and temperatures to delay it. Not an actual single tank bomb, just an exploding tank. I may be wrong but I think original single tank bombs are gone (the kind where you weld a hole in them).
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Re: Singletank Bombs

Postby granpawalton » Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:29 am #471480

as of tritium changes in https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/pull/42194 this "should" be no longer in the game without hyper nobelium unless some gamer finds an oversight


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