Roleplay hierarchy and its enforcment

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n00bllna
 
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Roleplay hierarchy and its enforcment

Postby n00bllna » Sun Jun 07, 2020 2:11 pm #564622

Have you noticed how most rounds at Manuel are similar to other lrp servers while being mrp server?

The issue comes because of no real roleplay hierarchy and different admin rulings on same issue.



Why am I proposing this and why should you care, after all you are a shitter?


As it stands now, "certain" heretical server, has better roleplay and more fun games despite certain aspects of its "questionable" behaviour. Everyone on manuel talks bad about it in ooc, but their rounds are more engaging and fun than ours on Manuel. How is that possible? Roleplay hierarchy and its enforcement.



How do we carry out this Roleplay hierarchy?


Easy, certain roles could or could not be whitelisted (heads of staff, captain ect...) and implementing a Roleplay hierarchy like on picture or something similar, and stricter punishment the higher you are on the list.

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When I think of captain I think of a leader and a person you should aspire to be, not a person who is worse than a greytider.

Hey wait a minute this exists. I think. Does it?


Yes and no, some hierarchy exists, some admins are stricter on punishment for those roles, some ignore them at all. By implementing this in rules you will make people know their place in hierarchy and that punishment will be stricter if they choose more "better" roles, admins will be forced to act if the players breaks them and overall you will free roles for those who trully wish to play ai, cap ect... and give their all best.

But we
Spoiler:
badmins
are already giving out punishments to people when we see broken rules.


Yes and no. As I stated different admins give different rulings on same issue. Vekter for example would give you out a warning and talk with you about issue and how it got there. Jimmy would say that he can`t read and complain on forum. Rose would go in tell you that you are wrong and ban you. Certain admin that name shall be hidden
Spoiler:
still hidden
will say that your roleplay is below lowrp and that you are breaking your laws (playing as silicon), and when shown that your roleplay is on par if not better than captains and heads, and that you did not break your laws (technicality is a bitch, it`s a silicon thing) will cite rule 1 and ban you.

Why is this bad?
Well one admin is solving problem and talking with everyone, one admin will not tolerate any rule break and ban every player and one will selectively ban people and leave others alone.

Can you give us an more concrete example, and are you mad at someone and releasing your frustrations on forum?


Yes and yes. Security such as is expected to bring order to station, to solve issues and deal with crimes. Security is in reality watching someone dragging a dead body and continuing talking (yes this happened on manuel this day and happens often), security is ignoring trails of blood ect. (Do you as a space officer on station that was clean on start of shift just pass and ignore trail of blood leading to maints, officers say yes). This is just an example for one department that should by my opinion have stricter regulation than others this is mrp not hrp server, yes but this also isn`t a lrp server, you don`t act worse than fucking Event Hall, at least there they follow trails of blood sometime. I agree some officers are doing their job, but most aren`t. On the other part of question, yes I am extremely mad at certain someone but it is an excellent opportunity to show how some admins are doing great job and are giving out fair rulings to all and some are selective and do it with pain in ass. You aren`t forced to be admin, if you want to do it do it fairly do not punish people selectively, apply same standard to everyone.

Can we fix the admin problem?


No, admins are not machines and are actually human like us. They play other games, eat, breathe air and other questionable activities you do after dark. Because they are different they give different judgments and some are liked more than others. But fear not most if not all issue can be fixed by "Roleplay hierarchy"

Captains & Ai on top, but why is centcom official on same status as heads and why should heads be held to lower standard than captain?


Captains & Ais are selected before round starts, their roleplay and rule followings should be ideal for how you would like everyone to behave and not screaming "My **** is hard" on captain announcement. Captains on Manuel if slipped by clown will order for his arrest and would often order execution for most trivial things (sad state of captains... I know). Ais are here and there (depending on who plays it but most are okayish (Hail Divina)), sad reality of heads is that they have departments to lead but are mostly not appreciated and not listened by their own crew. Try to demote someone as cmo and get crited by one of your own workers, mrp standards and admins words ("ic issue"). Hop telling quartermaster something? Fuck off this is cargonia.RD has a little better grip at his department since there are no reason to chimp out and tell RD to fuck himself. Hos??? Tribe leader of special space monkey division 13. Hos who is in theory same rank as rd,cmo, hop has more authority than captain and his mon... officers bellow him see other heads as nothing but below them? I cannot explain how many times I would see officer stun battoning heads and beating them without any evidence of their wrong doings, just because hos ordered. Security is below heads, if cmo is suspected you come to cmo and ask him to come with you for questioning (you cannot belive how many people listen and come with you when you ask "Can you come with us for questioning") but shoot now ask questions later is perfect explanation of sec. Easy fix for security? Add actual new job Officer trainee or something that forces you to play it before being actual security officer and stricter punishemnt for not actually roleplaying. (I know feuds happen between departments but hos can`t just storm in and shoot dead half of your department and offer little to no reason for doing so. Also Larry don`t play hos, you mentality is everyone is a traitor until proven otherwise and you go as far to destroy people ids,pda and pens and tell them to go get a new one, you also can`t confiscate someones non-illegal items (insulation gloves, tools, belts ) and never return them, also when cmo asked for evidence that one of his workers is traitor, you said you had them and didn`t want to show it,while in reality you didn`t have them and that guy wasn`t even a traitor)

How do we implement stricter punishment?


Lets say clown is tier 1 while captain & ai are tier 5. If clown says yolo and suicide bombs (chemists like to do this) someone his punishment between admin Vekter, Rose and magical fairy should be : Vekter warning; 3 day ban Rose; Magical fairy I don`t wanna log dive. Same thing as captain and he yoloes and suicide bombs someone for each tier +1 day punishemnt or +2, so at tier 5 for captain & Ais the punishment between Vekter, Rose and magical fairy should be : Vekter 5 day ban; Pernament ban by Rose visit forum for ban appeal; Magical fairy is still magical fairy it doesn`t exist. It is not so hard to adjust tiers to your usual things you do as admins. You just think about what ban length you think he deserves and add more time depending of what tier of Roleplay hierarchy he is in

Questions answered in advance:


This is bs, go fuck yourself.

Answer: noted.

This is mrp server, the shittery you wrote here is something for hrp servers.

Answer: No, you should act like you would act normally in rl but without all those emoticons ect. Plasma Man psychologist (he knows who he is) visits everyone and talks to them, uses lots of emote ect. He is wasting his time and is trying to rp on the same server with captain that is drinking himself to death. For more than 500+ hours, "gods" know how much I still havent unlocked ce, hos and captain. Why, well because there exists a player that will try to get that roll and will not get it because of me or some other shitter like me. Heads are leaders, and even I the shitter would actually if rolled one try to act decent and best in any way I could.

That magical fairy saying something.

Answer: No I do not wish to see you here nor want to hear your reasoning. This is problem that plagues Manuel for some time and admins like you are in it. When Rose forgot to ban me for shittery of maxsimus ick ockening I said that I was part of it and that I deserve ban. I will say the same to you that I was a borg that was dick by rule 1 to certain person who was dick to other person(technically no silicon laws were broken). But you ignored him and strike for me because I actually argued with you. Have I said yea I am wrong sorry, I bet the result would be different (and I will never say it if I think I am right and am not proven otherwise).

You are the are that moth shitter Fluffy people hate, why are you now talking like you are saint or something?

Answer: Fluffy who plays medical, viro and mostly assistant and prisoner. When I playing regular roles medical or viro I give in all best and better than most people, I roleplay a person that can be bribed with money or quality clothes (moth thing). I actually roleplay and people who were or were not traitor would bribe me. Cmo can and will demote me if it finds out and I accept the outcome, I am greedy after all. As an ASSistant I will break in caps room to gnaw his clothes, never have I took his spare cause in reality I do not need it when I can open doors in 2 sec. As prisoner if you do not visit me and mostly security ignores perma prisoners, I will escape it takes me 120 seconds to break out of prison and will do so. They are sec they have to keep me in line and check for my activity from time to time. I will often organize and gather other moths to raid heads lockers and eat their clothes, shittery to some yes fun to other but in reality I am assistant, literal no one with no important job.

You were that shit captain that round I member you.

Answer: I do not even have cap unlocked, I was prisoner who "walked out" from perma brig and took ssd captain id. Going ssd as a top role for over an hour... jikes, and I played captain better than most of them would anyway.

Why are you shilling for certain admins?

Answer: I like certain admins more than others because of their rulings. I do not care for their personality, I care for fairness in all bans. Even though I was telling Jimmy to fuck off I still think he is better than most admins, same applies to Jack, Rose, Vektor ect.

This is spess men game why u so mad m8, chill?

Answer: Yes, we all want this to be engaging and fun experience, we all do want to be shitters sometimes and act like one. But we want long rounds not 20 minute rounds like on Terry. Shifts can be slow sometimes and you need to spice things up.Cookie Dungeon Master borg who makes dungeon kidnaps non human and forces them to eat 5 cookies to be free. That person doesn`t expect to be taken and locked in a room till he eats the cookies and it leads to interesting escalation. "Accidentally" purging Divina? Fun if it doesn`t happen each round. Its a silly game, the more silliness we add to it more fun can it be, but you should still act within your role. I expect clown to spam my **** is hard joke, but I have different exception for captain. Last hostage situation I member, was when I "kidnaped" warden in prison brig and drank fruit wine while blackmailing hop. Half of station was talking and sec was arming like for Nuclear operatives. It was great fun for others. Ahelped to check if I may release an virus that makes you bald and have beard as non antag and got green light. It was great time on slow shift with nothing happening. Situations create escalation which brings rp and more enjoyment, some more some less. If you are citing rule 1 to someone who is dick to someone else cause he is a shitter then I can tell you that you can kill yourself. Why didn`t you cite rule 1 to him in first place. Calling other people rp less than lowrp while letting slide caps and hos beheadings and puting prisoners heads on spear near their department entrance(this time only captain wanted to behead certain someone for taking stray pod stuff), trying to execute everyone they dislike. Saying that you broke silicon rules when you in reality didn`t break them and go as far as to quote rule 2 of paladin "Law 2: Respect legitimate authority." and respecting his request to get "out" immediately, then realising that borg "technically" followed its laws and have to go to citing rule 1. Well that really grind my gears.



Now if you have not seen your question answered, or this thread exists somewhere that I havent seen it (send it to trash), feel free to jump in and give your opinion. Do you like idea and why? Want it changed somehow? You disagree ect..
Edit 1* grammar error
Would also like to mention that antags should have their own hierarchy on how to act. Syndicate agent and blood brother even if they are "working" for same organisation are not same rank (one is hardcore agent while the other one is possible future recruit), if bb wants to quit it and he could roleplay it out sure thing, but regular agent should not be given that possibility and if he is working against his objectives stricter punishment should be in order. Wizards should be wizards (30 year old virgins), trolls of massive proportions and should have different objective pool. You ever saw a wizard in court room with 20 people, captain as judge and lawyer actually lawyering, and crew screaming to release wizard? Horny Fenlind the wiz did, afer all she was trapped in dick picture the curator held in gallery and once crew destroyed it she was set free... yes I actually role played a wizard it`s possible and was interesting round for most(some people came to defend wizard against hos who wanted to execute it).
Last edited by n00bllna on Sun Jun 07, 2020 11:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Cobby
 
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Re: Roleplay hierarchy and its enforcment

Postby Cobby » Sun Jun 07, 2020 3:17 pm #564625

I dont believe whitelisted roles on a job that already has problems getting players is appropriate for any RP but strict HRP.

If you want people to play these roles, the simple solution I think would be to just give them protections from demotions in the same way sec has protection from arrests. That's assuming people aren't being shyd away due to rev.
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n00bllna
 
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Re: Roleplay hierarchy and its enforcment

Postby n00bllna » Sun Jun 07, 2020 4:06 pm #564630

Cobby wrote:I dont believe whitelisted roles on a job that already has problems getting players is appropriate for any RP but strict HRP.

If you want people to play these roles, the simple solution I think would be to just give them protections from demotions in the same way sec has protection from arrests. That's assuming people aren't being shyd away due to rev.

We of course want people to play these roles, but we also want people choosing to play these roles to act in a way "acceptable" for that position. Protection from demotions, is not protection from sec. Robos stormed sec with gygax today, rd came in to help sec with ion gun. After fight officer without a flinch harm batoned rd and put cuffs on him. 0 words 0 rp, harm baton head of research division, to say "sorry for misunderstanding", and released him 5 minutes later. So 2 things happened, first some robos don`t give a fuck about rd (their boss), second security doesn`t give a fuck if you are rd or any head (unless hos). On the issue about whitelisted, yea maybe its to harsh but how can you force them to act like heads of their department? People in general don`t respect them because of their low rp behaviour and is often said that they are memes on server. And by not respecting them leads to more low rp behaviour. Unless they get stricter rules including security nothing will change.
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Re: Roleplay hierarchy and its enforcment

Postby confused rock » Sun Jun 07, 2020 5:13 pm #564634

good but ironically implication, that assistants don't have to follow the rules as much as regular crewmembers.
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Re: Roleplay hierarchy and its enforcment

Postby n00bllna » Sun Jun 07, 2020 9:42 pm #564643

confused rock wrote:good but ironically implication, that assistants don't have to follow the rules as much as regular crewmembers.


ASSistants are the greytiders, new players, ect.. they are non essential crew member, slightly worse than clown. You don`t expect anything useful from both of them, beside taking gibs whenever they can. Clown should be little above ASSistant because he at least has (debatable) job role...

Good Example: Be moth clown, be retarded enough to break in cap room as some greytiders, break the locker steal all clothes and spray paint (your name) was here on cap floor, announce it with your silly megaphone. You just told people that you committed a crime breaking and entering, destruction of property, vandalism (might as well kidnap cap fox for lols).Sec comes to arrest you, you comply and when asked why you did it, you ask them why not? You being a shitter as you mostly are, created job for engineer to fix dam doors, pissed of captain a lot for vandalism and destruction of his new clothes and forced sec to do their job since cap was screaming over comms. Get 15 minutes in brig and on release tell the sec that you will see them soon

Bad Example: Be moth clown, instead for calling other moths to raid heads lockers to eat clothes or doing something "funny", you tell "yo moma" jokes for 30 minutes or read wgw to crew.



Now imagine if some doctor was doing same... Yea, you don`t expect him to do that.

Now imagine sec or god forgives... hos... breaking other people lockers (cap locker for example). Not only that you don`t expect sec to be thieves, but he should be punished for doing so.
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Re: Roleplay hierarchy and its enforcment

Postby ATHATH » Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:30 pm #564937

put mimes on the same tier as clowns

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Re: Roleplay hierarchy and its enforcment

Postby XivilaiAnaxes » Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:44 pm #564939

Yeah nobody respects the Captain because he's always some mouthbreather who has no game experience.

Best case people are polite to them or are bootlicking sec. Otherwise you're just grey tide lot pinata.

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Re: Roleplay hierarchy and its enforcment

Postby n00bllna » Thu Jun 11, 2020 1:03 pm #565135

ATHATH wrote:put mimes on the same tier as clowns

Mime role is not as simple as clowns, since you can't talk and must gestures. :silentman:
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Re: Roleplay hierarchy and its enforcment

Postby n00bllna » Thu Jun 11, 2020 1:08 pm #565137

XivilaiAnaxes wrote:Yeah nobody respects the Captain because he's always some mouthbreather who has no game experience.

Best case people are polite to them or are bootlicking sec. Otherwise you're just grey tide lot pinata.

It isn`t just captain, cmo who doesn`t know surgeries, ce constantly releasing accidentals singulios ect...
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Re: Roleplay hierarchy and its enforcment

Postby NecromancerAnne » Wed Jun 17, 2020 9:35 am #566273

I believe on goon, where we stole our MRP rules from, there is exactly one whitelist and it's Head of Security. But this is even for Goon Main so...

Anywho, I don't think hierarchy is necessary to be literally enforced. This comes off as a underhanded admin complaint given the way it is worded. We don't need overt hierarchial enforcement and it being ineffectively enforced via the players is part of the fun and helps give players a chance to dictate the flow of the game.


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