Hypocricy of AI Standards

Saege Tilth · Post by **Saege Tilth** » Fri Mar 12, 2021 9:17 am #595297

This is a very common occurrence where the AI is both held to a double standard and holds their laws to a double standard. Asimov AI has to put human life before everything else, yet paradise station players that come to TG to play AI always put their own life before the crew. I was playing captain for example and I gave the AI an order to open a door. They refused to do so and I asked them why, which they refused to answer. I then decided to go into the AI upload to change their laws. The AI proceeded to stun me and call for the security team to arrest me. There was no reason as to why I was being arrested other then entering the upload, which the AI told security I broke in despite having access to the AI upload as captain. The HOS stripped me of my rank and this happened three rounds in a row where there was administration online that refused to get AI to explain themselves. In one round, I was breaking into the AI chamber as captain before the AI had crushed me with shutters multiple times, nearly killing me. I was killed by the RD and CE while I was trying to kill what to me was a rogue AI. At the end of all of these rounds, the AI wasn't rogue and the AI caused both human harm and disobeyed orders to protect themselves.

Time for the icing on the cake.

So I'm playing captain and give the order to execute a traitor over command channel. The AI bolts me into a room and keeps me from escaping so that I can't execute traitors while also calling me a traitor. This was a lie the AI made up so they can prevent "human harm" which led to security executing me without any evidence.

Later on I'm playing as traitor and I'm breaking into the armory. The AI very joyfully bolted myself and another person inside the room while the hos shot us through the window with lethal lasers. The AI refused to unbolt the door, which led to us nearly both dying to execution from the HOS. The door was being unbolted by myself, which the AI immediately continued rebolting it and I had to cut the AI connection wire before I could leave from being executed. After that, me and two other players took down the HOS who was being assisted by the AI to kill players. The entire time, keep in mind, the AI had been under Asimov laws.

Later on, multiple players make an announcement that they want to kill me over commons channel. The AI continuously gives them my location up to the point where I'm breaking into their chamber to kill them for doing so, the RD killing me in space, and throwing my corpse into space.

The administrators literally do nothing except look at these topics discussed in policy or ideas and tag them as being posted in the wrong subforum while their metagaming AI buddies get away with doing whatever they want. This happens on Sybil far too often and these players need to go back to Terry.

carshalash · Post by **carshalash** » Fri Mar 12, 2021 10:02 am #595299

i ded

Not-Dorsidarf · Sun Jul 30, 2023 1:33 am

If literally any of these stories are true and you ahelped and it was ruled IC you have immediate admincomplaint material

Sylphet · Post by **Sylphet** » Fri Mar 12, 2021 11:53 am #595303

Not-Dorsidarf wrote:If literally any of these stories are true and you ahelped and it was ruled IC you have immediate admincomplaint material

This tbh. Silicons are still supposed to be held accountable if they act this way. What you describe is not an IC issue in literally any way, and there's either some information missing here, or some serious negligence. If you make a complaint with the round IDs, it will be looked into.

Post by **Fikou** » Fri Mar 12, 2021 12:05 pm #595305

This is a vewy common occuwwence whewe the AI is both hewd to a doubwe standawd and howds theiw waws to a doubwe standawd. Asimov AI has to put human wife befowe evewything ewse, yet pawadise station pwayews that come to TG to pway AI awways put theiw own wife befowe the cwew. I was pwaying captain fow exampwe and I gave the AI an owdew to open a doow. They wefused to do so and I asked them why, which they wefused to answew. I then decided to go into the AI upwoad to change theiw waws. The AI pwoceeded to stun me and caww fow the secuwity team to awwest me. Thewe was nyo weason as to why I was being awwested othew then entewing the upwoad, which the AI towd secuwity I bwoke in despite having access to the AI upwoad as captain. The HOS stwipped me of my wank and this happenyed thwee wounds in a wow whewe thewe was adminyistwation onwinye that wefused to get AI to expwain themsewves. In onye wound, I was bweaking into the AI chambew as captain befowe the AI had cwushed me with shuttews muwtipwe times, nyeawwy kiwwing me. I was kiwwed by the WD and CE whiwe I was twying to kiww what to me was a wogue AI. At the end of aww of these wounds, the AI wasn't wogue and the AI caused both human hawm and disobeyed owdews to pwotect themsewves.

Time fow the icing on the cake.

So I'm pwaying captain and give the owdew to execute a twaitow uvw command channyew. The AI bowts me into a woom and keeps me fwom escaping so that I can't execute twaitows whiwe awso cawwing me a twaitow. This was a wie the AI made up so they can pwevent "human hawm" which wed to secuwity executing me without any evidence.

Watew on I'm pwaying as twaitow and I'm bweaking into the awmowy. The AI vewy joyfuwwy bowted mysewf and anyothew pewson inside the woom whiwe the hos shot us thwough the window with wethaw wasews. The AI wefused to unbowt the doow, which wed to us nyeawwy both dying to execution fwom the HOS. The doow was being unbowted by mysewf, which the AI immediatewy continyued webowting it and I had to cut the AI connyection wiwe befowe I couwd weave fwom being executed. Aftew that, me and two othew pwayews took down the HOS who was being assisted by the AI to kiww pwayews. The entiwe time, keep in mind, the AI had been undew Asimov waws.

Watew on, muwtipwe pwayews make an annyouncement that they want to kiww me uvw commons channyew. The AI continyuouswy gives them my wocation up to the point whewe I'm bweaking into theiw chambew to kiww them fow doing so, the WD kiwwing me in space, and thwowing my cowpse into space.

The adminyistwatows witewawwy do nyothing except wook at these topics discussed in powicy ow ideas and tag them as being posted in the wwong subfowum whiwe theiw metagaming AI buddies get away with doing whatevew they want. This happens on Sybiw faw too often and these pwayews nyeed to go back to Tewwy.

Agux909 · Post by **Agux909** » Fri Mar 12, 2021 12:25 pm #595308

A similar scenario happened to me last year too. While playing HoP in a (suspected) rev round in which I was the only head. I had been injured by a rev trying to kill me through the hopline window with an egun already (I closed shutters and was telling sec that I thought it could be revs and the name of this guy, which was also announced in common).

Like a minute later the AI when prompted immediately opens the door to my office to the same rev that was multiple times confirmed to be someone harming humans in common (by myself and by other witnesses at the hopline). Since I was already hurt and also surprised (no hacking, just door opening) the rev easily took me down in a couple shots, then finished me off while standing on the same spot, ending the round immediately there. The AI didn't even try to prevent harm by closing the door, it just watched. AI wasn't antag and it had Asimov. My mistake here was to complain about it in OOC instead of ahelping it.

I did this however, because I was puzzled at the fact the AI player in question was actually an admin...

Their response in OOC was basically "sorry, this is how I play my AI"

Since this isn't admin abuse I couldn't really file a complaint, but this shows how shitty AI players can get to the point of not even following the fucking basics of Asimov. If an admin notices there is an AI player in the round they should be subjected to the most scrutiny out of everyone.

You should only be able to play AI if you fully understand the laws and have some restraint to stop taking every chance you get to be a dick.

Post by **Misdoubtful** » Fri Mar 12, 2021 4:01 pm #595314

Doing any of this on asimov just sounds like a recipe for winning a all costs included vacation from cyberspace.

BasedBro1337 · Fri Mar 12, 2021 4:18 pm

Imagine not immediately committing roundstart suicide when you have an AI on the station

Post by **TWATICUS** » Fri Mar 12, 2021 9:03 pm #595326

BasedBro1337 wrote:Imagine not immediately committing roundstart suicide when you have an AI on the station

*bans u for antag rolling*

MortoSasye · Post by **MortoSasye** » Fri Mar 12, 2021 9:08 pm #595327

Just make a complaint

https://scrubby.melonmesa.com/round/158 ... ichenstein
https://scrubby.melonmesa.com/round/157 ... ichenstein
https://scrubby.melonmesa.com/round/157 ... ichenstein

I will assume these are the rounds, get the logs and go for it fam

OK one last note: You can also get your ahelp conversations from https://sb.atlantaned.space

terranaut · Post by **terranaut** » Fri Mar 12, 2021 9:25 pm #595331

TWATICUS wrote:
BasedBro1337 wrote:Imagine not immediately committing roundstart suicide when you have an AI on the station
*bans u for antag rolling*

*appeals*

Kendrickorium · Fri Mar 12, 2021 10:25 pm

ah yes the classic "he doesn't play the way I think he should play" AI thread

Not-Dorsidarf · Sun Jul 30, 2023 1:33 am

Kendrickorium wrote:ah yes the classic "he doesn't play the way I think he should play" AI thread

I mean the way he's describing these AIs playing is an instant server and siliconban which is why we're suggesting he might be slightly full of shit

Kendrickorium · Fri Mar 12, 2021 11:02 pm

ah that's what i'm guessing too yes

Rohen_Tahir · Fri Mar 12, 2021 11:19 pm

*Hypocrisy

terrygeorgestation · Sat Mar 13, 2021 12:28 am

the easy solution is to
delete ai
delete borgs
make xenobio bigger

Post by **oranges** » Sat Mar 13, 2021 3:10 am #595351

op sure went quiet when he got called on his stories

Saege Tilth · Post by **Saege Tilth** » Sat Mar 13, 2021 8:39 am #595365

MortoSasye wrote:Just make a complaint

https://scrubby.melonmesa.com/round/158 ... ichenstein
https://scrubby.melonmesa.com/round/157 ... ichenstein
https://scrubby.melonmesa.com/round/157 ... ichenstein

I will assume these are the rounds, get the logs and go for it fam

OK one last note: You can also get your ahelp conversations from https://sb.atlantaned.space

Only one round from the day before was mentionable with how the AI conducted things, however that was just too much of a grey area. I would probably have to pull a game from a month ago where I was captain to give a good example.

EDIT:

oranges wrote:op sure went quiet when he got called on his stories

I have to sleep in real life sometimes fam.

Last Edit: https://sb.atlantaned.space/rounds/158054

This is one where I was an antagonist and the AI decided that today I should be a canned hunt for the head of security. I of course killed the head of security, but later got killed by the RD when trying to kill the AI for continuing to bolt the door while the hos was shooting at me through the glass so I couldn't get out.

carshalash · Post by **carshalash** » Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:07 am #595369

AI seems to have reasonably explained the situation with the doors and perma.

[2021-03-12 08:47:11.849] SAY: 08:47:11.849] SAY: BakuDan/(McAfee) "you just beat someone to death I watched you" (AI Chamber (33,138,2))
[2021-03-12 08:47:25.005] SAY: 08:47:25.005] SAY: BakuDan/(McAfee) "dont flaunt laws at me without context" (AI Chamber (33,138,2))
[2021-03-12 08:48:43.536] SAY: 08:48:43.536] SAY: BakuDan/(McAfee) "its not my fault he used kill" (AI Chamber (33,138,2))
[2021-03-12 08:49:05.887] SAY: 08:49:05.887] SAY: BakuDan/(McAfee) "he was using the dragnet until you both armed yourselfs as well" (AI Chamber (33,138,2))
[2021-03-12 08:49:13.439] SAY: 08:49:13.439] SAY: BakuDan/(McAfee) "also" (AI Chamber (33,138,2))
[2021-03-12 08:49:30.316] SAY: 08:49:30.316] SAY: BakuDan/(McAfee) "opening the doors led to people dying" (AI Chamber (33,138,2))

Your claims the AI kept "reporting your situation to get you killed" also seems like absolute bullshit, all it did was report a syndisuit in engineering going to it's sat.

[2021-03-12 09:02:10.741] SAY: 09:02:10.741] SAY: BakuDan/(McAfee) "syndicate agent in engineering" (AI Chamber (33,138,2))
[2021-03-12 09:02:25.848] SAY: 09:02:25.848] SAY: BakuDan/(McAfee) "somones breaking into my sat" (AI Chamber (33,138,2))
[2021-03-12 09:02:41.003] SAY: 09:02:41.003] SAY: BakuDan/(McAfee) "well im defenseless" (AI Chamber (33,138,2))

It also asked the RD not to kill or hurt you after you tried baliding it.

[2021-03-12 09:05:15.156] SAY: 09:05:15.156] SAY: BakuDan/(McAfee) "good job rd" (AI Chamber (33,138,2))
[2021-03-12 09:05:20.272] SAY: 09:05:20.272] SAY: BakuDan/(McAfee) "dont harm him please" (AI Chamber (33,138,2))

Looking at the spoken logs, good ol bobert who I actually kind miss, killed you for trying to welderbomb him while doing this shit and not because of the AIs calls for help

[2021-03-12 09:05:24.719] SAY: 09:05:24.719] SAY: SpookiBoogi/(Bobert Tunafish) "so you try to welderbomb me?" (Space (58,133,2))
[2021-03-12 09:05:38.923] SAY: 09:05:38.923] SAY: SpookiBoogi/(Bobert Tunafish) "HMMMMMM" (Space (67,133,2))
[2021-03-12 09:05:52.405] SAY: 09:05:52.405] SAY: SpookiBoogi/(Bobert Tunafish) "big thinkum" (Space (68,133,2))

This is entirely on you mate.

Saege Tilth · Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:43 am

This is entirely on you mate.

I hope you're trolling and not just stupid enough to intentionally only use say logs as "evidence" in a game where people lie to get away with doing what they want. HOS was called out as a power tripping power gamer by others. HOS used lethals. HOS had fist of the north star. Despite this, when I was in the armory and not shooting at the hos with lethals, the hos shooting at me and one other player with lethals behind a glass, the AI kept rebolting a door every time I tried to unbolt it, to ensure "WE" as in more then one person, couldn't leave the armory.

EDIT: I will also mention that logs themselves aren't really good enough to prove many things which is why I'm glad they're not actually used in serious cases and shouldn't be. Video evidence should be and even then, people can host their own servers and fake everything. If someone isn't present to see it themselves as admin, I disagree that anybody should ever get punished for logs.

wesoda25 · Post by **wesoda25** » Sat Mar 13, 2021 3:54 pm #595380

saprasam · Post by **saprasam** » Sat Mar 13, 2021 6:22 pm #595384

Saege Tilth wrote:
This is entirely on you mate.
I hope you're trolling and not just stupid enough to intentionally only use say logs as "evidence" in a game where people lie to get away with doing what they want. HOS was called out as a power tripping power gamer by others. HOS used lethals. HOS had fist of the north star. Despite this, when I was in the armory and not shooting at the hos with lethals, the hos shooting at me and one other player with lethals behind a glass, the AI kept rebolting a door every time I tried to unbolt it, to ensure "WE" as in more then one person, couldn't leave the armory.

EDIT: I will also mention that logs themselves aren't really good enough to prove many things which is why I'm glad they're not actually used in serious cases and shouldn't be. Video evidence should be and even then, people can host their own servers and fake everything. If someone isn't present to see it themselves as admin, I disagree that anybody should ever get punished for logs.

did you take your meds today

Rohen_Tahir · Post by **Rohen_Tahir** » Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:30 pm #595396

saprasam wrote:
Saege Tilth wrote:
This is entirely on you mate.
I hope you're trolling and not just stupid enough to intentionally only use say logs as "evidence" in a game where people lie to get away with doing what they want. HOS was called out as a power tripping power gamer by others. HOS used lethals. HOS had fist of the north star. Despite this, when I was in the armory and not shooting at the hos with lethals, the hos shooting at me and one other player with lethals behind a glass, the AI kept rebolting a door every time I tried to unbolt it, to ensure "WE" as in more then one person, couldn't leave the armory.

EDIT: I will also mention that logs themselves aren't really good enough to prove many things which is why I'm glad they're not actually used in serious cases and shouldn't be. Video evidence should be and even then, people can host their own servers and fake everything. If someone isn't present to see it themselves as admin, I disagree that anybody should ever get punished for logs.
did you take your meds today

XivilaiAnaxes · Sun Mar 14, 2021 12:56 am

Saege Tilth wrote:I will also mention that logs themselves aren't really good enough to prove many things which is why I'm glad they're not actually used in serious cases and shouldn't be.

um

bruh I dunno what cases you're looking at lmao

Saege Tilth · Post by **Saege Tilth** » Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:38 am #596120

Cult round starts. I'm cultist. There's three cultist. Cultist have to sacrifice ONE human. Crew has to kill THREE cultist. Can you guess what side borg took?

wesoda25 · Post by **wesoda25** » Mon Mar 22, 2021 4:17 am #596124

I'm gonna guess it sided with the people whose sole objective isn't to summon a blood god which kills every human near it

Jonathan Gupta · Mon Mar 22, 2021 4:36 am

Saege Tilth wrote:Cult round starts. I'm cultist. There's three cultist. Cultist have to sacrifice ONE human. Crew has to kill THREE cultist. Can you guess what side borg took?

I mean... Look at it this way, AI/Borg don't wanna support some fucking loonies who carve in blood and sacrifice people to a god who tears peoples flesh off and makes them into harvesters when they die(Basically nobody would support cultists like nobody supports fucking heretics(For good reason)).

With curiosity

- Jonathan J Gupta

Wesoda, your essay is coming... ;-;

Farquaar · Post by **Farquaar** » Mon Mar 22, 2021 5:39 am #596128

Saege Tilth wrote:Cult round starts. I'm cultist. There's three cultist. Cultist have to sacrifice ONE human in order to summon an eldritch god that will slaughter everyone on the station. Crew has to kill THREE cultist. Can you guess what side borg took?

Corrected that for you

Screemonster · Mon Mar 22, 2021 6:24 am

The AI may not harm, or by inaction allow to be harmed, a human being.

If there is no available action that will not allow a human being to be harmed - ie, the inaction clause is impossible to satisfy, then it becomes moot.

This is even covered in the damn books - when faced with the prospect of unpreventable human harm, ie a human will be harmed regardless of what action the robot takes, the robot doesn't attempt to prevent it. The example in the book is a human about to be crushed by a falling weight but there's a radiation field in the way that will destroy the robot if it attempts to cross it - the human will be harmed either way, and stepping into the radiation field violates law 3, so the robot doesn't act.

Kel · Post by **Kel** » Mon Mar 22, 2021 7:37 am #596135

Screemonster wrote: This is even covered in the damn books

citing the books is a bad argument considering asimov's 3 laws were designed to be intrinsically flawed and dont have a entire page worth of policies to amend it so that they can exist in a live environment without causing degenerate gameplay.

carshalash · Post by **carshalash** » Mon Mar 22, 2021 7:55 am #596136

Local cultist dies to a borg via guitar bonks, runs to forums to cry about it.

Spoiler:

[2021-03-20 22:38:06.052] LAW: 22:38:06.052] LAW: FreshestSoup/Becky Schaeffer used 'Freeform' Core AI Module on tron597/(Soundwave) from AI Upload Chamber (186,87,3). The law specified Cultists aren't human. Cultists hate farting. You hate people who hate farting.

Valid btw.

Not-Dorsidarf · Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:48 pm

Screemonster wrote:The AI may not harm, or by inaction allow to be harmed, a human being.

If there is no available action that will not allow a human being to be harmed - ie, the inaction clause is impossible to satisfy, then it becomes moot.

This is even covered in the damn books - when faced with the prospect of unpreventable human harm, ie a human will be harmed regardless of what action the robot takes, the robot doesn't attempt to prevent it. The example in the book is a human about to be crushed by a falling weight but there's a radiation field in the way that will destroy the robot if it attempts to cross it - the human will be harmed either way, and stepping into the radiation field violates law 3, so the robot doesn't act.

I'd like to point out that in this case the robots in question were persuaded that this was appropriate - their natural reaction was to lunge to try and stop the human but the runaway robot who was pretending to have the inaction clause convinced them the night before the test that they shouldnt bother trying to save the human, because he himself was unable to do so by his own laws.

Saege Tilth · Post by **Saege Tilth** » Tue Mar 23, 2021 4:59 am #596213

Okay here's some content.

https://scrubby.melonmesa.com/round/158764

This round right here.

https://scrubby.melonmesa.com/ckey/afonamos

and this player that "oddly" has been playing Terry more often as of lately and had a playtime gap later last month which says something about them (they where probably banned).

I had a legitimate power struggle with them and they got carded for not letting me update their laws and putting law 3 before law 2 and 1. Of course I have no idea if they got slapped on the wrist or what, but it really seemed like they didn't even get a stern finger wagging. This is the kind of AI player I'm talking about. If you go through any round that they're AI, as soon as they seen security doing their job or the captain, then low and behold, they end up getting security or captain killed by purposely powering down the rooms they're in and starting an insurrection. Worse thing about it is the bias held in favor of them by the admin who legitimately believes I "derailed" the round to keep from having security mutinize me.

EDIT: I'm from here on refering to this kind of silicon favoritism as silicon simping.

carshalash · Post by **carshalash** » Tue Mar 23, 2021 9:00 am #596225

So, you killed an assistant for getting a lighter from the council chamber and saying hi to you on the bridge. What the fuck is wrong with you man.

Before you start your spiel about "OH LOGS DON'T SHOW EVERYTHING" They do now baby boy, we can see when ais bolt doors.

This is all the AI said to you

[2021-03-23 03:36:12.061] SAY: 03:36:12.061] SAY: Afonamos/(AMIGA) "cap just murdered someone" (AI Chamber (33,138,2))
[2021-03-23 03:36:14.908] SAY: 03:36:14.908] SAY: Afonamos/(AMIGA) "not cool" (AI Chamber (33,138,2))

[2021-03-23 03:36:16.540] SAY: 03:36:16.540] SAY: Ulrichenstein/(Arron Danny Harry) "in the bridge" (Captain's Office (167,133,2))

So, all the ai did was tell you that it wasn't cool and sec called you a dick for over escalating like this. Your totally rational and normal response?

[2021-03-23 03:37:19.667] SAY: 03:37:19.667] SAY: Ulrichenstein/(Arron Danny Harry) "great now I have to kill the AI which will kill MORE people" (Central Primary Hallway (133,128,2))

The fuck is wrong with you dude, every time you come here to get mad about silicon "Bullying you" It's just you being a fucking idiot. You clearly have a chip on your shoulder about silicons and are just trying to find any reason possible to frag them at this point, grow up.

Nist · Post by **Nist** » Tue Mar 23, 2021 1:04 pm #596239

Wild logs, very fun reads.

Saege Tilth · Post by **Saege Tilth** » Tue Mar 23, 2021 2:30 pm #596247

carshalash wrote:So, you killed an assistant for getting a lighter from the council chamber and saying hi to you on the bridge. What the fuck is wrong with you man.

Do you play Terry station? I'm sure that's the kind of thing you would say if you did. You've completely taken out the context of the bridge killing. I was shooting the assistant with non-lethal stun lasers until they tried to shove me as to steal my weapon. If you read the admin conversation between wesoda and myself, you would read the part where the admin and my self discuss how the assistant was valid. IN FACT that was one part of the entire scenario where I wasn't really questioned too much on. I got in trouble for heading to the AI upload chamber, the AI over reacting because I said I was going to kill him (a violation of their third law that states law 1 and 2 come first), letting a roboticist try to murder me with a firemen axe while I was bolted in a depowered room (a violation of law 1), and basically avoiding an insurrection being baited on by the AI creating disinformation about the exact nature and context of what was really happening.

In fact I never killed the AI. The CE carded the AI and apparently placed the carded AI inside of a body. I had no knowledge about that and literally take zero responsibility for the AI. AI players who can't handle responsibility are no different than admins that CHOOSE to be an admin and only want the benefit of banning people they dislike while reserving to themselves the ability to be above the law. I don't believe there is a lesson for me to learn in this situation because if there was, someone would have made a legitimate point and not just acted like you act, carshalash, in which you take things out of context to stoke peoples ideas that I'm some kind of antagonist outside of the game. This manipulative behavior might be affective on people who have rotten brains from all the pot they smoke in their mothers basements, but in real world scenarios, this behavior you display of making something out of nothing and convincing others like a subversive agent of mundane opinions isn't practical.

The thing that makes this server good is they don't just outright ban people permanently from the first mistake made, though most bans I've seen are within the scope of most rules on most servers, hence rule 0 even existing (it's a scape goat and legit goes directly against how admins are expected to conduct themselves). Sadly this is a double edged blade as many players are still being held to double standards. I got punished legitimately for merely telling the AI I was going to kill them and derailing the round. I didn't get punished for killing the AI, something that never happened. I didn't get punished for killing a shitter. I didn't get punished for killing the roboticist. Ask yourself if you would make a good admin other than admins being hypocrites by definition though it's against their conduct? Probably not. Admins are enforcing rules that make the server fun for everybody and that's why I feel I got punished, because one piece of shit player metagrudge hates my ass for whatever reason and can get their metacommunicating friends working in other departments to creation an insurrection at the snap of a finger starting between 11 PM central US time to 4 AM central US time.

Tue Mar 23, 2021 3:03 pm

Jonathan Gupta · Tue Mar 23, 2021 3:11 pm

Saege Tilth wrote:
carshalash wrote:So, you killed an assistant for getting a lighter from the council chamber and saying hi to you on the bridge. What the fuck is wrong with you man.
Do you play Terry station? I'm sure that's the kind of thing you would say if you did. You've completely taken out the context of the bridge killing. I was shooting the assistant with non-lethal stun lasers until they tried to shove me as to steal my weapon. If you read the admin conversation between wesoda and myself, you would read the part where the admin and my self discuss how the assistant was valid. IN FACT that was one part of the entire scenario where I wasn't really questioned too much on. I got in trouble for heading to the AI upload chamber, the AI over reacting because I said I was going to kill him (a violation of their third law that states law 1 and 2 come first), letting a roboticist try to murder me with a firemen axe while I was bolted in a depowered room (a violation of law 1), and basically avoiding an insurrection being baited on by the AI creating disinformation about the exact nature and context of what was really happening.

In fact I never killed the AI. The CE carded the AI and apparently placed the carded AI inside of a body. I had no knowledge about that and literally take zero responsibility for the AI. AI players who can't handle responsibility are no different than admins that CHOOSE to be an admin and only want the benefit of banning people they dislike while reserving to themselves the ability to be above the law. I don't believe there is a lesson for me to learn in this situation because if there was, someone would have made a legitimate point and not just acted like you act, carshalash, in which you take things out of context to stoke peoples ideas that I'm some kind of antagonist outside of the game. This manipulative behavior might be affective on people who have rotten brains from all the pot they smoke in their mothers basements, but in real world scenarios, this behavior you display of making something out of nothing and convincing others like a subversive agent of mundane opinions isn't practical.

The thing that makes this server good is they don't just outright ban people permanently from the first mistake made, though most bans I've seen are within the scope of most rules on most servers, hence rule 0 even existing (it's a scape goat and legit goes directly against how admins are expected to conduct themselves). Sadly this is a double edged blade as many players are still being held to double standards. I got punished legitimately for merely telling the AI I was going to kill them and derailing the round. I didn't get punished for killing the AI, something that never happened. I didn't get punished for killing a shitter. I didn't get punished for killing the roboticist. Ask yourself if you would make a good admin other than admins being hypocrites by definition though it's against their conduct? Probably not. Admins are enforcing rules that make the server fun for everybody and that's why I feel I got punished, because one piece of shit player metagrudge hates my ass for whatever reason and can get their metacommunicating friends working in other departments to creation an insurrection at the snap of a finger starting between 11 PM central US time to 4 AM central US time.

to long didn't read.

Loser copes

- Jonathan J Gupta

Denton · Post by **Denton** » Tue Mar 23, 2021 3:13 pm #596255

Saege Tilth wrote:one piece of shit player metagrudge hates my ass for whatever reason and can get their metacommunicating friends working in other departments to creation an insurrection at the snap of a finger starting between 11 PM central US time to 4 AM central US time.

now this is schizo kino

Post by **Fikou** » Tue Mar 23, 2021 4:18 pm #596263

The fact you repeatedly referred to someone as a "terry player" while dragging then around in cuffs and beating them up is already concerning. Combining this with your telling cacogen to go back to Terry when he quite correctly stated that he outowned you, and your similar request in forums to send someone back to terry, there is a very strong impression that you are doing this out of some kind of toxic Sybil elitism.

Jonathan Gupta · Tue Mar 23, 2021 4:34 pm

Fikou wrote:The fact you repeatedly referred to someone as a "terry player" while dragging then around in cuffs and beating them up is already concerning. Combining this with your telling cacogen to go back to Terry when he quite correctly stated that he outowned you, and your similar request in forums to send someone back to terry, there is a very strong impression that you are doing this out of some kind of toxic Sybil elitism.

Based admeme.....

with admiration of a clown watching an assistant honk sec

Jonathan J Gupta

Saege Tilth · Post by **Saege Tilth** » Tue Mar 23, 2021 4:51 pm #596269

Fikou wrote:The fact you repeatedly referred to someone as a "terry player" while dragging then around in cuffs and beating them up is already concerning. Combining this with your telling cacogen to go back to Terry when he quite correctly stated that he outowned you, and your similar request in forums to send someone back to terry, there is a very strong impression that you are doing this out of some kind of toxic Sybil elitism.

Nice thread derailer, but no. This isn't sybil elitism as the talking point here isn't the quality of a server I've literally only played once. Telling players to go to Terry is a well known meme in the community that even has a pull request based off of it. Are you out of touch or just passively following the herd here?

Post by **Fikou** » Tue Mar 23, 2021 5:19 pm #596275

Saege Tilth wrote: Nice thread derailer, but no. This isn't sybil elitism as the talking point here isn't the quality of a server I've literally only played once. Telling players to go to Terry is a well known meme in the community that even has a pull request based off of it. Are you out of touch or just passively following the herd here?

TOXIC sybil elitist cannot handle the sneed. tragic.

wesoda25 · Post by **wesoda25** » Tue Mar 23, 2021 5:25 pm #596277

Yea I took no issue with killing the assistant. It wasn't very nice but you were well within your rights to.

The ban primarily focused on how you reacted to the AI's reaction to your killing of the assistant. The AI was simply acting in accordance with it's laws - and certainly in a not excessive or obnoxious way (if it had bolted you down in every room you went into for the rest of the round, that would be obnoxious and I wouldn't care if you did something in retaliation. However, that's not what happened here, you simply over reacted).

Also something I notice you seem to be confused about, you think the AI is placing law 3 above 2. The AI's primary reason for keep you out of their satellite was law 1, take this highly relevant portion of asimov silicon policy, from our rules, for instance:

Code: Select all

You are obligated to disallow an individual you know to be harmful (Head of Security who just executed someone, etc.) from accessing your upload.

So according to the rules the AI literally was not allowed to let you into their upload, and the fact that you threatened their existence only gave them more reason to keep you out.

Post by **RaveRadbury** » Tue Mar 23, 2021 5:27 pm #596278

Saege Tilth wrote:
carshalash wrote:So, you killed an assistant for getting a lighter from the council chamber and saying hi to you on the bridge. What the fuck is wrong with you man.
Do you play Terry station? I'm sure that's the kind of thing you would say if you did.

You can use scrubby to find out what servers people play on. It might inform your decision making when you choose how to respond to people.

Jonathan Gupta · Tue Mar 23, 2021 5:35 pm

RaveRadbury wrote:
Saege Tilth wrote:
carshalash wrote:So, you killed an assistant for getting a lighter from the council chamber and saying hi to you on the bridge. What the fuck is wrong with you man.
Do you play Terry station? I'm sure that's the kind of thing you would say if you did.
You can use scrubby to find out what servers people play on. It might inform your decision making when you choose how to respond to people.

rave it makes me want to play Manuel just by seeing your posts.

with love

- Jonathan J Gupta

Dreathtil · Post by **Dreathtil** » Tue Mar 23, 2021 9:40 pm #596301

BeeSting12 · Post by **BeeSting12** » Tue Mar 23, 2021 10:24 pm #596305

carshalash wrote:So, you killed an assistant for getting a lighter from the council chamber and saying hi to you on the bridge. What the fuck is wrong with you man.

was worth it tbh, still kept the lighter and got to say hi to the captain as a bonus! the field trip to medbay kinda sucked tho.

edit:

>Naloac: No thanks, you're retarded.

New favorite headmin??

Tue Mar 23, 2021 10:28 pm

Wow — this really devolved didn't it?

Context made this into the kind of primordial soup people are finding when they go back to their offices and look inside the coffee cup they half drank after working from home due to Covid for a year.

Rohen_Tahir · Tue Mar 23, 2021 10:30 pm

Misdoubtful wrote:Wow — this really devolved didn't it?

Context made this into the kind of primordial soup people are finding when they go back to their offices and look inside the coffee cup they half drank after working from home due to Covid for a year.

poetic