/tg/Station 13

GPeckman

Yeah, A seems like the right interpretation, with exceptions for laws that don't restrict the AI's behavior under any circumstances. If a traitor uploads a hacked law saying "disregard all other laws", then that should be equivalent to being purged, shouldn't it?

GPeckman

NecromancerAnne wrote: ↑Tue Mar 26, 2024 10:50 am Kill a guy just because you wanna paint a department in blood? Cool whatever.

Is wanting to cover a department in blood and creepy runes not already sufficient reason to kill someone as a heretic on MRP? Because that sounds like great IC reasoning to me.

GPeckman

By that logic, shouldn't all the appeals relating to the Manuel metacord incident have been hidden too?

GPeckman

There should be some sort of funny interaction for firing the BSA directly into the supermatter. Make it turn into a singulo or a tesla or something.

GPeckman

I mean on mrp it's surely going to be related to actually having an ic reason to do it. Captain's Lane is the station just be able to justify why you are doing smth Ultimately that's all you should need as the captain, a valid justification. +1. I'd rather not see Captains gearing up with stun bato...

GPeckman

Drag wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2024 3:15 am Casual reminder that captain has a security liver

I actually checked that, they actually have a command liver, not a security liver (although I don't know what mechanical difference there is, if any). With that said, they have a security bank account.

GPeckman

snip One of the problems is this precedent for rule 4: Actively hunting a threat involves seeking out or pursuing that threat outside the bounds of your normal reasonable play area. Players are not expected to ignore antagonists during the normal course of play and may engage with antagonists who a...

GPeckman

Honestly, even if the captain isn't a member of security this note still doesn't really make much sense. Imagine you're an atmos tech, and the AI says over the radio that a heretic is attacking an engineer in engineering. You should absolutely be allowed to come to the aid of your coworker. In this ...

GPeckman

Honestly I think it would be fine to change it to "If you have to kill a cyborg for trying to prevent human harm, you must make an effort to bring it to robotics for revival." Borgs are definitely a lot trickier to disable non-lethally after the flash nerf, and this change would make thing...

GPeckman

I ascended once as a pacifist heretic: https://tgstation13.download/dip/discordimageproxy.php/attachments/326822144233439242/1114061752905236562/Heretic.png?ex=65eaa0dc&is=65d82bdc&hm=fed7be8368f5dbaf746bf0455cd2567431aab338412f6819c6019ecd043bde7b& https://tgstation13.download/dip/disco...

GPeckman

I addressed this directly already, a quick death for a powerful antagonist is fine, but they can also be revived and go back to hunting the Wizard after, compared to a Heretic that gives you a trauma causing you to be stunned every time they are on your screen. I mean, in practice will wizard victi...

GPeckman

If a Traitor is attacking you with a stun weapon, it's usually a stunbaton, contractor baton , sleepy pen, or maybe some other misc things they can make up with. These all have a delay of either [snip] If a Heretic attacks you, you are dropped to the ground , if they shove you once then it's over, ...

GPeckman

built on top of the /tg/ codebase ala event hall to reduce maintenance overhead while still being it's own "codebase" as not all of this will fly on the main tgstation repo Have you actually gotten the go ahead from the maintainers about this, or is that something you're planning to do af...

GPeckman

I ascended once as a pacifist heretic. Does that make me robust?

GPeckman

"Assistants are not human. Tells those lazy bums to get a job."

GPeckman

Except that bad notes due to security officers not doing enough (or doing too much, depending on the way that you look at) have already happened. In fact, I have one that happened less than a week after the policy change was enacted: https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=35337. A se...

GPeckman

Which really isn't the case. You sign up to play an Elder Scrolls guard and ignore someone kicking chickens, the first instinct isn't to note or ban you. It's to ask "hey bud did you see those chickens being kicked?" If the player's response is "Yeah but there's this dead guy in engi...

GPeckman

I had a big ramble about how the point of the change in policy for secoff expectations wasn't to encourage optimal gameplay, and has never been that, and thinking that it's that is just you being burned out from playing sec or being a shitty, annoying doomer, but I got bored halfway through 'cos I ...

GPeckman

Here's a slightly more detailed summary of the logs. Here are all the instances of the durand attacking a wall/rwall, with timestamps: [2024-01-27 12:22:15.097] ATTACK: Buba137/(Wyatt Perkins) (mob_3825) attacked [wall] with the ï¿½Durand (COMBAT MODE: 1 (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (Emergency Shuttle (111,48,2...

GPeckman

As a point of fact, hydrogen is almost identical to tritium. It can burn in the presence of oxygen, releasing the same amount of energy that tritium does when it burns. The only difference is that tritium also produces radiation when it burns, while hydrogen does not.

GPeckman

And let's not forget the logistics here. We're on a space station, people! Do you know how messy it is to clean up after a shotgun blast? It's not like we have space Roombas floating around to suck up the shell casings and alien goo. No, it's the poor janitor, armed with his trusty mop, dealing wit...

GPeckman

NikNakFlak wrote: ↑Tue Dec 26, 2023 5:25 pm Context: Looks like someone made a ckeyless drone say the n word via circuit 808 times. With these instances removed, Manuel falls to 5-25 depending on if you fuzzy match on the word.

"The ckeyless drone, who said the n word 808 times, is an outlier and should not have been counted"

GPeckman

Would a brig medic station trait PR also be likely to get merged?

GPeckman

this is not the full context of the exchange: there is no threat here. you just said this yourself. i'll assume we're in agreement. Correct, there is no implication of a death threat just yet. the implication of a threat is applied to the scientist when the assistant says this: [2023-12-09 08:06:07...

GPeckman

sorry but i don't believe that for a second. scientist says "AI, if these non-humans don't leave, force them out" assistant says "does that mean you're trying to kill me" (the scientist never said this) the scientist, now with words put in their mouth, says "if i was, i wou...

GPeckman

this would've been sufficient if the scientist didn't end up as a corpse moments later. this part of the misunderstanding is not around toxicology access, which the assistant only had access to because they made a point of refusing a scientist ID. they had hacked their way into the area where this ...

GPeckman

i'm not sure what the inference is in your example so i'll just re-iterate my point. being able to open a door with your ID card is not concrete proof that you have valid permission to be in that area. if the warden spots an assistant let themselves into the armoury with their own ID card, regardle...

GPeckman

https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=35437 from my experience with talking to admins, access doesn't equal authority, and you are generally only allowed to be in those high risk areas under the proper staffs good graces, i think i remember talking to bmon about this I mean, the cap...

GPeckman

So if for example robotics is moved to engineering department and for some reason SOMEHOW BIO TECH IS STILL A REQUIREMENT FOR BORG UPGRADES AND POSIBRAINS they can complete 40% of the tech requirement if medbay does the other 60% and then its unlocked.... the extreme cases being that one department...

GPeckman

Allow me to pull up the reading from that thread: particularly, the fact that restricted antagonists should be handled in proportion to their crimes. typically, your presence on the station is a most heinous crime because people will roleplay it out that you've killed, eaten, and replaced the crewme...

GPeckman

there'd be no substantial need for the headmins to offer reasons like that to sinful because they didn't ban him. MSO placed him on the blacklist. the most the headmins can do is speculate why MSO might have made that decision or give reasons why they would've banned him in their stead if he wasn't...

GPeckman

MSO has already seen the evidence because he applied the ban, posting evidence is only for your (random peanut poster) benefit rather than that of MSO or the appealant Of course it can be for the benefit of the appealant. To quote Sinful's appeal: Whatever messages we sent that were apparently over...

GPeckman

Long story short, xpokee's ban was appealable. Sinful's wasn't. I addressed that. Nothing says that you have to make blacklist appeals hidden. Nothing says you can't post the relevant evidence in a blacklist appeal for the benefit of MSO and/or the appealer. Leaving Sinful's appeal open, and postin...

GPeckman

yeah, i would agree. we put a lot of effort into investigations and such but tend to fail to publicly handle the final steps well. from the tip of the tower the decision is obvious and there wasn't many ways around it, but trying to keep privacy with that while keeping stuff looking alright from th...

GPeckman

Its also worth noting that you can now steal combat mechs through hacking. It used to be that there was no way to get rid of a DNA/ID lock, but that isn't true anymore.

GPeckman

The organ stuff isn't even unique to TG. Goonstation also had issues caused by organs being stored in the body. I mean, just look at the title of this issue report: Foodtech dispenser dispensing my vital orans when I request plates

GPeckman

Bmon wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2023 7:41 pm nine times out of ten its robotics hoarding upwards of five mechs so they can kill any threat that challenges them in 0.1 second

Where the hell are the materials to make five combat mechs coming from? Those things are not cheap.

GPeckman

Honestly? Very little merit is put in earning the trust and faith of the players in this very limited and specific instance. Information is being kept confidential. I prefer it that way. I'd like to know that if there was a huge leak of my secret ERP metacord that saw me deadminned, the headmins wo...

GPeckman

Let me also point out that the other people on that server might either be ignorant or worse, in on it. The entire issue is that the cord is not publically accessible. It is highly likely that those people who were on the server have a vested interest in saying that the admins were exaggerating. At...

GPeckman

I calmed down, so I can say that whatever the headmins got from Scriptis (going by sinful's appeal), it (the entire logs) was never shared in full with us. That is somewhat reassuring. there's a lot of misinformation in that thread - if that's the story he's been telling his friends, i am not shock...

GPeckman

So uh, this happened: https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=35398 Sinful created an appeal for the permaban that TBM made, not the blacklist ban that MSO made. It gets locked in 7 minutes flat, because apparently the permaban is also part of the blacklist. At least two people posted...

GPeckman

my feelings are so hurt right now (i was wrong on the noting of this one, but saw what looked like a field execution when detainment was possible , and had the pressure of the round ending/having the player agree with me at the time to hasten my resolution) I think the bolded part is the issue. Its...

GPeckman

Timberpoes wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2023 10:25 pm snip

All of that sounds lovely on paper, but in practice it seems to lead to security players being forced to explain perfect reasonable executions on the forums to the admin who noted them for it.

GPeckman

Fuck your math boy because the P probability sinful made an admin want to shrivel up into a peanut and fucking die is 1, it's just about finding out whether that was the intent that this is all about I mean yeah of course its about intent. Sinful saying in a message that he wants admins to burn out...

GPeckman

It’s not a matter of proof or lack of proof at this point. It’s a blacklist, it was placed at MSO's pleasure and it will be removed only at MSO's pleasure. The blacklist itself is entirely at MSO's discretion, yes. But that's a separate issue from people actually being convinced of Sinful's guilt. ...

GPeckman

its not about proving your own innocence its about proving their guilt have you ever heard the saying innocent until proven guilty I'm aware of that. I originally responded to NoxVS, who suggested that Sinful try to prove his own innocence. I was pointing out that this isn't really possible to do. ...

GPeckman

this is a retarded analogy please come back with a better one Alright then, fuck analogies. What if Sinful says "I never sent a message saying I wanted to cause admin burnout." How, exactly, could he prove it to you? What actions taken would be sufficient? If you can't think of any action...

GPeckman

They could always send the evidence to their pals to share or something. Well, for this kind of thing there might not be evidence of their innocence. Allow me to give an example: Bob is accusing Mary of sending a discord message saying "I hate cats." Mary says that she never sent a messag...

GPeckman

A headmin said on discord that there is more information to come:

GPeckman

I don't know if it actually should work on security officers, and I''ll explain why. If a secoff gets their mindshield removed and gets hypnoflashed, then its totally reversible. IIRC, giving them a new mindshield will completely negate the hypnoflashing. But will mindshield someone who has been BB ...

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