The death of Box station?
- Danowar
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The death of Box station?
So from what I'm hearing ingame, Box might be getting phased out for Metastation. My question is: why? I thought it was obvious that people favored Box since, despite Basil running Metastation for awhile, it was often a low-pop station in comparison to Sybil (which seems even worse for Meta since it is a bit bigger than Box). I know Metastation has been around for a few years now, but I don't understand why there seems to be plans for suddenly making it the standard station map for Sybil.
Surely I'm not the only one who favors Box here, am I? I know it's been Sybil's bread-and-butter for awhile now, but I think it fits the theme of SS13 being a metal deathtrap far better than Metastation's "comfy" wide-open spaces.
Surely I'm not the only one who favors Box here, am I? I know it's been Sybil's bread-and-butter for awhile now, but I think it fits the theme of SS13 being a metal deathtrap far better than Metastation's "comfy" wide-open spaces.
- Ikarrus
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Re: The death of Box station?
I just find metastation too safe and secure. Box is an intentionally shitty map, with designed weaknesses and scarcity of resources. Whereas metastation is a paradise packed full of junk and gives everyone whatever they want.
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- MrStonedOne
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Re: The death of Box station?
Right now, sybil is running metastation because somebody mentioned that it should in ooc, then others agreed, then a vote was had, and meta won, and I was asked to change it to meta.
As for what happens after that....
no fucking idea.
As for what happens after that....
no fucking idea.
- leibniz
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Re: The death of Box station?
I agree, while a large maint is nice, things like the securitron in the armory are a turn-off.Ikarrus wrote:I just find metastation too safe and secure. Box is an intentionally shitty map, with designed weaknesses and scarcity of resources. Whereas metastation is a paradise packed full of junk and gives everyone whatever they want.
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Re: The death of Box station?
If there isn't a dedicated boxstation server I will probably stop playing and if I stop playing down the line I'd probably stop coding, or worse, not stop coding.
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Re: The death of Box station?
Jesus Christ it's hilarious how much some people don't like metastation.
Mindlessly playing the same map over and over is pretty terrible you know.
They're just maps. They have different strengths and weaknesses but ultimately it doesn't change how the game is played, and if anything, makes things less stagnant.
Mindlessly playing the same map over and over is pretty terrible you know.
They're just maps. They have different strengths and weaknesses but ultimately it doesn't change how the game is played, and if anything, makes things less stagnant.
Last edited by lumipharon on Mon Jul 20, 2015 1:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
- Ikarrus
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Re: The death of Box station?
We're mindless because we don't share your opinion, is that it?lumipharon wrote:Jesus Christ it's hilarious how much some people don't like metastation.
Mindlessly playing the same map over and over is pretty terrible you know.
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Re: The death of Box station?
No, people that say they're going to stop playing because of the map with little to no explaination as to why the difference in map ruins the game for them are mindlessly hating difference.
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Re: The death of Box station?
The only one who hasn't provided a reason here is Incoming, but I know his reasons because he's stated his many times before. Which are more or less in line with the reasons already stated here by others.lumipharon wrote:No, people that say they're going to stop playing because of the map with little to no explaination as to why the difference in map ruins the game for them are mindlessly hating difference.
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Re: The death of Box station?
Clearly, A difference in opinion must indicate such to a mind as clandestine and brilliant as that
At that level of intillect things are not opinions, or philosophy, they are either fact or they are not, and anyone who cannot see things that way possesses an inferior mind incapable of little more than drooling eating pooping and reproducing.
Metastation isn't bad, it's just an inferior product, I'll eat a mc-chicken, but why the fuck should I when there is rotisserie roasting at home?
At that level of intillect things are not opinions, or philosophy, they are either fact or they are not, and anyone who cannot see things that way possesses an inferior mind incapable of little more than drooling eating pooping and reproducing.
Metastation isn't bad, it's just an inferior product, I'll eat a mc-chicken, but why the fuck should I when there is rotisserie roasting at home?
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Re: The death of Box station?
and I have heard endless in OOC, an previous threads/discussions about it where people effectively say they hate meta and refuse to play on notbox.
Just because I say this here doesn't mean I'm directly attacking every person in the thread. Unless you sincerely believe that I'm wrong, and that there aren't lots of people that strongly dislike meta for no proper reason.
Just because I say this here doesn't mean I'm directly attacking every person in the thread. Unless you sincerely believe that I'm wrong, and that there aren't lots of people that strongly dislike meta for no proper reason.
- Ikarrus
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Re: The death of Box station?
I just don't believe you've bothered to ask them in an environment conducive to fleshed out discussion.
OOC is pretty terrible for that, it's usually filled with random discussions and people are generally distracted by actually playing the game.
I'm just saying that just because they haven't given a reason doesn't mean there aren't any. We're providing plenty of that here.
OOC is pretty terrible for that, it's usually filled with random discussions and people are generally distracted by actually playing the game.
I'm just saying that just because they haven't given a reason doesn't mean there aren't any. We're providing plenty of that here.
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Re: The death of Box station?
I'm pretty sure nobody said we're permanently removing box.
People can't go one hour without freaking out about trying a new map.
People can't go one hour without freaking out about trying a new map.
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Re: The death of Box station?
I've given my reasons multiple times; it's too big, it's too safe, there a ton of rooms that exist entirely for the sake of flavor. There's entirely too much given for free at roundstart, there's no scarcity of resources. There's places on the map that could probably survive 5 meteor waves in succession. You can always find a place to hide, even at high pop, you don't ever come into conflict with anyone unless both sides specifically want to.
Metastation is a map that was designed to make people feel comfortable, boxstation is a map that's been mercilessly tweaked to make make people feel vulnerable. My preferred environment is one where the very structure of the station is as much a hazard as the antagonists who exist in it. That's why I like box so much more. The game that I enjoy playing doesn't really seem to exist on metastation. It's nothing personal, it just ain't my bag or the direction I feel like map design should be working towards.
Metastation is a map that was designed to make people feel comfortable, boxstation is a map that's been mercilessly tweaked to make make people feel vulnerable. My preferred environment is one where the very structure of the station is as much a hazard as the antagonists who exist in it. That's why I like box so much more. The game that I enjoy playing doesn't really seem to exist on metastation. It's nothing personal, it just ain't my bag or the direction I feel like map design should be working towards.
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Re: The death of Box station?
I'd rather play box for eternity than meta. Meta just doesn't work for me. In addition to what Ikarrus pointed out about being a safe paradise, there are no dead areas. It's always crowded everywhere. If you think traitors can't breathe in Box, it will be even worse in Meta.lumipharon wrote:Jesus Christ it's hilarious how much some people don't like metastation.
Mindlessly playing the same map over and over is pretty terrible you know.
They're just maps. They have different strengths and weaknesses but ultimately it doesn't change how the game is played, and if anything, makes things less stagnant.
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Re: The death of Box station?
What's the difference in resources between the maps?
From memory, the only things that stand out is rng free gun in the armory, a multi belt in maint (which is inferior in every way to the trashbag in box maint), and I THINK a pair of insulated gloves somewhere.
How on earth is Box a death trap compared to metastation? They're both safe as fuck, over all.
The defining difference for me, is that metastation has intelligent maint access, so medstaff can go into maint from medbay, and the maint airlocks from there to the open corridor they can also use. This lets you use it as an emergency access route (like when they is a plasma fire).
On box, you can go from medbay into maint as a medstaff, then you're just stuck there. There is no logical point to even getting access to the maint door at all.
But I mean both maps are good and well thought out, and I'd sure as hell rather play both then just play one till the end of time.
Meta has arrivals/library, and escape/chapel. Other then the chapel though, there is NOTHING down at escape to go to, other then maint.
I unno, basically I can't understand how people can feel so strongly about any map when they're not even that different. They have a bridge box with a main corridor around it, with the departments branching off that, and the AI on a satallite.
From memory, the only things that stand out is rng free gun in the armory, a multi belt in maint (which is inferior in every way to the trashbag in box maint), and I THINK a pair of insulated gloves somewhere.
How on earth is Box a death trap compared to metastation? They're both safe as fuck, over all.
The defining difference for me, is that metastation has intelligent maint access, so medstaff can go into maint from medbay, and the maint airlocks from there to the open corridor they can also use. This lets you use it as an emergency access route (like when they is a plasma fire).
On box, you can go from medbay into maint as a medstaff, then you're just stuck there. There is no logical point to even getting access to the maint door at all.
But I mean both maps are good and well thought out, and I'd sure as hell rather play both then just play one till the end of time.
Box is dead around arrivals, and around library/chapel, although both of those are visible to anyone going to science.Scott wrote:I'd rather play box for eternity than meta. Meta just doesn't work for me. In addition to what Ikarrus pointed out about being a safe paradise, there are no dead areas. It's always crowded everywhere. If you think traitors can't breathe in Box, it will be even worse in Meta.
Meta has arrivals/library, and escape/chapel. Other then the chapel though, there is NOTHING down at escape to go to, other then maint.
I unno, basically I can't understand how people can feel so strongly about any map when they're not even that different. They have a bridge box with a main corridor around it, with the departments branching off that, and the AI on a satallite.
Last edited by lumipharon on Mon Jul 20, 2015 2:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
- Falamazeer
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Re: The death of Box station?
If it's so great why is basil unoccupied compared with sibyl?
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Re: The death of Box station?
No lumi, Meta isn't well thought out. At least not for the play style that evolved in Box. We're a Box community, you have to deal with that.
Metastation is undoubtedly an achievement, completing a map of its size and maintaining it is Hard. But it's just no good for 50+ people, in my opinion.
Metastation is undoubtedly an achievement, completing a map of its size and maintaining it is Hard. But it's just no good for 50+ people, in my opinion.
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Re: The death of Box station?
Who wants to play a dead server, and lots of people don't like a different map.
a couple of years ago, when I first started playing on badger, sybil was DEAD AS FUCK, and badger (with metastation) was constantly high pop. Shit changes.
I'm not even defendin Meta as glorioussuperiormap, just that fact that the differences are so small that there's nothing really worth complaining about.
a couple of years ago, when I first started playing on badger, sybil was DEAD AS FUCK, and badger (with metastation) was constantly high pop. Shit changes.
I'm not even defendin Meta as glorioussuperiormap, just that fact that the differences are so small that there's nothing really worth complaining about.
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Re: The death of Box station?
You're a lying shit.lumipharon wrote: a couple of years ago, when I first started playing on badger, sybil was DEAD AS FUCK, and badger (with metastation) was constantly high pop. Shit changes..
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Re: The death of Box station?
No, really.
Sybil died for like, a week or some shit.
Even after it came back, for months it stayed dead, and ony slowly bounced back because the same old story. Person gets on, sees no one on server 1, loads of people on server 2. Who wants to play 2 pop server, regardless of map?
Sybil died for like, a week or some shit.
Even after it came back, for months it stayed dead, and ony slowly bounced back because the same old story. Person gets on, sees no one on server 1, loads of people on server 2. Who wants to play 2 pop server, regardless of map?
- TechnoAlchemist
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Re: The death of Box station?
I started playing on Basil and I can confirm that it was highpop with Metastation.Scott wrote:You're a lying shit.lumipharon wrote: a couple of years ago, when I first started playing on badger, sybil was DEAD AS FUCK, and badger (with metastation) was constantly high pop. Shit changes..
Anyways, I think Meta is much better, it really opens up opportunities for stealth traitors, and it makes it much easier to get away with lowkey gameplay which really hails to the nature of traitor/ling/cult. I think that Meta is much more in the spirit of ss13.
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Re: The death of Box station?
People loved badger (the real, original badger) more because of how it was ran than what map it was running. There was another server running meta that was dead and when badger died, it didn't suddenly gain all the people who had been on badger.
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Re: The death of Box station?
TechnoAlchemist wrote:I started playing on Basil and I can confirm that it was highpop with Metastation.Scott wrote:You're a lying shit.lumipharon wrote: a couple of years ago, when I first started playing on badger, sybil was DEAD AS FUCK, and badger (with metastation) was constantly high pop. Shit changes..
Anyways, I think Meta is much better, it really opens up opportunities for stealth traitors, and it makes it much easier to get away with lowkey gameplay which really hails to the nature of traitor/ling/cult. I think that Meta is much more in the spirit of ss13.
lumipharon wrote:No, really.
Sybil died for like, a week or some shit.
Even after it came back, for months it stayed dead, and ony slowly bounced back because the same old story. Person gets on, sees no one on server 1, loads of people on server 2. Who wants to play 2 pop server, regardless of map?
I was here before and during Badger, it was popular during HBL and then it died. It never dominated the population scale.
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Re: The death of Box station?
The only time Sybil was dead was when it was hit by DDOSs constantly for like a week.
Badger was hosted by crossbowman at the time, so it wasn't hit the same way that Sybil did.
It had trouble recovering from that because of coder drama. I still remember when Badger station nearly killed coderbus, with Aranclanos and Cheridan as the only active contributors remaining. Everyone else jumped ship.
Badger ended when crossbowman decided to close it down and join forces with SoS.
Badger was hosted by crossbowman at the time, so it wasn't hit the same way that Sybil did.
It had trouble recovering from that because of coder drama. I still remember when Badger station nearly killed coderbus, with Aranclanos and Cheridan as the only active contributors remaining. Everyone else jumped ship.
Badger ended when crossbowman decided to close it down and join forces with SoS.
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Re: The death of Box station?
Meta is fun sometimes. Having a few rounds today was a blast.
Is it good all the time? Probably not.
Is it good all the time? Probably not.
plplplplp WOOOOooo hahahhaha
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Re: The death of Box station?
Meh.
Doesn't bother me a bit, hell, i'd play on a ported version of goon if it men't something new.
Box is box, its the same old shit we have had forever
Meta is bigger, roomier, and has more shit in it. Box on steriods essentially.
It doesn't bother me, meta's pretty cool, so is box.
Doesn't bother me a bit, hell, i'd play on a ported version of goon if it men't something new.
Box is box, its the same old shit we have had forever
Meta is bigger, roomier, and has more shit in it. Box on steriods essentially.
It doesn't bother me, meta's pretty cool, so is box.
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Re: The death of Box station?
I really do love the hypocrisy of these metashills. If you complain about their precious map, they tell you to "deal with it" or embrace change" while they refuse to take their own advice when directed to bagil. If all the people that voted for meta went to bagil then they would easily reach 50+ players combined with the native bagil population and there wouldn't be metafriends anymore because the bagil natives wouldn't be so lonely. However, no one wants to switch servers because they're lazy fucks. This wouldn't be so bad if bagil hosted box while sybil hosted meta but instead the only choice we have right now is high pop meta or low pop meta.
It really amazes me at how people dislike bagil so much that they would make sybil host meta rather than just play on bagil.
It really amazes me at how people dislike bagil so much that they would make sybil host meta rather than just play on bagil.
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Re: The death of Box station?
MSO said that he was going to put box on basil.deputi wrote:I really do love the hypocrisy of these metashills. If you complain about their precious map, they tell you to "deal with it" or embrace change" while they refuse to take their own advice when directed to bagil. If all the people that voted for meta went to bagil then they would easily reach 50+ players combined with the native bagil population and there wouldn't be metafriends anymore because the bagil natives wouldn't be so lonely. However, no one wants to switch servers because they're lazy fucks. This wouldn't be so bad if bagil hosted box while sybil hosted meta but instead the only choice we have right now is high pop meta or low pop meta.
It really amazes me at how people dislike bagil so much that they would make sybil host meta rather than just play on bagil.
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Re: The death of Box station?
Sweet, I'm in
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Re: The death of Box station?
So what's the point of all this? Swapping the maps between the servers?
Just seems like a waste of time.
Just seems like a waste of time.
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Re: The death of Box station?
It's been done before, it didn't work then either. Eventually everything just normalizes. Only thing it does is manually syncs character slots between the servers.
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Re: The death of Box station?
Meta was literally only on box as long as the vote won for meta. The moment box won, we switched back. (excluding the one extra round we ran due to MSO needing to change configs)
He's currently working on a map rotation system for tg, so its likely that the maps will be changing every so often.
He's currently working on a map rotation system for tg, so its likely that the maps will be changing every so often.
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Re: The death of Box station?
Alternate maps in bagil at the same time.
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Re: The death of Box station?
Both box and meta are good in different ways. No reason we can't run both.
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Re: The death of Box station?
box is so fucking boring. The only reason I played on sybil wasn't because of box. I played because of the high pop. and I'm pretty sure that's why 90% of the people there play on sybil. It's not that it's bad... it's just really really stale. The same situations have happened to me and many other players so many times. How many times has the holodeck been on fire. How many times has the medbay and that hallway area been bombed. How many times have you been killed in that narrow maint hallway between genetics and science where theres no room to manuver. I think it's time for a change. I don't think people actually like box, they're just playing on sybil because it has more players and no one wants to play on snoozefest low pop. Of course I'm not speaking for everyone, but just from what I've noticed, this is what I've concluded.
fuck
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Re: The death of Box station?
So was I, and I distinctly remember a time where badger dominated the pop, and everyone joined it. There was a reason there were threads mourning the death of badger. I remember server 1 being barren as fuck. Everyone just played on server 2 (badger) for like a round, and everyone started coming back because when you see the server list, you click the one with more people. Well at least that's what I and many other people do.Scott wrote:TechnoAlchemist wrote:I started playing on Basil and I can confirm that it was highpop with Metastation.Scott wrote:You're a lying shit.lumipharon wrote: a couple of years ago, when I first started playing on badger, sybil was DEAD AS FUCK, and badger (with metastation) was constantly high pop. Shit changes..
Anyways, I think Meta is much better, it really opens up opportunities for stealth traitors, and it makes it much easier to get away with lowkey gameplay which really hails to the nature of traitor/ling/cult. I think that Meta is much more in the spirit of ss13.lumipharon wrote:No, really.
Sybil died for like, a week or some shit.
Even after it came back, for months it stayed dead, and ony slowly bounced back because the same old story. Person gets on, sees no one on server 1, loads of people on server 2. Who wants to play 2 pop server, regardless of map?
I was here before and during Badger, it was popular during HBL and then it died. It never dominated the population scale.
fuck
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Re: The death of Box station?
Box is not a bad map.
Box however is fucking stale and overplayed. You literally can't run the same map over and over and over and expect people not to get bored.
Variety is a good thing.
If you absolutely can't play on anything other than box....I seriously don't get how you function as a human being.
Box however is fucking stale and overplayed. You literally can't run the same map over and over and over and expect people not to get bored.
Variety is a good thing.
If you absolutely can't play on anything other than box....I seriously don't get how you function as a human being.
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Re: The death of Box station?
I prefer variety but meta isn't new, it is a lot of nice things but it isn't that.
Good to see change though.
Good to see change though.
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- Joined: Fri May 30, 2014 11:55 am
- Byond Username: Tornadium
Re: The death of Box station?
I'd like to see new map concepts being developed, however for a lot of people meta is new.Incomptinence wrote:I prefer variety but meta isn't new, it is a lot of nice things but it isn't that.
Good to see change though.
Hell for people who have played it before it feels new.
- oranges
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 9:16 pm
- Byond Username: Optimumtact
- Github Username: optimumtact
- Location: #CHATSHITGETBANGED
Re: The death of Box station?
I like box, it plays well
- peoplearestrange
- Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 12:02 pm
- Byond Username: Peoplearestrange
- Location: old
Re: The death of Box station?
This is such a stupid course of reasoning. Does no one remember that basil was on Box for the longest time and it changed nothing in terms of population of basil.Falamazeer wrote:If it's so great why is basil unoccupied compared with sibyl?
I also noticed no decrease of players because of metastation, people here just sound like old men nattering that it "was better in the old days".
Also why has no one suggested the idea of a map rotation? Is it possible? can we get it so it does 5 rounds box 5 rounds meta?
Whatever
Spoiler:
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- Joined: Fri May 30, 2014 11:55 am
- Byond Username: Tornadium
Re: The death of Box station?
I actually made a suggestion thread a few weeks ago for a map rotation.peoplearestrange wrote:This is such a stupid course of reasoning. Does no one remember that basil was on Box for the longest time and it changed nothing in terms of population of basil.Falamazeer wrote:If it's so great why is basil unoccupied compared with sibyl?
I also noticed no decrease of players because of metastation, people here just sound like old men nattering that it "was better in the old days".
Also why has no one suggested the idea of a map rotation? Is it possible? can we get it so it does 5 rounds box 5 rounds meta?
- Lumbermancer
- Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2014 3:40 am
- Byond Username: Lumbermancer
Re: The death of Box station?
It's true. I was a Badger guy as well. Sybil was laggy as shit back in the day too.Scott wrote:You're a lying shit.lumipharon wrote: a couple of years ago, when I first started playing on badger, sybil was DEAD AS FUCK, and badger (with metastation) was constantly high pop. Shit changes..
Either way this thread is stupid. The answer to the loaded question "The death of box station?" should be "No", followed by a lock.
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- Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 3:29 am
- Byond Username: Amelius
Re: The death of Box station?
I played Meta some more. The biggest reason I dislike it is that it feels like there's way too many resources. There's no scarcity, hell, there's even a public autolathe. Eugh.
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- TGMC Administrator
- Joined: Mon Apr 28, 2014 4:40 am
- Byond Username: Lumipharon
Re: The death of Box station?
That's two things I dislike about meta.
Public lathe (that fucking cunts steal round start to make their maint base so they can murder bone with infinite revolver ammo), and the fucking CHEM SETUP in XENOBIO.
Like seriously, what reason does xenobio need this?
Public lathe (that fucking cunts steal round start to make their maint base so they can murder bone with infinite revolver ammo), and the fucking CHEM SETUP in XENOBIO.
Like seriously, what reason does xenobio need this?
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- Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2014 12:23 am
- Byond Username: Kromgar
Re: The death of Box station?
I clearly need it for my radiumlumipharon wrote:That's two things I dislike about meta.
Public lathe (that fucking cunts steal round start to make their maint base so they can murder bone with infinite revolver ammo), and the fucking CHEM SETUP in XENOBIO.
Like seriously, what reason does xenobio need this?
Planet Station Best Station
Vote Planetstation and Kor Phaeron 2017
Vote Planetstation and Kor Phaeron 2017
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- Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 1:47 pm
- Byond Username: Callanrockslol
Re: The death of Box station?
Don't talk shit about public autolathe that thing was the shit. Chem dispensers outside chemistry is dumb. Lots of fairly major design things like that will need to be addressed if it gets put on a rotation.lumipharon wrote:That's two things I dislike about meta.
Public lathe (that fucking cunts steal round start to make their maint base so they can murder bone with infinite revolver ammo), and the fucking CHEM SETUP in XENOBIO.
Like seriously, what reason does xenobio need this?
Barely playable at peak times and still the best SS13 experiences I ever had somehow.Lumbermancer wrote:Sybil was laggy as shit back in the day too.
The most excessive signature on /tg/station13.
Still not even at the limit after 8 fucking years.
The evil holoparasite user I can't believe its not DIO and his holoparasite I can't believe its not Skub have been defeated by the Spacedust Crusaders, but what has been taken from the station can never be returned.
OOC: TheGel: Literally a guy in a suit with a shuttle full of xenos. That's a doozy
Still not even at the limit after 8 fucking years.
Spoiler:
OOC: TheGel: Literally a guy in a suit with a shuttle full of xenos. That's a doozy
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- Joined: Fri May 30, 2014 11:55 am
- Byond Username: Tornadium
Re: The death of Box station?
It's an entirely different style of play from Box, We NEED more of this.Amelius wrote:I played Meta some more. The biggest reason I dislike it is that it feels like there's way too many resources. There's no scarcity, hell, there's even a public autolathe. Eugh.
Also, We had a pretty overwhelming choice for Meta over Box last night again. Same people bitching here that were bitching in-game.
Clearly people don't want to only play box anymore.
- peoplearestrange
- Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 12:02 pm
- Byond Username: Peoplearestrange
- Location: old
Re: The death of Box station?
If you have feedback for the metastation map it be great to plonk it in the feedback thread for it.
https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=3090
As Tornadium says it is a different playstyle to box being a very different map, however a rotation in how you play the game can be a great thing. It helps keep it fresh and means you end up with new things to work with.
https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=3090
As Tornadium says it is a different playstyle to box being a very different map, however a rotation in how you play the game can be a great thing. It helps keep it fresh and means you end up with new things to work with.
Whatever
Spoiler:
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