MAP ROTATION

ThanatosRa · Post by **ThanatosRa** » Fri Oct 02, 2015 9:10 pm #122723

Bottom post of the previous page:

Keep this in if only to spite them.

Scones · Post by **Scones** » Fri Oct 02, 2015 9:16 pm #122724

People are like lemmings and mass suicides are a meme that will not last

Shadowlight213 · Fri Oct 02, 2015 10:31 pm

If you suicide and demand swarmers or other ghost stuff, expect admins to laugh at you. You decided to suicide. Deal with your boredom.

Zilenan91 · Post by **Zilenan91** » Fri Oct 02, 2015 11:56 pm #122738

Oldman Robustin wrote:snip
Saegrimr wrote:

Also how do you know they didn't suicide just so they could get their antag roll then ghost around and learn the map instead of protesting about it.

CPTANT · Post by **CPTANT** » Sat Oct 03, 2015 1:12 am #122748

Every "major gamebreaking fault" that I have seen Metastation is some stupid detail (that may or may not effect how you play).

Its a perfectly fine map, grow up.

Xhagi · Post by **Xhagi** » Sat Oct 03, 2015 3:07 am #122759

70 players on Ministation with Rev/10

I like seeing the different maps, it takes some time but you can relearn them. A change of scenery is nice, and provides more challenge when I don't know where everything is right at round start.

Also no, after a mass suicide at the HoP line I will not spawn swarmers because the round is dull. You decided to quit the round, I'm not going to just let you back in because, surprise, your bored.

Incomptinence · Sat Oct 03, 2015 3:10 am

I like it.

tuypo1 · Post by **tuypo1** » Sat Oct 03, 2015 3:20 am #122763

im not used to this layout of ministation the one we have at d20 is so difrent

Not-Dorsidarf · Sun Jul 30, 2023 1:33 am

Oldman Robustin wrote:Only thing that's beyond question here is the ability of the average player to have competent knowledge of several maps. I research maps more than 99% of the players here and I still doubt my ability to become map competent on more than 3-4 maps.

First round of map rotation:

http://imgur.com/tCjREQ7

20% of the crew suicides off the bat. This is not a healthy round and doesn't enhance the game. Many veteran players do not want Dora the Explorer rounds and treat non-Box rounds about as seriously as you treat Meteor rounds.

Edit: Deadchat started mass chanting for swarmers so that we could destroy this abomination of a map.

Edit 2: 40 people in dead chat now, most of their own free will.

Yeah, and the round after when we played box, 15% of the crew gibbed themself in the HOP line at roundstart, too, including half of the sec team.

Airtank HOPline mass-suicides are a meme at the moment, especially when the first thing in every single round is

[Common] Oldman Robustin yells, "MASS SUICIDE AT HOP LINE EVERYONE COME EXPLODE"

Tornadium · Post by **Tornadium** » Sat Oct 03, 2015 11:23 am #122811

>Actively tries to start mass suicides
>Makes a complaint about it

Dude fucking what.

Grazyn · Post by **Grazyn** » Sat Oct 03, 2015 1:57 pm #122836

you should probably add a lobby message about the new map rotation thing because the preference is hidden in "game preferences" and you can only set it before joining, since it's not in the "preferences" tab

Danowar · Post by **Danowar** » Sat Oct 03, 2015 3:51 pm #122856

If we don't end up with a dedicated box station, then I'm moving on. I don't see why we keep a dedicated meta server around when no one plays on it.

Wyzack · Post by **Wyzack** » Sat Oct 03, 2015 4:05 pm #122857

Map rotation for basil when

Tornadium · Post by **Tornadium** » Sat Oct 03, 2015 4:22 pm #122859

We don't need dedicated servers for any map.

Amelius · Post by **Amelius** » Sat Oct 03, 2015 4:46 pm #122864

Non-0.5x vote weighting for Box when? Getting real sick of this shit.

Tornadium · Post by **Tornadium** » Sat Oct 03, 2015 5:00 pm #122866

Amelius wrote:Non-0.5x vote weighting for Box when? Getting real sick of this shit.

Hey other people are actually really enjoying not playing box all the time.

Jacough · Post by **Jacough** » Sat Oct 03, 2015 6:04 pm #122872

Oldman Robustin wrote: 20% of the crew suicides off the bat. This is not a healthy round and doesn't enhance the game. Many veteran players do not want Dora the Explorer rounds and treat non-Box rounds about as seriously as you treat Meteor rounds.

I guess all I can say is that those 20% of the crew are fucking stupid and could have just, you know, opened up a map our God forbid, explore and taken in some of the new sights. Immediately killing yourself and taking yourself out of the round permanently just because "waaah I don't know this map layout by heat yet" is just being a huge baby.

CPTANT · Post by **CPTANT** » Sat Oct 03, 2015 6:07 pm #122873

Jacough wrote:
Oldman Robustin wrote: 20% of the crew suicides off the bat. This is not a healthy round and doesn't enhance the game. Many veteran players do not want Dora the Explorer rounds and treat non-Box rounds about as seriously as you treat Meteor rounds.
I guess all I can say is that those 20% of the crew are fucking stupid and could have just, you know, opened up a map our God forbid, explore and taken in some of the new sights. Immediately killing yourself and taking yourself out of the round permanently just because "waaah I don't know this map layout by heat yet" is just being a huge baby.

[youtube]LHpdgHTINik[/youtube]

Post by **oranges** » Sun Oct 04, 2015 12:08 pm #123020

Tornadium wrote:>Actively tries to start mass suicides
>Makes a complaint about it

Dude fucking what.

This is some next level memery here

Whats up with the map vote weightings? why not just let the popular maps win?

J_Madison · Post by **J_Madison** » Sun Oct 04, 2015 12:59 pm #123039

Git gud, just because you're a one trick pony that only plays on Boxstation doesn't mean others aren't.

I can powergame in over 300 different ways, and that's only on ministation.

Looks like you need to step your game up.

Post by **MrStonedOne** » Sun Oct 04, 2015 1:30 pm #123046

map weights was changed for the first round only, to get it to actually rotate to something.

other then that, all maps have had a map weight of 1, outside of ministation, who had 0.5

Miauw · Post by **Miauw** » Sun Oct 04, 2015 1:33 pm #123047

pls mso i want birdboatstation to make bagil rounds more bearable

Post by **oranges** » Sun Oct 04, 2015 1:57 pm #123054

J_Madison wrote:Git gud, just because you're a one trick pony that only plays on Boxstation doesn't mean others aren't.

I can powergame in over 300 different ways, and that's only on ministation.

Looks like you need to step your game up.

what the literal fuck are you chinwagging about you unrobust dirtback. back to your wheelstation.

Grazyn · Post by **Grazyn** » Sun Oct 04, 2015 2:03 pm #123058

can we please add efficienty station too?

Not-Dorsidarf · Sun Oct 04, 2015 4:16 pm

MrStonedOne wrote:map weights was changed for the first round only, to get it to actually rotate to something.

other then that, all maps have had a map weight of 1, outside of ministation, who had 0.5

So what amelius has been sperging all over OOC and the forums was completely wrong?

Cuck.

Luke Cox · Post by **Luke Cox** » Tue Oct 06, 2015 7:49 am #123549

When can we expect to see this fully implemented on Sybil?

Tornadium · Post by **Tornadium** » Tue Oct 06, 2015 10:34 am #123563

It feels about right at the moment.

Seeing plenty of Dream Station, Meta and Ministation (On 90 fucking pop for some reason) but it's on box often enough for it to be the "main" map.

Seriously though 90 man ministation is FINAL DESTINATION for security. I'm going to have nightmares about that 50 man greytide assaulting the brig.

tuypo1 · Post by **tuypo1** » Tue Oct 06, 2015 11:10 am #123571

to be fair i have not been in game much the last few days so i dont have much idea of the map rates.

Wyzack · Post by **Wyzack** » Tue Oct 06, 2015 2:48 pm #123609

Asking again because I never got answered, when will we get this on basil? Will we ever? I wana try birdboatstation

Zilenan91 · Post by **Zilenan91** » Wed Oct 07, 2015 12:19 am #123771

If I can ask, what was wrong with the test outside of some maps not compiling? It seemed mostly working and ready to merge as it was.

Post by **oranges** » Wed Oct 07, 2015 12:29 am #123775

There are a few bugs that remain to be fixed, but don't panic, this is basically locked in

Danowar · Post by **Danowar** » Wed Oct 07, 2015 12:33 am #123776

oranges wrote:There are a few bugs that remain to be fixed, but don't panic, this is basically locked in

will you at least turn the other server into 24/7 box so I won't have to hang myself whenever meta gets picked.

Zilenan91 · Post by **Zilenan91** » Wed Oct 07, 2015 12:33 am #123777

Oh yeah I have full confidence this will get merged eventually, I was just wondering what the bugs were.

Grazyn · Post by **Grazyn** » Wed Oct 07, 2015 9:20 am #123920

I think the problem is with the maps not the map rotation system itself. Missing tiles, pipes etc.

Incoming · Post by **Incoming** » Wed Oct 07, 2015 9:45 am #123923

I'll say it again: The difficulty of maintaining maps scales exponentially with the number of maps to maintain.

Oldman Robustin · Wed Oct 07, 2015 6:32 pm

Everything I've seen in map rotations exhibits the problems I mentioned.

Nobody knows where anything is and every round just feels like a chaotic free for all since a random bluespace anomaly is more likely to show up and save your life than security.

Do you really think any number of rounds is going to give the average crew member competence on every map on rotation?

When I yell "HELP CULT SMES" or "ENEMY DOMINATOR PLACED IN SMES" or plain old-fashioned "BEING MURDERED IN SMES ROOM", take a look at Dreamstation and tell me that you honestly believe that the average security officer will ever know how to find that room.

Of course the first two examples are less likely since I found that rallying team antags is equally shit since everyone just gets lost trying to find you.

The new map novelty is going to wear off far sooner than sub-par round experiences because of crew+map incompetence.

WJohnston · Post by **WJohnston** » Wed Oct 07, 2015 6:54 pm #124063

You know, maybe players should get good by actually learning maps? You've stagnated and played box to the point of it being a routine. Try something new, try figuring out the map, enjoy the new weakspots and secrets etc. There's more content to explore now than ever before.

Incoming · Post by **Incoming** » Thu Oct 08, 2015 12:08 am #124154

Rounds don't progress when servers are completely empty, and restart votes never seem to trigger the map rotation. The net effect here is that if a server ends up empty with an unpopular map it can remain abandoned for a long time.

LiamLime · Post by **LiamLime** » Thu Oct 08, 2015 12:19 am #124164

All I can contribute to this is that we tried map rotation before in the gateway era and it was a colossal failure. I don't think we need to try it again. Sounds great on paper, but in reality, people have preferences and map rotation only makes a small but loud minority whine that their favourite map was not selected - at every single round start.

Absalom · Post by **Absalom** » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:23 am #124263

Just had a rev "round" with 30+ people on ministation.

Yeah it didn't last long

Tornadium · Post by **Tornadium** » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:25 am #124264

Absalom wrote:Just had a rev "round" with 30+ people on ministation.

Yeah it didn't last long

Sec must have been shit.

They did pretty damn well vs a 40 man gray tide wave that one round.

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:54 am #124266

We had a Nuke Op round where three of the Ops could not find the station.

Amusingly this was because the Op Ship lied on their location, meaning they went the wrong way due to the ship telling them they were in the wrong place.

Also it seemed hard for the remaining Ops, or station personal, to coordinate due to them not knowing the layout.

Tornadium · Post by **Tornadium** » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:59 am #124268

Steelpoint wrote:We had a Nuke Op round where three of the Ops could not find the station.

Amusingly this was because the Op Ship lied on their location, meaning they went the wrong way due to the ship telling them they were in the wrong place.

Also it seemed hard for the remaining Ops, or station personal, to coordinate due to them not knowing the layout.

These sound like teething problems and not problems with the concept of a map rotation.

newfren · Post by **newfren** » Thu Oct 08, 2015 12:20 pm #124295

Did those nuke ops not have a fucking pinpointer.

Oldman Robustin · Thu Oct 08, 2015 12:39 pm

Tornadium wrote:
Steelpoint wrote:We had a Nuke Op round where three of the Ops could not find the station.

Amusingly this was because the Op Ship lied on their location, meaning they went the wrong way due to the ship telling them they were in the wrong place.

Also it seemed hard for the remaining Ops, or station personal, to coordinate due to them not knowing the layout.
These sound like teething problems and not problems with the concept of a map rotation.

Again, Ops make fundamental mistakes on BOX and they're one of the oldest gametypes and their basic mechanics haven't changed in half a decade.

Map rotation only aggravates the problem.

Sure some things will get better but you'll see a disparity develop as powergaymen crew learn all the secrets and have a stun baton, grenade, pneumatic cannon, and all sorts of goodies after 2 minutes in maint while the security tasked with stopping them can't even find major departments.

Wyzack · Post by **Wyzack** » Thu Oct 08, 2015 1:20 pm #124310

Can we get birdboatstation into the rotation for basil?

Tsaricide · Post by **Tsaricide** » Thu Oct 08, 2015 2:56 pm #124349

Anyway to make it so if an admin hits random rotation button it won't select the same map?

Post by **MrStonedOne** » Thu Oct 08, 2015 6:23 pm #124429

Not at the moment, The rotation system has no way of linking the current map to its internal map list.

I might change this by giving maps a new define listing the name of the loader file, since the name of the dm map loader file is how the rotation system internally identifies maps.

Luke Cox · Post by **Luke Cox** » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:37 pm #124478

Dreamstation is kind of a clusterfuck. I'd remove it from rotation. Ideally, the choices should be Box, Meta, and a third choice that gets cycled out every few weeks. Ministation and Birdboatstation should only be available for low population rounds.

Post by **MrStonedOne** » Fri Oct 09, 2015 1:27 am #124545

The current map vote config (taken from sybil, basil's is mostly the same with the default set to metastation)

Code: Select all

map tgstation2
	friendlyname Box Station
	default
endmap

map metastation
	friendlyname Meta Station
endmap

map ministation
	friendlyname Mini Station
	maxplayers 20
	voteweight 0.5
endmap

map birdstation
	friendlyname Bird Boat Station
	maxplayers 30
endmap

map dreamstation
	friendlyname Dream Station
endmap

map DiscStation
	friendlyname Disc Station
	voteweight 0
endmap

A map must have at least 1 vote to count for random rotation.

Incoming · Post by **Incoming** » Sun Oct 11, 2015 5:48 pm #125188

There's kind of a problem with choosing a low pop map as your preferential, because it means that for any round above the player threshold (which on sybil can be most of them) you're effectively wasting your vote. As a side effect I think most people won't pick a low pop map as their preferential, which would mean that even at low pop, it'd probably stay on maps more suited for high pop.

An option for a fallback choice might be a decent idea.