Chemistry macros

[Dax Dupont]

One button kill/bone juice seems retarded and way too easy.
Chemistry should at least have a little bit of timegate instead of just being press button receive death syringe mix.

[TribeOfBeavers]

I made a bunch of the macros and I found the reason it was so strong is that you can input 1u amounts. It lets you make much smaller versions of most recipies (most importantly you can make minimum 3u oil instead of 15u) which lets you do more in one beaker.

If 5u was the minimum it'd be more of a way to mass produce simple chems instead of complex ones.

[iamgoofball]

Literally all this does is save you clicks and prevent carpal tunnel

[Dax Dupont]

Literally all this does is save you clicks and prevent carpal tunnel

Yeah and cut down on the time to make something.
and see

I made a bunch of the macros and I found the reason it was so strong is that you can input 1u amounts. It lets you make much smaller versions of most recipies (most importantly you can make minimum 3u oil instead of 15u) which lets you do more in one beaker.

If 5u was the minimum it'd be more of a way to mass produce simple chems instead of complex ones.

[CPTANT]

So why isn't there just an 1u button on the machine anyway....

[CPTANT]

Literally all this does is save you clicks and prevent carpal tunnel

No this literally makes it possible to mass produce medicines and grenades in quantities not seen before.

[Oldman Robustin]

"Number of clicks" is practically the only form of balance we have for gating non-antag weaponry.

Removing it is a BIG DEAL.

It also highlights one of the problems of chemistry: People are just Wiki pasters.

Why dont we just replace all the chem buttons with all the (non-traitor) chems on the Wiki page and call it a day?

I'm kinda shocked this got merged.

[iamgoofball]

"Number of clicks" is practically the only form of balance we have for gating non-antag weaponry.

Removing it is a BIG DEAL.

It also highlights one of the problems of chemistry: People are just Wiki pasters.

Why dont we just replace all the chem buttons with all the (non-traitor) chems on the Wiki page and call it a day?

I'm kinda shocked this got merged.

because balancing something around "does this person have a working mouse or working autoclicker and if so what's their cookie clicker CPM record" is dumb

[iamgoofball]

i did my best to balance the goonchem ports around the actual reagent effects and not the production time

if shit like tricord/bicard/kelotane becomes a problem from mass production and stacking that's not my problem lol, should of just not re-added them

[CPTANT]

"Number of clicks" is practically the only form of balance we have for gating non-antag weaponry.

Removing it is a BIG DEAL.

It also highlights one of the problems of chemistry: People are just Wiki pasters.

Why dont we just replace all the chem buttons with all the (non-traitor) chems on the Wiki page and call it a day?

I'm kinda shocked this got merged.

because balancing something around "does this person have a working mouse or working autoclicker and if so what's their cookie clicker CPM record" is dumb

I agree its dumb.

However removing that restriction without putting something else in place is also dumb.

[iamgoofball]

"Number of clicks" is practically the only form of balance we have for gating non-antag weaponry.

Removing it is a BIG DEAL.

It also highlights one of the problems of chemistry: People are just Wiki pasters.

Why dont we just replace all the chem buttons with all the (non-traitor) chems on the Wiki page and call it a day?

I'm kinda shocked this got merged.

because balancing something around "does this person have a working mouse or working autoclicker and if so what's their cookie clicker CPM record" is dumb

I agree its dumb.

However removing that restriction without putting something else in place is also dumb.

see above post re: goonchems

[Oldman Robustin]

However removing that restriction without putting something else in place is also dumb.

Yes, thats the entire theme here.

Was chem balancing around it being a pain in the ass to click up chems a great system? No.

Did it still prevent people from spamming the most annoying chem mixes? Yes.

Now you've got copypasting chem where you've got a big gap in productivity between "normal player using chemistry as intended" and "turbohitler copypasting everything he needs from his deathmix from notepad".

At this point its just a Telescience-style knowledge gap where if you dont have a personal powergaming file shared on the forums then you're literally doing your job wrong - and just like telescience it's only a matter of time before it gets removed or gutted.

[iamgoofball]

At this point its just a Telescience-style knowledge gap where if you dont have a personal powergaming file shared on the forums then you're literally doing your job wrong - and just like telescience it's only a matter of time before it gets removed or gutted.

every fucking job is "consult the outside guide for the meta" you idiot, why don't you realize this

[iamgoofball]

>check the wiki for optimal supermatter setup
>check the medical page for best chem mixes
>check the R&D page for best 5 minute scien-oh wait we got rid of that one because time gates lol, wait
>check the R&D page for the optimal techweb path since its not randomized
>check the robotics page for best mecha combo
>check the slime page for best slime path
>check the cargo page for stock tips
>check the mining page for damage breakpoints
>check the security page to die

you can bitch about this after you've made every job procedurally generated with no way to metagame or powergame it

[D&B]

>Mining page for damage breakpoint

That doesn't make player magically able to not die to goliaths

[iamgoofball]

>Mining page for damage breakpoint

That doesn't make player magically able to not die to goliaths

what is your point here

[oranges]

there's more gameplay to mining than just the points, unlike chemistry

[iamgoofball]

there's more gameplay to mining than just the points, unlike chemistry

there's more gameplay to chemistry than just the mixing too

application, chemical mixes, countering, healing odd shit, treating diseases, etc.

[Deitus]

i did my best to balance the goonchem ports around the actual reagent effects and not the production time

if shit like tricord/bicard/kelotane becomes a problem from mass production and stacking that's not my problem lol, should of just not re-added them

>I coded and merged this while knowing it could be very easily exploited but if it does get exploited it's not my problem

??????????????

[PKPenguin321]

>check the wiki for optimal supermatter setup
>check the medical page for best chem mixes
>check the R&D page for best 5 minute scien-oh wait we got rid of that one because time gates lol, wait
>check the R&D page for the optimal techweb path since its not randomized
>check the robotics page for best mecha combo
>check the slime page for best slime path
>check the cargo page for stock tips
>check the mining page for damage breakpoints
>check the security page to die

you can bitch about this after you've made every job procedurally generated with no way to metagame or powergame it

nigger, a blind man could see how these things aren't the same
we removed NTSL in part because the extent of what it was used for was copy-pasting a .txt with no downside or real gameplay involved
instead of arguing against the copypaste part you're screaming about guides in general
reading a beginner guide on how to switch hands and then switching hands is not the same as pushing ctrl+c ctrl+v and getting 100u of instant death
all you are doing is strawmanning and deflecting blame onto trekchems (?!) for literally no reason except to draw attention from this because even you must know you don't have an argument

like i'm impartial to the feature at hand here but stop making yourself look like a complete retard in front of everybody, it's embarrassing and makes it hard to vouch for you

[ShadowDimentio]

On Goon macros spat out a fixed amount (10U) for each chem and just went in order, so your fancy complex chem mixes still needed a bunch of steps to complete.

[EagleWiz]

So this lets you use an out of game pastebin with chem macros to be vastly better at ingame chemistry, and the feature is all but worthless without said out of game meta resource?
Between this, circuits, and an attempt to reward toxin mixes with much faster R&D research I wouldn't be surprised if goof tried to add a feature that awards traitors with extra TP for entering the correct password, as provided daily by Powergame Friends Discord.

[iamgoofball]

i did my best to balance the goonchem ports around the actual reagent effects and not the production time

if shit like tricord/bicard/kelotane becomes a problem from mass production and stacking that's not my problem lol, should of just not re-added them

>I coded and merged this while knowing it could be very easily exploited but if it does get exploited it's not my problem

??????????????

I didn't readd tricord's recipe you fucknugget

[iamgoofball]

So this lets you use an out of game pastebin with chem macros to be vastly better at ingame chemistry, and the feature is all but worthless without said out of game meta resource?
Between this, circuits, and an attempt to reward toxin mixes with much faster R&D research I wouldn't be surprised if goof tried to add a feature that awards traitors with extra TP for entering the correct password, as provided daily by Powergame Friends Discord.

Sorry dipshit but people are bored of the same set path mechanic and I don't see you coding procedural generation for mechanics

[CPTANT]

i did my best to balance the goonchem ports around the actual reagent effects and not the production time

if shit like tricord/bicard/kelotane becomes a problem from mass production and stacking that's not my problem lol, should of just not re-added them

>I coded and merged this while knowing it could be very easily exploited but if it does get exploited it's not my problem

??????????????

I didn't readd tricord's recipe you fucknugget

Why use tricord when your styptic and silver sulfadine patches heal instantly and without OD......

Seriously, what downside do you even think your own chems have?

[Deitus]

i did my best to balance the goonchem ports around the actual reagent effects and not the production time

if shit like tricord/bicard/kelotane becomes a problem from mass production and stacking that's not my problem lol, should of just not re-added them

>I coded and merged this while knowing it could be very easily exploited but if it does get exploited it's not my problem

??????????????

[iamgoofball]

i did my best to balance the goonchem ports around the actual reagent effects and not the production time

if shit like tricord/bicard/kelotane becomes a problem from mass production and stacking that's not my problem lol, should of just not re-added them

>I coded and merged this while knowing it could be very easily exploited but if it does get exploited it's not my problem

??????????????

I didn't readd tricord's recipe you fucknugget

Why use tricord when your styptic and silver sulfadine patches heal instantly and without OD......

Seriously, what downside do you even think your own chems have?

Styptic And Sulf have a basic knowledge gate for application. Don't you dare try to tell me you want the basic healing chems to be harder to use. You're lying if you do.

[Deitus]

>check the wiki for optimal supermatter setup
>check the medical page for best chem mixes
>check the R&D page for best 5 minute scien-oh wait we got rid of that one because time gates lol, wait
>check the R&D page for the optimal techweb path since its not randomized
>check the robotics page for best mecha combo
>check the slime page for best slime path
>check the cargo page for stock tips
>check the mining page for damage breakpoints
>check the security page to die

you can bitch about this after you've made every job procedurally generated with no way to metagame or powergame it

nigger, a blind man could see how these things aren't the same
we removed NTSL in part because the extent of what it was used for was copy-pasting a .txt with no downside or real gameplay involved
instead of arguing against the copypaste part you're screaming about guides in general
reading a beginner guide on how to switch hands and then switching hands is not the same as pushing ctrl+c ctrl+v and getting 100u of instant death
all you are doing is strawmanning and deflecting blame onto trekchems (?!) for literally no reason except to draw attention from this because even you must know you don't have an argument

like i'm impartial to the feature at hand here but stop making yourself look like a complete retard in front of everybody, it's embarrassing and makes it hard to vouch for you

i did my best to balance the goonchem ports around the actual reagent effects and not the production time

if shit like tricord/bicard/kelotane becomes a problem from mass production and stacking that's not my problem lol, should of just not re-added them

>I coded and merged this while knowing it could be very easily exploited but if it does get exploited it's not my problem

??????????????

[iamgoofball]

wow deitus, I knew you were fucking retarded but holy shit this is a new low

[SpaceInaba]

reminder that goof is so retarded he got himself gitbanned by being a huge dick

[iamgoofball]

reminder that goof is so retarded he got himself gitbanned by being a huge dick

reminder that your strawman knows no bounds

[kevinz000]

Why bother responding to goof he doesn't play and he doesn't listen

[iamgoofball]

Why bother responding to goof he doesn't play and he doesn't listen

Yup.

[iamgoofball]

actually, you know what

if you insist chemistry is so easy, then I will try this:

https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/pull/34235

[Deitus]

>goof sees something he doesnt like
>"i know ill code something that allows it to be really easily exploited so i can get it removed heh im a genius nobody will notice"
>slams face on keyboard until something resembling code gets spewed out
>merges it
>people dont like it and point out how it can be really easily exploited
>"ITS NOT MY FAULT IF IT GETS EXPLOITED WITH THE CODE THAT I SPECIFICALLY ACKNOWLEDGE IS VERY EASILY EXPLOITED WE SHOULD REMOVE THESE CHEMS AMIRITE???"
>("SHIT they're onto me!")
>"I-IM JUST TRYING TO PREVENT CARPAL TUNNEL IN A GAME SPECIFICALLY ABOUT CLICKING THINGS"
>[provides non-answers to people who dont agree with them, call them retarded, or outright ignores them]
>[usues strawman argument multiple times while accusing others of doing so]

Why bother responding to goof he doesn't play and he doesn't listen

>doesnt play
>doesnt listen
>still allowed to code
so why do we still let him shit up the server?

[onleavedontatme]

Deitus complaining repeatedly that goof merged his own PRs makes this thread worth it

[iamgoofball]

Deitus complaining repeatedly that goof merged his own PRs makes this thread worth it

the funnier part is he thinks I re-added mixing trekchems

[Deitus]

the only funny (sad) thing is that head/admins constantly let you get away with this, but thats par for the course ive come to realize

[MMMiracles]

THEY CAN'T KEEP LETTING HIM GET AWAY WITH THIS!

[Dr_bee]

While I am all for medicine interaction, looking at the PR it just looks like a hamfisted way to stop people from taking healing chems and a REALLY good way to accidentally or purposefully poison people.

It would be better if the chemicals still did what they were supposed to do but had more interesting side effects than toxin damage, although it would make sense for certain drug interactions to be toxic.

Also the topical stuff shouldnt have a drug interaction, as the brute one is just a powder that causes blood vessels to constrict on contact and another is just a topical antibiotic used for burns.

It would be better just to cap the amount of effective topical chems to like 20 or 30 units or something, and any more being used before the chemical gets out of the persons blood stream being wasted. Also they really shouldnt have any healing effect when in the bloodstream as they are literally just ointments not drugs.

Trekchems can have a place as slower, longer term more reliable healing, with some interactions if you mix them, like possibly headaches that cause you to drop things, liver damage, or mild toxin damage.

I mean the system is a neat base it is just the interactions themselves are kinda... shittily balanced and uninteresting.

[D&B]

While I am all for medicine interaction, looking at the PR it just looks like a hamfisted way to stop people from taking healing chems and a REALLY good way to accidentally or purposefully poison people.

It would be better if the chemicals still did what they were supposed to do but had more interesting side effects than toxin damage, although it would make sense for certain drug interactions to be toxic.

Also the topical stuff shouldnt have a drug interaction, as the brute one is just a powder that causes blood vessels to constrict on contact and another is just a topical antibiotic used for burns.

It would be better just to cap the amount of effective topical chems to like 20 or 30 units or something, and any more being used before the chemical gets out of the persons blood stream being wasted. Also they really shouldnt have any healing effect when in the bloodstream as they are literally just ointments not drugs.

Trekchems can have a place as slower, longer term more reliable healing, with some interactions if you mix them, like possibly headaches that cause you to drop things, liver damage, or mild toxin damage.

I mean the system is a neat base it is just the interactions themselves are kinda... shittily balanced and uninteresting.

Code it then

[oranges]

the only funny (sad) thing is that head/admins constantly let you get away with this, but thats par for the course ive come to realize

What in the christ are you talking about.

Nowhere in your inconsistent fumbling rants, have you identified anyone even remotely responsible for `letting goof get away with`

jesus christ, do you have brain damage?

[ShadowDimentio]

>Want to become a coder
>Make baby's first PR adding a 1 and 2 unit transfer to bottles
>Shitstorm brews about removing droppers and this being unbalanced
>Denied

>Goof PR that lets you make any chem with one click
>It's merged

Coding is a sham and maintainers are a joke

[D&B]

MRTY did the PR though, not goof.

[Deitus]

the only funny (sad) thing is that head/admins constantly let you get away with this, but thats par for the course ive come to realize

What in the christ are you talking about.

Nowhere in your inconsistent fumbling rants, have you identified anyone even remotely responsible for `letting goof get away with`

jesus christ, do you have brain damage?

>kevinz saying not to argue with goof because he wont listen
>kor just laughing
>no admins or maintainers keeping goof in check despite him constantly pulling bullshit
>goof resorts to calling us all retarded and providing nonarguments
>i bring up issues that he continually ignores
>"do you have brain damage?"

i dont know, do you?

[onleavedontatme]

Goof didn't make the PR (though it was his code from months ago that he gave up on)

Goof didn't merge the PR

Goof just got off a month long git ban

Goof is still permabanned from OOC

You have no idea what you're talking about in any of your posts

[yorii]

Can Terry also get this merged? I haven't even tried this out yet...

[Floiven]

From someone that just picked up chemistry to try and learn it, this system, while convenient, seems like you're not playing it properly if you don't write out and copy/paste the macros to make things during a round. I spent around 30 mins or so stocking up the fridge during a round, when another chemist showed up (who was very friendly and helpful), and showed me that he could pump out hundreds of units of the meds that I spent a long time making near instantly.

Now, I'm all for cutting down clicks, as I have tendonitis from vidya, but perhaps a balance for this would be making the macro-based crafting have time for each step, slightly slower than someone making it all manually, allowing for someone experienced and practiced enough to outpace the machine doing the sequence by itself.

I'm not a fan of the 'gotchya' system of the meds interacting with each other in a negative way, unless it's made apparent on the drugs description somewhere, because that seems like a trap a lot of people are going to fall into unless they're keeping up with the wiki/github like I am, and I already see barely any medical doctors in the rounds I play.

Another option that I recall someone mentioning was making a larger container (like a stationary cauldron or something) that would allow you to mix larger amounts of chems at once, that would effectively allow for mass production of needed things while cutting down the steps as well.

[yorii]

Another option that I recall someone mentioning was making a larger container (like a stationary cauldron or something) that would allow you to mix larger amounts of chems at once, that would effectively allow for mass production of needed things while cutting down the steps as well.

It's called stealing the space cleaner bottle at round start.

[Floiven]

Another option that I recall someone mentioning was making a larger container (like a stationary cauldron or something) that would allow you to mix larger amounts of chems at once, that would effectively allow for mass production of needed things while cutting down the steps as well.

It's called stealing the space cleaner bottle at round start.

Just recalled there being one in the med break room. Good idea.