Oh god I love fulltile windows

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 12:12 pm #43974

Quoting my own post from that PR.

"I disagree with this change. The last time we used a map with full tile windows most people despised them and the same thing will happen again.

It's a generally agreed (if little known) mapping rule to not use full tile windows because they look bad.

I won't go onto a rant, but to summarise (THUMBS DOWN)

(Also this is something I would suggest a forum thread be made on)"

Stickymayhem · Wed Oct 13, 2021 6:17 pm

I always liked how grille and border windows look, and the fact you can easily arrange them with the inside grilled without internal windows. It makes sense, looks good and saves on glass.

That said, I can't really argue against this change because it's being made due to fucked up border object code or something, which is a fucking shame really.

Saegrimr · Post by **Saegrimr** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 12:38 pm #43978

Removing the sleek minimal firelocks with ugly ass full tile firelocks? I cannot get behind this at all.

iyaerP · Post by **iyaerP** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:28 pm #43996

Directional firelocks are way better than massive firelocks, one of the things I really like.

Erbbu · Post by **Erbbu** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 3:00 pm #43999

Rebuilding those grille/rwindow things is a bitch after a bomb. If this helps with that, I'm for it.

Bluespace · Post by **Bluespace** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 4:32 pm #44014

Love the new firelocks.
The damaged windows could probably use another sprite but that's just my opinion.
I like the look of bordered windows and would be unhappy to see them go but if it fixes bugs i'm all for it.

cedarbridge · Post by **cedarbridge** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 5:23 pm #44020

Erbbu wrote:Rebuilding those grille/rwindow things is a bitch after a bomb. If this helps with that, I'm for it.

Depending on your positioning you can rebuild 3+ windows in about 3 minutes with minimal hassle.

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 5:28 pm #44021

Rebuilding single-pane windows is easy once you understand what to do, however I do agree that a newer/less experience engineer would have a better time repairing a full pane window over a single pane window.

One change this PR will have is how broken windows/grilles interact with one another. Currently you have to break one window, the grille then the outer window to get through, now its just the window then the grille. This might make electrified windows less effective and make space exposed windows easier and quicker to break into.

Incoming · Post by **Incoming** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 6:24 pm #44031

Removing functionality to fix bugs is less fixing and more giving up if you ask me. Plus the more fair comments I actually made in the PR.

ExplosiveCrate · Mon Nov 17, 2014 6:46 pm

Doesn't change the fact that anyone with a crowbar and screwdriver can make a breach in under 2 seconds without risking being electrocuted by shocked wires.

ExplosiveCrate · Mon Nov 17, 2014 7:16 pm

You can't take down the outer window without breaking the grille, which would be a very bad idea if it happened to have a wire running underneath and you were without any kind of gloves.

kosmos · Post by **kosmos** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 7:19 pm #44044

ExplosiveCrate wrote:Doesn't change the fact that anyone with a crowbar and screwdriver can make a breach in under 2 seconds without risking being electrocuted by shocked wires.

Or the unscrewing and dislodging could take double the time since most of the time it's someone breaking in.

ExplosiveCrate · Mon Nov 17, 2014 8:28 pm

Just tested it, nope.

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:18 pm #44084

Intentionally making breaches to space is a capital crime in space law for a reason

Post by **lumipharon** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:41 pm #44089

Border windows/grille sandwich looks nicer, and has cooler functionality, but it does have some shitty bugs with it, which supposedly can't be readily fixed. so while I don't like full tile windows (making breaches to space is annoyingly easy, since you bypass shocked grilles), I'll deal with it.

Also with firelocks under airlocks: You can fucking open airlock before crowbarring the firelock. Try click the airlock, shit's magic man. Also, not 100% sure, but you can probably alt click the tile and go direct to the firelock.

Cipher3 · Post by **Cipher3** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:45 pm #44094

Saegrimr wrote:Removing the sleek minimal firelocks with ugly ass full tile firelocks? I cannot get behind this at all.

Saegrimr · Post by **Saegrimr** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:49 pm #44098

lumipharon wrote:Also with firelocks under airlocks: You can fucking open airlock before crowbarring the firelock. Try click the airlock, shit's magic man. Also, not 100% sure, but you can probably alt click the tile and go direct to the firelock.

Or the mapper could just move it down one tile, for consistency reasons.

Post by **lumipharon** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:03 pm #44104

Wait, what, I don't understand the issue? Because a firelock cannot stop you from opening an airlock, unless it's physically blocking the tile infront of it. If the firelock is on the same tile as an airlock, you can still click the airlock open with your id to open it. Or is the issue something else?

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:50 pm #44112

I can make it so reinforced windows (who have metal frames and metal rods running through them) shock you when you try to deconstruct them if they are on top of a shocked grille

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:51 pm #44113

Knocking/punching the windows as a hulk would be unaffected, only attacking with tools for deconstruction would cause it to shock. I dunno, probably not worth the effort.

Post by **oranges** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 12:50 am #44120

Just make reinforced windows actually a challenge to get past. Just like how reinforced girders take 5+6 steps to deconstruct and are loud

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 12:57 am #44123

Yeah true. Maybe later since freeze and lazy.

Cipher3 · Post by **Cipher3** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 1:42 am #44131

You realize that reinforced windows are literally everywhere, right? I can't name a single location on the station which uses non-reinforced windows by default, while r-walls are only for secure locations and sensitive parts of departments.

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 3:37 am #44146

Maybe buff regular windows and put R-windows where they make sense (space, etc) while also buffing how hard it is to deconstruct r-windows?

Post by **lumipharon** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 5:55 am #44161

The big thing with r-window decon, is that there's zero delay, you literally just have screwdriver and crowbar in hand, click,shift hand click, shift hand click. Takes literally half a second.

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 6:05 am #44166

Reinforced/regular window deconstruction will be reworked after the feature freeze so that reinforced windows are to r-walls as regular windows are to normal walls.

kosmos · Post by **kosmos** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 6:54 am #44174

paprika wrote:Maybe buff regular windows and put R-windows where they make sense (space, etc) while also buffing how hard it is to deconstruct r-windows?

It would be nice if normal windows actually had a reason to exist. I've only seen them when an engineer builds them by accident.

Saegrimr · Post by **Saegrimr** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 12:30 pm #44230

paprika wrote:Reinforced/regular window deconstruction will be reworked after the feature freeze so that reinforced windows are to r-walls as regular windows are to normal walls.

So this means many of the r-windows inside the station will be replaced with regular windows, right?

Grazyn · Post by **Grazyn** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 6:40 pm #44287

To the people saying that rebuilding single pane window grills is hard: just click the grill with rglass

cedarbridge · Post by **cedarbridge** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 8:10 pm #44307

Grazyn wrote:To the people saying that rebuilding single pane window grills is hard: just click the grill with rglass

I can't think of any non-rwindow windows on the station anywhere.

TZK13 · Post by **TZK13** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 8:20 pm #44309

A big reason why there's no normal windows is that they just look a lot less aesthetically pleasing than reinforced ones but that really might only be because everybody's so used to reinforced ones.

Ultimately I think if we are going to switch to full tile windows making them more in line with walls with normal windows for general areas and more difficult to bypass reinforced windows for secure areas is the way to go.

Intigracy · Post by **Intigracy** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 9:05 pm #44319

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paprika · Post by **paprika** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 9:13 pm #44320

Saegrimr wrote:
paprika wrote:Reinforced/regular window deconstruction will be reworked after the feature freeze so that reinforced windows are to r-walls as regular windows are to normal walls.
So this means many of the r-windows inside the station will be replaced with regular windows, right?

Yeah, only space ones/brig ones/etc would be r-windows and they'd probably require you to welder their frame to deconstruct them.

Intigracy wrote:Problem with normal windows is they're piss easy to break.

The fulltile ones don't even have the health of a single onesided r-window.

I repathed full tile windows so that they're not just windows with a dir var edited, they're actually window/reinforced/fulltile and window/fulltile so you can easily var edit their health without effecting the health of directional windows. Buffing the health of windows would be piss easy.

Intigracy · Post by **Intigracy** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 9:59 pm #44343

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Intigracy · Post by **Intigracy** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 10:16 pm #44351

.

Intigracy · Post by **Intigracy** » Tue Nov 18, 2014 10:55 pm #44369

.

Miauw · Post by **Miauw** » Thu Nov 20, 2014 4:07 pm #44725

Just an FYI, fixing border objects is really out of the question. 95% of all of their issues are completely inherent to them because we can't really place things on borders, we can only place them on one side of a tile. (And I personally think full-tile airlocks look much better than single-tile airlocks. I dont really have an onion on windows though)

E:
also, fulltile windows have 2x the health of normal windows. (if this pr is merged)

Post by **lumipharon** » Thu Nov 20, 2014 11:17 pm #44802

Oh yes please god, I can deal with fulltile windows for code reasons, but after playing with them in a space bar I made, they are fucking ugly as shit, compared to our current setup. Those donut/hollow square fulltile ones would be a better middle ground.

Intigracy · Post by **Intigracy** » Fri Nov 21, 2014 12:24 am #44811

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Post by **lumipharon** » Fri Nov 21, 2014 12:50 am #44822

The transparent part in the middle looks really ugly when it's on top of a grille. (Well, it looks ugly in general...) A clean open square would be nicer.

Intigracy · Post by **Intigracy** » Fri Nov 21, 2014 12:58 am #44824

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Nienhaus · Post by **Nienhaus** » Fri Nov 21, 2014 1:46 am #44838

You guys should take a new image with the new glass breaking.

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Fri Nov 21, 2014 4:16 am #44859

For free

Edit: Just gonna use my old overlays, if someone wants to make better ones they can, nien's didn't look too good on the new windows

Intigracy · Post by **Intigracy** » Fri Nov 21, 2014 5:29 am #44866

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Lo6a4evskiy · Post by **Lo6a4evskiy** » Sat Nov 22, 2014 6:39 am #45124

One assistant with fire axe can decompress all those public hallways.

Sure, it can be done now, but with three times as many hits.

Random Players · Sat Nov 22, 2014 7:13 am

You.. haven't been paying attention, have you?

The full windows are going to have the same health as two side windows. Same amount of hits.

Also, assistants that do that should be arrested and/or banned.

Lo6a4evskiy · Post by **Lo6a4evskiy** » Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:15 pm #45146

Random Players wrote:You.. haven't been paying attention, have you?

You.. have no idea what you're talking about, are you?

Let me enlighten you.

Code: Select all

/obj/item/weapon/twohanded/fireaxe/afterattack(atom/A as mob|obj|turf|area, mob/user as mob, proximity)
	if(!proximity) return
	if(A && wielded && (istype(A,/obj/structure/window) || istype(A,/obj/structure/grille))) //destroys windows and grilles in one hit
		if(istype(A,/obj/structure/window)) //should just make a window.Break() proc but couldn't bother with it
			var/obj/structure/window/W = A

			new /obj/item/weapon/shard( W.loc )
			if(W.reinf) new /obj/item/stack/rods( W.loc)

			if (W.dir == SOUTHWEST)
				new /obj/item/weapon/shard( W.loc )
				if(W.reinf) new /obj/item/stack/rods( W.loc)
		qdel(A)

In case you didn't notice

Code: Select all

//destroys windows and grilles in one hit

Random Players · Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:19 pm

So? That's a FIREAXE. Only on the bridge and Atmos.
Which a assistant (Which is what you said, not atmos techs) SHOULDN'T have access to. And as said, Assistants that do that should be arrested and/or banned.
I admit that I missed that you specified Fireaxe the first time, but the point still stands.

Lo6a4evskiy · Post by **Lo6a4evskiy** » Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:32 pm #45151

Random Players wrote:So? That's a FIREAXE. Only on the bridge and Atmos.
Which a assistant (Which is what you said, not atmos techs) SHOULDN'T have access to. And as said, Assistants that do that should be arrested and/or banned.
I admit that I missed that you specified Fireaxe the first time, but the point still stands.

Anyone with fireaxe then.

Gee. That was kind of my point.

What point stands? That nobody will ever get a fire axe without being caught? That a laughable point.

Anyway, it's not a huge deal, especially considering that doing this now would also be pretty easy, but this change would make it three times easier and harder to repair properly (because grilles would still be there). Oh and with slow space it could become a nightmare.

Miauw · Post by **Miauw** » Sat Nov 22, 2014 1:15 pm #45156

wow there is a single powerful item in the game and thus fulltile windows suck

in case you didnt notice, the fireaxe is a large item, has to be wielded, theres only two of them etc
repairing that window really isnt that hard.