"Stealth" traitor items.

[Hornygranny]

I think it's fair to say at this point that people generally do not use "stealth" traitor items, except for the parapen and noslips (muh murderbone). I believe this is because each and everyone one of them has an altered description that allows people to acceptably meta that you are a traitor if you're caught. Why do we make items that are much less powerful and much less used than things like the dualsaber and ebow useless this way?

[Cheridan]

What tools are you referring to? I don't believe the voice changer has any different indicators besides simply putting it on yourself.
Agent cards are similarly subtle.
Chameleon jumpsuit has a different examine description but only until you switch your suit for the first time, at which time it takes on the description of the new jumpsuit.
EMP kit is disguised fairly well. The grenades are obvious but the flashlight is subtle.

Camera bug could probably use some stealthiness: http://www.ss13.eu/tgdb/tg/latest_stats.html
Even though it's very cheap at 2tc, it's VERY unpopular.

While we're on the subject, binary translation key NEEDS some way of differentiation. I've lost mine before while switching... put the wrong damn cipherkey into the headset, left my binary one sitting on the ground. Infuriating.

[suomynonAyletamitlU]

Camera bug could probably use some stealthiness: http://www.ss13.eu/tgdb/tg/latest_stats.html
Even though it's very cheap at 2tc, it's VERY unpopular.

It needs to be improved. I have been thinking about it but I don't have time to work on it. Most likely, it should have the EMP and monitor abilities built in for cameras that it has bugged, with a secondary mode to look through any camera in exchange for losing extra functionality. Alternately, you should be able to select any one mode, but doing so resets all the bugs. The whole extension thing clearly is terrible.

For sayustation, I also gave it the ability to be used from your pockets (action button) and allowed camera bugs to turn on and off camera lights. The former makes it far more stealthy, but doesn't make sense ("I will monitor cameras from my pocket"); the latter is fairly pointless, except that I also gave AIs a camera bug, allowing them to monitor cameras and toggle lights.

[Miauw]

>removing things that could be used for shenanigans

improve dont remove.

[Cheridan]

miauw what are you even talking about

nobody said anything about removing anything

how about u improve or remove ur reading ability skrub

[paprika]

Camera bug is holy fuck good once you learn how to use it. It's 'beaten' by other items, but that's not why it exists. See: miauw's post.

What I would love to see is parapen being increased in TC price tho, because like I stated earlier, it gives more illegal tech than an ebow and also I can't imagine it's cheap to harvest carp toxin.

[Incomptinence]

The whole disguise suit is prohibitively expensive and incomplete. Is he wearing a generic looking gas mask? Did he turn his cham suit into a uniform version that is out of date? Does he have the right colour pda? Harmbatton that tattorly sneak!

[leibniz]

The whole disguise suit is prohibitively expensive and incomplete. Is he wearing a generic looking gas mask? Did he turn his cham suit into a uniform version that is out of date? Does he have the right colour pda? Harmbatton that tattorly sneak!

Cham jumpsuit should come with cham shoes and cham backpack.

[Cheimon]

Why do we make items like this? I imagine it's because the people adding them have different views on what makes a good traitor item. Some people think it should be a totally secret weapon. Some say you should be able to spot it with experience (e.g. noslips examine text). Some are obviously keen on going loud.

I think there's a balance to be struck between the two extreme ends. I like the idea that you can't tell at a glance that something is a bit off, but if you get the chance to thoroughly search someone you can. And very few of the items are entirely useless. But it's almost as though some things are built around a different acceptable level of meta, one which dictates that the examine text is more so someone can tell them apart than so that some warden can throw them in perma.

At the end of the day, and so long as no one item is so overpowered it's pointless to get anything else (hello parapen, virtually impossible to detect and yet able to stun someone long enough to kill them with your bare hands), it's fun to have lots of possibilities.

[paprika]

The whole disguise suit is prohibitively expensive and incomplete. Is he wearing a generic looking gas mask? Did he turn his cham suit into a uniform version that is out of date? Does he have the right colour pda? Harmbatton that tattorly sneak!

Cham jumpsuit should come with cham shoes and cham backpack.

There was a cham kit idea suggested a while back and I think it's a suitable replacement for just the shitty jumpsuit.

[Neerti]

The code needs to be improved but it wouldn't be too hard if you knew how to make everything into a chameleon proc.

[Psyentific]

If you're in a position for people to tell that your voice changer gasmask or your chameleon jumpsuit is a traitor item, you're bunged anyway. Ditto on no-slips, though I'd like to see Noslips have a chameleon shoe function, just to counter the brown shoe meta.

Honestly, I think subtle traitor items are fine as-is

[Kelenius]

It can be done so only taters can tell antag items from non-antag items.

[Incomptinence]

If you're in a position for people to tell that your voice changer gasmask or your chameleon jumpsuit is a traitor item, you're bunged anyway. Ditto on no-slips, though I'd like to see Noslips have a chameleon shoe function, just to counter the brown shoe meta.

Honestly, I think subtle traitor items are fine as-is

If you are going to dart around in a generic gas mask so quickly no one searches you, you might as well be wearing a generic gas mask and a random jump suit.