[StickyMayhem] AnonymousNow - This is not a ban appeal.

[AnonymousNow]

AnonymousNow, playing as Derrick Cobb. Following ban placed at around 2:40pm GMT.

You have been banned by stickymayhem.
Reason: Killed someone with a saw for intruding on robotics. Left their body which ended up destroyed. Ban lessened due to intruder taunting him, but otherwise this was far too lethal.

720 minutes. EDIT: Yes, a temporary ban, arguably not worth appealing, but read on.

First of all - did you people move forums again? Jesus wept, it's like you're trying to avoid me.

Second, here's what happened. I start in robotics. An assistant charges at the desk window and smashes at it with a wrench. I inform the assistant that I have had a bad day and that if he continues to attack then I will kill him with a bonesaw (as a deterrent). The assistant laughs, repeatedly, taunts me and continues to break into robotics.

He breaks in, charges straight at me with his wrench, and is turned into a bloody meatpile on the floor (that is still just about alive). I was tempted to finish him off, put his brain in an MMI and work from there, but the Mime nicked him and (presumably) took him to medbay.

Lo and behold, I get an admin message. Turns out that the massively antagonising behaviour of this colossal douchebag was, in fact, the work of a non-antagonist, and he demands to know why I've killed him.

Ever since I can remember on this server, the term "Act like an antagonist, get treated like an antagonist" has been law. Following this has allowed for the prevention of ban-baiting behaviour as well, wherein one player taunts another into killing them so that the second player can be banned. This meant that the first player can be held accountable to their actions.

This is completely lost on Stickymayhem - and so begins the most admin interaction I've had in weeks, despite constantly being on the receiving end of literal random kills from people in the corridor, some of which couldn't have possibly been antagonists (hey, admins, did you do something about Sven randomly beating me to death with the null rod after I helped him up off the floor from a slip yet, or are you going to fob me off for another month?).

So after nearly jobbanning me for four days because he misread what I told him and thought I'd turned the assailant into a cyborg, he slaps me with this temp ban. EDIT: Oh, and he refused to say whether or not the antagonistic assistant was an actual round antagonist, citing it as meta-information and, remarkably, not finding it relevant. Isn't that fun?

I'm not even appealing it (even though it is a stupid ban which enables the shitty behaviour of such people that break into departments and threaten their workers). I'm going to a collective meeting soon. I've got other things to do, and I don't think I want to play with the kind of people who do that kind of thing as a non-antagonist anyway. But I wanted you to know that this is the kind of thing that happens if you defend your department nowadays.

And you know what could possibly be the worst thing? I can't even remember that giant arsehole's name. He's getting away scott free, and being taught that what he's doing is right.

That's the current nature of this server, people.

[Stickymayhem]

Firstly, based on your previous implications, I said: PM: Stickymayhem/(Jack Steiner)->AnonymousNow/(Derrick Cobb): But you're forceborging him

To which you replied: PM: AnonymousNow/(Derrick Cobb)->Stickymayhem/(Jack Steiner): If he' have complained that much, then it would've been the work of a few seconds to pop his brain back into his body and get him cloned.

Which implied to me that you had debrained him. This was an error, but the wording made me believe that you were borging him.

Secondly, he did not touch you in any way, and yet you sawed him to death, resulting in the destruction of his corpse and him being totally removed from the game. Killing someone for breaking in is itself fairly shitty, but not ensuring they would be cloned is even worse.

and third, you were totally belligerent in adminhelps, throwing your weight around because you used to be an admin observer and so on. The rule on breaking into departments is that it opens them up to fun. Knocking them out and tossing them out is fine, but murdering them and letting their body be destroyed is not. They were not a serious threat to you in any way and they definitely didn't need to die.

[Ikarrus]

What? It's always been okay to defend your departments against people breaking in. There shouldn't be any problem if they intend to cause trouble, which, judging by the taunts the assistant made, he clearly just wanted to piss robotics off. He even got his warning and he disregarded it.

While it's true that AnonNow can be a pain in the ass to work with, this ban should not have been made.

[AnonymousNow]

Firstly, based on your previous implications, I said: PM: Stickymayhem/(Jack Steiner)->AnonymousNow/(Derrick Cobb): But you're forceborging him

To which you replied: PM: AnonymousNow/(Derrick Cobb)->Stickymayhem/(Jack Steiner): If he' have complained that much, then it would've been the work of a few seconds to pop his brain back into his body and get him cloned.

Which implied to me that you had debrained him. This was an error, but the wording made me believe that you were borging him.

Secondly, he did not touch you in any way, and yet you sawed him to death, resulting in the destruction of his corpse and him being totally removed from the game. Killing someone for breaking in is itself fairly shitty, but not ensuring they would be cloned is even worse.

and third, you were totally belligerent in adminhelps, throwing your weight around because you used to be an admin observer and so on. The rule on breaking into departments is that it opens them up to fun. Knocking them out and tossing them out is fine, but murdering them and letting their body be destroyed is not. They were not a serious threat to you in any way and they definitely didn't need to die.

I was, and am, frankly amazed that I was ever messaged by an admin at all on the matter, aside from "why'd you nearly kill that guy?" "he was being a dick, broke into the department, came at me with a wrench" "oh okay". I wasn't throwing my weight around, I was appalled at what was happening, and continue to be. And I have NEVER heard this rule about break-ins being "fun" before.

I probably would've got around to the MMI stage, had the mime not intervened.

The mime was the one who stole the still-living attacker. I cannot be held responsible for the actions of another player, and though I could've pursued the body, I was in the pressured position of my department just having been smashed open and decided to trust that it was probably going to medbay, or could otherwise be retrieved. Tell me - in a cultist round, how could the attacker, under the care of the mime, get removed from the round permanently, especially considering how many constructs were around? It is extremely convenient - one way or another, they were likely to live, and by sheer coincidence, when it would have been the absolute most troubling, they mysteriously didn't (how, you never specified).

While it's true that AnonNow can be difficult to work with, this ban should not have been made.

Look, I really enjoy this game, and I get annoyed when I feel like I'm getting shafted. So when it begins to feel like I'm getting so shafted, so often, I could be sitting on a bed of nails, I am going to be bloody caustic.

Why don't they investigate the people who kill me? Why have I had only one other admin get back to me with a conclusion and a course of action in months of trouble?

EDIT:

While it's true that AnonNow can be a pain in the ass to work with,

Fucksakes, Ikarrus. Do I have a note in the Adminbus or something?

[Bluespace]

Mime here.

The assistant was being a little shit and broke into robotics with a wrench.

I think it's because you were busy and didn't want to borg him then or something.

However I stood and waited for you to crit him, before dragging him to the bar in an attempt to soulstone him, as I was cult.

Didn't manage to though, Kameron was idling around so his body just kinda got buckled in the bar and left.

[Jordie0608]

The issue, as discussed in #adminbus, is your use of lethality to what was not an appropriate situation for it; especially after you had incapacitated him with a flash.

[Stickymayhem]

After a lengthy adminbus discussion, it was decided that while a note was in order, a ban was harsh. When you have the capability to use non-lethal force in a situation like that, use it instead of murdering. I'm editing your note to reflect that.

Sorry for issuing a ban where it was not warranted, but it was a borderline case and at the time it seemed the appropriate course of action, especially since I conferred with other admins. I apologize for making a mistake in this case, but hopefully since it was short, it wasn't too inconvenient.

[AnonymousNow]

Well, as long as the error was rectified (also I've been out for ten hours).

I don't usually go to lethality so quickly... it's actually fairly uncharacteristic of me to go lethal at all. But I needed to defend myself, and had frivilously made a deadly statement in my attempt to shoo the assailant away, and knew that if I didn't see it through, that assistant would target me the entire round (and as I was convinced that he was an antagonist, there would've been a point where one of us would've died very soon, and I was not likely to get the drop on him again).