[Cheridan] TentacleTherapist - Ban for Murder as Chaplain

[TentacleTherapist]

Byond account and character name: TentacleTherapist/Josuke Higshig
Banning admin: Cheridan
Ban type (What are you banned from?): Normal ban.
Ban reason and length: "Incinerated someone as chaplain when they retaliated after stealing from their department because they wouldn't give him a whetstone.

Stop killing people over these things holy shit it's like +3 damage" 2440 minutes.
Time ban was placed (including time zone): Around 5:15 PM, EST.
Your side of the story: I'm not 100% used to /tg/'s rules and how they handle retaliation, so let me put that upfront first. If I'm completely in the wrong with how you guys handle bans, I apologize. With that out of the way:

At the start of the round, I went to the chef to ask for a whetstone, at which they said no. I climbed over the table and grabbed their rolling pin, since they were kind of being dicks. I then ran off, and one of them came after me with another rolling pin, which I took before he could hurt me with it. Seeing that he wasn't going to stop chasing me, I ran back to chapel, at which point he pushed and kicked me repeatedly (to the point of me nearly falling into crit). I'd like to mention that during this whole time of being beaten and attacked, I didn't stand up a single time, meaning I couldn't have retaliated. I was pretty damn sure that I was going to get killed, so I said "Stop, I'll give you the rolling pins back", but he kept going. I got lucky and managed to stand up.

Being that I was a couple punches away from crit, I pulled out my pitchfork (null rod) and started fighting back. I did this because I couldn't have ran away, he clearly wasn't willing to reason (based on him ignoring me outright saying I'd give the rolling pins back), and it was in the heat of the moment. I got a few hits in before he picked up a chair, and we kept fighting. By the time I managed to crit him I was in blinking red, and I was genuinely convinced that I'd pass out and die of blood loss and he'd get healed, so I dragged him to the back room and incinerated him. Note - I didn't die of blood loss, I managed to walk to medbay and get healed. I'll admit to that being bad judgement on my part.

Why you think you should be unbanned: I understand that this may have been too far, but beating someone damn near into crit for stealing a rolling pin, in my eyes, justifies killing and burning them. I remember hearing that acting like a shitter has much higher ingame repercussions on this server than the one I'm used to playing on, but I didn't think it would go this far. The way I see it, this is the level of ecalation - I steal a rolling pin, they try to attack me with another. I take it and run away. I get beaten into orange, almost red, while completely down, and telling them that I'll give it back, but they don't stop. I then get lucky, crit/kill him, and incinerate him.

I think the chef escalated things a lot harder than I did, considering I didn't even pull out a weapon until I was a hit or two away from death. Another thing of note that irked me a bit -- Cheridan only PMed me once to ask about the situation before banning. I gave him a VERY brief (3-4 sentence, if that) rundown, and got no response. I went about the round waiting for a reply where I could go into more detail, but none came, so I assumed I was in the clear. Only after being booked by sec, released, and fully healed was I banned, without a single extra PM. Maybe that's just how things are done on /tg/, I don't know, but it felt iffy and a bit rushed. I understand that managing 60+ people is difficult, but I feel like a 2440 minute ban is really high, especially for something that seemed like a completely IC issue to me.

One last thing, a hypothetical question. If I didn't get a chance to stand up, and the chef just beat me to death and incinerated me without me getting a chance to fight back, would he get the same punishment as me? Or would he be let off the hook due to me stealing the rolling pin? Still trying to pinpoint how /tg/ handles things. Thanks for reading.

[calzilla1]

I was the other chef. Yeah, fuck you. I had ALL my rolling pins stolen. Granted the last one was stolen by pirates. Also i had all the whet stones, he just wanted to give out ice cream.

[Screemonster]

anon3 amendment to say that if the chef had gibbed you for hopping the counter, then he'd be on the hook for overescalating. Cremating someone for trying to get their shit back after you, as nonantag, stole something they need for their job as "punishment" for not letting you powergame is... not only is it escalating a fight you started, it's borderline banbait.

[Shaps-cloud]

Both sides overescalated and acted kinda dumb, but if the chef kept attacking after you surrendered and said you'd give the rolling pin back, that's absolutely on him for continuing to escalate the situation. Also, I feel like one PM is usually never enough to decide whether someone should be banned or not unless they just reply with "fuck u", since even if someone seems like they've done something clearly dumb and bad, they might have some sort of explanation or justification for it that can change things.

All in all, sounds like all sides acted a bit dumb here, and I'd say the chef was almost as much responsible as the chaplain was

[Cheridan]

anon3 amendment to say that if the chef had gibbed you for hopping the counter, then he'd be on the hook for overescalating. Cremating someone for trying to get their shit back after you, as nonantag, stole something they need for their job as "punishment" for not letting you powergame is... not only is it escalating a fight you started, it's borderline banbait.

This was my logic.

"Hey can I have [thing given to your job that i have no business having]?"
"No" <--- This is where you should have walked away.
"Ok I'll just hop the table and steal a bunch of your guy's stuff just to be petty and then run away" <--- What you did

Whetstones are a hot topic right now and people need to stop fucking with chefs over them, or they're going to get binned.

[Shaps-cloud]

I agree that stealing stuff like that was dumb, but the chef continuing to attack after the chap had surrendered was a conscious decision on his part that exceeded his "getting my stuff back" protection.

[TentacleTherapist]

I wouldn't really consider stealing one rolling pin to be "stealing a bunch of your guy's stuff", considering it was one rolling pin, and I only took the other one after they charged me with it. I could've seen a ban for a few hours over this, but this is what, like.. two days, almost? I understand that I went a bit overboard, but have I ever even been bwoinked on this server? (Genuine question, I don't remember.) A two-day ban for an escalated murder seems kinda harsh to me.

[Shaps-cloud]

Seems like the issue at hand is whetstones more or less, we'll lift your ban, but something is probably gonna change with whetstones because this can't keep happening with different people

[TentacleTherapist]

Yeah I honestly hope that they get removed, they're kinda ridiculous. It's sort of like baseballs OHKOing when thrown on other servers - I'll use them while I can, but dear god, I can't wait for them to be fixed.
Thanks for the responses, everyone. I strongly appreciate it.