[Epicgamer545] killed a borg using a hydrogen canister on the EVAC shuttle

[EmpressMaia]

Ban Details
BYOND account: empressmaia
Character name:maia roentgen
Ban type: Note
Ban reason: Note left by Epicgamer545 on 2024-01-14 23:37:30
(MRP) As HOS, killed a borg no questions asked on a emergency shuttle. While the borg did drag a hydrogen canister over to connector port, there should have been a warning or order to stop before killing them. Said that they will keep this in mind in the future.Time ban was placed: Try to get this from the server when you get the ban reason. If it was a note, the note has a timestamp. If it was a server ban, it will also have a timestamp. Both of these times are in UTC.
Server you were playing on when banned: manuel
Round ID in which ban was placed: 222195

Reasons for Appealing - Delete irrelevant sections
Are you appealing a validly placed permaban and would like another chance to be unbanned?: appealing a factually correct but silly note

Do you disagree with the admin's interpretation of rules or policy?: no and yes
If no, please provide more details: the note is factually correct but silly, sec had been nearly wiped out after 2 waves of pirates and the station was falling apart, im shouldnt have to take chances with the borg that connected a hydrogen canister to a injector pipeline on the evacuation shuttle.

[EmpressMaia]

oh also the note is slightly incorrect because i wasnt hos, but a sec officer

[GPeckman]

As a point of fact, hydrogen is almost identical to tritium. It can burn in the presence of oxygen, releasing the same amount of energy that tritium does when it burns. The only difference is that tritium also produces radiation when it burns, while hydrogen does not.

[Drag]

Just for clarity: Do you believe this note is overly harsh or factually incorrect, save for your job role.

Edit: I was the other admin assisting with this investigation along with Epic, so I have the context they do.

[EmpressMaia]

Just for clarity: Do you believe this note is overly harsh or factually incorrect, save for your job role.

Edit: I was the other admin assisting with this investigation along with Epic, so I have the context they do.

shouldnt have been noted in the first place, i correctly assesed a very dangerous situation where many innocent crew could have been killed and i responded appropriately

[NecromancerAnne]

viewtopic.php?p=686559#p686559

Relevant policy thread. You can prepare for EORG, but if you shouldn't make it obvious that you are preparing for EORG. The example given was an openly visible TTV you are dragging behind you.

[Epicgamer545]

Hey, sorry for the wait. I had to do something regarding reviving myself from the grave.

Quick reminder that this is a note and not a ban. Anyway, on that note, I'm going to be looking at this appeal and using my best judgement from the situation.

First off, this note can only be appealed/edited if there was misleading or misinformation in the note. Let's settle that first, and then I'll go down to the dirty stuff about the implications of the note. At the start of the round, you signed up as Security Officer. But somehow, when the escape shuttle left and was near Centcom, you were being displayed as the Head Of Security. Now, I don't have full context, but this sort of explains it.

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[2024-01-14 23:10:36.176] GAME-SAY: 23:10:36.176] GAME-SAY: EmpressMaia/(Maia Roentgen) (mob_3431) "cap" (Fore Central Primary Hallway (152,147,2))
[2024-01-14 23:10:38.333] GAME-SAY: 23:10:38.333] GAME-SAY: EmpressMaia/(Maia Roentgen) (mob_3431) "i need a HOS ID" (Fore Central Primary Hallway (152,147,2))

You seemed to ask for the HOS ID, not specifically the position of acting HOS, but the ID. I think you did this because you lost a lot of stuff after dying to pirates.

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[2024-01-14 23:10:52.910] GAME-SAY: 23:10:52.910] GAME-SAY: EmpressMaia/(Maia Roentgen) (mob_3431) "all my shits gone" (Fore Central Primary Hallway (152,147,2))

Whenever you were intending to either use the HOS ID as a replacement or to take the position, most assumed you were now the HOS. Generally, when taking a Head Of Staff ID, you're technically that role now. So that's why I added that into the note, you knew that you were taking a HOS ID and you knew the position that came with it. At the time, you were displaying the HOS ID in your ID slot.

So, am I wrong about you being HOS? Not really. It depends on how you want to interpret it. I just thought you were acting on behalf of HOS since you took the ID.

Now, onto the actual implications. I saw it first-hand when I was observing, but at the time I didn't have the logs I needed. All I saw was a Borg with a hydrogen tank in an isolated room of the emergency shuttle, with the door bolted. I didn't know if they brought the tank, if someone put that tank there, or if that tank came with the shuttle (could be a possibility but in retrospect, what mapper would be insane enough to do that). I had no context on hand, so I looked at the logs.

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[2024-01-14 23:03:01.291] GAME-SAY: 23:03:01.291] GAME-SAY: DATAxPUNGED/(Azdak-Keztaf) (mob_4317) "The hell's this, fafnir?" (Engineering (99,112,2))
[2024-01-14 23:03:13.716] GAME-SAY: 23:03:13.716] GAME-SAY: Pratty420/(Fafnir) (mob_3416) "Making Hydrogen" (Engineering (101,112,2))

Fafnir was making hydrogen in engineering and possibly brought it to emergency shuttle themselves. The reason? I'm not sure. There is little context behind it and I think it's for EORG, so that kind of sucks. My main guess is that they wanted to do a controlled burn on the shuttle in an isolated room with a atmos , seeing from these logs.

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[2024-01-14 23:03:37.169] GAME-SAY: 23:03:37.169] GAME-SAY: Pratty420/(Fafnir) (mob_3416) "Could you do me a favpir" (Engineering (101,113,2))
[2024-01-14 23:03:38.157] GAME-SAY: 23:03:38.157] GAME-SAY: Pratty420/(Fafnir) (mob_3416) "Please" (Engineering (101,113,2))
[2024-01-14 23:03:47.237] GAME-SAY: 23:03:47.237] GAME-SAY: Pratty420/(Fafnir) (mob_3416) "Go to the lathe and get an atmos fan" (Engineering (101,113,2))
[2024-01-14 23:03:50.620] GAME-SAY: 23:03:50.620] GAME-SAY: Pratty420/(Fafnir) (mob_3416) "Please" (Engineering (101,113,2))

Now that I know this, I feel like the note feels less supported than I thought. The fact that the Borg dragged the tank ALL the way from engineering to an input connected to a gas injector for EORG or a controlled burn could have, yes, caused some problems. The door was bolted though, and there was a chance for you to do some warning shots before you fired at them, and that was the main point I wanted to get across with this note. But now, things make more sense.

I'm willing to remove the note entirely. It doesn't make sense from a reasonable standpoint and doesn't get my point across now that I found out these facts. It's my fault for making the wrong move and assuming the wrong things, and at the moment I thought something happened otherwise. In the future, I'll try to take all possible actions available to me to assure if things are justified or if they are not.

The spirit of the note still stands, though; what I wanted was to remind you that there are other paths to take other than using lethal force. But in this situation, I feel like your train of thought was justified. Let me know what you think about this and once you respond I'll get back as soon as I can. If anything is hard to understand, let me know.

[EmpressMaia]

i think removing the note is the right action, thanks for being responsive and reasonable

[Epicgamer545]

I have removed the note. I apologize for the misjudgment, and I'll aim to improving myself in the future.