[FatalX1]Falsely banned for hellfoam.

[Lizardborea]

BYOND account: Lizardboreansupersoldier

Ban/note type (Check what applies):
(x) - Server Ban
() - Note
() - Forum Ban
() - Discord Ban

Ban/note length: 2 weeks
Ban/note reason:
Banned by host: You, or another user of this computer or connection (Lizardboreansupersoldier) is banned from playing here. The ban reason is: Activated two hellfire grenades on the emergency shuttle which killed the entire shuttle, claims someone stole his bag and he never activate the grenades, yet logs show the only two grenades activated during the entire round were done by him. If you can provide evidence to show someone else activated them, please provide it in an appeal This ban (BanID #70375) was applied by FatalX1 on 2024-04-12 16:19:17 during round ID 227091. The ban is for 14 days and expires on 2024-04-26 16:19:17 (server time).
Time ban was placed: 2024-04-12 16:19:17
Server you were playing on when banned: Terry
Round ID in which ban was placed: 227091

Why are you making this appeal?(Check what applies):
(x) - The ban/note is factually incorrect
() - The ban/note is not against the rules
(x) - The ban/note needs modification
() - The ban was unjustifiably harsh
() - I was permabanned and I want another chance

Why should this appeal be accepted?:
[2024-04-12 15:46:05.825] ATTACK: Cymrulad24/(Toolbox) (mob_3578) is stripping Lizardboreansupersoldier/(Michel Garland) of the chemist satchel. (Chemistry (136,70,2))
2024-04-12 15:46:09.591] ATTACK: Cymrulad24/(Toolbox) (mob_3578) has stripped Lizardboreansupersoldier/(Michel Garland) of the chemist satchel. (Chemistry (136,70,2))
[2024-04-12 15:49:34.447] ATTACK: Lizardboreansupersoldier/(Michel Garland) (mob_3436) shoved Cymrulad24/(Toolbox) with knocking them down (NEWHP: 98) (Aft Central Primary Hallway (167,105,2))
[2024-04-12 15:49:35.400] ATTACK: Lizardboreansupersoldier/(Michel Garland) (mob_3436) grabbed Cymrulad24/(Toolbox) passive grab (NEWHP: 98) (Aft Central Primary Hallway (167,105,2))
[2024-04-12 15:49:35.404] ATTACK: JustRandomGuy/(Roger O'Void) (mob_3521) transferred reagents to [beaker] with the pepper spray refiller which had /datum/reagent/consumable/condensedcapsaicin (10u, 0.5 purity) (Security Post - Medsci (146,88,2))
[2024-04-12 15:49:35.607] ATTACK: Llaren Hlaalo/(Borgo-2000) (mob_3379) attacked [foamed metal] with the hydraulic wrench (Medical (162,75,2))
[2024-04-12 15:49:36.461] ATTACK: Lizardboreansupersoldier/(Michel Garland) (mob_3436) grabbed Cymrulad24/(Toolbox) passive grab (NEWHP: 98) (Aft Central Primary Hallway (167,105,2))
[2024-04-12 15:49:38.241] ATTACK: Lizardboreansupersoldier/(Michel Garland) (mob_3436) attempted to neck grab Cymrulad24/(Toolbox) neck grab (NEWHP: 98) (Aft Central Primary Hallway (167,105,2))
[2024-04-12 15:49:38.564] ATTACK: Lizardboreansupersoldier/(Michel Garland) (mob_3436) broke grab Cymrulad24/(Toolbox) (NEWHP: 98) (Aft Central Primary Hallway (167,105,2))
[2024-04-12 15:50:20.651] ATTACK: Lizardboreansupersoldier/(Michel Garland) (mob_3436) tabled Cymrulad24/(Toolbox) onto the wooden table (NEWHP: 50.5) (Library (174,99,2))
[2024-04-12 15:50:42.932] ATTACK: Cymrulad24/(Toolbox) (mob_3578) suffered: Joint Dislocation to right arm | Damage: 15 (rolled 43/44.3127) (Library (173,99,2))
[2024-04-12 15:50:13.235] GAME-SAY: Lizardboreansupersoldier/(Michel Garland) (mob_3436) "wheres my bag scum" (Library (174,99,2))
[2024-04-12 15:50:23.884] GAME-SAY: Cymrulad24/(Toolbox) (mob_3578) "I dont have your bag" (Library (173,99,2))

in the last 2 logs you can see that I fought over him for the bag and he said that he didnt have and I also checked everything if he took it so I let him go
[2024-04-12 15:50:33.701] ATTACK: Lizardboreansupersoldier/(Michel Garland) (mob_3436) is stripping Cymrulad24/(Toolbox) of the backpack. (Library (174,99,2))

[2024-04-12 16:08:23.318] ATTACK: Lizardboreansupersoldier/(Michel Garland) (mob_3436) primed a chemical grenade at Emergency Shuttle (89,49,14) containing: (metamaterial beaker 1 : Gunpowder, 120 | Water, 60); (metamaterial beaker 2 : Fluorosurfactant, 60 | Chlorine Trifluoride, 1 | Phlogiston, 20.0007 | Gunpowder, 99);. (Emergency Shuttle (88,55,14))
[2024-04-12 16:08:23.388] ATTACK: Lizardboreansupersoldier/(Michel Garland) (mob_3436) primed a chemical grenade at Emergency Shuttle (89,49,14) containing: (metamaterial beaker 1 : Phosphorus, 60 | Potassium, 60 | Chlorine Trifluoride, 1 | Plasma, 59); (metamaterial beaker 2 : Sugar, 60 | Napalm, 20 | Fluorosulfuric Acid, 20 | Phlogiston, 20.0008 | Plasma, 60);. (Emergency Shuttle (88,55,14))

apparently its says that I primed the bomb but the thing is I didnt, round can be rewatched if im not misstaken and I couldve not carried the bombs on me since I didnt have space to put them because the moth clearly stole my satchel [can be seen from the loggs above]

[2024-04-12 16:08:18.565] GAME-SAY: Cymrulad24/(Toolbox) (mob_3578) "This is for Donald Trump" (Emergency Shuttle (88,49,14))
5 seconds before shit went to hell he said this

I claim the ownership of the grenades because I wanted to test it out roundend but I didnt detonate it.


also this is intresting too while checking the logs I have spotted this [2024-04-12 15:28:38.908] GAME: Cymrulad24/(Toolbox) completed the /datum/tutorial/switch_hands tutorial.
this account is clearly an alt
I honestly feel that 2 weeks is a bit unjust considering that I didnt detonate them, altho I will take the blame for the manufacturing of them

[dragomagol]

I will let Fatal respond to this post, but first:

round can be rewatched if im not misstaken

This is a feature of Yog's, we do not have round replays.

also this is intresting too while checking the logs I have spotted this [2024-04-12 15:28:38.908] GAME: Cymrulad24/(Toolbox) completed the /datum/tutorial/switch_hands tutorial.
this account is clearly an alt

Thanks for pointing this out, they almost certainly were.

[Fatal]

I don't really know what to say here, you just posted the logs I pretty much posted to you, as evidence, that you primed those grenades

[2024-04-12 16:08:23.318] ATTACK: Lizardboreansupersoldier/(Michel Garland) (mob_3436) primed a chemical grenade at Emergency Shuttle (89,49,14) containing: (metamaterial beaker 1 : Gunpowder, 120 | Water, 60); (metamaterial beaker 2 : Fluorosurfactant, 60 | Chlorine Trifluoride, 1 | Phlogiston, 20.0007 | Gunpowder, 99);. (Emergency Shuttle (88,55,14))
[2024-04-12 16:08:23.388] ATTACK: Lizardboreansupersoldier/(Michel Garland) (mob_3436) primed a chemical grenade at Emergency Shuttle (89,49,14) containing: (metamaterial beaker 1 : Phosphorus, 60 | Potassium, 60 | Chlorine Trifluoride, 1 | Plasma, 59); (metamaterial beaker 2 : Sugar, 60 | Napalm, 20 | Fluorosulfuric Acid, 20 | Phlogiston, 20.0008 | Plasma, 60);. (Emergency Shuttle (88,55,14))

Priming means you basically "clicked" the grenade, as far as I'm aware, perhaps someone more versed in the logging system can explain if there's anything untoward here, but as I say, all evidence I could find points to you, and nobody else

Two weeks is entirely fair given the evidence I have, and if anyone else were to have activated those grenades, they would have been logged as activating them, not you

[Lizardborea]

I dont know what to tell you I could suspect that popped out like that because the grenades were set on a signaler

[Fatal]

Here's the related log if anyone wants to look through it

https://tgstation13.org/parsed-logs/ter ... attack.txt

As far as I'm aware, our logging system is pretty robust when it comes to these things, and if someone were to fire it off with signaller, it would have told us that

[Fatal]

Alright, we have done some testing because we did find something after we went through the game log some more

https://tgstation13.org/parsed-logs/ter ... 1/game.txt

It does appear that someone else pulsed the grenades as you said, and we tested this in the thunderdome to see if we could replicate the issue with the logging, and we did


Considering all that, I'm going to reduce the ban and change the note, whilst we cannot prove who DID activate those grenades (that I can find so far at least), our proof that you did, we can confirm to be flawed. However, given you made that grenade, you do have to take some responsibility for the damage it caused (making WMD level weapons is always a risky move as a non-antag), so I'm just going to reduce this to a dayban

Does that sound reasonable

[Lizardborea]

That sounds very reasonable, thanks.

[Fatal]

Okay, ban reduced to merely a day and note changed to reflect the new information we have:

Manufactured two hellfire grenades which were stolen by someone else and activated on the emergency shuttle via signaller, sometimes its best to save the super WMD weapons for just when you're an antag

Apologies for the inconvenience, and thanks to the other admins who helped look through and find the logging issue here

[iwishforducks]

Hey there, after doing a quick code dive, I believe I have found the reason as to why Lizard was shown as the "primer" in the logs.

First and foremost, the fact that the grenades were triggered by a signal is the single most important piece of information here:

Code: Select all

[2024-04-12 16:08:23.277] GAME: 16:08:23.277] GAME: A remote signaling device has pulsed the chemical grenade (/obj/item/grenade/chem_grenade), which was installed by lizardboreansupersoldier

[2024-04-12 16:08:23.320] GAME: 16:08:23.320] GAME: primed a chemical grenade at Emergency Shuttle (89,49,14) containing: (metamaterial beaker 1 : Gunpowder, 120 | Water, 60); (metamaterial beaker 2 : Fluorosurfactant, 60 | Chlorine Trifluoride, 1 | Phlogiston, 20.0007 | Gunpowder, 99);.

[2024-04-12 16:08:23.347] GAME: 16:08:23.347] GAME: A remote signaling device has pulsed the chemical grenade (/obj/item/grenade/chem_grenade), which was installed by lizardboreansupersoldier

[2024-04-12 16:08:23.390] GAME: 16:08:23.390] GAME: primed a chemical grenade at Emergency Shuttle (89,49,14) containing: (metamaterial beaker 1 : Phosphorus, 60 | Potassium, 60 | Chlorine Trifluoride, 1 | Plasma, 59); (metamaterial beaker 2 : Sugar, 60 | Napalm, 20 | Fluorosulfuric Acid, 20 | Phlogiston, 20.0008 | Plasma, 60);. 

If we look at the code for grenades, this is where it begins the process of logging who'dun'did'it when triggered via wire:

Code: Select all

/datum/wires/explosive/chem_grenade/explode()
	var/obj/item/grenade/chem_grenade/grenade = holder
	var/obj/item/assembly/pulser = get_attached(get_wire(1))
	var/message = "\An [pulser] has pulsed [grenade] ([grenade.type]), which was installed by [fingerprint]"
	if(istype(pulser, /obj/item/assembly/voice))
		var/obj/item/assembly/voice/spoken_trigger = pulser
		message +=  " with the following activation message: \"[spoken_trigger.recorded]\""
	if(!grenade.dud_flags)
		message_admins(message)
	log_game(message)
	var/mob/M = get_mob_by_ckey(fingerprint)
	grenade.log_grenade(M) //Used in arm_grenade() too but this one conveys where the mob who triggered the bomb is
	if(grenade.landminemode)
		grenade.detonate() ///already armed
	else
		grenade.arm_grenade() //The one here conveys where the bomb was when it went boom

As you can see, the pulse logs are in the code here.
However, more interesting, is that when pulsed by wire, it places the blame on who has the current fingerprints of the grenade.

Code: Select all

var/mob/M = get_mob_by_ckey(fingerprint)
grenade.log_grenade(M) //Used in arm_grenade() too but this one conveys where the mob who triggered the bomb is

If we look into what happens when you attach a pulse to a grenade...

Code: Select all

/datum/wires/explosive/chem_grenade/attach_assembly(color, obj/item/assembly/S)
	if(istype(S,/obj/item/assembly/timer))
		var/obj/item/grenade/chem_grenade/G = holder
		var/obj/item/assembly/timer/T = S
		G.det_time = T.saved_time*10
	else if(istype(S,/obj/item/assembly/prox_sensor))
		var/obj/item/assembly/prox_sensor/sensor = S
		var/obj/item/grenade/chem_grenade/grenade = holder
		grenade.landminemode = sensor
		sensor.proximity_monitor.set_ignore_if_not_on_turf(FALSE)
	else if(istype(S,/obj/item/assembly/health))
		var/obj/item/assembly/health/sensor = S
		if(!sensor.secured)
			sensor.toggle_secure()
		if(!sensor.scanning)
			sensor.toggle_scan()
	fingerprint = S.fingerprintslast
	return ..()

... it places fingerprints on the grenade of the person who installed the signaller. This would explain why it's placing the blame on Lizard, even though they were not the ones to pulse the signal. There's no logs on pulsing signals, or at least pulsing signals on chemical grenades.

[NecromancerAnne]

When in doubt, always check hrefs.

[2024-04-12 16:08:22.064] HREF-TGUI: cymrulad24 (as Toolbox at 89,49,14)
- Using: /obj/item/assembly/signaler [0x2025cbc]
- new Signaler fancy 1

[2024-04-12 16:08:23.265] HREF-TGUI: cymrulad24 (as Toolbox at 89,49,14) in tgui-window-1
- Using: /obj/item/assembly/signaler [0x2025cbc]
- Action: signal {}

TGUI actions are logged and tracked.

[Fatal]

Well the logging issue for this is already up on github so this is unlikely to happen again

This is resolved so shuffling off