Do we really need Basil?

ColonicAcid · Tue Aug 25, 2015 12:27 am

Bottom post of the previous page:

He assumed something, and like majority of assumptions, it was not even close to the truth.
Look at feedback, tell me all the "remove x" and what players made them and see what server they go to.
Hint: it's not basil.

Malkevin · Post by **Malkevin** » Tue Aug 25, 2015 9:37 am #114754

Assumptions? I was there arguing with them on a daily basis you fuck knuckle.

I'm talking policy not code

The biggest culprits for policy being as weak as it is are hbl and pandarsenic, both from server2.
In fact the majority of admins we got at the time were from and admined almost solely on server2.

ColonicAcid · Tue Aug 25, 2015 12:39 pm

Yes the Yinadele admins were all from #2. Nobody is arguing that.

The yinadele era was also 3 years ago, and back then it was the "rough and tumble" way of playing ss13 that you mentioned you wanted, so I don't really understand your point here?

Malkevin · Post by **Malkevin** » Tue Aug 25, 2015 3:12 pm #114803

No it wasn't, it was the end of that era.

People like me fought tooth and nail to slow down the encroachment of the server 2 admins but where we're at today was inevitable because at the end of the day its the admins that write and interpret and enforce the rules, and it was those admins that were selecting and training other admins to be like them, they were the ones with the actual power to change things to their way and the ability to select and make other people think their way too, my side on the other hand was a dying breed with no power other than the ability to grumble loudly.

TheWiznard · Post by **TheWiznard** » Tue Aug 25, 2015 4:57 pm #114821

Malkevin wrote:
BUT! What if we actually DID make Server 2 a completely separate server for a different play style?
Now hear me but you think I'm crazy.

I'm not talking about giving server 2 to the Basilers, because to be frank: there are half a dozen ss13 servers out there catering to their playstyle (hell, Sigurd was empty last I checked - they could go squat there), and if I'm to be honest they are the cancer that has turned tg into a hugb0x (not that the current Sybil playerbase isn't largely a cancer itself - somehow its managed to become an even bigger Idiocracy than it was two years ago), and its pretty daft running an entire server for their small playerbase.

But what if Server 2 became the TG Classic server, for those us that are man enough to deal with the low rules, low admin interference, rough and tumble playstyle of old.
The low rules rounds have apparently gone down a treat when ran on sybil, a large number of people actually enjoying them, and sybil will still exist for those bedwetters that still require admins to hold their hands when they're being fucktards.

Admins are normally on server 2 though, I don't understand. Server 2 is the TG classic server, that's where everyone hangs out at.
To be honest I rarely even log into server 1 anymore because hardly anyone is online. I could see the point in removing a server that only 10-15 people play on. I just think that if server 1 gets removed I'd just stop playing, I don't think I could get used to playing 20 minute long rounds again.

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Tue Aug 25, 2015 4:59 pm #114822

Can we clarify what is server 1 and what is server 2?

Are we going with the current (and imo wrong) of server 1 being Basil/Basiglasdasd and server 2 being Sybil or the older version of it being inverted.

E: I'm sure its S1 Basil S2 Sybil but still.

TheWiznard · Post by **TheWiznard** » Tue Aug 25, 2015 5:02 pm #114823

Steelpoint wrote:Can we clarify what is server 1 and what is server 2?

Are we going with the current (and imo wrong) of server 1 being Basil/Basiglasdasd and server 2 being Sybil or the older version of it being inverted.

E: I'm sure its S1 Basil S2 Sybil but still.

I'm just going off what the main page says

Malkevin · Post by **Malkevin** » Tue Aug 25, 2015 5:45 pm #114839

Ignore the main page, it's a lie

Takeguru · Post by **Takeguru** » Tue Aug 25, 2015 9:59 pm #114881

Wasn't bagil moved to the left to try to goad people to joining it instead?

Or am I talking out my ass

Post by **oranges** » Thu Aug 27, 2015 8:16 am #115167

that was mso's le epic troll

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Thu Aug 27, 2015 9:39 am #115174

As apart of many attempts to boost Basil's population the server numbers, and the server positions, were swapped so Basil was Server 1 and Sybil was Server 2.

I don't know but do we even have the population to support two servers that are well populated each? It seems we only ever get one server that breaches more than that twenty person limit (sybil) while the other server (basil) always remains sub twenty people at best.

I mean fucking Oranges is paying just 10$ shy of the 60$ needed to fund Basil, if the Patron funders don't care or are fine with paying to support Basil then so be it, its not like Basil's somehow detracting from /tg/station overall or Sybil's population. Sure you can (try and) make a case of the actual people that play on Basil may not be the best but the actual server is not really impeding anything aside from people's wallets, of which they are paying willingly.

Post by **oranges** » Mon Aug 31, 2015 6:46 am #115954

it's oranges

QuartzCrystal · Mon Aug 31, 2015 10:07 pm

Has anyone else noticed Basil's population has diminished slowly since ERP was allowed?

Falamazeer · Post by **Falamazeer** » Mon Aug 31, 2015 10:13 pm #116040

QuartzCrystal wrote:Has anyone else noticed Basil's population has diminished slowly since ERP was allowed?

I dunno if causality is a part of these linked points, but yeah, a bit.

there are 5 on right now. compared to 66/65 on sybil, just as a sampling.

Not-Dorsidarf · Sun Jul 30, 2023 1:33 am

That's because the ERPers don't have to only do it when there are no admins on, so they go to chaosstation13

Post by **oranges** » Wed Sep 02, 2015 4:37 am #116259

QuartzCrystal wrote:Has anyone else noticed Basil's population has diminished slowly since ERP was allowed?

my secret master plan has been revealed

Shadowlight213 · Wed Sep 02, 2015 7:52 am

We should open up bagil to coderbus to use as a dev server possibly for testing features or gememodes before pushing live.

Tornadium · Post by **Tornadium** » Wed Sep 02, 2015 9:19 am #116292

Can we please re ban ERP for the love of god.

Get them back on fucking Basil.

Not-Dorsidarf · Wed Sep 02, 2015 8:29 pm

palpatine213 wrote:We should open up bagil to coderbus to use as a dev server possibly for testing features or gememodes before pushing live.

It is, in theory. Just wait until both MSO and a maintainer are online and there isn't a real round on basil and talk really fast at them.

Demonbane · Post by **Demonbane** » Fri Sep 04, 2015 6:21 pm #116752

fuck u

Demonbane · Post by **Demonbane** » Fri Sep 04, 2015 6:22 pm #116753

and fuck u francium for posting this old ass thread in ooc

francinum · Post by **francinum** » Fri Sep 04, 2015 11:15 pm #116817

Demonbane wrote:and fuck u francium for posting this old ass thread in ooc

I didn't post this, someone else did.

Luke Cox · Post by **Luke Cox** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:25 pm #117272

Map rotation on Sybil, low-pop map on Basil. Problem solved.

Ahammer18 · Post by **Ahammer18** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:42 pm #117276

Im okay with how things are run currently, however, if Sybil were to run with a larger, more largepop supporting map, I could see this being a good thing.

QuartzCrystal · Fri Sep 25, 2015 4:48 pm

Destroy Basil.

Malkevin · Post by **Malkevin** » Fri Sep 25, 2015 5:43 pm #121267

Remove Basil, Sybil Strong

QuartzCrystal · Fri Sep 25, 2015 6:44 pm

Basil currently has 0 players online, Sybil has 51.

I logged onto Basil earlier, there was a single player online (who was also antag) with myself and one other admin observing. It is a cancer.

Shadowlight213 · Fri Sep 25, 2015 7:07 pm

Just blacklist a bunch of stuff in sandbox, and set bagil to that.

Wyzack · Post by **Wyzack** » Fri Sep 25, 2015 7:10 pm #121289

Our population has plummeted as of late, i guess because school is back in or something. But really, why are all you sybil players so anal devastated about the existence of a server no one is forcing you to play on?

Post by **Atlanta-Ned** » Sat Sep 26, 2015 4:23 pm #121433

I'd play on Basil more (and view it as a viable alternative to Sybil) if the population was in that sweet spot of like, more then 20 but less than 60 people. As long as it's "the overflow server", it's gonna stay that way. Especially with the population caps being what they are.

I think at this rate, the "Basil is for metafriends" schtick is too ingrained in the community's culture to get rid of it. Scrap the Basil/Sybil names and give them something new entirely. Don't even announce it, just do it one day and enjoy the ensuing meltdown.

Or we can keep circlejerking over metagangs.

Wyzack · Post by **Wyzack** » Sat Sep 26, 2015 4:24 pm #121434

Basil hasn't been called basil since the NT days, most just still call it that because it is the most well known name

Remie Richards · Sat Sep 26, 2015 10:06 pm

Atlanta-Ned wrote: Scrap the Basil/Sybil names and give them something new entirely. Don't even announce it, just do it one day and enjoy the ensuing meltdown.

Wouldn't work.
The button positions were swapped, and people still went to Sybil.
The name "Sybil" may as well just be a title, Sybil is highpop+box, the highpop tends to move to box, so whichever server that is, will become Sybil in spirit.

Bluespace · Post by **Bluespace** » Sat Sep 26, 2015 11:06 pm #121476

I was never in support of basil being shut down but I think with sybil population not being an issue and basil being empty all the time it's time we accept sybil as our only station.

Scones · Post by **Scones** » Sun Sep 27, 2015 1:58 am #121509

mercy killing

tuypo1 · Post by **tuypo1** » Sun Sep 27, 2015 9:10 am #121539

lumipharon wrote: There is a big fucking difference between getting to knowing people (which is what anyone with atleast the mental capacity of a toaster will achieve), and actually metafriending. ie: Knowing Dick McTickler always starts fights, so when someone accuses him of assault, you're more inclined to believe them. As opposed to: hearing that Dick McTicker and someone are in a fight, so you run over and beat the other person to death without any context.

Indeed to use an example from another server over on d20 we have lone lee being really touchy around silicons so the ai knows to be careful around him it's not a perfect example because the crew on a larger server would stop the ai killers shit but the basic idea of saying somebody should not use what they know about somebody's personality being stupid remains the same.

And in my experience almost all use of prior knowledge of a character is people having negative opinions of somebody for instance I spend far less time getting zoey Webb to cooperate in interrogation then anybody else and she ends up in perma far more rapidly for it.

Some might say that that just goes from metafriending to metagrudging but there's a difrence between searching a clown known for shaving people bald if you see broken mirrors or missing shavers and just instantly arresting them without evidence or giving them a 10 minuite sentence for shaving people when you would give anybody else 2.

Anybody except for a clown, mime, Borg or ai using a static name is stupid anyway but if your going to have it on a server you have to accept there will be effects on the game.

tuypo1 · Post by **tuypo1** » Sun Sep 27, 2015 9:21 am #121540

Wyzack wrote:You forgot the most likely scenario, where the round generates a single changeling, tatorling or traitor, they go loud and get killed 10 minutes in and then we get another pseudo extended. We really need more admin presence on server 2

And of course if those killed don't get revived there out of the round for 3+ hours it's the only situation where people auctualy have a reason to complain about low pop murderboner.

Not-Dorsidarf · Sun Jul 30, 2023 1:33 am

Despite being a long-term basil player, I really think it's become superfluous now. Nobody is interested in it, so why keep it?Also now boxaholics cant just foist the cool maps off on the server where nobody sees them.

Also: The irony of ERP unbanning killing basil.

PickleInspector · Mon Sep 28, 2015 8:43 pm

Took all the thrill out, don't you know.

tuypo1 · Post by **tuypo1** » Tue Sep 29, 2015 3:05 am #121916

Problem is if we ditch basil we loss the superior map. map rotation could work but we all know byond has a tendency to wipe its cache and make users redox load the game how much data would the actual map file add it could really fuck over rural Australians who can't spare the bandwidth.

tuypo1 · Post by **tuypo1** » Tue Sep 29, 2015 3:10 am #121918

It might help to make messages to centcom/the syndicate and prayers to go through to ooc like ahelps do

Tue Sep 29, 2015 3:30 am

tuypo1 wrote:Problem is if we ditch basil we loss the superior map. map rotation could work but we all know byond has a tendency to wipe its cache and make users redox load the game how much data would the actual map file add it could really fuck over rural Australians who can't spare the bandwidth.

map preference is entirely objective by nature, don't use it as subjective evidence

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Tue Sep 29, 2015 3:36 am #121928

Fucking over rural Australians is already targeting a very specific niche of a already small population.

Not to mention, according to the Australian Bureau of Statistics, barely 2.6% of people live in remote or very remote areas. This goes to around 11% if you include outer regional areas (ABS, 2004).

-----
References

Australian Bureau of Statistics. (2004). How many people live in Australia's remote areas?. (No.1301.0). Canberra, ACT: Author.

tuypo1 · Post by **tuypo1** » Tue Sep 29, 2015 3:57 am #121935

Steelpoint wrote:Fucking over rural Australians is already targeting a very specific niche of a already small population.

Not to mention, according to the Australian Bureau of Statistics, barely 2.6% of people live in remote or very remote areas. This goes to around 11% if you include outer regional areas (ABS, 2004).

-----
References

Australian Bureau of Statistics. (2004). How many people live in Australia's remote areas?. (No.1301.0). Canberra, ACT: Author.

I suppose your right there

PKPenguin321 wrote:[quote="tuypo1]
map preference is entirely objective by nature, don't use it as subjective evidence

[/quote]
I would say it's pretty relevant I can't be the only one who prefers the map of bagel but the pop of Sybil

Not-Dorsidarf · Sun Jul 30, 2023 1:33 am

tuypo1 wrote:
Steelpoint wrote:Fucking over rural Australians is already targeting a very specific niche of a already small population.

Not to mention, according to the Australian Bureau of Statistics, barely 2.6% of people live in remote or very remote areas. This goes to around 11% if you include outer regional areas (ABS, 2004).

-----
References

Australian Bureau of Statistics. (2004). How many people live in Australia's remote areas?. (No.1301.0). Canberra, ACT: Author.
I suppose your right there

PKPenguin321 wrote:[quote="tuypo1]
map preference is entirely objective by nature, don't use it as subjective evidence

I would say it's pretty relevant I can't be the only one who prefers the map of bagel but the pop of Sybil[/quote][/quote][/quote]

MSO has been working on map rotation for weeks.

tuypo1 · Post by **tuypo1** » Tue Sep 29, 2015 2:17 pm #121989

oh it will be interesting to see how that turns out then

im surprised to here its something that would take more then 2 minuites but you know byond

Not-Dorsidarf · Wed Sep 30, 2015 9:29 am

tuypo1 wrote:oh it will be interesting to see how that turns out then

im surprised to here its something that would take more then 2 minuites but you know byond

You can't code this in BYOND apparently, he's hooking it to an external program between rounds

Tornadium · Post by **Tornadium** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:44 am #122183

Remove Basil 2015.

Post by **MrStonedOne** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 4:07 pm #122240

<TheGhostOfWhibyl1> [-tg-station] MrStonedOne opened pull request #12089: HOLY FUCKING SHIT, I'VE DONE IT! Map rotation! (master...maprotation) https://github.com/tgstation/-tg-station/pull/12089

Tornadium · Post by **Tornadium** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 4:23 pm #122248

MSO #1

QuartzCrystal · Wed Sep 30, 2015 8:36 pm

Remove Basil 2015

Wyzack · Post by **Wyzack** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 8:49 pm #122325

I am so tired of fighting against all the anti basil rhetoric. Go ahead and fucking kill it then. I hope that it improves your sybil experience somehow you assholes.