[Aranclanos] paprka - banned for IC in OOC

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Sun Sep 28, 2014 11:35 pm #31935

Byond account and character name: paprka / wyatt shields
Banning admin: aranclanos
Ban reason and length: 15m, IC in OOC
Time ban was placed (including time zone): 4:30pm PST
Your side of the story: I WAS BANNED FOR IC IN OOC BECAUSE ARAN WAS MAD
Why you think you should be unbanned: ARANCLANOS IS BAD AT ADMINISTRATING

Aran actually banned me because I got him caught by sec when I stunned him and put a chameleon projector at his feet ingame. He was an atmospherics tech, I leaked plasma, I blamed it on him. I came back and yelled AYY LMAO when sec was arresting him and ran off, then he banned me for 'ic in ooc'. And then my AMAZING double agent round was ruined because he was booty bothered.

Plz remove his admin powers.

Edit: Someone move this to admin complaints actually, there's nothing to appeal here.

CreationPro · Post by **CreationPro** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 12:10 am #31945

ayy lmao in IC? 15 minutes and you are mad about it? K.

Post by **NikNakFlak** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 12:10 am #31946

Ayy Lmao is OOC in IC and it was agreed unanimously for all admins to ban for it and there are tons of bans for it already.
<Aranclanos> it was ooc in ic, it was a typo

Skorvold · Post by **Skorvold** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 12:13 am #31947

please deadmin aran asap this is atrocious

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 12:24 am #31950

Except there was a guy literally named 'ayy lmao' in that round and he never got banned.

Nice cherrypicking.

CreationPro wrote:ayy lmao in IC? 15 minutes and you are mad about it? K.

It was in the middle of a round that was ruined because of this garbage ban without even a PM. The circumstances that happened just before the ban (when there were like 4 other admins online, mind you) kind of make me think this doesn't have anything to do with aran being a good administrator and more him being mad. He also left immediately after that round, so.

NikNakFlak wrote:Ayy Lmao is OOC in IC and it was agreed unanimously for all admins to ban for it and there are tons of bans for it already.

I was completely unaware this was even a thing, an admin PM before kneejerk banning would have been appropriate. But keep excusing Aran's bullshit administrating as legitimate, I guess?

CreationPro · Post by **CreationPro** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 12:29 am #31951

I agree with everything you just said.

Post by **NikNakFlak** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 12:39 am #31952

paprika wrote:Except there was a guy literally named 'ayy lmao' in that round and he never got banned.

Nice cherrypicking.

Ayy lmao was a clown, and if I may quote the name policy:
Pick a normal name. You must have a first name and a last name (e.g John Smith). You must not use honorifics or nick names (E.g. Dr Greg House or Jack "Johnny" Johnson), and must be spelt fully with capitals and no shortenings (e.g. NOT J Hoffman or jaiden mallow). Exceptions to this are Eats-The-Lemons format of Lizard names, Clown, Mime, Silicon, Wizard and Nuke Op names. References are still allowed, but try to be original.

NikNakFlak wrote:Ayy Lmao is OOC in IC and it was agreed unanimously for all admins to ban for it and there are tons of bans for it already.

paprka wrote:I was completely unaware this was even a thing, an admin PM before kneejerk banning would have been appropriate. But keep excusing Aran's bullshit administrating as legitimate, I guess?

It is not bullshit, ignorance of the rules is never an excuse to break them. This has been a thing for months now. As far as I am concerned, this is resolved.

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 12:45 am #31954

I guess.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 3:44 am #32006

Whether paprika deserved the ban for OOC in IC or not
isn't it normally bad for business to have an admin banning someone they were involved with IC?

I'm not talking about just being close enough to Paprika to hear the offending message. The whole chain of "I dunked Aran and then got banned by Aran for something else".

Good job totally ignoring the part where the admin banned the player who just got them thrown in prison to parrot "LEL 15 MINUTE BAN", team. Are you guys actively covering for bad behavior or just ignorant?

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 3:51 am #32007

I don't know. Aran's a shitter with his administration powers (THERE IS A LOT OF EVIDENCE FOR THIS ACTUALLY) but niknak has a point. I don't like AYY LMAO either. It's annoying and almost as bad as when aran spammed MESSI every time he could during fifa. Anyway, while I don't put it past Aran to ban me after I dunked his ass (I was on a pretty great spree of looting enemy double agents that round and he happened to get caught in the crossfire) I also deserved the ban. I'd want someone who said AYY LMAO to be banned too. But not immediately, not when they're antag, not in the middle of their round. Because that's fucking stupid. I said it to be annoying and piss off the sec guard and dana ray who was being arrested when I outside the window in space after I flooded plasma. That's what antags do. I thought antags were above most of the rules because they're supposed to be antags? What happened to that?

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 4:06 am #32011

This is really more grounds for an admincomplaint than a ban appeal.

It's a justifiable ban, but it's also very plain to see that Aran was frustrated with you for something that happened in game and capitalized on an opportunity to punish you as an admin.

Food for thought: what are the odds you would've been banned for this if the events leading up to it hadn't happened? Or if Aran had reported the OOC in IC infraction to another admin to handle?

Hornygranny · Post by **Hornygranny** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 4:19 am #32013

I can promise if Aran sees anybody say ayy lmao IC he will ban them, I have made him hate it.

CreationPro · Post by **CreationPro** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 4:25 am #32016

I've been about to PM you myself when Aran applied the ban (I was spectating you after some guy adminhelped about you killing him), so the odds are pretty high. I'd also give you some time to cover somewhere, probably.

I also spawned a carp of retribution on you, sorry. :^)

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 4:30 am #32017

An0n3 wrote:This is really more grounds for an admincomplaint than a ban appeal.

I suggested this in the main post and reported it to forum moderators to move it, I don't know why they haven't yet

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 4:52 am #32021

CreationPro wrote:I also spawned a carp of retribution on you, sorry. :^)

I wouldn't give a shit, you could sick a ninja on me for the fucking rampage I went on. The fact that I didn't even get a chance to fight back just because aran got booty bothered I framed him for the plasma flooding made me butthurt.

CreationPro · Post by **CreationPro** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 4:54 am #32022

Nah, the one I spawned was before you got banned (you e-sworded it pretty quick), throwing one on an unprotected person is boring. I am unaware what happened to your body afterwards, you were in space next to the AI satellite, that's all I know.

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 5:00 am #32023

Oh haha yeah I thought that was just a conveniently timed carp spawn coming after me for the mass murdering. I don't mind that at all. I tried to end it early by c4ing myself and jihading the brig from maint but alas c4ing yourself doesn't work anymore (i don't see why not it's hilarious)

Aranclanos · Post by **Aranclanos** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 10:49 am #32075

I though this thread was a joke. Oh well.

You're saying that I was buttmad, but I wasn't actually, you didn't kill me when you had the chance on the first place and gifted me for some reason the charmeleon projector. For those who don't know, pap was in atmos and shot me with an ebow, and because I'm a scrub who needs no help I didn't yell on the radio for help, instead I talked to pap two or one lines, he left me live. It was even cooler when this was the second situation in a row that day on the same job on the same place, some tator let me live saying 'don't tell anyone' and I ran like hell.
Anyways, at some point I came back to atmos and an officer entered, finding me with the charmeleon projector, who at this point didn't even touch, so there was a funny situation where I had to explain where it came from, some guy in a bloody engineer hardsuit, that sounded like an imaginary person, but in the middle of the explanation you showed up, and I screamed that there was no such engineer in fear that you would kill me, at least that was my intention because you can't type that fast, I think I only was able to say 'I MEAN I DON'T KNOW ANY ENGINEER'.
Then you said ayy lmao, the sec officer believed me and I waited for you to move away from the screen before banning you, so you would be in a 'safe' position in space.

Oh and I edited the ban reason because it was a typo, OOC in IC, not IC in OOC.

Why would I be mad after you gifted me an item and left me life, I was having fun.

QuartzCrystal · Mon Sep 29, 2014 1:04 pm

Call me a stupid pubbie who doesn't know anything, but why is "ayy lmao" OOC in IC?

Saegrimr · Post by **Saegrimr** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 1:23 pm #32107

For the same reason other chatspeak and smileys are OOC in IC.

"hey u get that egun from my locker lol ;^)"

QuartzCrystal · Mon Sep 29, 2014 1:25 pm

This is gonna reflect even worse on me as a person, but I have been reading "ayy lmao" in this thread and entirely not registering that "lmao" isn't an actual word.

Thanks for the clarification Saeg.

Hibbles · Post by **Hibbles** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 2:48 pm #32119

The only issue I have is with avoiding even the appearance of bad things, namely, don't ban people you were involved with IC, even if it's a situation like this. This isn't a reprimand of Aran so much as a reminder of the policy we try to keep.

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 6:00 pm #32177

Aranclanos wrote:Why would I be mad after you gifted me an item and left me life, I was having fun.

Why would you ban an antag for saying two words? What if I only said it because that was the clown's name? Don't you find it stupid that you banned me for 15 minutes in the middle of my traitor round for saying a stupid meme when you could spam HITLER DID NOTHING WRONG or WGW without getting banned as an antag?

Like come the fuck on Aran.

Aranclanos · Post by **Aranclanos** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 7:41 pm #32202

Antag status isn't some kind of shield against bans. The complaint is about some bias that is nonexistent, over a 15 min ban. I don't feel like I was involved to you rally, you just shot me with an ebow. If you screamed that I was leaking plasma, I didn't notice it, I wasn't paying a lot of attention. The security officer didn't even try to arrest me or hinted anything about it, he was pretty chill.

There wasn't anything happening to me related to you, really. You broke the rurus and you got bant.

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 9:06 pm #32229

I never implied antag status was a shield against bans, but antags NEVER get hit with stupid bans like this unless it's metagaming. Antag status absolutely means you're above some of the rules, too, unless you're implying that antags aren't allowed to be dicks or something. You can keep trying to prove it was legitimate and you weren't mad as hell but the fact that you left immediately after this and typo'd (likely out of frustration that i said two words??) says otherwise. This is shit administrating. No antag should be banned for this, especially not by an admin they were antagonizing.

I'd really like to see proof that aran's ban here is totally acceptable behavior of an admin and it happens more often. I'll still be depressed but at least it won't be directed towards a coder who abuses his admin powers on a monthly basis.

Hornygranny · Post by **Hornygranny** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 9:47 pm #32258

He's a codermin, not just a coder. Hyperbole doesn't do you any favors, take your sore rump elsewhere.

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Mon Sep 29, 2014 10:01 pm #32263

Are you a hypocrite just some of the time or all of the time HG

Aranclanos · Post by **Aranclanos** » Tue Sep 30, 2014 12:06 am #32301

I explained exactly how the situation was for me, isn't that enough proof? You invented a situation that doesn't exist and now you're asking me proof of why it isn't real.

Nobody blamed me for anything, nobody arrested me for anything, I wasn't involved to you. The last interaction we had was you shoting me once, actually not killing me and gifting me an item, and that happened like 5 minutes before the ban, in-between that time I left and came back to atmos.

You arrived, broke the rules, got banned, assumed and instantly made a complaint.

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Tue Sep 30, 2014 5:08 am #32362

Fuck off steno

@Aran:
But you were involved with me, I did shoot you and flood plasma when you were an atmos tech and you were blamed for possessing the cham proj and flooding plasma, and you'll have a hard time convincing anyone that you aren't involved with me during that round after that.

Okay, so let's say Aran wasn't buttmad from the antagonizing -- he did ban an antag for saying two words and I'd really love some proof that the rest of the administration totally thinks this is okay and not completely retarded even if it was a shitty meme. I've seen this happen HUNDREDS of times by antags. Especially WGW. NEVER SAY AYY LMAO EVER OR YOU WILL FACE A 15 MINUTE BAN IN THE MIDDLE OF YOUR ANTAG ROUND!! is stupid as fuck. No admin I've ever seen would do this.

Saegrimr · Post by **Saegrimr** » Tue Sep 30, 2014 6:53 am #32391

paprika wrote:NEVER SAY AYY LMAO EVER OR YOU WILL FACE A 15 MINUTE BAN IN THE MIDDLE OF YOUR ANTAG ROUND!! is stupid as fuck. No admin I've ever seen would do this.

http://tgstation13.org/wiki/Rules
>7. Speak like a normal person while in character. Don’t spam, either IC or OOC. Don’t use smileys, netspeak, etc. in IC speech.

I've put in like 8 of these bans myself.

Hibbles · Post by **Hibbles** » Tue Sep 30, 2014 5:11 pm #32461

The only part of this issue I mind, the actual him banning a person he was 'involved' with, I've talked with Aran about it and sorted things out. Otherwise? I'm sorry Paprka, but that's kinda how it goes. A bit on the harsh side compared to the usual but not extraordinarily so.

EDIT: And to clarify, I've personally seen more than once adminbus up in arms about the 'ayy lmao' crap and other soft OOC in IC we'd usually let go, multiple admins have been enthusiastic about putting that kind of thing in the trash.

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Wed Oct 01, 2014 7:49 am #32624

Saegrimr wrote:
paprika wrote:NEVER SAY AYY LMAO EVER OR YOU WILL FACE A 15 MINUTE BAN IN THE MIDDLE OF YOUR ANTAG ROUND!! is stupid as fuck. No admin I've ever seen would do this.
http://tgstation13.org/wiki/Rules
>7. Speak like a normal person while in character. Don’t spam, either IC or OOC. Don’t use smileys, netspeak, etc. in IC speech.

I've put in like 8 of these bans myself.

On antags? You guys seem to be ignoring the only part of this ban I'm actually upset about

Aranclanos · Post by **Aranclanos** » Wed Oct 01, 2014 1:04 pm #32678

Yes, again, being antag isn't a shield against bans

Post by **MrStonedOne** » Thu Oct 02, 2014 3:29 am #32836

The argument here is that short bans like that effect an antag (or head) more then normal.

Its an argument I can agree with, and I do in fact give warnings on borderline things like this when its likely their round will be more effected by a short ban then normal.

Oh, and trying to shift the argument over to "antag isn't a shield against bans" is a bit dishonest. You're either not trying to understand the argument or you're ignoring it.

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Thu Oct 02, 2014 3:34 am #32839

Of course he's intentionally shifting the argument, he made a shitty ban and this isn't the first time.

Aranclanos · Post by **Aranclanos** » Thu Oct 02, 2014 4:13 am #32850

If you're so upset of getting banned in your antag round, DON'T BREAK THE RULES. I'm sick of repeating myself on this thread, if you want antags to be free to break the rules because they got RNG luck of getting antag, go make a policy thread and stop annoying me. Also this is all about 'ayy lmao', for next time please pick something less cancerous.
You claimed that there was bias, there wasn't, then you switched the admin complaint to discuss how your antag status should protect you instead, you're just looking for any excuses to complain at this point! And I'm not even sure why, your ban ended four days ago. It lasted 15 minutes.

You broke the rules. You got banned. FOR 15 MINUTES. End of the story.

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Thu Oct 02, 2014 4:35 am #32854

No this is an admin complaint about you being a shit admin kneejerk banning antags for breaking rules designed to keep annoying players out when the entire point of antag is to be annoying of which I've N E V E R seen another admin do.

WGW is an objectively older and more beaten to death 'cancerous' meme but that's allowed for antags to read because they're antags all of the sudden? Why is it up to the admins which memes antags are allowed to say to be annoying? I've never seen an antag banned for saying ayy lmao or reading WGW. Ever. That's what I'm asking for. Some proof this is fucking normal and not just Aran being a shitty admin.

Post by **MrStonedOne** » Thu Oct 02, 2014 5:21 am #32860

Since I'm sick and tried of seeing the argument get reframed to "antags exempt from bans":

It boils down to this:

Did you have any reason to think that they knew, at the time they pressed enter, that they were breaking the ooc in ic rule?

Is this rule common place enough that they should know?

Is this application of the rule common place enough that they should know?

If the answer to any of these is no, then maybe ruining an antag round wasn't the best way to go about this.

Hornygranny · Post by **Hornygranny** » Thu Oct 02, 2014 6:11 am #32866

Reading WGW isn't bannable, but it makes you valid for anyone on the station and you can get banned for defending yourself.

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Thu Oct 02, 2014 6:25 am #32870

Why not just blanket make all memes valid and or admin gibbable instead of fucking banning people for it like they committed a crime as bad as IC in OOC (which can be meta, everyone in the server can see it usually, and give away gametypes)?

I wouldn't mind if I got gibbed, got 50 carps spawned on me, got a space ninja named AYY LMAO sent after me, but getting banned like this is somehow as bad as IC in OOC is stupid. It's like Aran doesn't even know why we have the no IC in OOC rule - to prevent metagame, which can RUIN ROUNDS for EVERYBODY.

Saying emoticons in chat and saying shit like 'lmao' or 'lol is bad, but HOW is it even REMOTELY as bad as IC in OOC? I'm not contesting whether or not I broke the rules Aran, this would be a fucking ban appeal still if I was, I'm contesting whether or not you made a shitty ban. No other admin worth their salt else has made a ban like this. Parroting 'BROKE DA RULEZ GET BANT' is stupid. Administrating in ss13 has never been that black and white and implying it is proves my point that you shouldn't be an admin.

The reason this is an admin complaint and not a policy thread because you're the only admin I've ever seen capable of this kind of retarded kneejerk banning. So stop fucking doing it, please.

Aranclanos · Post by **Aranclanos** » Thu Oct 02, 2014 2:22 pm #32921

Well, yes, there are levels of OOC in IC, I don't think I ever banned someone who used smilies, I just told them to stop, as it's just an innocent mistake for not knowing how the game is. I DO instantly ban people who go 'bitch im telling the admins ur getting bant' (actually there might be cases were I didn't insta-ban for this). And also memespouters, because I don't think it's an innocent mistake, It's just retardation that we don't really welcome. We have been banning the 'ayy lmao' idiotic memspouting for weeks now, there are other admins on this same thread telling you about it. But you're still asking for proof.

I really don't know what you want, you invented bias, instantly proved wrong, you switched the complaint to your antag status, we told you being an antag doesn't protect you against bans, you asked for proof and you have admins on this same thread telling you that yes, we ban for memespouting. It was a 15 minute ban, there is no valid complaint here, get over yourself.

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 6:59 am #33140

There's no proof any of these admins have banned antags for saying memes. Once AGAIN deflecting the issue here. Sure, they ban meme spouters, but not antags in the middle of their rounds. That's the proof I'm asking for, in simple terms you can easily understand, since you either seem to be too stupid to read what I've said several times or are just intentionally shifting the conversation away from this to try and prove it wasn't a shitty ban that no other admins have made.

Ignoring the context and trying to make it black and white is, once again, awful administrating.

Pandarsenic · Post by **Pandarsenic** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 11:08 am #33208

I can't believe for a second that any other circumstance, especially a player ahelping, would've been met with a prompt mid-antag-round ban. Should it? Maybe. Has it? Provide logs.

Saegrimr · Post by **Saegrimr** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 7:43 pm #33358

paprika wrote:There's no proof any of these admins have banned antags for saying memes. Once AGAIN deflecting the issue here.

I'm not gonna go digging through logs to check which one of my ayylmao bans were antags, i'm positive at least two of them were, and one of them was a captain.

I honestly do not care about "BUT MUH ANTAG ROUND" if you mix IC/OOC in any fashion, or break any of the rules for that matter.

Pandarsenic · Post by **Pandarsenic** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 8:42 pm #33377

Just checked. Saegrimr has put about 5 Ayylmao bans down. If I can work up the effort, I might dig through the actual proper logs instead of the bans for their antag statuses.

paprika · Post by **paprika** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 9:26 pm #33404

Saegrimr wrote:
paprika wrote:There's no proof any of these admins have banned antags for saying memes. Once AGAIN deflecting the issue here.
I'm not gonna go digging through logs to check which one of my ayylmao bans were antags, i'm positive at least two of them were, and one of them was a captain.

I honestly do not care about "BUT MUH ANTAG ROUND" if you mix IC/OOC in any fashion, or break any of the rules for that matter.

A new admin making shit bans doesn't exactly prove me wrong. Especially when older admins like Pandarsenic and An0n3 are condemning this ban.

"B-BUT HE SAID TWO WORDS!" is not a reason to shit on someone's round, especially without an admin PM or ANY kind of forewarning. OOC in IC is largely harmless as fuck, especially when it's just dumb memes. I don't like it either, it breaks immersion, but when it elicits the same kneejerk response that ACTUAL SERIOUS THINGS DO (IC in OOC) you might see where this gets into the territory of shitty administration. It doesn't completely fucking kill rounds for everyone in the same way IC in OOC can do, and being ignorant and saying 'lol dont care you broke the rules' is exactly the kind of shit I'm saying is the problem here.

Aranclanos · Post by **Aranclanos** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 9:31 pm #33405

I adminned more than pandar and anon3 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Hornygranny · Post by **Hornygranny** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 9:34 pm #33407

I think we're done here.