[stickymayhem] Cash Ricter - Day Ban for defending myself?

[Burninate]

Byond account and character name: Burninate / Cash Ricter

Banning admin: stickymayhem

Ban type (What are you banned from?): Temporary Ban

Ban reason and length: Killed someone for epipenning them. / 1440 minutes.

Time ban was placed (including time zone): 2/6/2015 9:30pm EST

Your side of the story: A player named Andrea Stainford had pricked me while I was looking in my web browser and not looking at SS13. When I heard the airlock close
I tabbed back in and saw her standing next to me. At that moment a message on my screen said "You feel sluggish." and I scrolled up to see I had been pricked. I immediately called her out for being a changeling across the radio and started beating her. I did beat her into critical but only because I was POSITIVE she was a changeling as the message "You feel sluggish" appeared which made me scared that she pricked me with a para sting or something in a round full of changelings. I later found out from stickymayhem that the prick was actually a EPI pen? I am not familiar with the item and did not know it makes you feel sluggish. However, Andrea did not say anything about administering me medication and I was at full HP and wouldn't have even needed it. I feel I did not overreact given the situation and the many changelings on board during the round.

Why you think you should be unbanned: I should be unbanned because the way I reacted is how any player would have reacted in a round full of changelings near round end. I felt endangered the moment that message "You feel sluggish" appeared on screen and I attacked her thinking she was just trying to absorb a AFK body. I feel stickymayhem may have overreacted SLIGHTLY with the type of ban given and did not look at the whole circumstance.

[Stickymayhem]

You did about 180 damage and they died of oxyloss shortly after. You beat someone to death for epipenning you when you could have taken any number of other courses of action.

Changelings do not prick you, epipens are incredibly common and used often and you beat someone to death for trying to help you.

Don't jump straight to killing people on the flimsiest possible evidence.

[Burninate]

You did about 180 damage and they died of oxyloss shortly after. You beat someone to death for epipenning you when you could have taken any number of other courses of action.

Changelings do not prick you, epipens are incredibly common and used often and you beat someone to death for trying to help you.

Don't jump straight to killing people on the flimsiest possible evidence.

What do you mean changelings don't prick you? In the past, when pricked by a changeling, it would display "you feel a tiny prick" on the screen. Is that no longer the case? Also, I was not damaged at all and she said nothing about trying to heal me. In a game where you can be killed in a blink of an eye by weird stuff like para stings, point blank revolver shots, cuff buckling, tiny pricks, etc, I feel my reaction was appropriate given the circumstance of KNOWN changelings on board. I wouldn't have done anything to her otherwise. I wasn't looking to kill a person for no reason. I was looking to survive because I felt I had been assaulted by a changeling. Also, not everyone knows everything about the game, no matter how common the item. I have asked some of the longer admins how something in the kitchen works and they don't have an answer which is fine. You shouldn't assume that everyone knows how a certain item works.

Again, in a round with known changelings, my reaction would have been pretty common for anyone not familiar with some of the newer items like epi pens. Also, you are making the assumption I knew she was trying to help me. She didn't tell me she was trying to help me and I beat her to near death BECAUSE I believed her to be a changeling. Not because "she was trying to help you".

[cedarbridge]

You did about 180 damage and they died of oxyloss shortly after. You beat someone to death for epipenning you when you could have taken any number of other courses of action.

Changelings do not prick you, epipens are incredibly common and used often and you beat someone to death for trying to help you.

Don't jump straight to killing people on the flimsiest possible evidence.

What do you mean changelings don't prick you? In the past, when pricked by a changeling, it would display "you feel a tiny prick" on the screen. Is that no longer the case?

Sticky is right. This has not been the case for a long time now.

[Burninate]

You did about 180 damage and they died of oxyloss shortly after. You beat someone to death for epipenning you when you could have taken any number of other courses of action.

Changelings do not prick you, epipens are incredibly common and used often and you beat someone to death for trying to help you.

Don't jump straight to killing people on the flimsiest possible evidence.

What do you mean changelings don't prick you? In the past, when pricked by a changeling, it would display "you feel a tiny prick" on the screen. Is that no longer the case?

Sticky is right. This has not been the case for a long time now.

How would a person know that if they haven't been stung by a changeling in awhile? I only reacted the way I did because I was under the impression that changelings still operated that way. I am an old player but not a player that plays very often. I don't mind being banned for a day but I just would like sticky to realize that he may have over done it considering the circumstances.

[Stickymayhem]

I explained the circumstances quite clearly. Anything running through your head outside the game is only metaknowledge.

At the end of the day, you beat someone to death for giving you medicine. This is about as clear-cut as bad kills get.

If you can accept that you don't know everything about the game you should probably accept that the first response is not to immediately beat someone to death, then ask questions later.

[Burninate]

I explained the circumstances quite clearly. Anything running through your head outside the game is only metaknowledge.

At the end of the day, you beat someone to death for giving you medicine. This is about as clear-cut as bad kills get.

If you can accept that you don't know everything about the game you should probably accept that the first response is not to immediately beat someone to death, then ask questions later.

What would have happened if she were a changeling? I am just supposed to let antags kill me because "they may be trying to help you." Its really easy for people to kill you in this game BEFORE you can react. This isn't like a first person shooter or anything like that where you can react and maybe live. IN this game, there is a very short period in which you can react. I chose to live instead of potentially being killed. The very culture and theme of SS13 is paranoia to an extent. In a game where anyone can be a traitor out to kill you, you are supposed to let people do potentially dangerous things to you just because "they could be helping."?

[Vekter]

You alt-tabbed out, came back and metagamed what happened instead of taking stock of your surroundings. If you would've inspected her (takes less than a second) you would've seen the epipen in her hand. If you would pay attention to patch notes you'd know that we removed most stings giving the prick message because metagaming became a huge issue.

It literally does not matter if changelings still worked that way or not. You shouldn't be making the assumption that just because you got pricked means whoever is near you is a changeling. Unless you're security or a Head, your character likely has no fucking clue what a changeling is (or at least basic knowledge) and isn't going to run around being 100% paranoid about them unless they have a damn good reason.

[Ikarrus]

We allow players to have knowledge of what antagonists are and generally what abilities they posses.

What I take issue here is that you weren't paying attention and used that information incorrectly (which is still okay, but then you), jumped to conclusions, and killed them on the spot because of a bad gut reaction.

You fucked up, and I don't feel that the ban length was excessive.

[peoplearestrange]

Resolving topic as both banning admin and head admin have suggested ban will stick.