[Note] {JeanManche} Trevorious

[Trevorious]

Trevorious

CS-F-Awoo

Is currently named : CS-F-Awoo. While being confronted about that, refused to see the issue. After being displayed the rule, and explained them the reasoning behind it, refused to see the issue still. After being told that the change was non negotiable, went with the attitude "or what?". This is a 15 minute ban for you to read the rules thoroughly and understand them. Next offense will be escalation in more deterrent measures.

2021-02--21 16:36:40

7431

I have been playing as this character for a month or so now. It's supposed to be a clone of my main character Ellie. I named them Awoo because it seemed fitting and similar to other clones names that weren't actual VATties with numbers.

But yea, I have played them in many rounds with many admins around, them even playing as characters right beside Awoo. Ahelped as this character aswell. So I know other admins have seen this name. Never has anyone told me before now it was in any way against any rules.

I understand my attitude when being talked to about the matter wasn't great, so the ban itself is reasonable.

A real issue I have with this is theres no rules for clones names. And it's being called immersion breaking but I don't see how.

I don't think it's unreasonable to think my character Ellie got cloned and named them Awoo. Considering clones don't even have names.

I would like the note changed to be about my attitude, or even, hopefully removed.

[JeanManche]

Here is the whole ticket conversation :

Log:
13:23:17: JeanManche/(JeanManche) PM'd Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo)
13:23:17: PM From JeanManche/(JeanManche): Hey bud. We have to talk about that char name.
13:23:31: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): what's wrong with it?
13:24:23: PM From JeanManche/(JeanManche): The question itself is a bit redundant, isn't it? When you read your char name, out loud, and compare it to other player's char names, doesn't it feel a bit out of place?
13:24:45: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): I don't see an issue here...
13:25:01: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): in fact I've had the name almost a month now and it's been fine
13:25:24: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): granted yes as CL it's strange and I didn't mean to join as CL but I didn't notice it was my clone character
13:25:47: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): is there some kinda naming guidelines to clones I wasn't aware of?
13:26:05: PM From JeanManche/(JeanManche): We are just unpaid slaves here, we don't see everything. I was just about to play when I noticed your char name. But the matter is : If there is no issue, why would everyone would not be named James(?|FLW) Awoo? Jimmy Fart? Alicia Waifu?
13:26:40: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): the differecne being I'm a clone, and my name isn't related to farting or waifu
13:27:13: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): what about the clone named kat, or the one named unga
13:28:32: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): I really do not see the issue here
13:29:43: PM From JeanManche/(JeanManche): Here is the rule section breaking : "Humans must have a realistic first name and last name with no honorifics attached. Nicknames in-between are fine. Synthetics must only have a human first name or nickname.(?|FLW) Silicons like AIs should use a one-word simple name, nickname or acronym for identification. Xenos are identified ICly by caste and/or their chosen nickname. The naming rule intends to preserve a certain degree of immersion. As a general guideline, if it wouldn't fit in a new non-comedy sci-fi work, it likely won't fit here. This is subjective and ultimately up to the discretion of the admins and lore people. Ask if in doubt to get your name approved." And here is the particular problematic issue : "The naming rule intends to preserve a certain degree of immersion. As a general guideline, if it wouldn't fit in a new non-comedy sci-fi work"
13:30:37: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): I still don't see the issue here, if it was a issue why hasn't it been addressed sooner by players
13:30:48: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): if they felt it was breaking their RP
13:31:30: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): the real issue here is theres no clone name guidelines
13:33:54: PM From JeanManche/(JeanManche): Answer is : players don't always ahelp, especially for RP matters. This is our staff job to fill this gap. Now, for the issue part, and this is not negociable : Awoo is not sci-fi friendly. Awoo is some anime stuff and has no place in a sci-fi universe.
13:34:07: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): and again if the issue is I accidentally went CL as my clone character. It was an accident
13:34:31: PM From JeanManche/(JeanManche): Even if you would have been a PFC, I would have boinked you sooner or later for it, it would have just been a matter of time.
13:34:34: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): what gap theres no issue here to begin with in anyomnes eyes but yours
13:34:53: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): so what's the issue you dislike my name?
13:35:11: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): what rule is broken here?
13:35:32: PM From JeanManche/(JeanManche): As said, this is not negotiable. Change Awoo, replace it with a more suitable nickname(?|FLW) for the moment. Rule guide for clone might come in the future.
13:35:47: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): lol
13:36:02: PM From JeanManche/(JeanManche): I already displayed you the whole rule section that you broke. Highlighting the particular part that was problematic. Do you want it displayed again?
13:36:06: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): or what?
13:37:16: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): I'll be asking for help on this issue
13:37:20: PM From JeanManche/(JeanManche): Understood. I will issue you a note right now, a 15 minutes ban for you to read our rules carefully and thoroughly about this particular naming issue. Then, you will change your name when you will be able to connect again. If you don't, measures will be more deterrent.
13:37:27: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): for now sure I'll respect what you say
13:37:45: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): and why is that?
13:37:55: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): you're gonna ban me over a name?
13:38:44: Reply PM from-Trevorious/(CS-F-Awoo): I don't think that's very reasonable of you
13:40:45: JeanManche/(JeanManche) has created a temporary 15 minutes server ban for Trevorious.
13:40:45: Client disconnected.
13:40:45: Resolved by JeanManche/(JeanManche).

Here is my reasoning on the matter :
When at some point, a player answers with "Lol, or what?", it means that they won't comply. You could have just got a small note for administrative reference, and nothing else. You would have changed your char name, and that's it.
Though, your attitude showed me that you needed a small time off to show you that : reading the rules, thoroughly, would be more productive than having to boink you later in the week for the same issue.

When the rule is being displayed, and explained to you, and you still don't see (or don't want to see) the issue needs you to make some effort.

[Trevorious]

Okay that's fine again my attitude wasn't great.

The matter I'm more so concerned with is the note for the name itself and the fact that I feel the name isn't, wasn't and still is not an issue, or the issue.

I'd also like to add that I was typing I'd respect his request as he sent the message about banning me. as you can check logs to see.

[JeanManche]

Oh, the name itself was the very issue, the fact that you couldn't/refuse to see it was secondary, but still present.

[Trevorious]

I don't really know or have anything else to say, personally when I was an admin here I wouldn't have seen an issue with this.

I would like to see what one of the headmins has to say on the matter.

Thank you.

[JeanManche]

Sure thing. No problem.

[Lewdcifer]

At the moment, we're working on a guideline for clone names and adding it to the TGMC Rules in the wiki, so I can understand if there's a little bit of confusion on that front. Ideally, we'll include a guideline in Rule 3, Precedent 4, specifically for clones.

The guideline for clones will ideally be:

CS-[Gender]-[Nickname or up to 3 numbers]

Where the nickname is subject to the same rules and standards we hold marines with nicknames to, as well as Rule 3.5.

Regardless, the mere absence of a clearly defined guideline doesn't give you an excuse to ignore already existing rules on the matter:

Rule 3, Precedent 5: The naming rule intends to preserve a certain degree of immersion. As a general guideline, if it wouldn't fit in a new non-comedy sci-fi work, it likely won't fit here. This is subjective and ultimately up to the discretion of the admins and lore people. Ask if in doubt to get your name approved.

Your behavior in the ticket wasn't an appropriate one, and considering your notes history, a simple fifteen minute ban seems quite lenient to me.
I don't understand how anyone in a non-comedy sci-fi work would let the name "Awoo" slide by as an official thing, be it their own idea or someone else's.

[Lewdcifer]

Enough time was given for the original poster to make a reply, but since there has been none from their side, I will proceed to close this.