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oranges wrote:in awe at the amount of rent free coders living in your head that you consider them to have had anything to do with this banYenwodyah wrote:In awe at the amount of coder/admin seethe this man generates by just existing
[youtube]4SmfWhhZyDE[/youtube]Whoneedspacee wrote: na bro he's WORTHLESS
keep dumping coders into the coal fire
Doesn't really mean anything, the separation between codebase and server is absolutePandarsenic wrote:So I took a few examples for comparison, going by the admins.txt, written as
[Fix PRs Opened] since [year] -- [per-year average, round any decimal up]
Obviously there's some jank, since I'm not actually counting 2021 as its existing half of a year. If someone would like to adjust to to account for the half-year not counted, or whatever, feel free, you have all the data necessary, but I cbf because I didn't think about it until the end.
Actioninja: 87 since 2019 -- 44
AnturK: 809(!) since 2014 -- 115
Cyberboss: 786(!) since 2016 -- 158
Denton: 128 since 2018 -- 43
Fikou: 117 since 2019 - 59
MrStonedOne: 261 since 2015 -- 53
NinjaNomNom: 148 since 2017 -- 37
Optimumtact (Oranges): 156 since 2015 -- 26
ShizCalev: 842(!) since 2017 -- 211(!?)
And for good measure, iamgoofball: 115 since 2015 -- 20
Incidentally, I'm pretty happy that I went in alphabetical order down the TXT and the ridiculously high numbers from AnturK, Cyberboxx, and ShizCalev came in escalating per-year fix count. With 3 of them, I hesitate to even call them outlier figures.
So our sorted dataset, for per-year fix PRs, is
211
158
115
59
53
[I couldn't find ATHATH's git name at a glance to verify, but allegedly the 45 goes here]
44
43
37
26
Obviously, this doesn't mean sufficiently prolific coders should get to do Whatever They Want - even ShizCalev would cop a ban for doing something fucky enough.
I'm not sure that can be said to apply, because I pulled these names based on who is called out specifically as a coder by the server's admins.txtTheFinalPotato wrote: Doesn't really mean anything, the separation between codebase and server is absolute
I skipped mentioning it, but among all of those, I'm pretty sure less than a dozen were rejected, and most of those were things like one of the A names I searched first doing a dark mode fix that was closed because it was addressed as part of a larger overhaul of dark mode stuff.TheFinalPotato wrote: (You may also want to filter those by merged, tho that might be a bit unfair since most maintainer prs end up going through)
ATHATH is free to contribute to the codebase, and people who don't want to deal with his bikeshedding are free to block himWhoneedspacee wrote:na bro he's WORTHLESS
keep dumping coders into the coal fire
And 262 issues, including 240 not marked as "not a bug"), 15 describing exploits of various severity and 2 issues marked as high priority.Arcanemusic wrote:If anything, I'm just discouraged by much of the precedent here.
Upgrading a 2 day ban to a permaban is an extreme punishment for a seemingly straightforward case of perspective mismatch.
Didn't post in the thread before it got locked because it's a touchy subject, but man, seeing that I'm on all 3 sides of this debate I'm concerned about how this'll turn out.
Edit: ATH made 90 fix prs in 2 years. By codebase standards, that a rather high bar for "Commiting nothing of value to the codebase".
[youtube]CJinWua98NA[/youtube]Pandarsenic wrote:I also have some Thoughts I'm going to elaborate on more specifically from each of the named notes...
So if we look at that timeline, it's...Spoiler:
2 years: Actual exploit, do not do
2 years: Actual exploit, do not do
1.5 years: Actual exploit, do not do.
1.5 years: NOT an exploit.
long awkward silence
3 months ago: Naming note that mentions low-key use of an actual exploit in a way that had no significant round impact.
Just now, banned for...I stand by what I said, even if Fikou and Arm want to cry about me being a "bad faith actor." History-of-X bans without an actual incidence of someone doing X in the moment stink, always have.Spoiler:
i mean yeah i was mostly just saying this in response to what oranges said cause its funny to exaggerateDenton wrote:ATHATH is free to contribute to the codebase, and people who don't want to deal with his bikeshedding are free to block himWhoneedspacee wrote:na bro he's WORTHLESS
keep dumping coders into the coal fire
If he stops contributing because he got banned on the servers that's not our issue
stop acting in bad faithPandarsenic wrote:I also have some Thoughts I'm going to elaborate on more specifically from each of the named notes...
So if we look at that timeline, it's...Spoiler:
2 years: Actual exploit, do not do
2 years: Actual exploit, do not do
1.5 years: Actual exploit, do not do.
1.5 years: NOT an exploit.
long awkward silence
3 months ago: Naming note that mentions low-key use of an actual exploit in a way that had no significant round impact.
Just now, banned for...I stand by what I said, even if Fikou and Arm want to cry about me being a "bad faith actor." History-of-X bans without an actual incidence of someone doing X in the moment stink, always have.Spoiler:
Yo it really do be like that dont it.Agux909 wrote:[youtube]CJinWua98NA[/youtube]Pandarsenic wrote:I also have some Thoughts I'm going to elaborate on more specifically from each of the named notes...
So if we look at that timeline, it's...Spoiler:
2 years: Actual exploit, do not do
2 years: Actual exploit, do not do
1.5 years: Actual exploit, do not do.
1.5 years: NOT an exploit.
long awkward silence
3 months ago: Naming note that mentions low-key use of an actual exploit in a way that had no significant round impact.
Just now, banned for...I stand by what I said, even if Fikou and Arm want to cry about me being a "bad faith actor." History-of-X bans without an actual incidence of someone doing X in the moment stink, always have.Spoiler:
It’s extremely embarrassingCritawakets wrote:https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=29365
after reading this appeal i can tell that the headmin role just isnt for coconut
Or you could use the real numbers instead.Rohen_Tahir wrote:And 531 issues, including 509 not marked as "not a bug"), 15 describing exploits of various severity and 2 issues marked as high priority.Arcanemusic wrote:If anything, I'm just discouraged by much of the precedent here.
Upgrading a 2 day ban to a permaban is an extreme punishment for a seemingly straightforward case of perspective mismatch.
Didn't post in the thread before it got locked because it's a touchy subject, but man, seeing that I'm on all 3 sides of this debate I'm concerned about how this'll turn out.
Edit: ATH made 90 fix prs in 2 years. By codebase standards, that a rather high bar for "Commiting nothing of value to the codebase".
As it turns out I seem to have accidentally removed is:issue from the search. Post is fixed now.Arcanemusic wrote:Or you could use the real numbers instead.Rohen_Tahir wrote:And 531 issues, including 509 not marked as "not a bug"), 15 describing exploits of various severity and 2 issues marked as high priority.Arcanemusic wrote:If anything, I'm just discouraged by much of the precedent here.
Upgrading a 2 day ban to a permaban is an extreme punishment for a seemingly straightforward case of perspective mismatch.
Didn't post in the thread before it got locked because it's a touchy subject, but man, seeing that I'm on all 3 sides of this debate I'm concerned about how this'll turn out.
Edit: ATH made 90 fix prs in 2 years. By codebase standards, that a rather high bar for "Commiting nothing of value to the codebase".
I am triple posting.ardentarclight wrote:What the fuck happened here
Those truly are words in an orderMy second life fursona reacting to this news
go take your pillschesse20 wrote:(redacted)
My second life fursona reacting to this news
The issue with this is that it makes no provisions for quality: a single line grammar fix is counted as 1 for this total in the same way a fundamental rewrite of a non-functional system is. I'm not going to pass any judgement on the fixes made by any of the mentioned parties, but just counting PRs doesn't mean much in the grand scheme of things.Pandarsenic wrote:So I took a few examples for comparison, going by the admins.txt, written as
[Fix PRs Opened] since [year] -- [per-year average, round any decimal up]
Obviously there's some jank, since I'm not actually counting 2021 as its existing half of a year. If someone would like to adjust to to account for the half-year not counted, or whatever, feel free, you have all the data necessary, but I cbf because I didn't think about it until the end.
Actioninja: 87 since 2019 -- 44
AnturK: 809(!) since 2014 -- 115
Cyberboss: 786(!) since 2016 -- 158
Denton: 128 since 2018 -- 43
Fikou: 117 since 2019 - 59
MrStonedOne: 261 since 2015 -- 53
NinjaNomNom: 148 since 2017 -- 37
Optimumtact (Oranges): 156 since 2015 -- 26
ShizCalev: 842(!) since 2017 -- 211(!?)
And for good measure, iamgoofball: 115 since 2015 -- 20
Incidentally, I'm pretty happy that I went in alphabetical order down the TXT and the ridiculously high numbers from AnturK, Cyberboxx, and ShizCalev came in escalating per-year fix count. With 3 of them, I hesitate to even call them outlier figures.
So our sorted dataset, for per-year fix PRs, is
211
158
115
59
53
[I couldn't find ATHATH's git name at a glance to verify, but allegedly the 45 goes here]
44
43
37
26
Obviously, this doesn't mean sufficiently prolific coders should get to do Whatever They Want - even ShizCalev would cop a ban for doing something fucky enough.
they do have furdo wasps or whatever that is even have fur
like mammals are furries and reptiles are scalies what the fuck do you call bugs
Someone has to do the work the highschool teachers failed at: teaching people proper grammarThe issue with this is that it makes no provisions for quality: a single line grammar fix is counted as 1 for this total in the same way a fundamental rewrite of a non-functional system is. I'm not going to pass any judgement on the fixes made by any of the mentioned parties, but just counting PRs doesn't mean much in the grand scheme of things.
larpHiKewne wrote:Someone has to do the work the highschool teachers failed at: teaching people proper grammarThe issue with this is that it makes no provisions for quality: a single line grammar fix is counted as 1 for this total in the same way a fundamental rewrite of a non-functional system is. I'm not going to pass any judgement on the fixes made by any of the mentioned parties, but just counting PRs doesn't mean much in the grand scheme of things.
And I for one would rather not have my eyes bleed than having a workable system, BECAUSE YOU CANNOT HAVE ONE WITHOUT THE OTHER
YOU CANNOT HAVE A NICE HOUSE WHEN IT'S FILLED WITH GARBAGE
A NICE CAR WHEN IT'S COVERED IN MUD
OR A NICE GAME
WHEN IT LOOKS LIKE IT WAS MADE IN AN EASTERN EUROPEAN COUNTRY
This man has been doing literally the janitorial job not even the JANITORS wanted to do. And I'm not going to just sit here and TAKE IT.
In ALL of his PRs he's done GOD'S WORK
And I don't appreciate you even implying that somehow all his efforts were meaningless.
I can't tell if you didn't actually read what I said or are exaggerating for comedic effect, so to be on the safe side I'll clarify.HiKewne wrote:Someone has to do the work the highschool teachers failed at: teaching people proper grammarThe issue with this is that it makes no provisions for quality: a single line grammar fix is counted as 1 for this total in the same way a fundamental rewrite of a non-functional system is. I'm not going to pass any judgement on the fixes made by any of the mentioned parties, but just counting PRs doesn't mean much in the grand scheme of things.
And I for one would rather not have my eyes bleed than having a workable system, BECAUSE YOU CANNOT HAVE ONE WITHOUT THE OTHER
YOU CANNOT HAVE A NICE HOUSE WHEN IT'S FILLED WITH GARBAGE
A NICE CAR WHEN IT'S COVERED IN MUD
OR A NICE GAME
WHEN IT LOOKS LIKE IT WAS MADE IN AN EASTERN EUROPEAN COUNTRY
This man has been doing literally the janitorial job not even the JANITORS wanted to do. And I'm not going to just sit here and TAKE IT.
In ALL of his PRs he's done GOD'S WORK
And I don't appreciate you even implying that somehow all his efforts were meaningless.
Yeah, I'd hoped I wouldn't have to put a disclaimer or anything, but my thing is purely an at-a-glance comparison. It makes no accounts for how, for example, ShizCalev got to averaging more than one Fix PR every 2 days, because I ain't reading all that.EOBGames wrote:I can't tell if you didn't actually read what I said or are exaggerating for comedic effect, so to be on the safe side I'll clarify.HiKewne wrote:Someone has to do the work the highschool teachers failed at: teaching people proper grammarThe issue with this is that it makes no provisions for quality: a single line grammar fix is counted as 1 for this total in the same way a fundamental rewrite of a non-functional system is. I'm not going to pass any judgement on the fixes made by any of the mentioned parties, but just counting PRs doesn't mean much in the grand scheme of things.
And I for one would rather not have my eyes bleed than having a workable system, BECAUSE YOU CANNOT HAVE ONE WITHOUT THE OTHER
YOU CANNOT HAVE A NICE HOUSE WHEN IT'S FILLED WITH GARBAGE
A NICE CAR WHEN IT'S COVERED IN MUD
OR A NICE GAME
WHEN IT LOOKS LIKE IT WAS MADE IN AN EASTERN EUROPEAN COUNTRY
This man has been doing literally the janitorial job not even the JANITORS wanted to do. And I'm not going to just sit here and TAKE IT.
In ALL of his PRs he's done GOD'S WORK
And I don't appreciate you even implying that somehow all his efforts were meaningless.
I said specifically that I didn't want to personally pass judgement on any of the individual contributors mentioned. Of course grammar fixes are important- but they require considerably less effort than major revamps or refactors, and I can assure you that issues which cause severe lag, or crashes, or whatever, are far more pressing than incorrect spelling or slightly dodgy wording. For all I know (or care) every one of Athath's PRs could have been extremely difficult work. My point was that simply sitting and counting PRs is a meaningless indicator of the work someone puts into the codebase, since what is really important to consider is the quality of those fixes. That's all.
I was just exagerating because I barely use the forum and I saw you can change the size of words so i decided to use it for commedic effectEOBGames wrote:I can't tell if you didn't actually read what I said or are exaggerating for comedic effect, so to be on the safe side I'll clarify.HiKewne wrote:Someone has to do the work the highschool teachers failed at: teaching people proper grammarThe issue with this is that it makes no provisions for quality: a single line grammar fix is counted as 1 for this total in the same way a fundamental rewrite of a non-functional system is. I'm not going to pass any judgement on the fixes made by any of the mentioned parties, but just counting PRs doesn't mean much in the grand scheme of things.
And I for one would rather not have my eyes bleed than having a workable system, BECAUSE YOU CANNOT HAVE ONE WITHOUT THE OTHER
YOU CANNOT HAVE A NICE HOUSE WHEN IT'S FILLED WITH GARBAGE
A NICE CAR WHEN IT'S COVERED IN MUD
OR A NICE GAME
WHEN IT LOOKS LIKE IT WAS MADE IN AN EASTERN EUROPEAN COUNTRY
This man has been doing literally the janitorial job not even the JANITORS wanted to do. And I'm not going to just sit here and TAKE IT.
In ALL of his PRs he's done GOD'S WORK
And I don't appreciate you even implying that somehow all his efforts were meaningless.
I said specifically that I didn't want to personally pass judgement on any of the individual contributors mentioned. Of course grammar fixes are important- but they require considerably less effort than major revamps or refactors, and I can assure you that issues which cause severe lag, or crashes, or whatever, are far more pressing than incorrect spelling or slightly dodgy wording. For all I know (or care) every one of Athath's PRs could have been extremely difficult work. My point was that simply sitting and counting PRs is a meaningless indicator of the work someone puts into the codebase, since what is really important to consider is the quality of those fixes. That's all.
most of us are autistic, we can't tell other peoples emotions(some of us it is a spectrum).HiKewne wrote:I was just exagerating because I barely use the forum and I saw you can change the size of words so i decided to use it for commedic effectEOBGames wrote:I can't tell if you didn't actually read what I said or are exaggerating for comedic effect, so to be on the safe side I'll clarify.HiKewne wrote:Someone has to do the work the highschool teachers failed at: teaching people proper grammarThe issue with this is that it makes no provisions for quality: a single line grammar fix is counted as 1 for this total in the same way a fundamental rewrite of a non-functional system is. I'm not going to pass any judgement on the fixes made by any of the mentioned parties, but just counting PRs doesn't mean much in the grand scheme of things.
And I for one would rather not have my eyes bleed than having a workable system, BECAUSE YOU CANNOT HAVE ONE WITHOUT THE OTHER
YOU CANNOT HAVE A NICE HOUSE WHEN IT'S FILLED WITH GARBAGE
A NICE CAR WHEN IT'S COVERED IN MUD
OR A NICE GAME
WHEN IT LOOKS LIKE IT WAS MADE IN AN EASTERN EUROPEAN COUNTRY
This man has been doing literally the janitorial job not even the JANITORS wanted to do. And I'm not going to just sit here and TAKE IT.
In ALL of his PRs he's done GOD'S WORK
And I don't appreciate you even implying that somehow all his efforts were meaningless.
I said specifically that I didn't want to personally pass judgement on any of the individual contributors mentioned. Of course grammar fixes are important- but they require considerably less effort than major revamps or refactors, and I can assure you that issues which cause severe lag, or crashes, or whatever, are far more pressing than incorrect spelling or slightly dodgy wording. For all I know (or care) every one of Athath's PRs could have been extremely difficult work. My point was that simply sitting and counting PRs is a meaningless indicator of the work someone puts into the codebase, since what is really important to consider is the quality of those fixes. That's all.
man we do live in a society, I can't imagine dealing with people like that in a daily basis to the point it's hard to tell when someone's joking
no you don't understand bro we are literally behind everythingDenton wrote:ATHATH is free to contribute to the codebase, and people who don't want to deal with his bikeshedding are free to block himWhoneedspacee wrote:na bro he's WORTHLESS
keep dumping coders into the coal fire
If he stops contributing because he got banned on the servers that's not our issue
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