Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

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Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by dragomagol » #649587

AKA tattle

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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by Imitates-The-Lizards » #649588

So far RaveRadbury is my top pick for wanting streaming enabled. It's the obvious play for longevity and bringing in new players.

Hope to see more candidates weigh in on that and specifics about silicon policy. If Sticky makes a thread proposing "make it just follow your laws" I'll be really hard pressed to pick between him and Rave, since I want +streaming and just gutting silicon policy.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by Omega_DarkPotato » #649589

From the current candidates list I'm expecting/hoping for rave to snag player vote - unsure about admin vote, and considering I'm basically running for admin vote I'd be a little sad if rave ended up snagging that one. PE's is nice, but it's very MRP focused, and I don't think that 3 MRPmins is the sanest idea - and the glow is killing me (I'm sorry PE)
Fikou seems like he's liable to burn out again, Wiggle's... leaves room to want more, but I can respect the "running to get their opinions out there" grindset
San literally has 80% of his post dedicated to who he is and has like 3 short lines about his actual policies at the bottom. Not great i think

Eronymun is a really strong contender for the rabbit vote

if youre a player reading this, make an admin application NOW
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by Farquaar » #649590

Imitates-The-Lizards wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 5:58 pm So far RaveRadbury is my top pick for wanting streaming enabled. It's the obvious play for longevity and bringing in new players.
Twitch users are nearly as bad as Redditors though
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by Imitates-The-Lizards » #649591

Farquaar wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 6:23 pm
Imitates-The-Lizards wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 5:58 pm So far RaveRadbury is my top pick for wanting streaming enabled. It's the obvious play for longevity and bringing in new players.
Twitch users are nearly as bad as Redditors though
Jokes on you, from whatever date rule 11 was implemented, this IS digg.

Also, I hope Rave gets a little bit more specific regarding what he mentioned about validhunting Borg's in his thread.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by Farquaar » #649593

Imitates-The-Lizards wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 6:39 pm Jokes on you, from whatever date rule 11 was implemented, this IS digg.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by kieth4 » #649595

I'm feeling absolutely great about this run this time around. One of my points is in opposition to Rave's so it'll be interesting to see how everything goes in that regard; killing greytiding vs keeping it going strong. Can't wait!
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by XII3912 » #649596

Imitates-The-Lizards wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 5:58 pm So far RaveRadbury is my top pick for wanting streaming enabled. It's the obvious play for longevity and bringing in new players.
Streaming can't be controlled well it's a easy way to gain meta information + youtube promoted ss13 aswell (ssethtide) so we don't need this

+ rave advocates for pacifism bans which aren't good at all because what if you're being attacked by somebody? Well now you cannot fight back because a admin "pacifism banned" you what if you're antag? Seems like a bad idea tbh
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by Omega_DarkPotato » #649597

XII3912 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 7:52 pm + rave advocates for pacifism bans which aren't good at all because what if you're being attacked by somebody? Well now you cannot fight back because a admin "pacifism banned" you what if you're antag? Seems like a bad idea tbh
have you tried not getting banned
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by Indie-ana Jones » #649598

My top votes so far are going to be San, Fikou, and Keith in some order. Reasons why:

- San is an very reliable maintainer and admin, never had a bad experience with them. Perhaps wouldn't be making any radical changes but stands as a solid choice.
- Fikou is very dedicated to the game and I'd be interested in seeing how his server population growth strategy would play out. One concern is even though we've made significant strides in free lag reduction in the past year alone, can the server reasonably handle 120 people and still play well?
- Keith because I always like the idea of a player advocate and unlike some of those similar candidates in the past, Keith's platform is a lot more reasonable. Less fire and brimstone and more open communication and mending of issues. Also support keeping greytiding to some extent because traitors don't cause enough ruckus anymore to warrant its removal.
Last edited by Indie-ana Jones on Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by XII3912 » #649599

Indie-ana Jones wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 7:56 pm Top votes so far are going to be San, Fikou, and Keith in some order. Reasons why:
Idk man headmin predictions aren't usually correct
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by Indie-ana Jones » #649600

XII3912 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:00 pm Idk man headmin predictions aren't usually correct
I meant my top votes.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by RaveRadbury » #649601

kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 7:44 pm I'm feeling absolutely great about this run this time around. One of my points is in opposition to Rave's so it'll be interesting to see how everything goes in that regard; killing greytiding vs keeping it going strong. Can't wait!
Pretty sure we're both looking for a middling approach to greytide, just as I'm not looking to have people banned over grabbing insuls likewise I'd assume that you'd take issue with people who are chronically making the game unfun with their greytiding choices?
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by BONERMASTER » #649602

XII3912 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 7:52 pm + rave advocates for pacifism bans which aren't good at all because what if you're being attacked by somebody? Well now you cannot fight back because a admin "pacifism banned" you what if you're antag? Seems like a bad idea tbh
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by CMDR_Gungnir » #649603

XII3912 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 7:52 pm + rave advocates for pacifism bans which aren't good at all because what if you're being attacked by somebody? Well now you cannot fight back because a admin "pacifism banned" you what if you're antag? Seems like a bad idea tbh
If you can't escape an attack without killing them, then you could probably use the time as a pacifist to make you more robust.

(and just, y'know. don't get banned. the alternative is you'd get a server ban, at least you still get to play this way.)
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by scamoppi » #649604

an SS14 server sounds really interesting though i wonder how likely it is to actually happen
there’s probably a lot of stuff that needs to be decided on but hopefully it can be done
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by kieth4 » #649605

RaveRadbury wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:09 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 7:44 pm I'm feeling absolutely great about this run this time around. One of my points is in opposition to Rave's so it'll be interesting to see how everything goes in that regard; killing greytiding vs keeping it going strong. Can't wait!
Pretty sure we're both looking for a middling approach to greytide, just as I'm not looking to have people banned over grabbing insuls likewise I'd assume that you'd take issue with people who are chronically making the game unfun with their greytiding choices?
You say in your thread that you want a crackdown on lrp greytiding for more freedom. This doesn't present the idea of a moderate approach. I'm also content with the current state of greytiding and want to keep it as it is.

Furthermore, what you've said here is: "i assume we're both going for a moderate point here??? i'm fine with people getting insuls and i assume that you're against grief??? right????? " Which isn't really constructive nor does it do either of our takes any justice.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by Somepan » #649607

tiding ≠ grief
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by RaveRadbury » #649608

kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:43 pm
RaveRadbury wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:09 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 7:44 pm I'm feeling absolutely great about this run this time around. One of my points is in opposition to Rave's so it'll be interesting to see how everything goes in that regard; killing greytiding vs keeping it going strong. Can't wait!
Pretty sure we're both looking for a middling approach to greytide, just as I'm not looking to have people banned over grabbing insuls likewise I'd assume that you'd take issue with people who are chronically making the game unfun with their greytiding choices?
You say in your thread that you want a crackdown on lrp greytiding for more freedom. This doesn't present the idea of a moderate approach. I'm also content with the current state of greytiding and want to keep it as it is.

Furthermore, what you've said here is: "i assume we're both going for a moderate point here??? i'm fine with people getting insuls and i assume that you're against grief??? right????? " Which isn't really constructive nor does it do either of our takes any justice.
The man can't say he's against grief for some reason.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by kieth4 » #649609

RaveRadbury wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:22 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:43 pm
RaveRadbury wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:09 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 7:44 pm I'm feeling absolutely great about this run this time around. One of my points is in opposition to Rave's so it'll be interesting to see how everything goes in that regard; killing greytiding vs keeping it going strong. Can't wait!
Pretty sure we're both looking for a middling approach to greytide, just as I'm not looking to have people banned over grabbing insuls likewise I'd assume that you'd take issue with people who are chronically making the game unfun with their greytiding choices?
You say in your thread that you want a crackdown on lrp greytiding for more freedom. This doesn't present the idea of a moderate approach. I'm also content with the current state of greytiding and want to keep it as it is.

Furthermore, what you've said here is: "i assume we're both going for a moderate point here??? i'm fine with people getting insuls and i assume that you're against grief??? right????? " Which isn't really constructive nor does it do either of our takes any justice.
The man can't say he's against grief for some reason.
This is an absolute misrepresentation of my point but you're already aware of that I think. Trying very hard to mischaracterize me as I obviously do not support grief.

The whole point of your post was trying to back me into a corner. If I agreed with you, we'd be very similar in our points(Which you know is not the case). If I disagreed- you'd say that I support grief.

No idea why you're so hell-bent on trying to do this but you do you I guess.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by NoxVS » #649610

kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:45 pm
RaveRadbury wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:22 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:43 pm
RaveRadbury wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:09 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 7:44 pm I'm feeling absolutely great about this run this time around. One of my points is in opposition to Rave's so it'll be interesting to see how everything goes in that regard; killing greytiding vs keeping it going strong. Can't wait!
Pretty sure we're both looking for a middling approach to greytide, just as I'm not looking to have people banned over grabbing insuls likewise I'd assume that you'd take issue with people who are chronically making the game unfun with their greytiding choices?
You say in your thread that you want a crackdown on lrp greytiding for more freedom. This doesn't present the idea of a moderate approach. I'm also content with the current state of greytiding and want to keep it as it is.

Furthermore, what you've said here is: "i assume we're both going for a moderate point here??? i'm fine with people getting insuls and i assume that you're against grief??? right????? " Which isn't really constructive nor does it do either of our takes any justice.
The man can't say he's against grief for some reason.
This is an absolute misrepresentation of my point but you're already aware of that I think. Trying very hard to mischaracterize me as I obviously do not support grief.

The whole point of your post was trying to back me into a corner. If I agreed with you, we'd be very similar in our points(Which you know is not the case). If I disagreed- you'd say that I support grief.

No idea why you're so hell-bent on trying to do this but you do you I guess.
Do you take issue with people who are chronically making the game unfun with their greytiding choices
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by XII3912 » #649612

CMDR_Gungnir wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:40 pm If you can't escape an attack without killing them, then you could probably use the time as a pacifist to make you more robust.
Running away from a aggressor takes quite literally less skill then fighting off one! So you're most definitely wrong in this point. Also I do not think its OK for players to lose their fighting abilities by administrative action.

Maybe if they made it like the chaplain sect thing where if somebody attacks you then you can attack them back because that's only fair is it?
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by RaveRadbury » #649613

kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:45 pm
RaveRadbury wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:22 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:43 pm
RaveRadbury wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:09 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 7:44 pm I'm feeling absolutely great about this run this time around. One of my points is in opposition to Rave's so it'll be interesting to see how everything goes in that regard; killing greytiding vs keeping it going strong. Can't wait!
Pretty sure we're both looking for a middling approach to greytide, just as I'm not looking to have people banned over grabbing insuls likewise I'd assume that you'd take issue with people who are chronically making the game unfun with their greytiding choices?
You say in your thread that you want a crackdown on lrp greytiding for more freedom. This doesn't present the idea of a moderate approach. I'm also content with the current state of greytiding and want to keep it as it is.

Furthermore, what you've said here is: "i assume we're both going for a moderate point here??? i'm fine with people getting insuls and i assume that you're against grief??? right????? " Which isn't really constructive nor does it do either of our takes any justice.
The man can't say he's against grief for some reason.
This is an absolute misrepresentation of my point but you're already aware of that I think. Trying very hard to mischaracterize me as I obviously do not support grief.

The whole point of your post was trying to back me into a corner. If I agreed with you, we'd be very similar in our points(Which you know is not the case). If I disagreed- you'd say that I support grief.

No idea why you're so hell-bent on trying to do this but you do you I guess.
My brother in christ I was trying to find common ground with you and possibly have fruitful discussion. This is something we might have to do if we end up working together. Why would I try to start a fight with someone I might have to cooperate with soon?

Now granted, I did tease you in my response to your response, and I'll own that and apologize. Sorry for saying cheeky things to wind you up.

We are similar in our points, it's pretty unavoidable because neither of us can be radical in them. There's nothing wrong with acknowledging it.

Anyways, I won't trouble you any further as it does seem like you're pretty keyed up and feeling cornered.

Hope you do well in the election! I've always been a fan of your hustle.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by HeyHey » #649614

Keith looks like the cool guy candidate this round, best of luck.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by kieth4 » #649615

NoxVS wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:48 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:45 pm
RaveRadbury wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:22 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:43 pm
RaveRadbury wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:09 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 7:44 pm I'm feeling absolutely great about this run this time around. One of my points is in opposition to Rave's so it'll be interesting to see how everything goes in that regard; killing greytiding vs keeping it going strong. Can't wait!
Pretty sure we're both looking for a middling approach to greytide, just as I'm not looking to have people banned over grabbing insuls likewise I'd assume that you'd take issue with people who are chronically making the game unfun with their greytiding choices?
You say in your thread that you want a crackdown on lrp greytiding for more freedom. This doesn't present the idea of a moderate approach. I'm also content with the current state of greytiding and want to keep it as it is.

Furthermore, what you've said here is: "i assume we're both going for a moderate point here??? i'm fine with people getting insuls and i assume that you're against grief??? right????? " Which isn't really constructive nor does it do either of our takes any justice.
The man can't say he's against grief for some reason.
This is an absolute misrepresentation of my point but you're already aware of that I think. Trying very hard to mischaracterize me as I obviously do not support grief.

The whole point of your post was trying to back me into a corner. If I agreed with you, we'd be very similar in our points(Which you know is not the case). If I disagreed- you'd say that I support grief.

No idea why you're so hell-bent on trying to do this but you do you I guess.
Do you take issue with people who are chronically making the game unfun with their greytiding choices
And what are these choices? This is such a subjective question. Some people cry as soon as someone steps into their department- for them, the game is made chronically unfun when people do this. Are these the greytiding choices that you're referring to??? Some people get upset when the fucking fire lockers have no fire extinguishers because they have been tided. I take no issue with these. Are these the people who make the game chronically unfun??

Do I take an issue with people randomly jumping others and stealing their ids? Yes.

You're trying to take a broad topic that is essentially unique to every single player and condense it into a rather stupid statement that means nothing.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by kieth4 » #649616

RaveRadbury wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:53 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:45 pm
RaveRadbury wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:22 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:43 pm
RaveRadbury wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:09 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 7:44 pm I'm feeling absolutely great about this run this time around. One of my points is in opposition to Rave's so it'll be interesting to see how everything goes in that regard; killing greytiding vs keeping it going strong. Can't wait!
Pretty sure we're both looking for a middling approach to greytide, just as I'm not looking to have people banned over grabbing insuls likewise I'd assume that you'd take issue with people who are chronically making the game unfun with their greytiding choices?
You say in your thread that you want a crackdown on lrp greytiding for more freedom. This doesn't present the idea of a moderate approach. I'm also content with the current state of greytiding and want to keep it as it is.

Furthermore, what you've said here is: "i assume we're both going for a moderate point here??? i'm fine with people getting insuls and i assume that you're against grief??? right????? " Which isn't really constructive nor does it do either of our takes any justice.
The man can't say he's against grief for some reason.
This is an absolute misrepresentation of my point but you're already aware of that I think. Trying very hard to mischaracterize me as I obviously do not support grief.

The whole point of your post was trying to back me into a corner. If I agreed with you, we'd be very similar in our points(Which you know is not the case). If I disagreed- you'd say that I support grief.

No idea why you're so hell-bent on trying to do this but you do you I guess.
My brother in christ I was trying to find common ground with you and possibly have fruitful discussion. This is something we might have to do if we end up working together. Why would I try to start a fight with someone I might have to cooperate with soon?

Now granted, I did tease you in my response to your response, and I'll own that and apologize. Sorry for saying cheeky things to wind you up.

We are similar in our points, it's pretty unavoidable because neither of us can be radical in them. There's nothing wrong with acknowledging it.

Anyways, I won't trouble you any further as it does seem like you're pretty keyed up and feeling cornered.

Hope you do well in the election! I've always been a fan of your hustle.
Wishing you the best also. Absolutely no hard feelings here, I'm sorry if my style of typing and response makes you feel that I'm keyed up or whatever. I'm pretty chill!

Have a good one!
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by san7890 » #649617

Hey so how about that Rabbit photo
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by bastardblaster » #649618

san7890 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 10:09 pm Hey so how about that Rabbit photo
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by iwishforducks » #649622

let's keep the great maintainer headmincy going by voting in fikou and san
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by cybersaber101 » #649623

kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:58 pm -snip-
now wasn't that easy to make less clutter? as a future headmin you will all have to learn.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by kieth4 » #649624

cybersaber101 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 10:34 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:58 pm -snip-
now wasn't that easy to make less clutter? as a future headmin you will all have to learn.
But towers are funny...
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by Rohen_Tahir » #649626

cybersaber101 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 10:34 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:58 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:58 pm
RaveRadbury wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:53 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:45 pm
RaveRadbury wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:22 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:43 pm
RaveRadbury wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:09 pm
kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 7:44 pm I'm feeling absolutely great about this run this time around. One of my points is in opposition to Rave's so it'll be interesting to see how everything goes in that regard; killing greytiding vs keeping it going strong. Can't wait!
Pretty sure we're both looking for a middling approach to greytide, just as I'm not looking to have people banned over grabbing insuls likewise I'd assume that you'd take issue with people who are chronically making the game unfun with their greytiding choices?
You say in your thread that you want a crackdown on lrp greytiding for more freedom. This doesn't present the idea of a moderate approach. I'm also content with the current state of greytiding and want to keep it as it is.

Furthermore, what you've said here is: "i assume we're both going for a moderate point here??? i'm fine with people getting insuls and i assume that you're against grief??? right????? " Which isn't really constructive nor does it do either of our takes any justice.
The man can't say he's against grief for some reason.
This is an absolute misrepresentation of my point but you're already aware of that I think. Trying very hard to mischaracterize me as I obviously do not support grief.

The whole point of your post was trying to back me into a corner. If I agreed with you, we'd be very similar in our points(Which you know is not the case). If I disagreed- you'd say that I support grief.

No idea why you're so hell-bent on trying to do this but you do you I guess.
My brother in christ I was trying to find common ground with you and possibly have fruitful discussion. This is something we might have to do if we end up working together. Why would I try to start a fight with someone I might have to cooperate with soon?

Now granted, I did tease you in my response to your response, and I'll own that and apologize. Sorry for saying cheeky things to wind you up.

We are similar in our points, it's pretty unavoidable because neither of us can be radical in them. There's nothing wrong with acknowledging it.

Anyways, I won't trouble you any further as it does seem like you're pretty keyed up and feeling cornered.

Hope you do well in the election! I've always been a fan of your hustle.
Wishing you the best also. Absolutely no hard feelings here, I'm sorry if my style of typing and response makes you feel that I'm keyed up or whatever. I'm pretty chill!

Have a good one!
now wasn't that easy to make less clutter? as a future headmin you will all have to learn.
Very cool
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by sinfulbliss » #649627

I think over the last few years enforcement has been approached much tighter in many areas. In many ways this is a great thing - especially for things like rule 11, where two years ago this sort of discourse was commonplace on TG, and completely status quo:
Spoiler:
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This drove away new players because of the toxic 4chan-esque atmosphere. That bled into rounds and the same occurred on servers. When you compare that era to today's TG, it's certainly a net improvement.

That said, and what I believe Keith is getting at, is admins are often more hands-on than they need to be. In 2018 I remember regularly getting flossed on by assistants as a noobie sec player, for no real reason other than that I was doing my job which was going against the greytider's goals. But some of my fondest memories are rounds in which this happened. The lawlessness and chaotic atmosphere that nonantags were allowed to engage in, within reason, was a great part of SS13.

Many admins still have this philosophy, and prefer to let things transpire IC naturally. Is the brig timer under 10 minutes? "IC issue, retaliate against sec how you like if it was unjust." Was someone torching you with a welder as an officer? "Feel free to execute them." Did the chemist get attacked after drilling an assistant in the head for breaking into his department? Well, that's how the cookie crumbles!

Now these situations are often treated very differently. I've received bwoinks for as little as 2-minute sentences, because the player ahelped and the admin investigated it seriously, which creates positive reinforcement to ahelp even the most IC of IC issues. Why retaliate IC when you can get the other player bwoinked for 20 minutes over it instead?

The escalation rules have been expanded in a way that they no longer make sense. Players are expected to drag the person who tried to chop their head off to medbay after the fight. Players that are killed or crit are expected to forget the fight ever happened, because the conflict "ended." In practice no one does this, and many admins don't enforce this because it's counterintuitive. If the recommendation is to ahelp every time you are escalated against instead of figuring it out IC, then it just moves the conflict to the admins and takes it away from the round.

So what I think Lukas is trying to argue, is simply that greytiding should be enforced in a more commonsense way. To prevent serious grief against players that ruins their rounds. Not to nitpick at every interaction and conflict that occurs, because this is part and parcel of what drives action and excitement in what would otherwise be a job simulator.
Last edited by sinfulbliss on Mon Aug 15, 2022 10:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by Mothblocks » #649628

Choices this year are not too exciting or interesting but I would love to see Rave or Omega win

I probably would like san too but their thread is in plain text and my eyes glazed through trying to read it
Shaps-cloud wrote: Mon Dec 07, 2020 7:59 am May eventually become one of the illusive maintainer-headmins if they choose to pursue that path, having a coder in the senior admin leadership has usually been positive for both sides in the past.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by san7890 » #649630

Mothblocks wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 10:59 pm -snip-

I probably would like san too but their thread is in plain text and my eyes glazed through trying to read it
It’ll be fixed when I get computer access
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by kieth4 » #649632

sinfulbliss wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 10:53 pm I think over the last few years enforcement has been approached much tighter in many areas. In many ways this is a great thing - especially for things like rule 11, where two years ago this sort of discourse was commonplace on TG, and completely status quo:
Spoiler:
Image
This drove away new players because of the toxic 4chan-esque atmosphere. That bled into rounds and the same occurred on servers. When you compare that era to today's TG, it's certainly a net improvement.

That said, and what I believe Keith is getting at, is admins are often more hands-on than they need to be. In 2018 I remember regularly getting flossed on by assistants as a noobie sec player, for no real reason other than that I was doing my job which was going against the greytider's goals. But some of my fondest memories are rounds in which this happened. The lawlessness and chaotic atmosphere that nonantags were allowed to engage in, within reason, was a great part of SS13.

Many admins still have this philosophy, and prefer to let things transpire IC naturally. Is the brig timer under 10 minutes? "IC issue, retaliate against sec how you like if it was unjust." Was someone torching you with a welder as an officer? "Feel free to execute them." Did the chemist get attacked after drilling an assistant in the head for breaking into his department? Well, that's how the cookie crumbles!

Now these situations are often treated very differently. I've received bwoinks for as little as 2-minute sentences, because the player ahelped and the admin investigated it seriously, which creates positive reinforcement to ahelp even the most IC of IC issues. Why retaliate IC when you can get the other player bwoinked for 20 minutes over it instead?

The escalation rules have been expanded in a way that they no longer make sense. Players are expected to drag the person who tried to chop their head off to medbay after the fight. Players that are killed or crit are expected to forget the fight ever happened, because the conflict "ended." In practice no one does this, and many admins don't enforce this because it's counterintuitive. If the recommendation is to ahelp every time you are escalated against instead of figuring it out IC, then it just moves the conflict to the admins and takes it away from the round.

So what I think Lukas is trying to argue, is simply that greytiding should be enforced in a more commonsense way. To prevent serious grief against players that ruins their rounds. Not to nitpick at every interaction and conflict that occurs, because this is part and parcel of what drives action and excitement in what would otherwise be a job simulator.
This is absolutely how I feel.

Great post.

Without greytiding to spice up the rounds I don't feel that the game experience would be as familiar or as fun- obviously- blatant griefing should be punished, (I feel that it already is to a very good extent) but tiding itself should remain strong. We want conflicts, we want funny thing to happen hell- Engineers are christened and inducted into the creed when they dust their first rider. I want these interactions to stay strong.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by Fikou » #649633

iwishforducks wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 10:22 pm let's keep the great maintainer headmincy going by voting in fikou and san
that would be pretty funny
Mothblocks wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 10:59 pm Choices this year are not too exciting or interesting but I would love to see Rave or Omega win

I probably would like san too but their thread is in plain text and my eyes glazed through trying to read it
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by Shadowflame909 » #649634

how will this effect the peanut thread quality
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by toemas » #649635

vote for lukas
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by wesoda25 » #649639

I think I’d like rave and lukas to win, that’d be a neat triumvirate with spook in the mix (🥳). Wouldn’t mind omega, solely for their takes on training and applicants. Can’t wait to ask some questions.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by sinfulbliss » #649640

kieth4 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 11:40 pm Without greytiding to spice up the rounds I don't feel that the game experience would be as familiar or as fun- obviously- blatant griefing should be punished, (I feel that it already is to a very good extent) but tiding itself should remain strong. We want conflicts, we want funny thing to happen hell- Engineers are christened and inducted into the creed when they dust their first rider. I want these interactions to stay strong.
Just yesterday I got cuffed, fullstripped, and given cat ears as an officer. I then went on a 20 minute revenge plot to catch them, and created a funny little glass jail display of the two people that did it. I could have also had no chill and just ahelped, at which point they would have probably just been asked to uncuff me and return my stuff. But that would have eliminated the entire IC conflict that we had, and the fun story it created.

Players who want to just do their jobs undisturbed with absolutely no conflict or negative experiences are better off playing on a higher RP server. I don't say that in an incendiary way - I've played MRP hundreds of hours myself. You play LRP if you want to take the game a little bit lighter and invite a little chaos into your shift.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by Mothblocks » #649650

san7890 wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 11:19 pm
Mothblocks wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 10:59 pm -snip-

I probably would like san too but their thread is in plain text and my eyes glazed through trying to read it
It’ll be fixed when I get computer access
Much better. Still a bit clunky but you would do great in the seat I think
Shaps-cloud wrote: Mon Dec 07, 2020 7:59 am May eventually become one of the illusive maintainer-headmins if they choose to pursue that path, having a coder in the senior admin leadership has usually been positive for both sides in the past.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by blackdav123 » #649651

only rave talked about silicon policy so +1 for him also pacifism bans sounds like a good idea to laser scalpel shitters
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by san7890 » #649652

I don’t personally get talking about proposed policy in your platform (which is why I don’t have any). I get you can have pre-conceptions about certain policy and really angle through that, but I’d personally just let the questions come in and I’ll work them through.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by san7890 » #649653

Mothblocks wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 3:55 am -snip-

Much better. Still a bit clunky but you would do great in the seat I think
What you see as of this moment there is my partially failed attempt to forum-post on mobile. I have a crack team doing Double Blind Studies, Consumer Feedback, UI/UX testing as we speak. It will soon be very palatable.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by Mothblocks » #649654

Your thoughts on policy topics that come up all the time in discussion like silicon policy are great things to put in, as long as you remember that the most important part of who you pick as head admin is their ability to fight for you and keep on top of things. Rave is the most apt to be talking about policy since they already very much understand that
Shaps-cloud wrote: Mon Dec 07, 2020 7:59 am May eventually become one of the illusive maintainer-headmins if they choose to pursue that path, having a coder in the senior admin leadership has usually been positive for both sides in the past.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by SpaceSmithers » #649656

who the hell is this SpaceSmithers guy the candidates are talking about
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by Jonathan Gupta » #649666

I made a thread when I told everyone I wasn't, I know I'm not gonna get voted its more to get my ideas out and spread them.
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by iwishforducks » #649695

pacifism bans will be the hot thing for a week until some shitter realizes they can just release plasma or space the station to get around it and then nobody will ever use them again
im gay (and also play the moth “bugger”)
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Re: Headmin Election 16 Discussion Thread

Post by san7890 » #649696

iwishforducks wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 3:37 pm pacifism bans will be the hot thing for a week until some shitter realizes they can just release plasma or space the station to get around it and then nobody will ever use them again
Delaminates ur supermatter :flushed:
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