Progression Changeling Brainstorming thread

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The Wrench
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Progression Changeling Brainstorming thread

Post by The Wrench » #668194

Bottom post of the previous page:

So what would you all like to see in the event of a Progression style rework of the changeling?

Personally, I am a huge fan of the prototype series, so I would love to see more of absorbing certain people or objects to unlock certain abilities, such as absorbing a monkey to gain shapechange.

I also happen to be a huge fan of the relatively new game the eternal cylinder (You should all play it right now <3). In the game, your main player, character gains powers based on physical foods they eat. Maybe we could add some emergent gameplay with the chef and add new changeling powers? Under this point, I would not want to lock any of the existing powers under this sub system because that’s just blatantly Unfun.
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Jonathan Gupta wrote: ↑Sat Jan 22, 2022 6:32 pm all you godamn do is whine and complain come up with ideas, stop bitching for christs sake.
Flatulent wrote: ↑Wed Jan 26, 2022 1:02 am You and anyone who supports the rule 3 as described by mso is simply put not an lrp player
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Armhulen
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Re: Progression Changeling Brainstorming thread

Post by Armhulen » #668961

Itseasytosee2me wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 4:43 pm If you wanted to go really crazy, we could look into making traitor progression shared among all traitors.
"Syndicate Influence" over the station increasing over time from all the agent's actions. Kinda cool! A global way to make sure SOMEONE is antagonizing a little while the rest cook
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CPTANT
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Re: Progression Changeling Brainstorming thread

Post by CPTANT » #668964

Please just go with the timelock.

It solves all the problems that led to the creation of progtot in the simplest way.
Timberpoes wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 3:21 pm The rules exist to create the biggest possible chance of a cool shift of SS13. They don't exist to allow admins to create the most boring interpretation of SS13.
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iwishforducks
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Re: Progression Changeling Brainstorming thread

Post by iwishforducks » #668968

Armhulen wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 5:29 pm
Itseasytosee2me wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 4:43 pm If you wanted to go really crazy, we could look into making traitor progression shared among all traitors.
"Syndicate Influence" over the station increasing over time from all the agent's actions. Kinda cool! A global way to make sure SOMEONE is antagonizing a little while the rest cook
holy mother of god STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP

YOU WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO GAMEIFY HOW MUCH ANTAGONISTS ARE ANTAGONIZING

THIS IS A SANDBOX ROLEPLAY GAME IN ITS PUREST FORM AND THE FETISHIZATION OF TRYING TO CODIFY IT INTO SIMPLE NUMBERS FOR GAME DESIGN IS KILLING IT FROM THE INSIDE

im sorry for yelling but this whole shtick has been an endless source of frustration for me. i was very supportive of prog tots when it was first conceived but when i actually got my boots on the ground to see the idea come to fruition i realized how absolutely distant and shortsighted it was. we don't need to make players have a reason to do things as antagonist. we should be encouraging players to make their own reasons.

it delves into the issues of intrinsic and extrinsic motivations. people tend to just be more engaged when they have intrinsic motivations instead of doing something because they want Rewards (extrinsic). green text was a perfect balance in my eyes of extrinsic and intrinsic. it gives some very very low bar goals for traitors to seek out. but the more enlightened folks realize that "green text is meme text"- and that's exactly what it was. at the end of the day doing your green text never actually gave any concrete goals, they were merely suggestions. some of the objectives were even free and incentivized doing whatever you wanted, like die a glorious death

if we want to get the best mileage out of our antags we should just have a way to gain new suggestions for your goals. but it's easy to make things worse as we saw with prog tots. personally i think it's just better to leave it how it was before prog tots while adding a timelock feature for some of our most problematic items. we should encourage admins to also clamp down on loser traitors who go around silently murderboning every round with no real gimmick

is game maker's toolkit considered lame yet? this video explains this whole intrinsic vs extrinsic motivation thing best.
Jacquerel wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 3:37 pm It is not true that every item is time locked.
The chameleon projector is not time locked. The stealth implant is also not time locked.

Generally speaking the only things which are time locked are weapons or items which cause very widespread effects.
There is absolutely a need to audit the rep requirements on items and there’s some bizarre ones in there (nonslip galoshes??) but the ones you have mentioned already have no time lock.
my mistake but i remember distinctly looking at my uplink and being unable to purchase like 80% of its items. and then like 10 minutes latter still only being like 30% of which i could purchase. i was being dramatic to get my point across as i couldn't remember what i could and could not buy
im gay (and also play the moth “bugger”)
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Jacquerel
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Re: Progression Changeling Brainstorming thread

Post by Jacquerel » #668970

iwishforducks wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 6:15 pm my mistake but i remember distinctly looking at my uplink and being unable to purchase like 80% of its items. and then like 10 minutes latter still only being like 30% of which i could purchase. i was being dramatic to get my point across as i couldn't remember what i could and could not buy
Perhaps it felt that way but I really do need to assure you that the majority of items do not have a time lock on them at all.
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iwishforducks
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Re: Progression Changeling Brainstorming thread

Post by iwishforducks » #668992

Jacquerel wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 6:20 pm
iwishforducks wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 6:15 pm my mistake but i remember distinctly looking at my uplink and being unable to purchase like 80% of its items. and then like 10 minutes latter still only being like 30% of which i could purchase. i was being dramatic to get my point across as i couldn't remember what i could and could not buy
Perhaps it felt that way but I really do need to assure you that the majority of items do not have a time lock on them at all.
*Ahem*

Here's a list of every single item that is locked behind progression.
► Show Spoiler


Here is a list of every non-progression item.
► Show Spoiler
78 items locked behind reputation
53 items that are not locked behind reputation

by pure numbers, a majority of items are locked behind progression

now you may argue that some of the items locked behind progression are little fish like the 6 different modsuit modules. in which i agree. i tried to get the data for how many times each uplink item was bought and i would pull put together how many reputation items were bought compared to non-reputation items. but i'll get to that at a later date, maybe. from purely anecdotal evidence, i think 80% of all items bought are progression-locked if i had to ballpark it.

i agree that most items that shouldn't be time-locked but i must drag you for gaslighting me :?
im gay (and also play the moth “bugger”)
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Kendrickorium
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Re: Progression Changeling Brainstorming thread

Post by Kendrickorium » #669010

iwishforducks wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 4:33 am the very easy solution is to just timelock shit and remove everything else about progtots
this is why i just sit in the arrivals shuttle until the 40 minute mark, then bring my bomb onto the escape shuttle instead

(coders ignore this)
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CPTANT
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Re: Progression Changeling Brainstorming thread

Post by CPTANT » #669025

Kendrickorium wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 9:36 pm
iwishforducks wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 4:33 am the very easy solution is to just timelock shit and remove everything else about progtots
this is why i just sit in the arrivals shuttle until the 40 minute mark, then bring my bomb onto the escape shuttle instead

(coders ignore this)
I have no idea why you would actively sabotage yourself like that. You could you know, actually play the game in that time. Maybe even do a little traitoring that doesn't involve that bomb?
Timberpoes wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 3:21 pm The rules exist to create the biggest possible chance of a cool shift of SS13. They don't exist to allow admins to create the most boring interpretation of SS13.
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RedBaronFlyer
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Re: Progression Changeling Brainstorming thread

Post by RedBaronFlyer » #669052

Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race.
Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race.
Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race.
Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race.
Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race.
Dynamic and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Dynamic and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Dynamic and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race.
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Dynamic and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Dynamic and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Dynamic and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race.
Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race.
Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race.
Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race. Progression traitor and its consequences have been a disaster for the spessman race.
WARNING, Prolonged exposure to my opinions can be mentally scarring or in some cases, FATAL
Stamper of papers, pusher of crates, and the cleaner of floors.
I'm Eugine Adrian Hynes on Manuel, I'm very uncool.
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Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Fri Mar 03, 2023 5:11 pm I assume he did it elsewhere because it's fucking goofball and he never half-asses his shitty ideas, he full asses them so both cheeks are absolutely slathered in shit
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Re: Progression Changeling Brainstorming thread

Post by Not-Dorsidarf » #669054

CPTANT wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 10:44 pm
Kendrickorium wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 9:36 pm
iwishforducks wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 4:33 am the very easy solution is to just timelock shit and remove everything else about progtots
this is why i just sit in the arrivals shuttle until the 40 minute mark, then bring my bomb onto the escape shuttle instead

(coders ignore this)
I have no idea why you would actively sabotage yourself like that. You could you know, actually play the game in that time. Maybe even do a little traitoring that doesn't involve that bomb?
I mean, if john explosion's only goal is "I want to blow up [Location]", doing "Bug high security location" x 10 is just giving him a bunch of extra chances to get caught and instantly deleted by the crew if you think about it.
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kieth4 wrote: infrequently shitting yourself is fine imo
There is a lot of very bizarre nonsense being talked on this forum. I shall now remain silent and logoff until my points are vindicated.
Player who complainted over being killed for looting cap office wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 1:33 am Hey there, I'm Virescent, the super evil person who made the stupid appeal and didn't think it through enough. Just came here to say: screech, retards. Screech and writhe like the worms you are. Your pathetic little cries will keep echoing around for a while before quietting down. There is one great outcome from this: I rised up the blood pressure of some of you shitheads and lowered your lifespan. I'm honestly tempted to do this more often just to see you screech and writhe more, but that wouldn't be cool of me. So come on haters, show me some more of your high blood pressure please. 🖕🖕🖕
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Timonk
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Re: Progression Changeling Brainstorming thread

Post by Timonk » #669156

iwishforducks wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 8:00 pm
Jacquerel wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 6:20 pm
iwishforducks wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 6:15 pm my mistake but i remember distinctly looking at my uplink and being unable to purchase like 80% of its items. and then like 10 minutes latter still only being like 30% of which i could purchase. i was being dramatic to get my point across as i couldn't remember what i could and could not buy
Perhaps it felt that way but I really do need to assure you that the majority of items do not have a time lock on them at all.
*Ahem*

Here's a list of every single item that is locked behind progression.
► Show Spoiler


Here is a list of every non-progression item.
► Show Spoiler
78 items locked behind reputation
53 items that are not locked behind reputation

by pure numbers, a majority of items are locked behind progression

now you may argue that some of the items locked behind progression are little fish like the 6 different modsuit modules. in which i agree. i tried to get the data for how many times each uplink item was bought and i would pull put together how many reputation items were bought compared to non-reputation items. but i'll get to that at a later date, maybe. from purely anecdotal evidence, i think 80% of all items bought are progression-locked if i had to ballpark it.

i agree that most items that shouldn't be time-locked but i must drag you for gaslighting me :?
I assure you that you can get these items before those timers if you do secondary objectives
joooks wrote:
Naloac wrote:
In short, this appeal is denied. Suck my nuts retard.
Quoting a legend, at least im not a faggot lol
See you in 12 months unless you blacklist me for this
Timberpoes wrote: ↑ I'm going to admin timonk [...]. Fuck it, he's also now my second host vote if goof rejects.
pikeyeskey13 wrote: ↑ ok don't forget to shove it up your ass lmao oops u can delete this one I just wanted to make sure it went through
Agux909 wrote:
Timonk wrote:This is why we make fun of Manuel
Woah bravo there sir, post of the month you saved the thread. I feel overwhelmed by the echo of unlimited wisdom and usefulness sprouting from you post. Every Manuel player now feels embarrased to exist because of your much NEEDED wise words, you sure teached'em all, you genius, IQ lord.


The hut has perished at my hands.
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The pink arrow is always right.
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iwishforducks
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Re: Progression Changeling Brainstorming thread

Post by iwishforducks » #669165

Timonk wrote: ↑Sat Mar 11, 2023 9:17 am
iwishforducks wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 8:00 pm Words
I assure you that you can get these items before those timers if you do secondary objectives
you’re very much late to the party, sir
im gay (and also play the moth “bugger”)
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Tearling
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Re: Progression Changeling Brainstorming thread

Post by Tearling » #669188

RedBaronFlyer wrote: ↑Tue Mar 07, 2023 9:33 am If you really wanted to gimp wizards, you could have a magicka pool (like Morrowind) that doesn't regen, and each spell takes away from that pool. At a certain point, the wizard becomes a fancily dressed person with a stick. Adjust the magicka pool based on the player pop. (or take the dynamic approach where you pinky swear that it is totally designed around lowpop as well but give the wizard way more magicka in proportion to the crew on low pop to encourage even more of why playing lowpop dynamic sucks) It would then become a game to see if the wizard murder the station/force a shuttle call before they run out of magicka. It would also help kill any inefficient wizard combat gimmicks since traitor also got most of its ability to do gimmicks before 30 minutes into a round got killed via progtot.
Bookmarking this post so in 2025 when this exact thing gets merged I can find this again and blame you for it.
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Timberpoes wrote: ↑Fri Jan 27, 2023 12:41 am From my perspective, players just want to genuinely be listened to. And I don't mean it condescendingly, but to genuinely have their say and for admins to listen, process it and reply. Even if you don't give two shits about what the player is saying, even if you disagree with every part of what they say, players are less likely to leave an ahelp pissed off if you've listened to them and given a reply that directly addresses what they've told you.
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Kendrickorium
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Re: Progression Changeling Brainstorming thread

Post by Kendrickorium » #669220

CPTANT wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 10:44 pm
Kendrickorium wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 9:36 pm
iwishforducks wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 4:33 am the very easy solution is to just timelock shit and remove everything else about progtots
this is why i just sit in the arrivals shuttle until the 40 minute mark, then bring my bomb onto the escape shuttle instead

(coders ignore this)
I have no idea why you would actively sabotage yourself like that. You could you know, actually play the game in that time. Maybe even do a little traitoring that doesn't involve that bomb?
I don't do that ALL the time

sometimes I just walk around with a welding fuel tank screaming I AM NOT A TRAITOR, and then use said explosion to prove that I MIGHT in fact, be a traitor.
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Timonk
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Re: Progression Changeling Brainstorming thread

Post by Timonk » #669373

iwishforducks wrote: ↑Sat Mar 11, 2023 12:54 pm
Timonk wrote: ↑Sat Mar 11, 2023 9:17 am
iwishforducks wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 8:00 pm Words
I assure you that you can get these items before those timers if you do secondary objectives
you’re very much late to the party, sir
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joooks wrote:
Naloac wrote:
In short, this appeal is denied. Suck my nuts retard.
Quoting a legend, at least im not a faggot lol
See you in 12 months unless you blacklist me for this
Timberpoes wrote: ↑ I'm going to admin timonk [...]. Fuck it, he's also now my second host vote if goof rejects.
pikeyeskey13 wrote: ↑ ok don't forget to shove it up your ass lmao oops u can delete this one I just wanted to make sure it went through
Agux909 wrote:
Timonk wrote:This is why we make fun of Manuel
Woah bravo there sir, post of the month you saved the thread. I feel overwhelmed by the echo of unlimited wisdom and usefulness sprouting from you post. Every Manuel player now feels embarrased to exist because of your much NEEDED wise words, you sure teached'em all, you genius, IQ lord.


The hut has perished at my hands.
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The pink arrow is always right.
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