What did MSO mean by this

[Naloac]

Bottom post of the previous page:

Completely ignoring the entire thing what the hell did he mean by the last line.



its a joke right? it has to be a joke

[toemas]

But size and behaviour are not causal or uniform, neither are the actual differences in statistics between genders.

Size and behavior are absolutely "causal" and the rest of this is just irrelevant

Populations can have larger men with more testosterone yet less violent crime meaning that these just correlate and aren't why this actually happens.

This is like saying that poverty doesn't cause crime because "Some poor populations commit less crime than some rich populations" Completely incoherent logic

It's easy to say men and women have different statistics in crime due to biology. But it's way too simplistic and ignores why crime actually occurs and increases/decreases within a population.

the statement "Men commit more crime than women because they're biologically inclined towards violence and aggression" is indisputably true, the existence of various socio-economic factors that result in crime don't change the reality of this

I don't wanna drag this convo out here though, ping me on the tg discord in politics if you wanna discuss this more.

I'm not going to do that, I'm not in the discord.

[toemas]

See guys this is why we should befriend neo-nazis

Are the "Neo-Nazis" in the room with us right now, Fren256?

[AsbestosSniffer]

the thing that will change you and better you in this regard is to make friends with everyone, even those you might disagree with. they will see you as a real person, not some political opposition that's dangerous to them, and you will see the same in them too, and both of you will grow from sharing your experiences and your struggles.

See guys this is why we should befriend neo-nazis

Boy, I wonder how many fallacies this single reply has.

[dendydoom]

the thing that will change you and better you in this regard is to make friends with everyone, even those you might disagree with. they will see you as a real person, not some political opposition that's dangerous to them, and you will see the same in them too, and both of you will grow from sharing your experiences and your struggles.

See guys this is why we should befriend neo-nazis

i'm glad you brought this up, thank you.

i'm not insinuating that anyone should be a doormat to intolerance and bigotry. righteous anger, acting in defence of people you care about and elevating the causes of others who face intolerance and oppression are noble causes.

my concern comes from the fact that while the internet is an incredible tool for communication, it strips the human element from its users and merges us all into an amorphous, ephemeral entity that becomes an easy opposition to point to and loses any sense of nuance or consideration for the complexity and depth of the person behind the screen.

what that sometimes means is showing an ounce of vulnerability is an opportunity to connect with you on a human level. to understand that in many ways our fears themselves come from a place of vulnerability, and to share that vulnerability helps us to expand our worldview and shed ignorance. it takes that amorphous, scary oppositional entity in someone's mind and replaces it with a real flesh and blood human being. the next time they may try to access that place of ignorance, in its stead they will see you, someone they now care about who is different to them, your struggles and your experiences, and they will think twice. an open palm is a tool with many uses, a fist can only do one thing.

obviously not everyone can do this in every situation with every person they meet. it is an example of one of many points of privilege to be able to do this, and if it brings you harm to open yourself up to people who display ignorance, then to protect yourself on that basis is a good choice that is part of your own journey. i am saying that when it's possible, it should be something to be seriously considered.

my mother is brown, and a first generation immigrant. she is the one who taught me these things. it just took me a good amount of years and a fair amount of my own mistakes to finally listen to her.

[MrStonedOne]

Hey everybody, its nice to see some healthy debate about man's place in society but all of the crime statistics talk really smells like some "despite making up 13% ..." tier shit and i'm not sure why anybody thinks it's acceptable to justify bigotry with statistics given the whole point of being anti-bigotry is to stop erasing individuals with the stereotypes of their demographics.

There are a lot of walls of text i don't have the mental energy to read thru right now to figure out who needs a timeout so i'm just gonna suggest everybody relax on that a bit.

[Super Aggro Crag]

Hey everybody, its nice to see some healthy debate about man's place in society but all of the crime statistics talk really smells like some "despite making up 13% ..." tier shit and i'm not sure why anybody thinks it's acceptable to justify bigotry with statistics given the whole point of being anti-bigotry is to stop erasing individuals with the stereotypes of their demographics.

There are a lot of walls of text i don't have the mental energy to read thru right now to figure out who needs a timeout so i'm just gonna suggest everybody relax on that a bit.

bro you should read dendy she's spitting straight fire

[Kendrickorium]

has anyone gotten forum banned because of this thread yet

[BONERMASTER]

the thing that will change you and better you in this regard is to make friends with everyone, even those you might disagree with. they will see you as a real person, not some political opposition that's dangerous to them, and you will see the same in them too, and both of you will grow from sharing your experiences and your struggles.

See guys this is why we should befriend neo-nazis

i'm glad you brought this up, thank you.

i'm not insinuating that anyone should be a doormat to intolerance and bigotry. righteous anger, acting in defence of people you care about and elevating the causes of others who face intolerance and oppression are noble causes.

my concern comes from the fact that while the internet is an incredible tool for communication, it strips the human element from its users and merges us all into an amorphous, ephemeral entity that becomes an easy opposition to point to and loses any sense of nuance or consideration for the complexity and depth of the person behind the screen.

what that sometimes means is showing an ounce of vulnerability is an opportunity to connect with you on a human level. to understand that in many ways our fears themselves come from a place of vulnerability, and to share that vulnerability helps us to expand our worldview and shed ignorance. it takes that amorphous, scary oppositional entity in someone's mind and replaces it with a real flesh and blood human being. the next time they may try to access that place of ignorance, in its stead they will see you, someone they now care about who is different to them, your struggles and your experiences, and they will think twice. an open palm is a tool with many uses, a fist can only do one thing.

obviously not everyone can do this in every situation with every person they meet. it is an example of one of many points of privilege to be able to do this, and if it brings you harm to open yourself up to people who display ignorance, then to protect yourself on that basis is a good choice that is part of your own journey. i am saying that when it's possible, it should be something to be seriously considered.

my mother is brown, and a first generation immigrant. she is the one who taught me these things. it just took me a good amount of years and a fair amount of my own mistakes to finally listen to her.

I have added you to my friends list because of the posts you made in this thread. I had no idea that you were this based and really like how you're putting forth a very nuanced, open-minded worldview and encouraging everyone to see the other's point of view, so to speak.
Needless to say that I fully agree and there should be more of that in the world. Go Dendy!


With friendly regards
-BONERMASTER

[MrStonedOne]

Hey everybody, its nice to see some healthy debate about man's place in society but all of the crime statistics talk really smells like some "despite making up 13% ..." tier shit and i'm not sure why anybody thinks it's acceptable to justify bigotry with statistics given the whole point of being anti-bigotry is to stop erasing individuals with the stereotypes of their demographics.

There are a lot of walls of text i don't have the mental energy to read thru right now to figure out who needs a timeout so i'm just gonna suggest everybody relax on that a bit.

bro you should read dendy she's spitting straight fire

I always read dendy's walls of text

[Fren256]

the thing that will change you and better you in this regard is to make friends with everyone, even those you might disagree with. they will see you as a real person, not some political opposition that's dangerous to them, and you will see the same in them too, and both of you will grow from sharing your experiences and your struggles.

See guys this is why we should befriend neo-nazis

i'm glad you brought this up, thank you.

i'm not insinuating that anyone should be a doormat to intolerance and bigotry. righteous anger, acting in defence of people you care about and elevating the causes of others who face intolerance and oppression are noble causes.

my concern comes from the fact that while the internet is an incredible tool for communication, it strips the human element from its users and merges us all into an amorphous, ephemeral entity that becomes an easy opposition to point to and loses any sense of nuance or consideration for the complexity and depth of the person behind the screen.

what that sometimes means is showing an ounce of vulnerability is an opportunity to connect with you on a human level. to understand that in many ways our fears themselves come from a place of vulnerability, and to share that vulnerability helps us to expand our worldview and shed ignorance. it takes that amorphous, scary oppositional entity in someone's mind and replaces it with a real flesh and blood human being. the next time they may try to access that place of ignorance, in its stead they will see you, someone they now care about who is different to them, your struggles and your experiences, and they will think twice. an open palm is a tool with many uses, a fist can only do one thing.

obviously not everyone can do this in every situation with every person they meet. it is an example of one of many points of privilege to be able to do this, and if it brings you harm to open yourself up to people who display ignorance, then to protect yourself on that basis is a good choice that is part of your own journey. i am saying that when it's possible, it should be something to be seriously considered.

my mother is brown, and a first generation immigrant. she is the one who taught me these things. it just took me a good amount of years and a fair amount of my own mistakes to finally listen to her.

I'd like to clarify that I do agree with what you've said so far, I just saw that sentence and I remembered it's used by centrists, so I had to make a sarcastic comment.

Taking bad people off the equation, keeping an open mind and meeting people with different thoughts, customs and ideals is very good advice, especially on the internet. It helps reinforce, or even transform, your own values through points of view and knowledge gained from outside perspectives.

Thank you for taking the time to expand your thoughts through my response, and I apologize if it came off as aggressive.

[conrad]

dendydoom for headmin

[yobihodazine2]

Many people will exploit your vulnerabilities given the chance. I suggest you choose wisely who you open up to.

[Boot]

the thing that will change you and better you in this regard is to make friends with everyone, even those you might disagree with. they will see you as a real person, not some political opposition that's dangerous to them, and you will see the same in them too, and both of you will grow from sharing your experiences and your struggles.

See guys this is why we should befriend neo-nazis

i'm glad you brought this up, thank you.

i'm not insinuating that anyone should be a doormat to intolerance and bigotry. righteous anger, acting in defence of people you care about and elevating the causes of others who face intolerance and oppression are noble causes.

my concern comes from the fact that while the internet is an incredible tool for communication, it strips the human element from its users and merges us all into an amorphous, ephemeral entity that becomes an easy opposition to point to and loses any sense of nuance or consideration for the complexity and depth of the person behind the screen.

what that sometimes means is showing an ounce of vulnerability is an opportunity to connect with you on a human level. to understand that in many ways our fears themselves come from a place of vulnerability, and to share that vulnerability helps us to expand our worldview and shed ignorance. it takes that amorphous, scary oppositional entity in someone's mind and replaces it with a real flesh and blood human being. the next time they may try to access that place of ignorance, in its stead they will see you, someone they now care about who is different to them, your struggles and your experiences, and they will think twice. an open palm is a tool with many uses, a fist can only do one thing.

obviously not everyone can do this in every situation with every person they meet. it is an example of one of many points of privilege to be able to do this, and if it brings you harm to open yourself up to people who display ignorance, then to protect yourself on that basis is a good choice that is part of your own journey. i am saying that when it's possible, it should be something to be seriously considered.

my mother is brown, and a first generation immigrant. she is the one who taught me these things. it just took me a good amount of years and a fair amount of my own mistakes to finally listen to her.

I'd like to clarify that I do agree with what you've said so far, I just saw that sentence and I remembered it's used by centrists, so I had to make a sarcastic comment.

Taking bad people off the equation, keeping an open mind and meeting people with different thoughts, customs and ideals is very good advice, especially on the internet. It helps reinforce, or even transform, your own values through points of view and knowledge gained from outside perspectives.

Thank you for taking the time to expand your thoughts through my response, and I apologize if it came off as aggressive.

"Be open to good people. Be closed off to bad people."

You don't need to make an effort to be open to good people. You already think they are good!!!

This whole meme of "online people may seem to be very easy to understand data points but each and every one of them is a unique human with a story all of their own that we can never know the nuances of so we should be open to that" doesn't have "but throw all that out the window if they are the out group because they are bad!" Stapled onto the end.

Edit:https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/09/30/i ... e-outgroup this is a good read about the topic.

[dendydoom]

I have added you to my friends list because of the posts you made in this thread. I had no idea that you were this based and really like how you're putting forth a very nuanced, open-minded worldview and encouraging everyone to see the other's point of view, so to speak.
Needless to say that I fully agree and there should be more of that in the world. Go Dendy!


With friendly regards
-BONERMASTER

thank you so much for the kind words BONERMASTER! i'd be happy to be your friend. i'm a big fan of your posts too, they're always a treat to stumble upon.

I'd like to clarify that I do agree with what you've said so far, I just saw that sentence and I remembered it's used by centrists, so I had to make a sarcastic comment.

Taking bad people off the equation, keeping an open mind and meeting people with different thoughts, customs and ideals is very good advice, especially on the internet. It helps reinforce, or even transform, your own values through points of view and knowledge gained from outside perspectives.

Thank you for taking the time to expand your thoughts through my response, and I apologize if it came off as aggressive.

there is no apology necessary, you brought up a valid point and i'm genuinely thankful that you did. thank you for coming back and reaching out.

i cannot ask or expect anyone to go out and start shaking hands with genuinely hateful people that march around in armbands with four-pronged geometric shapes on them. i'm not strong enough to do that myself, there is a limit to anyone's patience and understanding and it is an incredibly difficult thing to do. of course, there are people who have done so and have been successful, the story of Daryl Davis often springs to mind, a black man who befriended and de-radicalized klansmen for 30 years. i would compel anyone to look up his story, as he's a genuinely incredible man with an endless wellspring of compassion and strong convictions.

i don't feel right to soapbox about anything that i'm not able to do myself, and i told myself when i entered this thread that i wouldn't defer to anything other than my own life experiences. so far that has been that truly hateful people who are incapable of change are few and far between, but they are the ones that we most often hear about. we all require compassion, empathy and understanding to be human - many of us, particularly men, are deprived of this through our lives and so are easily susceptible to manipulation and conscription into intolerant and ignorant ideologies. it is not any of our duty to stick our necks out to try and help anyone that are intolerant of us, but oftentimes i've met people who are clearly normal, compassionate people underneath that thin veneer of bitterness and anger. they are not lost, and they deserve a chance. it has brought me friends in the most unlikely places, and it has brought peace to myself through the years and reignited my belief in the natural good of people.

but, again, i'd like to re-iterate that it's a personal choice that everyone has to make. it's difficult, doesn't always work and it's important to look after yourselves, and if i had a fool proof 10 point plan that would cure the world of ignorance and intolerance then i would share it, but alas i don't. i'm not perfect myself, i have just as much ignorance as anyone else and all i can do is my best when i'm able.

"Be open to good people. Be closed off to bad people."

You don't need to make an effort to be open to good people. You already think they are good!!!

This whole meme of "online people may seem to be very easy to understand data points but each and every one of them is a unique human with a story all of their own that we can never know the nuances of so we should be open to that" doesn't have "but throw all that out the window if they are the out group because they are bad!" Stapled onto the end.

Edit:https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/09/30/i ... e-outgroup this is a good read about the topic.

thanks for posting that link! it was an enlightening and interesting read that i've not seen before.

[kieth4]

I guess you could say that mso is an imposter...amongus???

[Kendrickorium]

a pol thread with no need for starsector, truly an amazing beast

[stairmaster]

praise ludd

[conrad]

praise ludd

— Sent from stairmaster's iPhone