From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)

[The Wrench]

Bottom post of the previous page:

https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/ ... omment-box
I don’t like this PR

[Cobby]

let me know when you'd like my rent I assume im way behind since i didnt even know i was using this space until your post. If youd like to have a productive conversation about medical/chem im happy to indulge, but harboring this amount of disdain for a feature years after is a bit much.

Not sure how cobbychem "bullied casuals out of their role", chem has always been a very wiki intensive job. Changing the chem effects or what have you doesnt touch that problem. Now Fermichem certainly progresses that issue where you need to know both the recipe AND ideal pH, but im not sure how cobbychem did that anymore than trekchems or goofchems.

it's almost like the people making the code and designing the mechanics are totally detached from the people running the rounds and dictating rules around gameplay and roleplay

its no different than players thinking admins are putting their hands in the cookie jar when they shouldnt be.

This might be true in the sense that people who played heavily in say 2015 or even the timeframe of 2018ish want to recreate the experience they fell in love with which becomes much harder to do when new players come in with a different expectation or personal enjoyment of the game. Especially true when people come from say a murderbone video or a sseth video where the gamey parts are highlighted instead of the more immersive rp-centric style people i'd argue used to be accustomed to, so to curb that you have to make mechanical changes that curb the behavior (such as nerfs or downsides to originally powerful aspects of the game). SUPER Especially true is that the community is big enough now where you the individual dont have to care about how you behave towards other players in the game because the community isnt as tightknitted/small as it used to be, so theres no love lost if you abuse a feature and consequently little love lost if someone ends up patching it despite it being a classic.

Also obligatory you are able to contribute to the game in ways you think it would be improved. It may require selling but thats no different than wanting to push a policy change.

[zergking]

Isn’t this what CEV eris does?

[Timonk]

Honestly when cobbychem came out I missed the old chems but I see the merit in cobbychem now. Truly a visionary.

[chocolate_bickie]

snip

Cobby chem does live rent-free in my head. So much I got it mixed up with fermichem which is what I was thinking of in my previous comments.

[Kubisopplay]

Already on most rounds that I play having materials is a rare occurrence, especially so for things other than glass and metal. Getting any advanced upgrades as a borg is slowly becoming the hallmark of greenshifts, because either you don't have research because nobody wants to do experiments, or you don't have materials because miners are dead. I am pretty sure this won't fix the issues, but it might make shorter rounds even more resource deficient. PS Before arcane comes in and tells everyone about data they collected, iirc it's rounded data, which is barely useful, because it's polluted by the one powergamer miner who comes back when shuttle gets called so he can use his gear on station.

[Turbonerd]

The problem is the expectation of reliably getting whatever you want, not material deficiency. If you don't care, then all your problems will go away.

[MooCow12]

There should be an expectation of the station reliably doing basic things unless an antagonist does something to disrupt the status quo.

If the status quo itself is unreliable then that`s a fundamental problem that hurts everyone`s willingness to cooperate and pushes us to play selfishly, ie calling shuttle to end everyone else`s rounds just because your department didnt get the materials it needed to function.



Thats another fundamental problem with scarcity and failing jobs, COMMAND STAFF ARE ALLOWED TO CALL SHUTTLE OVER STUFF LIKE THIS AND ROLL FOR A BETTER ROUND THAT HAS MATTS/POWER/RESEARCH POINTS

if sm delams because engies griefed themselves/dereliction of duty CE calls shuttle even though every other department is fine and has ways to get around limited power/make their own power (solars) no bwoink/no ban, its literally the same as calling shuttle as RD because you accidently bombed ordnance or because miners didnt get matts.


Remember swarmers???? All they do is eat materials / the ore silo, and what did that result in? A round with scarce resources? no 5 minutes of everyone waiting for shuttle to dock and get to another round that has resources.


Hey botanist I see that you are learning botany and trying to accomplish an epic plant and you dont need materials to do that. Well guess what fuck you , you are gonna have to spend another 45 minutes trying again, nearly an hour of your life because im calling shuttle because we are out of matts.

Hey chemist I see you spent the entire round setting up plumbing, well do it again because I want a mech and I cant get a mech this round.

Hey xenobiologist, cargo tech, geneticist, etc. fuck you

[Cobby]

Honestly when cobbychem came out I missed the old chems but I see the merit in cobbychem now. Truly a visionary.

trust the process.

Cobby chem does live rent-free in my head. So much I got it mixed up with fermichem which is what I was thinking of in my previous comments.

It's cool we all want the best for the game.

[Pandarsenic]

Desperately need to keep at least some wall minerals for non-miners who just want the mats to do their damn jobs and for gulag.

[dirk_mcblade]

There should be an expectation of the station reliably doing basic things unless an antagonist does something to disrupt the status quo.

If the status quo itself is unreliable then that`s a fundamental problem that hurts everyone`s willingness to cooperate and pushes us to play selfishly, ie calling shuttle to end everyone else`s rounds just because your department didnt get the materials it needed to function.



Thats another fundamental problem with scarcity and failing jobs, COMMAND STAFF ARE ALLOWED TO CALL SHUTTLE OVER STUFF LIKE THIS AND ROLL FOR A BETTER ROUND THAT HAS MATTS/POWER/RESEARCH POINTS

if sm delams because engies griefed themselves/dereliction of duty CE calls shuttle even though every other department is fine and has ways to get around limited power/make their own power (solars) no bwoink/no ban, its literally the same as calling shuttle as RD because you accidently bombed ordnance or because miners didnt get matts.


Remember swarmers???? All they do is eat materials / the ore silo, and what did that result in? A round with scarce resources? no 5 minutes of everyone waiting for shuttle to dock and get to another round that has resources.


Hey botanist I see that you are learning botany and trying to accomplish an epic plant and you dont need materials to do that. Well guess what fuck you , you are gonna have to spend another 45 minutes trying again, nearly an hour of your life because im calling shuttle because we are out of matts.

Hey chemist I see you spent the entire round setting up plumbing, well do it again because I want a mech and I cant get a mech this round.

Hey xenobiologist, cargo tech, geneticist, etc. fuck you

Yeah I actually think it's lame to call shuttle when SM delams but before any power issues manifest. Command staff who call shuttle before station objectives are met ought to be jobbanned automatically for like a day (but not noted).

[TheLoLSwat]

If you want to have a say on shuttle getting called, be command staff

If you want a bigger say, be captain

Troll calls are troll calls but command has the power to call and it’s one of the few shreds of (on LRP atleast) of authority they have

[The Wrench]

https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/pull/78164


UPDATE! BASED PR INCOMING. ALL OF MY PROBLEMS HAVE BEEN SOLVED, I AM NOW AN ARCANE STAN.

[conrad]

Jacquerel is seriously suffering the risk of being ousted as my favourite maintainer by Arcane

[MooCow12]

Pr is good but i hate that the cargo shuttle has a magical anti teleport field so i cant get my deliveries from cargo without hacking in and fighting off the cargo techies who arnt doing their job

[Jacquerel]

Pr is good but i hate that the cargo shuttle has a magical anti teleport field so i cant get my deliveries from cargo without hacking in and fighting off the cargo techies who arnt doing their job

It's because otherwise people use it to break into centcomm

[Timonk]

Pr is good but i hate that the cargo shuttle has a magical anti teleport field so i cant get my deliveries from cargo without hacking in and fighting off the cargo techies who arnt doing their job

It's because otherwise people use it to break into centcomm

What, were they teleporting in while the shuttle was about to leave?

[Jacquerel]

Pr is good but i hate that the cargo shuttle has a magical anti teleport field so i cant get my deliveries from cargo without hacking in and fighting off the cargo techies who arnt doing their job

It's because otherwise people use it to break into centcomm

What, were they teleporting in while the shuttle was about to leave?

In varying ways yes. You'd be amazed what we need to blacklist in cargo shuttles to prevent someone from using it to exit the map.

[The Wrench]

Why do we make the cargo shuttle go to Central command anyways? Why not just let it rest in hyperspace and then create whatever is ordered there

[Jacquerel]

Why do we make the cargo shuttle go to Central command anyways? Why not just let it rest in hyperspace and then create whatever is ordered there

mostly it makes it easier for admins to set up their own shit to put onto the cargo shuttle

[scamoppi]

yeah you can put a series of increasingly goofy things on the shuttle for the cargo techs to find every time they send it back to the station