Rework the note/ban editing conduct rule.

[NamelessFairy]

This was introduced yesterday but a bunch of issues have already been pointed out so I want to propose a rework to the incoming headmin term.

Simply change it to "You must make the noted/banned player aware that you are editing the wording or length of a note or ban placed on them."
(Or some other wording)

Firstly to be clear this doesn't mean admins can extend players bans, that doesn't happen and shouldn't happen, its covered by other rulings.

As for why this is good:
It removes the arbitrary time limit on error corrections. Inaccurate notes/bans harm everyone and could result in players getting banned on false pretenses in the future, we should strive to ensure that bans/notes are free of errors.
It removes the need for headmin intervention for traditionally accepted note changes. E.g. error corrections on appeal. Headmins don't need the additional workload of needing to intervene on every little correction on a ban/note.

Why this is worse:
It removes the bit about making new notes for separate incidents rather than editing old ones. I think removing this clause is fine however, its common sense and as far as I'm aware no currently active admin trainer is teaching their candidates to do this.

Does this fulfill the same purpose?
I think it does, if the noted/banned player is informed of the changes they are given a change to challenge them either immediately in an ahelp or on appeal if thats not an option or they'd like to seek headmin intervention. This covers beneficial note/ban modifications just as the current policy does (assuming people wont challenge these unless they're inaccurate) . This also gives players a say in if they think the change is valid or not rather than a admin needing to explain to the headmins the player is given a chance to explain themselves and ensure greater accuracy in the note/ban or if they disagree with the change they are given an opportunity to explain to the headmins why they disagree rather than being faced with a change that already has headmin backing without any say in the matter.

[Misdoubtful]

I will state for the record that the incoming headmin term also contributed to and were involved the creation of this rule and were involved in the process of making it with their feedback, concerns, and questions as a round table of the six of us after being something the current term discussed and brought to experienced administrators.

To be clear, the intention is to replace the entire section with, "You must make the noted/banned player aware that you are editing the wording or length of a note or ban placed on them'?

This conduct was added in part to address the removal of positive notes that were given to players by entirely separate admins, and to cement standard practices and provide knowledge for players. While these things may be common sense to you, a tenured admin, they may not be to players or to new admins.

It also exists to usher things towards appeals, where things have historically always been done so that they may be documented and done in an official manner, rather than cutting corners to avoid an appeal because 'its a lot of work'. Due diligence is a must and doing the appeals makes for big deals.

How are you going to address that with this proposal?

If this means that admins can not extend bans and other things that make bans and notes worse for the player that received them where will that be documented?

If making new things into separate notes is common sense, do the players that freshly read this new addition to conduct already know that?

This proposal as it stands feels incredibly rushed, and truthfully feels like its focused on you not liking the documented time limit on changing bans/notes before they must go to appeals and seeking headmin guidance for extraordinary circumstances. Rather than the actual merits of this conduct addition.

To continue with it feeling incredibly rushed: please include the actual addition to admin conduct so that people reading this proposal know what its all about...

Modifying Notes and Bans
Do not modify non-secret notes/bans outside of appeals unless it either benefits the player in question or you are correcting an error within [24hr] of it being placed.
Each new incident must result in the placement of a new note, rather than the modification of a placed note.
If in doubt about editing a note or in a circumstance falling outside of the above, refer to the current head admin team for guidance.

[NamelessFairy]

To be clear, the intention is to replace the entire section with, "You must make the noted/banned player aware that you are editing the wording or length of a note or ban placed on them'?

Correct or something worded better than this.

This conduct was added in part to address the removal of positive notes that were given to players by entirely separate admins

My proposal covers this equally to the existing rule, under both someone needs to be informed when a note/ban is modified. In mine is the noted/banned player is, in the current one the headmin team is. The player being in the loop seems better to me as they have more context and it would suck to have changes made to your note/ban behind your back.

It exists to usher things towards appeals, where things have historically always been done so that they may be documented and done in an official manner, rather than cutting corners to avoid an appeal because 'its a lot of work'.

My proposal implements this. By informing players that a modification is made to their note/ban this gives them a chance to challenge it at appeal. The newly introduced conduct does not facilitate this as modifications would need to be made behind closed doors where admins need to ping headmins, the noted/banned player entirely in the dark to this.

If this means that admins can not extend bans and other things that make bans and notes worse for the player that received them where will that be documented?

Note modifications are documented in the note themselves, the noted/banned player would also need to be informed and given a chance to appeal allowing for the dispute to be logged. The existing ruling does also allow for this but its purely for show as headmins have already ruled on the modification, the appeal would serve no purpose.

If making new things into separate notes is common sense, do the players that freshly read this new addition to conduct already know that?

Fair enough, that line can be retained but it seems more along the lines of something that belongs in a guide to Adminning though (Guide consolidation some day)

[Cheshify]

The current Head Admin team helped to write the policy that's being debated over here and has no interest in changing anything. The current wording only codifies existing expectations and should never be that important, admins acting in good faith will never get into trouble for correcting minor issues on a note.

Cheshify - Yeah
TheBibleMelts - Agreed
Fikou - Pure Apathy