Two problems of Manny

[Yobrocharlie]

in my own personal opinion you should take this with a grain of salt

Meta-cliques/closed door roleplay

People often time blame meta-cliques and closed door roleplay for a reason of a lack of roleplay- it makes just social sense, sentient beings on station will make friends assuming they're actual sentient beings in the first place and not just skinwalkers (Not to be confused with changelings) sure it may be generally bad for the game but that's not just some game mechanic you can control that's just human nature and this is a thing in real life for those of you who do not know how humans generally socialize or have had what at least i would consider to be an abnormal social life. I feel like if anything as far as this goes if you seek to look at the consequences of trying to destroy these you can look no farther than beestation, and yea that turned out great. fun fact, it didnt and there has been a mass exodus of actual roleplayers leaving beestation and going elsewhere, primarily monkeystation and here

no QC

its not a exactly a closed kept secret that not everybody comes to the roleplay servers to roleplay, infact a lot of people who are fresh faces and not static's/well knowns are often times shitters or people who are quite NRP, hell even a lot of casuals and well knowns are just NRP shitters as well who come here so they dont get rolled by crew as an antag or who maybe just always played here. Whats worse is that this practice of just being a murderbone shitter who will constantly just barely edge the rules so they dont technically violate the rules while generally taking as much away from the round and being as destructive as possible- is not only something just normal players do but on a few times something I have seen even the servers administration do which is really just soul-crushing to see that even some of the staff of the server dont even treat it like a roleplay server and will consistently rile up d-chat more than other shitters do all while just barely not crossing the line. These people are meant to be the QC in themselves of the server and seriously dictating the environment/general atmosphere of the server, and they set the bar the lowest on the hub. Hell even beestation can be better for roleplay but there you have to be pro-active about it and force it on people, but its better than here where as a bartender main on a three hour greenshift on high pop only four people stopped by, security roundstart asking for quad sec, then an assistant asking for bloody marry, then an engineer asking for screwdriver while glowing, and then the same assistant from earlier giving me berries and saying "give me bastion bourbon" to which i told him that it was worse than epi now he just said "fucking coders" and then left. (No i dont remember the assistants name) Its no real wonder why were the laughing stock in the non ERP SS13 roleplay community (thanks for taking the title beestation)


At the end of the day though there is still roleplay on manual but its mainly either pre-meditated arc's and such in the non official manual discord admins fucking with people (mainly just a set of specific people) and often times groups of people who will interact with each other without much branching out. Although i am extremely guilty of doing this myself it still sucks whenever i see a genuinely new player play manual only to see that people here don't roleplay and they just leave and go somewhere else sometimes to far worse places for people.



What does this have to do with policy?

Something needs to change about manny and how it is, otherwise it will stay as it is right now that being just an LRP/NRP slop of shittery, i think a great step towards this would be the ability for people banned from manny to not be banned on sybil or terry just server specific bans or better yet more QC enforcement.

[Jacquerel]

I'll be honest I don't see how any of what you wrote leads to your conclusion.
Do you think admins would ban people from Manuel more often if it did not ban them from all three servers? I can assure you that this is not the case.

[Constellado]

Something needs to change about manny and how it is, otherwise it will stay as it is right now that being just an LRP/NRP slop of shittery, i think a great step towards this would be the ability for people banned from manny to not be banned on sybil or terry just server specific bans or better yet more QC enforcement.

I am a BIG fan of having server specific bans. 100 percent.
The issue is, MOST of the time, if one is being a shitter enough to get banned on manuel, they are probably a big enough shitter to get banned on sybil. However, I still think that kind of thing will be very useful for temp bans.

In my experience the RP quality jumps higher as soon as you do a single custom emote. People see that, oh they are roleplaying, and will roleplay back. It happens a lot. I will act as my character as much of the time as possible, and ever stray from it. That gives a higher chance of people noticing and would start roleplaying with you. Somtimes they will do a /me back it makes me smile. I need to /me more tbh it adds a lot.
Sometimes when I am a curator people don't show up much to do things some shifts. That happens because its out of the way. Other shifts though you can get a LOT happening. One time ( a couple days ago) a person went into the library just to say the library was useless, but they RP'd it so well it ended up being a long and fun conversation, and others even walked in to add to the RP. Eventually everybody was trying out new hats.
You will get RP sometimes, but it does need people going up to you and needing to have interesting thing to say in a conversation. Having interesting things to talk about while serving drinks might help with that? I have a character where I just make up stupid retro cybernetic stories and blabber about them when in surgery, its very entertaining. People tend to respond to that.

Also, I agree admin should not be going around and just muderboning as soon as they ghost roll wizard or something without an RP flavor tbh. Gives a bad look. Many people have complained about that now.

(BTW If ya want to RP with me, just go up to me when I am not beelining somewhere to do a job and ask some interesting questions. If I am not busy I will respond back! If I am curator I will 100% respond)

[BonChoi]

Honestly I'm a big fan of server specific bans as well, but I'd imagine that either MSO, the headmins, or the admin team in general are not big on them or else they probably would've been instituted by now.

To respond to your first point, however, I think the meta-cliques got better after the big metacommunications ban this year. Despite who might think what about them, they were to me the worst offenders of the "closed-door" roleplay style that I really haven't seen in as much force as I did when they were playing.

[Isratosh]

I can see a use-case for Manuel-specific bans being an option, but I don't like the implications of it. The majority of bans I place on Manuel are for global rules, but I also don't shy away from server bans for MRP-specific rule breaks (nor should any admin). If you can't follow the rules on one of our servers I'd prefer you to be off all of them.

Your complaint is an on-going admin AND player issue. We will need to see tighter enforcement of the RP rules on Manuel AND a willingness from its playerbase to roleplay more goodly to see any noticeable change.

[Vekter]

Server-specific bans aren't going to happen; the headmin teams have always stated we don't want them and I'm not certain BYOND can support that on the front-end. They're bad for server health because they result in us just shunting anyone who we think isn't a "good fit" for Manuel onto the other servers.

[TheRex9001]

SNIP

Also, I agree admin should not be going around and just muderboning as soon as they ghost roll wizard or something without an RP flavor tbh. Gives a bad look. Many people have complained about that now.

I think this is a pretty lame mentality, admins should be able to have fun murderboning as a wizard if they want, same as any other player. Wizards RP can be fun but sometimes it can be fun to just switch things up for a change and have a fun hectic murderbone wizard run using a kit you like. Maybe that kit has an RP flavor and maybe it doesn't, I think its a silly thing to complain about and (to me) just sounds like extended dchat salt.

[dendydoom]

i am having a little trouble parsing what policy changes this thread is asking for: is this specifically asking to introduce MRP-specific bans that still let people play on LRP if they're banned from MRP and vice versa?

the strong argument against this is that, simply put, breaking the rules is breaking the rules. if you can't participate appropriately on one server, then the solution isn't to dump you into another. it's to ask you to take a break and try to alter your behaviour when you come back.

also, i've made posts on this before, but enforcing an RP standard is an evil i think many people only want to toy around with when it's used against people who play in a way they don't agree with. what this would mean is restricting the scope of acceptable actions down into a pre-defined schema and then enforcing that standard against all players. we would lose a lot of creative interpretations of our rounds which create unique (if chaotic) stories.

i've personally been against this because i think that having the low lows of people possibly abusing the openness of the sandbox (which can be addressed and corrected by admins as it currently stands) is worth the high highs of players having the freedom to utilize the space in ways that make rounds unique and fun without being scared that they're going to break the infallible thespian's code of roleplay. the feeling of having the roleplay council breathing down your neck and judging your contributions is anathema to creativity.

MRP is MRP because we have an extended ruleset that controls conflict and enforces slightly higher roleplay expectations for command and security. beyond this i have always quite despised the idea of nitpicking someone's playstyle or contributions beyond these sweeping policy standards. i feel that ultimately our job is to keep the space accessible and to enforce the main rules and our extended MRP rules, but beyond that it is up to players and players alone to decide what their contribution to a round will be.

there have been plenty of gold standard statics over the years who have introduced a higher standard by being the change they want to see. players naturally congregate around that sort of bonfire of creativity and fun to share in its warmth. i believe the best way to achieve a higher standard is not to punish people who fall out of line but to simply play better and influence them to see the light.

[Yobrocharlie]

I'll be honest I don't see how any of what you wrote leads to your conclusion.
Do you think admins would ban people from Manuel more often if it did not ban them from all three servers? I can assure you that this is not the case.

Basically this is just me bitching about how the quality of Manuel would put an F13 server to shame.

[Yobrocharlie]

SNIP

Also, I agree admin should not be going around and just muderboning as soon as they ghost roll wizard or something without an RP flavor tbh. Gives a bad look. Many people have complained about that now.

I think this is a pretty lame mentality, admins should be able to have fun murderboning as a wizard if they want, same as any other player. Wizards RP can be fun but sometimes it can be fun to just switch things up for a change and have a fun hectic murderbone wizard run using a kit you like. Maybe that kit has an RP flavor and maybe it doesn't, I think its a silly thing to complain about and (to me) just sounds like extended dchat salt.

Yea I agree murderboning as wizard and stuff is fine- but more often than not it’s not wizard it’s a traitor or a ling who will edge the rules as hard as physically possible killing anybody who they can, while also being ludicrously toxic while doing so.

[Jacquerel]

If this is just a stream of conciousness post and not like, a proposal to change something specific based on your experience you should probably just post it in the player's club

[Higgin]

There is a policy topic in here (even if the initial suggestion of stuff like server-specific bans is a non-starter for both practical and principled reasons,) and I think it's around where the freedom allowed on MRP has messy tradeoffs depending on who gets what antag license and how disruptively/competitively they use it.

If there's something to be done about it, it probably needs to be expressed in more specific terms in another thread with a fuller vision of what Manuel and MRP are actually supposed to "be" perhaps with what dendy articulated as a starting point (I have some problems with where we presently focus those restrictions that I think appear in some of the same threads.)

I'm pretty sure I experienced the round that spawned this thread, know who it's about, and have been on the receiving end of others in the genre.

I think I said in OOC at the end to either ahelp or make a complaint about it, but a complaint needs to be actionable under the rules/SOP, or the rules need to be changed to move future behavior into that remit.

If I'm not mistaken, this goes back to a changeling having said fuck. Changelings can say fuck. That's a policy issue.

Admins acting as players should not be held to different, invisible standards in their conduct as players. You've got to be able to run a game you'd want to and be able to play just as well as anyone else at the table. If you deadmin and are otherwise as any player, you should get that treatment under the rules, and the rules should be consistently enforced as to reflect that.

For what it's worth, I've seen a lot less interesting and sporting play from people with a license to say "fuck" on Manny than anything from last night.

[Yobrocharlie]

There is a policy topic in here (even if the initial suggestion of stuff like server-specific bans is a non-starter for both practical and principled reasons,) and I think it's around where the freedom allowed on MRP has messy tradeoffs depending on who gets what antag license and how disruptively/competitively they use it.

If there's something to be done about it, it probably needs to be expressed in more specific terms in another thread with a fuller vision of what Manuel and MRP are actually supposed to "be" perhaps with what dendy articulated as a starting point (I have some problems with where we presently focus those restrictions that I think appear in some of the same threads.)

I'm pretty sure I experienced the round that spawned this thread, know who it's about, and have been on the receiving end of others in the genre.

I think I said in OOC at the end to either ahelp or make a complaint about it, but a complaint needs to be actionable under the rules/SOP, or the rules need to be changed to move future behavior into that remit.

If I'm not mistaken, this goes back to a changeling having said fuck. Changelings can say fuck. That's a policy issue.

Admins acting as players should not be held to different, invisible standards in their conduct as players. You've got to be able to run a game you'd want to and be able to play just as well as anyone else at the table. If you deadmin and are otherwise as any player, you should get that treatment under the rules, and the rules should be consistently enforced as to reflect that.

For what it's worth, I've seen a lot less interesting and sporting play from people with a license to say "fuck" on Manny than anything from last night.

I don’t think the ability to say “fuck” has anything to do with the spawning of this thread. more so they were just toxic in the sense that t-bagging a person you just killed is toxic. And that killing anybody the rule permits you to and exactly that for no other reason than just to get frags is toxic and behavior I would expect in more so a fallout server and not here.

[Higgin]

[snip]

I don’t think the ability to say “fuck” has anything to do with the spawning of this thread. more so they were just toxic in the sense that t-bagging a person you just killed is toxic. And that killing anybody the rule permits you to and exactly that for no other reason than just to get frags is toxic and behavior I would expect in more so a fallout server and not here.

How would you propose we regulate that toxicity? No gloating about kills or wins? Should the bad guys never brag (a great way to inspire people to hate them, arguably their narrative purpose and very hard to distinguish from them just playing the game if we don't assume they're there to lose?)

edit to be very clear: that's a terrible assumption in a game with any competitive aspect. Players in a competitive game aren't responsible for each other's fun - the ref/GM/designer is.

Changelings get to say fuck to my understanding because they're otherwise basically doomed. Meaningful restriction does not apply to the immortal guy with inherent abilities (forgetting BZ or shutting them in a 3x3 box because who the fuck has time or wants to do that?) They're best thought of in-round along other unrestricted antags but unfortunately lack a built-in ending mechanism like others (blob, nukies.)

Should they be disabled on MRP, changed, or should the decision be reversed?

[Yobrocharlie]

[snip]

I don’t think the ability to say “fuck” has anything to do with the spawning of this thread. more so they were just toxic in the sense that t-bagging a person you just killed is toxic. And that killing anybody the rule permits you to and exactly that for no other reason than just to get frags is toxic and behavior I would expect in more so a fallout server and not here.

How would you propose we regulate that toxicity? No gloating about kills or wins? Should the bad guys never brag (a great way to inspire people to hate them, arguably their narrative purpose and very hard to distinguish from them just playing the game if we don't assume they're there to lose?)

edit to be very clear: that's a terrible assumption in a game with any competitive aspect. Players in a competitive game aren't responsible for each other's fun - the ref/GM/designer is.

Changelings get to say fuck to my understanding because they're otherwise basically doomed. Meaningful restriction does not apply to the immortal guy with inherent abilities (forgetting BZ or shutting them in a 3x3 box because who the fuck has time or wants to do that?) They're best thought of in-round along other unrestricted antags but unfortunately lack a built-in ending mechanism like others (blob, nukies.)

Should they be disabled on MRP, changed, or should the decision be reversed?

That was me clarifying about how I was bitching, there is no regulating this.

[Yobrocharlie]

And also changelings are fine, antags in general are fine (besides slaughter demons) it’s not X antag that’s the issue it’s just bad actors that are the issue. Sure a lone traitor may not be an issue on a greenshift- but if it’s low pop, with no security or generally proactive people, all of the sudden a round which actually had potential is instead going to become an acting cap traitor RD who has mindslaved half the station and only one person is having fun-

That being the tot. And it’s perfectly okay for the traitor to do this but what’s not okay is when the tot just starts doing things that ruin the rounds for others just because they’re bored and have already fragged any threat to them.

[Yobrocharlie]

This kind of coincides with the thread about antags being able to kill security just for being security, is that- that is a kind of LRP inconsiderate and extremely powergamey mindset to have of “oh this person has the potential to be a threat to me I gotta go silently round remove them two minutes into the round because I’m the antagonist therefore the protagonist and only my experience matters”

[dendydoom]

it probably needs to be expressed in more specific terms in another thread with a fuller vision of what Manuel and MRP are actually supposed to "be" perhaps with what dendy articulated as a starting point

oh goodness... this exact topic has been tread so many times you could pour all my posts into a very large hat (probably a stetson), stick your hand in, swish it around, pull one out, read it aloud and there's an 80% chance it starts with something like "the RP designations and the identity of manuel-"

the truth is that most of the time adminning a highpop round is like trying to gently steer a burning cruise liner into port. shit was already fucked before you entered the room, and there's very little you can do to bring it back under control.

the only time i'd consider manuel matching a "vision" is when i turn up at roundstart, admin enabled, taking control of the round like picard stepping onto the bridge of the enterprise. all dynamic switched off. full DM mode, rolling antags when narratively appropriate, giving them custom objectives, communicating with them as IC entities to guide their missions, and doing the same for the crew to make the world seem interactive outside of antag-driven interactions. an engaged centcom presence for command is also vital.

that's a lot of plates to spin, and i have the energy to do it to that extent maybe 3 times a week if i'm lucky.

i see this as ultimately less of an issue where the game's automated systems and people's ability to self police is lacking, but rather that, as an extension of the ongoing over-arching dynamic conversation, there is a portion of the manuel playerbase that is feeling the lack of curated and personalized roleplay from the world itself that isn't just driven by antaggery and mechanics. what this requires is 2 things: admin attention, and enough downtime in the round to do it in.

however, if this thread truly is about a very specific situation, then rather than tweaking policy around that situation, i personally believe it to be more productive to just address the situation itself, whatever that merits: appeals, feedback, complaints, etc.

[RedBaronFlyer]

I've long held that Manuel is LRP with MRP characteristics, even saying that though, the whole "roleplay" tag is absolutely meaningless. Ask 20 "MRP" players what MRP entails, and you'll get 48 different answers. I will say after playing LRP, MRP, and HRP, MRP tends to be the "big tent" of the three where you have the most diverse range of playstyles/mindsets. MRP has always been the one of the three server types that tends to get the most criticism. LRP criticizes it for being too strict, HRP criticizes it for not being strict enough.

Friend cliques are a thing, but I would say, by and large, they aren't as much of an issue as people make out. There definitely are friend groups, I'm not denying that, but I haven't seen new players get denied because they aren't part of the friend team. I haven't really noticed any more or less friend groups then when I played on Goon or Fulp, or even Skyrat (skyrat was probably the most cliquey from my experience) On the contrary, I tend to find new players welcomed pretty warmly. I never really felt as sense of being an "outsider" other than when I was a new player and a chef started wailing on me because I was behind the bar as an assistant but they stopped when the barkeep was yelling that I was there to learn, and they apologized for it.

Roleplay standards definitely ebb and flow over time. summer break/holidays tend to be real rough in terms of roleplay quality, but the time of day and day of the week can change it as well. Fridays on Manuel tend to range from business as usual to absolute chaos. As Constellado said, a lot of people will roleplay back with you if you roleplay first. Some people play Manuel like it's LRP and will wordlessly pilfer your department for donkpockets, some people will roleplay everything, and some people tend to be in the middle. Server culture is a constantly changing thing that's impossible to pin unless you have a legal document worth of rules and a legion of admins/moderators enforcing everything all the time. Some stuff is pretty easy to enforce such as quickly stamping out any instances of people being sexually creepy or bigoted, but it's a lot harder to keep tabs on someone for having "poor roleplay" unless their solution to IC slights is to bash someone's head in with the nearest toolbox.

The QC is something that some have pushed for but my issue is that what qualifies as "good" roleplay will dramatically differ from person to person, admin to admin. It's like how Manuel has a wide range of views on what is considered "fair play" some players won't ever round remove people, and some even make sure their murder targets are able to be found, others see no issue with decapitating someone and tucking their brain inside a crate in some part of the station no one ever goes. I can't really comment on some of the stuff you are talking about but yeah, people can be pretty shitty sometimes.

It does feel like some players tend to join MRP just to troll or whatnot but it tends to get noticed eventually. It usually results in them cleaning up their act or getting the boot.

[Higgin]

[very well-put snip about how no plan survives contact with the players (not a bad thing imo!) ties back into that freedom/creativity]

i see this as ultimately less of an issue where the game's automated systems and people's ability to self police is lacking, but rather that, as an extension of the ongoing over-arching dynamic conversation, there is a portion of the manuel playerbase that is feeling the lack of curated and personalized roleplay from the world itself that isn't just driven by antaggery and mechanics. what this requires is 2 things: admin attention, and enough downtime in the round to do it in.

I very much like that stuff. I think a lot of on-station rp really does need a touch from the outside world to "come to life" and not just be interpersonal headcanon and vibes.

My perspective has been that some of the frustration seems to come from antaggery and mechanics dominating the space where people might rather there be something else. The admin attention they're asking for would be to prune and regulate the antagonism where it's not compatible with that downtime or the game they're out to play, a negative role to the current setup, rather than necessarily even take the positive, strapped-in, GM Zen role you described

how do you get more downtime (or make it more felt) for people who want it, when they want it, if you do? assuming either there are or aren't admins turning all the knobs manually, part of that has to go back to self-policing and dynamic, i'd figure, but you also mentioned that it's only part of the current manny crowd -

a lot of folks are happy with it as-is, in spite of occasionally damned expectations, and player #s seem to bear that out.

is that because the expectation has shifted down to what rbf mentioned as "LRP with MRP characteristics" over time, or was it always more recently such? i've heard a lot of people say manny today feels more like sibyl than itself used to

however, if this thread truly is about a very specific situation, then rather than tweaking policy around that situation, i personally believe it to be more productive to just address the situation itself, whatever that merits: appeals, feedback, complaints, etc.

the proximate cause was a specific situation, but it's one that happens enough and so broadly as to be general beyond one player and admin - I think we're here because a lot of it really isn't actionable, though I don't know if it was ever ruled on or pursued through those channels at the time

[dendydoom]

the proximate cause was a specific situation, but it's one that happens enough and so broadly as to be general beyond one player and admin - I think we're here because a lot of it really isn't actionable, though I don't know if it was ever ruled on or pursued through those channels at the time

i honestly have no idea what this situation is, so apologies if this was not helpful input in that context - i have a sort of sixth sense for when a policy thread alludes to a very specific situation, but it's becoming apparent that this isn't entirely the case. moving on:

i think that it's a futile experiment to try and pin down any concrete identity for manuel - it is, i believe, merely a manifestation of its participants. what we try to do with the "MRP" stamp is to trick players into a productive and collaborative headspace that will be conducive to more thoughtful and slower paced rounds. the intention behind this is to allow more time to explore situations (the roleplay, as it were,) with more nuance involved than simply responding to mechanical stimuli in turn. in truth, we are at the total mercy of the player's willingness to co-operate with this intended mindset. it is, sorry to say, mostly just smoke and mirrors. the more you try to underpin what makes MRP into MRP, the more you realize how impossible it is to actually enforce that fantasy in a way that creates a fun, compelling and open environment for collaborative and improvisational storytelling. at the root of it all, if the player doesn't want to do it, then you are making sacrifices to be able to try and twist their arm into playing along. the middle ground we have found for ourselves is in the extended ruleset - mostly a combination of extra rules around conflict, rough sweeping standards for RP expectations for authoritative roles, and more power to admins to be able to step in when reoccurring gimmicks and trends overstay their welcome.

the tone of manuel shifts constantly. the manuel of 6 months ago is not the manuel of today. and the manuel in 6 months from now will not be the manuel of today. there are good and bad aspects of this: no one group dictates what the server is about or what people should utilize the space for, it restricts the ability to gatekeep, and in doing so allows very open and creative interpretations of roles and rounds by its participants. however, as many manuellites know, that freedom can give way to people who are only out to reap the rewards of the sandbox for their own benefit. selfish play is still problematic, and requires active admins to monitor it.

with regards to giving people space to explore these lower-intensity scenarios, i don't think there's any one-size-fits-all solution to this. i mentioned prior that manuel has had a long lineage of incredible statics that really do pull the server up by its bootstraps when they're around. people are enthused by their presence and reflect the effort they put into their own gameplay. this, to me, is the platinum solution to the issue. players just enjoying the game, enjoying being part of their community, and enjoying creating fun stories for each other. that sort of positivity is infectious.

alternatively, there is the crunchier side behind the veil of adminship and code where, in my experience, it's quite clear that dynamic is a lot more impactful on the "tone" of manuel than perhaps other servers. there is only so much tolerance a crew has before all order breaks down, and under the weight of dynamic i think this happens much sooner than later as compared to older systems like gamemodes. my own personal solution to this is to simply remove threat from the round when i'm going to be active as an admin. a human pilot is a much better judge of pacing and dramatic timing than a script that fires off randomly. people like to see cause and effect: for example, under my purview, if i see someone arrested who seems like a suitable candidate for some syndicate brainwashing, i will extend a deal to them to join the syndicate via secret radio comms to try and cut a deal with them: freedom for employment, or something similar. this creates a narrative with clearly defined motivations and is a response to an actual IC inciting incident that set it off in the first place.

so, really, to sum it up, the dendydoom school of thought around mrp is: empower good players to run their section to the benefit of everyone under them, inhabit the role of the world as much as possible from the grand to the small-scale and mundane to respond to people's inputs, create meaning from chaos so that it posits the existence of a substantive, player-run narrative that characters can feel they're able to have a meaningful impact on, and perhaps think about ripping threat out by the roots when you join the round as an admin.

this is of course not the be-all-end-all of what i think MRP is and how it should be cultivated, but these are effective tools i've found through my time that have given positive results.

[8bot]

Server-specific bans aren't really necessary but server-specific admins should 110% be a thing.
An admin who primarily does MRP should not be allowed to hop onto LRP and ban people or try to turn LRP into MRP-lite.
The inverse does not happen because LRP players and admins (historically in the latter case since they've all disappeared) don't want anything to do with MRP.

[Cheshify]

Server Specific Bans and Server Specific Admins are awful ideas, I have no interest in further separating a community that has no good reason to be split in the first place. It's insulting to imply that either server is "better" than the other and needs bans specific to it, and even more insulting to imply that admins who prefer LRP servers can't wrap their heads around our relatively sparse MRP rules (and vice versa).

[Cheshify]

Meta-cliques/closed door roleplay

There is no clear policy solution for this, people just need to learn to be more inclusive and admins can smack metagroups if they become overbearing / give the players an advantage.

No QC

As I said in the above post, I don't believe in MRP specific bans just because it places MRP on a pedestal as needing to be protected. It's my personal belief that someone acting out like an NRP shitter on Manuel shouldn't be "demoted" to LRP like it's a downgrade instead of a different experience. Even if I did agree with it, we can't do anything because code issue.