A better twohanded item system.

[paprika]

Twohanded, heavy objects, guns you can't fire without holding them with both hands. All of these things are wrapped up in random different systems that could be combined into one.

I proposed a better system some time ago, and now with the new 'alerts' system, I believe potential for player feedback with this feature is possible.

Basically, a lot of twohanded weapons have a 'wield' state that you enable by activating the item which switches the mob sprite and in some cases ups the damage. In other cases, you can't even use the item without wielding it (defib paddles).

I propose a new system of hand restrictions that goes as follows:

Twohanded-mandatory items: You must have two free hands to hold a super-heavy item (Gibtonite, heavy parts) or you can't pick it up. This is the most simple style of heavy objects and will be standardized for other large items with better feedback.

Twohanded-optional items: A heavy item that can be held with one hand will be in a 'debuffed' state if your other hand isn't empty.

Bad concept art:



Essentially, everything will work the same, except there will be a check for your offhand when picking up a twohanded-optional item, that will buff it and change the mob sprite if your offhand is free. The fireaxe does more damage when wielded, so it will do more damage and have an alternate mob sprite if your offhand is free.

Defib paddles will be automatically useable if your other hand is free, rather than having to wield them.

Two-handed rifles (assault rifles, grenade launchers, LMGS) will be usable with one hand, but you will experience recoil when shooting them and possible shot deviation.

Large guns (miniguns, etc) that are too heavy to even aim will require both hands to carry or you won't be able to shoot it. Essentially, you'd be able to carry it with one hand using the carry handle or under your arm, but since both hands won't be holding it up, no hand would be on the trigger.

You'd still be able to pump shotguns with one hand like the terminator, don't worry.

[Wyzack]

Can we have a two hand sprite for shotguns anyways? I wanna be an operator and holding a shotgun in one hand is kinda silly

[Zilenan91]

Could probably do it like Colonial Marines does it and make it so if you click a weapon in your hand you dual-wield it and there's a weapon tab that lets you unload it and do other stuff

[confused rock]

Could probably do it like Colonial Marines does it and make it so if you click a weapon in your hand you dual-wield it and there's a weapon tab that lets you unload it and do other stuff

fuck no reloading with that is horrid keep it how kinetic accelerators work

[Topham]

I'm confused, how would switching between wielded and unwielded states be handled? Would two-handed optional items be assumed to be wielded until you pick something up with your other hand? is the state of wieldedness decided upon picking things up and, if so, does that mean you have to drop your weapon and pick it back up to change its state of wieldedness?

Could probably do it like Colonial Marines does it and make it so if you click a weapon in your hand you dual-wield it and there's a weapon tab that lets you unload it and do other stuff

tabs are clunky and shitty and i feel like we need to encourage moving away from adding more tab-based shit

[lumipharon]

Good suggestion.

Essentially Pap is making a system where you use the improved 'two handed' grip on certain items by checking if your other hand is free, rather than the current setup where you have to spend time and clicks wielding and unwielding shit.
This is a very logical change that simply removes tedious clicking - +1 for neato quality of life improvement, as well as useful gamebalance change.

Will need to consider certain balance things - ie: e-shields for nuke ops will be significantly weaker, depending on how severe the penalty is for using their guns one handed.

[paprika]

Yeah this system would be really easily expanded, code-wise, to other items too. Items like shields would remain the same one-handed, but they could be buffed if you had them in two hands or covering more of yourself.

Two-handing eswords or claymores is another good example.

[Topham]

but what about switching between wielding and unwielding? does it happen automatically when you try to pick something up with the other hand?

[paprika]

Yes. The only potential downside is not being able to use weapons one-handed when your other hand is free but the idea is that there would be no reason to.

[Luke Cox]

Good suggestion.

Essentially Pap is making a system where you use the improved 'two handed' grip on certain items by checking if your other hand is free, rather than the current setup where you have to spend time and clicks wielding and unwielding shit.
This is a very logical change that simply removes tedious clicking - +1 for neato quality of life improvement, as well as useful gamebalance change.

Will need to consider certain balance things - ie: e-shields for nuke ops will be significantly weaker, depending on how severe the penalty is for using their guns one handed.

Could it be argued that the awkwardness of items like the fire axe is a deliberate feature meant to balance out their strength?

[paprika]

Never a good excuse.

[lumipharon]

Good suggestion.

Essentially Pap is making a system where you use the improved 'two handed' grip on certain items by checking if your other hand is free, rather than the current setup where you have to spend time and clicks wielding and unwielding shit.
This is a very logical change that simply removes tedious clicking - +1 for neato quality of life improvement, as well as useful gamebalance change.

Will need to consider certain balance things - ie: e-shields for nuke ops will be significantly weaker, depending on how severe the penalty is for using their guns one handed.

Could it be argued that the awkwardness of items like the fire axe is a deliberate feature meant to balance out their strength?

Not really - in a combat situation there is zero reason to unwield an axe, unless someone drops a gun or some shit. Same with other weapons.
At best it would let you stunbaton and axe someone to death like 1/2 second faster, but that's about it.

but what about switching between wielding and unwielding? does it happen automatically when you try to pick something up with the other hand?

From what I understand wielding won't be a thing anymore - it's simply "do you have your other hand free?" if yes, you get the 'wielded' stats/sprite/whatever, if your other hand is not free, then you get the 'non wielded' stats/sprite/whatever.

[Remie Richards]

Lumi that would still be governed by the weapon being in a "Wielded state", it's just (as you said earlier) the clicks to trigger it are gone.
All I see from this is that it's a little more usable, not amazingly better or anything but certainly something worth doing.