Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
- Istoprocent1
- Joined: Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:14 pm
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Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
At the moment, anybody with a few items can craft a makeshift shotgun and print unlimited ammo in the cargo as well as order unlimited supplies of ballistic weaponry from cargo.
For the game to have paranoia in it, the defender (non-antagonist), has to be at a disadvantage (ie. they don't know that the antag has a stechkin and antag knowing that they don't have a sawn-off riot shotgun in their backpack fnr).
All sorts of high damage and easily concealable weapons should be distinct traitor items - energy dagger, stechkin, revolver, ling armblade etc, not something literally every crewmember has "just in case" - cakehat, sawn-off shotgun etc.
If a weapon fits in the backpack and can deal close to or more damage than traitor gear, then there is a problem - why bother getting traitor gear, when you can get a "legal" weapon that works as well. If you get caught with a stechkin, you get lynched, while most of the times if you get caught with a sawn-off shotgun nobody bats an eye.
tl;dr - remove ballistic and high damage concealable weapons from the hands of regular crew (including bartender and detective). Give them disablers instead. With disablers there are counterplay options, getting shot once with a slug ends your antag round 9 out of 10 times, because there is no way to heal that damage in combat.
For the game to have paranoia in it, the defender (non-antagonist), has to be at a disadvantage (ie. they don't know that the antag has a stechkin and antag knowing that they don't have a sawn-off riot shotgun in their backpack fnr).
All sorts of high damage and easily concealable weapons should be distinct traitor items - energy dagger, stechkin, revolver, ling armblade etc, not something literally every crewmember has "just in case" - cakehat, sawn-off shotgun etc.
If a weapon fits in the backpack and can deal close to or more damage than traitor gear, then there is a problem - why bother getting traitor gear, when you can get a "legal" weapon that works as well. If you get caught with a stechkin, you get lynched, while most of the times if you get caught with a sawn-off shotgun nobody bats an eye.
tl;dr - remove ballistic and high damage concealable weapons from the hands of regular crew (including bartender and detective). Give them disablers instead. With disablers there are counterplay options, getting shot once with a slug ends your antag round 9 out of 10 times, because there is no way to heal that damage in combat.
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
so what do you suggest? sawn off shotguns have an higher aim penality?
- Istoprocent1
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
Im suggesting the removal of shotguns from civilian hands entirely - cannot make them with a pipe, cannot order them via cargo. At most have a few in the armory, but even better would be if the game for non-antags moved towards energy weapons only.Tlaltecuhtli wrote:so what do you suggest? sawn off shotguns have an higher aim penality?
- Arathian
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
That is a terrible idea krok, I mean come on.
Printing unlimited ammo from any lathe is stupid, I agree. But ordering guns, ammo etc should absolutely be a thing. That's part of ss13 and it should be up to the captain/security to stop it if they don't like it (with whatever consequences trying to disarm cargonia carries).
This is "remove the clown because the noise annoys me"-tier suggestion.
Printing unlimited ammo from any lathe is stupid, I agree. But ordering guns, ammo etc should absolutely be a thing. That's part of ss13 and it should be up to the captain/security to stop it if they don't like it (with whatever consequences trying to disarm cargonia carries).
This is "remove the clown because the noise annoys me"-tier suggestion.
Iron, blood and spider armies
- Istoprocent1
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
I can see your point of view.Arathian wrote:That is a terrible idea krok, I mean come on.
Printing unlimited ammo from any lathe is stupid, I agree. But ordering guns, ammo etc should absolutely be a thing. That's part of ss13 and it should be up to the captain/security to stop it if they don't like it (with whatever consequences trying to disarm cargonia carries).
This is "remove the clown because the noise annoys me"-tier suggestion.
Ordering guns would be still optional, but they would be standard army issue laser rifles, disablers and/or maybe keep bulky mosin (slow rate of fire, cannot be hidden) as an option.
If everybody is armed to the teeth and most of them can easily get better weapons than you with your "syndicate connection", then the game becomes more of a RDM with no incentive to make things interesting.
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- Anonmare
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
Remember when R&D could print off SMGs and we removed that because it was dumb?
- Qbopper
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
I would legitimately be surprised if people remembered this or knew about itAnonmare wrote:Remember when R&D could print off SMGs and we removed that because it was dumb?
Limey wrote:its too late.
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
As a compromise, you could make improvised shotguns have a chance to blow up in your hand(s) when fired, sort of like a .38 revolver that's been modified to fire .357 rounds.
I don't really see this as that much of a problem, though, simply because I don't see people make/use improvised shotguns very often. It helps that they're a bit clunky to use and are a bit of a bitch to craft.
I don't really see this as that much of a problem, though, simply because I don't see people make/use improvised shotguns very often. It helps that they're a bit clunky to use and are a bit of a bitch to craft.
- Flatulent
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
oh look another security buff we like those a lot
if you want to nerf projectile weaponry for the crew, nerf ammunition abundance. make ammo unprintable anywhere but sec lathe and nerf self-made shells
if you want to nerf projectile weaponry for the crew, nerf ammunition abundance. make ammo unprintable anywhere but sec lathe and nerf self-made shells
Mothblocks, winter 2020, “successfully” preventing bagil death with relevant data wrote:You seem to be under the fallacy that reinforcing that Bagil is a TDM shithole where you must carry bolas and spears on you at all times, while looking for the next valid to hunt down is a positive change to the server. I don't. The data suggests other people don't.
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- CPTANT
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
"Another"? I recall only security nerfs the last year. Their taser got removed, baton got nerfed and flashbangs were nerfed.Flatulent wrote:oh look another security buff we like those a lot
if you want to nerf projectile weaponry for the crew, nerf ammunition abundance. make ammo unprintable anywhere but sec lathe and nerf self-made shells
Timberpoes wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 3:21 pm The rules exist to create the biggest possible chance of a cool shift of SS13. They don't exist to allow admins to create the most boring interpretation of SS13.
- Flatulent
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
armor was buffed against disablersCPTANT wrote:"Another"? I recall only security nerfs the last year. Their taser got removed, baton got nerfed and flashbangs were nerfed.Flatulent wrote:oh look another security buff we like those a lot
if you want to nerf projectile weaponry for the crew, nerf ammunition abundance. make ammo unprintable anywhere but sec lathe and nerf self-made shells
Mothblocks, winter 2020, “successfully” preventing bagil death with relevant data wrote:You seem to be under the fallacy that reinforcing that Bagil is a TDM shithole where you must carry bolas and spears on you at all times, while looking for the next valid to hunt down is a positive change to the server. I don't. The data suggests other people don't.
imsxz wrote:I give up there’s too many furries
cacogen wrote:i asked oranges how often he plays and he deleted the post
cybersaber101 wrote:Welp, you guys let a terrymin become a headmin, thousand years of darkness.
Vekter wrote:I jerk off Nist a bit too much but he's honestly one of the best silicon players on the server. B.O.R.G.O. is also pretty good.
- PKPenguin321
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
remember when we briefly considered giving every crewmember a gunAnonmare wrote:Remember when R&D could print off SMGs and we removed that because it was dumb?
i play Lauser McMauligan. clown name is Cold-Ass Honkey
i have three other top secret characters as well.
tell the best admin how good he is
i have three other top secret characters as well.
tell the best admin how good he is
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- CPTANT
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
Hardly a buff that securities main weapon is worse against armour now.Flatulent wrote:armor was buffed against disablersCPTANT wrote:"Another"? I recall only security nerfs the last year. Their taser got removed, baton got nerfed and flashbangs were nerfed.Flatulent wrote:oh look another security buff we like those a lot
if you want to nerf projectile weaponry for the crew, nerf ammunition abundance. make ammo unprintable anywhere but sec lathe and nerf self-made shells
Timberpoes wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 3:21 pm The rules exist to create the biggest possible chance of a cool shift of SS13. They don't exist to allow admins to create the most boring interpretation of SS13.
- Flatulent
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
having armor makes non-sec/heads valid so you use lethals insteadCPTANT wrote:Hardly a buff that securities main weapon is worse against armour now.Flatulent wrote:armor was buffed against disablersCPTANT wrote:"Another"? I recall only security nerfs the last year. Their taser got removed, baton got nerfed and flashbangs were nerfed.Flatulent wrote:oh look another security buff we like those a lot
if you want to nerf projectile weaponry for the crew, nerf ammunition abundance. make ammo unprintable anywhere but sec lathe and nerf self-made shells
Mothblocks, winter 2020, “successfully” preventing bagil death with relevant data wrote:You seem to be under the fallacy that reinforcing that Bagil is a TDM shithole where you must carry bolas and spears on you at all times, while looking for the next valid to hunt down is a positive change to the server. I don't. The data suggests other people don't.
imsxz wrote:I give up there’s too many furries
cacogen wrote:i asked oranges how often he plays and he deleted the post
cybersaber101 wrote:Welp, you guys let a terrymin become a headmin, thousand years of darkness.
Vekter wrote:I jerk off Nist a bit too much but he's honestly one of the best silicon players on the server. B.O.R.G.O. is also pretty good.
- Anonmare
- Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2015 8:59 pm
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
Remember when we replaced tasers with m1911's with rubber bullets?PKPenguin321 wrote:remember when we briefly considered giving every crewmember a gunAnonmare wrote:Remember when R&D could print off SMGs and we removed that because it was dumb?
- oranges
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
i'm not opposed to removing the makeshift shotgun
I don't know how to fix the shotguns absurd opness easily, probably by making it twohanded.
I don't know how to fix the shotguns absurd opness easily, probably by making it twohanded.
- Nalzul
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
Limit ammo rather than guns. In any apocalyptic survival game it's always ammo you conserve, not the weapons. Makeshift bullets can still be crafted but just make them explode in your face a la det 357. If you really wanted to go a step further make it so ammo can only be bought, giving a reason for security to actually care about cargo, and utilize their defense budget.
- NoxVS
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
It already kinda is, one empty hand is needed to fire it.oranges wrote:i'm not opposed to removing the makeshift shotgun
I don't know how to fix the shotguns absurd opness easily, probably by making it twohanded.
The weak should fear the strong
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
I was going to suggest this, but thankfully I read the whole thread first. Making it like a 25% chance to misfire would definitely reduce their usage without removing the option entirely, and stay in line with the spirit of an improvised weapon.ATHATH wrote:As a compromise, you could make improvised shotguns have a chance to blow up in your hand(s) when fired, sort of like a .38 revolver that's been modified to fire .357 rounds.
I'd also suggest moving buckshot and techshot rounds from the hacked autolathe to the security lathe, so that the only public rounds available are slugs and rubbershot. This would - again - still keep some power in the hands of the crew, but make them have to work harder for more lethal options, while keeping the lethal methods available for legitimate use.
Galatians 4:16 "Have I now become your enemy by telling you the truth?"
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
Increasing armor effectiveness would do wonders for limiting how powerful buckshot is as well.oranges wrote:i'm not opposed to removing the makeshift shotgun
I don't know how to fix the shotguns absurd opness easily, probably by making it twohanded.
If you want to make the makeshift shotgun less of a threat I would give it a chance to fucking explode like the zip gun does on goon, at least when using non-makeshift ammo. This would make it similar to the detectives revolver in that if you want the powerful ammo you got to risk blowing your own ass up.
- Critawakets
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Re: Limit Crew's Access to (Projectile) Weapons
Actually look at development and play the game when talking about balance you must.Nalzul wrote:utilize their defense budget.
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