Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
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- Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2016 6:31 pm
- Byond Username: DrBee
Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
I enjoy the inclusion of moths to the station.
In the dubious lore Nanotrasen is known to use cheap non-human labor, angering the human only syndicates, plus with sci-fi having various alien life forms is a trope of the genre that I think can be fleshed out more.
I was brainstorming different race types when, thinking about what type of life forms we dont currently have. We dont have round start plant based life-forms or round start mineral based life forms, and in thinking about that, I remembered we DO have Golems and Pod-people as in-round races.
It would make sense for Pod-people, golems, and to a lesser extent slime people that survive rounds to continue their employment on nanotrasen stations, so adding them as round start races would be an easy enough thing to do.
However all three of those races are more powerful than humans, which means they CANT be round start races.
So, why not nerf the hell out of them, or make nerfed versions of them, to let people start as slime people scientists or pod people botanists.
I have some ideas as to how this can be done, also other changes to the non-human races to make them more unique, especially medically, and I would love if other people would also share any ideas they may have, especially as to how the three races mentioned earlier can be brought down to round-start worthy levels of power.
In the dubious lore Nanotrasen is known to use cheap non-human labor, angering the human only syndicates, plus with sci-fi having various alien life forms is a trope of the genre that I think can be fleshed out more.
I was brainstorming different race types when, thinking about what type of life forms we dont currently have. We dont have round start plant based life-forms or round start mineral based life forms, and in thinking about that, I remembered we DO have Golems and Pod-people as in-round races.
It would make sense for Pod-people, golems, and to a lesser extent slime people that survive rounds to continue their employment on nanotrasen stations, so adding them as round start races would be an easy enough thing to do.
However all three of those races are more powerful than humans, which means they CANT be round start races.
So, why not nerf the hell out of them, or make nerfed versions of them, to let people start as slime people scientists or pod people botanists.
I have some ideas as to how this can be done, also other changes to the non-human races to make them more unique, especially medically, and I would love if other people would also share any ideas they may have, especially as to how the three races mentioned earlier can be brought down to round-start worthy levels of power.
- cedarbridge
- Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 12:24 am
- Byond Username: Cedarbridge
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
I'd rather we kept the classic transformation races as transformation races so that the remain a reward for doing your job. It loses a lot of that reward potential (and requires a nerf) to force them into roundstart meme status. Not worth it.Dr_bee wrote:I enjoy the inclusion of moths to the station.
In the dubious lore Nanotrasen is known to use cheap non-human labor, angering the human only syndicates, plus with sci-fi having various alien life forms is a trope of the genre that I think can be fleshed out more.
I was brainstorming different race types when, thinking about what type of life forms we dont currently have. We dont have round start plant based life-forms or round start mineral based life forms, and in thinking about that, I remembered we DO have Golems and Pod-people as in-round races.
It would make sense for Pod-people, golems, and to a lesser extent slime people that survive rounds to continue their employment on nanotrasen stations, so adding them as round start races would be an easy enough thing to do.
However all three of those races are more powerful than humans, which means they CANT be round start races.
So, why not nerf the hell out of them, or make nerfed versions of them, to let people start as slime people scientists or pod people botanists.
I have some ideas as to how this can be done, also other changes to the non-human races to make them more unique, especially medically, and I would love if other people would also share any ideas they may have, especially as to how the three races mentioned earlier can be brought down to round-start worthy levels of power.
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- Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2016 6:31 pm
- Byond Username: DrBee
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
Slime People
Slime people are an easy enough change, they already have considerable disadvantages when compared to normal humans if you remove the splitting power.
So why not just do that, roundstart slime people would just be normal slime people without the splitting power. The splitting power can be unlocked via mutation toxin in xenobiology as normal.
The only possible other problem with roundstart slime people would be their resistance to non-cold based burn damage, but considering they take 4x as much damage from cold that might be a strength worth keeping.
Slime people are an easy enough change, they already have considerable disadvantages when compared to normal humans if you remove the splitting power.
So why not just do that, roundstart slime people would just be normal slime people without the splitting power. The splitting power can be unlocked via mutation toxin in xenobiology as normal.
The only possible other problem with roundstart slime people would be their resistance to non-cold based burn damage, but considering they take 4x as much damage from cold that might be a strength worth keeping.
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- Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2016 6:31 pm
- Byond Username: DrBee
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
Pod People
A much harder race to balance considering their healing over time.
That needs to go.
My other suggestion is to make them medically completely different from humans.
They should have unique blood, and normal healing chemicals should have no effect on them at all.
They should probably not be able to eat as well, outside of liquids. Nutriment would become a slow healing chem to them, but only if it is in liquid or pill form, they cant actually digest anything.
Healing can be done via botany fertilizers or plain nutriment, and should be considerably slower than other life forms. Nutrition should be linked to light like it currently is.
It would make for interesting gameplay for medical and bring podpeople's power down a few notches.
A much harder race to balance considering their healing over time.
That needs to go.
My other suggestion is to make them medically completely different from humans.
They should have unique blood, and normal healing chemicals should have no effect on them at all.
They should probably not be able to eat as well, outside of liquids. Nutriment would become a slow healing chem to them, but only if it is in liquid or pill form, they cant actually digest anything.
Healing can be done via botany fertilizers or plain nutriment, and should be considerably slower than other life forms. Nutrition should be linked to light like it currently is.
It would make for interesting gameplay for medical and bring podpeople's power down a few notches.
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- Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2016 6:31 pm
- Byond Username: DrBee
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
Golems
Trying to round-start golems is going to be difficult. So a new golem type should be made, and have that be round start.
Call them elder golems or something, bullshit lore that golems get more brittle with age.
This can be an excuse to remove alot of their armor, their space-proof ability, and possibly allowing them to wear more than nothing at all.
Golem medicine should also be changed, it makes no sense for styptic powder to heal a creature with no blood.
So golems would not get healed by healing chemicals, and would need mineral based chemicals to heal, and slowly.
Iron, aluminum, silicon and the like would heal. rarer minerals like uranium, gold, and silver would heal faster.
The slowdown would obviously stay.
Trying to round-start golems is going to be difficult. So a new golem type should be made, and have that be round start.
Call them elder golems or something, bullshit lore that golems get more brittle with age.
This can be an excuse to remove alot of their armor, their space-proof ability, and possibly allowing them to wear more than nothing at all.
Golem medicine should also be changed, it makes no sense for styptic powder to heal a creature with no blood.
So golems would not get healed by healing chemicals, and would need mineral based chemicals to heal, and slowly.
Iron, aluminum, silicon and the like would heal. rarer minerals like uranium, gold, and silver would heal faster.
The slowdown would obviously stay.
- Gratian
- Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2017 6:38 pm
- Byond Username: Pdgamer
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
This is how you bring in furries.
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- Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2016 6:31 pm
- Byond Username: DrBee
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
I fail to see how plant and mineral based life forms, which is part of the whole sci-fi thing, would bring in furries.Gratian wrote:This is how you bring in furries.
- Screemonster
- Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2014 7:23 pm
- Byond Username: Scree
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
if you refused to include anything because somebody somewhere had a fetish for it you'd have to remove everything
even the floor tiles thanks to that one tile patterns guy on 4chan
even the floor tiles thanks to that one tile patterns guy on 4chan
- DemonFiren
- Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2014 9:15 pm
- Byond Username: DemonFiren
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
remove all roundstart races but humans and lizards
remove all non-roundstart races but podpeople, flies and golems
remove all non-roundstart races but podpeople, flies and golems
- D&B
- Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2016 2:23 am
- Byond Username: Repukan
- Location: *teleports behind you*
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
Give them an inch and they want to take a mile
Spoiler:
- kevinz000
- Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2014 8:41 am
- Byond Username: Kevinz000
- Github Username: kevinz000
- Location: Dorm Room 3
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
D&B wrote:Give them an inch and they want to take a mile
Local catgirl scratching post - Shezza
Usually seen as Skylar Lineman/Mekhi Anderson.
Commissions way too much art...
https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic ... 7&p=239075 - IN GAME ADMINISTRATOR
Usually seen as Skylar Lineman/Mekhi Anderson.
Commissions way too much art...
https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic ... 7&p=239075 - IN GAME ADMINISTRATOR
NSFW:
- BeeSting12
- Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2016 1:11 am
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- Location: 'Murica
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
This must be the slippery slope I hear so much about.
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- Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2014 12:23 am
- Byond Username: Kromgar
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
Slippery Slope is a type of fallacy but slippery slopes can happen
Planet Station Best Station
Vote Planetstation and Kor Phaeron 2017
Vote Planetstation and Kor Phaeron 2017
- SpaceInaba
- Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2016 1:03 pm
- Byond Username: SpaceInaba
- Location: everyone's favorite sjw
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
1) the furries are already here
2) no please we dont need any more roundstart races for people to start drama over
2) no please we dont need any more roundstart races for people to start drama over
Spoiler:
- iamgoofball
- Github User
- Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 5:50 pm
- Byond Username: Iamgoofball
- Github Username: Iamgoofball
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
SLIPPERY SLOPE
- Nilons
- Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2016 5:38 pm
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- Location: Canada
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
/BeeSting12 wrote:This must be the slippery slope I hear so much about.
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- Joined: Sun Dec 11, 2016 6:19 am
- Byond Username: Reondin
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
1. No
2. No
3. Carpians, Vox and Dullahans are next in line.
2. No
3. Carpians, Vox and Dullahans are next in line.
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- Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2016 6:31 pm
- Byond Username: DrBee
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
Well an aquatic lifeform would be neat, I was hoping that crab people idea would actually get implemented as it would tick the aquatic creature and non-human form creature sci-fi race boxes.CosmicScientist wrote:Carpe diem are next?
- Qbopper
- Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:34 pm
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Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
can we make a PR for real life that causes users to burst into flame when they try to claim that something will "bring furries" or whatever along those lines
Limey wrote:its too late.
- SpaceInaba
- Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2016 1:03 pm
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- Location: everyone's favorite sjw
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
lets just ban all non furries so nobody will ever complain
Spoiler:
- Qbopper
- Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:34 pm
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- Github Username: Qbopper
- Location: Canada
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
now the question is "what constitutes a furry"SpaceInaba wrote:lets just ban all non furries so nobody will ever complain
Limey wrote:its too late.
- SpaceInaba
- Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2016 1:03 pm
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- Location: everyone's favorite sjw
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
meQbopper wrote:now the question is "what constitutes a furry"SpaceInaba wrote:lets just ban all non furries so nobody will ever complain
Spoiler:
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- Joined: Sat Nov 11, 2017 11:11 am
- Byond Username: Serpentarium
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
Let's add mi go as playable race and nerf humans.To show their misery before otherwordly overlords
- UltimateGamer21
- Joined: Fri Feb 09, 2018 11:05 pm
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Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
I think OP's brain got nerfed on his way to the Submit Post button
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- Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2016 6:31 pm
- Byond Username: DrBee
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
I was hoping for actual constructive criticism or ideas, but I guess I was naive to think that this wouldnt become more than a hut thread outside the hut.
- NanookoftheNorth
- Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2017 11:14 pm
- Byond Username: NanookoftehNorth
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
I didn't add any input because I personally think that the current meta is good with those races as goals instead of standard. One would need to add in extra races for those goals instead, and as not to associate with stereotypes.Dr_bee wrote:I was hoping for actual constructive criticism or ideas, but I guess I was naive to think that this wouldnt become more than a hut thread outside the hut.
I like the progression for plant people as it is, for example. If lets say the cloning pod goes down, start growing people instead. One time my friend was chaplain and worshipped plants. He killed himself and was reborn as a pod person. Everyone started to kill themselves to become pod people with his plant cult. Eventually the command staff was getting nervous about an uprising of the plant people, and started escalating the situation, attempting to stop the plant people. Before you knew it, they killed some of the command staff and reborn them as plant people.
If plant people were available from the beginning, a fun story like this wouldn't be possible. Nerfing existing items is difficult to get traction for, especially due to the fear of furries and the like. You'll need to make a more compelling argument to do so other than only to add races to an already large lineup.
Love, your favorite forum poster, Jenna Tills
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- Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2016 6:31 pm
- Byond Username: DrBee
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
This is the kind of conversation I am asking for, thank you.NanookoftheNorth wrote:I didn't add any input because I personally think that the current meta is good with those races as goals instead of standard. One would need to add in extra races for those goals instead, and as not to associate with stereotypes.Dr_bee wrote:I was hoping for actual constructive criticism or ideas, but I guess I was naive to think that this wouldnt become more than a hut thread outside the hut.
I like the progression for plant people as it is, for example. If lets say the cloning pod goes down, start growing people instead. One time my friend was chaplain and worshipped plants. He killed himself and was reborn as a pod person. Everyone started to kill themselves to become pod people with his plant cult. Eventually the command staff was getting nervous about an uprising of the plant people, and started escalating the situation, attempting to stop the plant people. Before you knew it, they killed some of the command staff and reborn them as plant people.
If plant people were available from the beginning, a fun story like this wouldn't be possible. Nerfing existing items is difficult to get traction for, especially due to the fear of furries and the like. You'll need to make a more compelling argument to do so other than only to add races to an already large lineup.
First my reasoning for wanting to add these races as roundstart races is because the sprites already exist in the game, and there is a lore reason for their inclusion on round start. Also alien races working in concert is a well used and loved sci-fi trope, and making biologically unique races would make certain jobs like medbay, and to a lesser extent the chef, more interesting.
I also dont see how making pod people round-start would prevent the story you described from happening. I am not suggesting removing the current ways to obtain the races. In fact, keeping them in as more powerful versions of the roundstart versions of the races keeps their place as a reward for cooperation and round progression.
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- In-Game Admin
- Joined: Thu May 01, 2014 3:25 pm
- Byond Username: FatalX1
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
Having OP races at round start sounds like a good use for some kind of reward currency that I know has been floated around a few times, and I think some other servers have such a thing also
Might be worth looking at that option instead of nerfing the races, and to keep the rarity factor
Might be worth looking at that option instead of nerfing the races, and to keep the rarity factor
- DemonFiren
- Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2014 9:15 pm
- Byond Username: DemonFiren
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
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- Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2016 6:31 pm
- Byond Username: DrBee
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
I was thinking just having the old method to gain the power "unlock" the OP parts of the race like the healing, or space-proof-ness or splitting.Fatal wrote:Having OP races at round start sounds like a good use for some kind of reward currency that I know has been floated around a few times, and I think some other servers have such a thing also
Might be worth looking at that option instead of nerfing the races, and to keep the rarity factor
- BeeSting12
- Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2016 1:11 am
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- Location: 'Murica
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
if it has the word race in the title thne it will probably be treated as a shed post
- Pascal125
- Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2016 7:48 am
- Byond Username: Pascal123
- Location: Your closet
Re: Nerfing OP races to use them at round start.
Any open-minded person willing to consider themselves a furry.Qbopper wrote:now the question is "what constitutes a furry"SpaceInaba wrote:lets just ban all non furries so nobody will ever complain
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