Bottom post of the previous page:
Gogodapogostick wrote:I say again, this is a pretty major change for it to not be on the big poll
Bottom post of the previous page:
Gogodapogostick wrote:I say again, this is a pretty major change for it to not be on the big poll
this, very much. expect more bombs and plasma fires, arguably less fun ways to die from.saprasam wrote:ok guess i'll just learn how to make one tank bombs and kill the entire station that way instead
Timberpoes wrote: Lepi was right all along.
technokek wrote:Cannot prove this so just belive me if when say this
There are many merits on this.oranges wrote:Floating an idea that I think could have merit here around changes to uplinks for traitors, want to see what people think....
(...)
...Difficult Main objective
Simple sub objectives that you have to complete to build up a gear set for your main one.
If that's the case, then how come it seems like most traitors redtext, even on Manuel where you're supposed to attempt your objective?Naloac wrote:I like the idea but, In all honesty the objectives right now fucking suck. They are almost always extremely easy to do and not fun.
I'm just going to say:oranges wrote:Some subnotes:
This moves the antag into a more progression based system, something which changeling, our other solo antag, has.
There is possibility we take murderbone focused stuff and move that to yet *ANOTHER* store, where you can only get access to it if you press a button/request help.
This grants you full access to murderbone shop inc, *BUT* NT gets notified of who you are and announces to the crew.
NB: this alert/request help would only become available after either a time bound pneriod, or some level of objective completion, this is to prevent round start traitor murderbone giving away gamemode for more passive traitors.
Mothblocks, winter 2020, “successfully” preventing bagil death with relevant data wrote:You seem to be under the fallacy that reinforcing that Bagil is a TDM shithole where you must carry bolas and spears on you at all times, while looking for the next valid to hunt down is a positive change to the server. I don't. The data suggests other people don't.
imsxz wrote:I give up there’s too many furries
cacogen wrote:i asked oranges how often he plays and he deleted the post
cybersaber101 wrote:Welp, you guys let a terrymin become a headmin, thousand years of darkness.
Vekter wrote:I jerk off Nist a bit too much but he's honestly one of the best silicon players on the server. B.O.R.G.O. is also pretty good.
If we were trying to preserve the generic low level solo antagonist with open ended goals, how would you fix:Flatulent wrote:a basic bitch solo antagonist with a wide variety of tools at his disposal.
skill issueArmhulen wrote:If we were trying to preserve the generic low level solo antagonist with open ended goals, how would you fix:Flatulent wrote:a basic bitch solo antagonist with a wide variety of tools at his disposal.
1. Traitors sabotaging the station beyond belief, before station progresses and without counterplay (see problem 2). A traitor can, within 30 seconds of the round starting, purchase a revolver and dump it into the SM, triggering an instant delamination. They can also purchase a syndiebomb + c4 kit and instantly turn medbay into a huge hole.
problems this makes:
* more important round antagonists do not have time to progress, their rounds are essentially hijacked by a low level antag role (i'll talk a bit more about "low level antagonist") later
* security had no power to stop this, only damage control
* crew doesn't get to progress to counter antagonists, as the round won't go on that long
* creates a "tainted" round where people will stop trying to do anything interesting and instead rushing to call the shuttle. people want a round with a medbay/engine and do not consider having to put in the time to fix those areas worth it vs a restart
2. Traitors not having a paper trail behind their antagonism. Since they can purchase anywhere, anything, and at any time, traitors are free to use the syndiebomb + c4 trick after 50 minutes of doing nothing to turn the shuttle into a hole
problems this makes:
* the amount of work security gets at stopping antagonists is directly dependent on how much they decide to actually antagonize, if they decide to do nothing but evaporate the shuttle then there was no possibility of being able to "catch" the traitor setting up for this (think someone that makes bombs in toxins leaves the paper trail of them working in toxins, but one who buys from the kit doesn't have that.)
* another case of a low level antagonist very possibly hijacking the roundend for more important ones. i'm not saying in the end that a traitor shouldn't be able to become the big focus of a round but rather that a traitor doing that to majorly switch how the round ends is entirely unearned.
You can nerf traitor without removing him all-together. We already have contraband uplink that lets you buy dumb crap with money and its transported to a random location on the station, you could have traitors use this mechanic to acquire the most overpowered gear they have. Obviously it won’t tell the crew where the (immovable) box with shit will land, but traitors will have to do some legwork to recover their property. Boning traitors could definetly use a speed bump, but nuking all traitors over this seems too harsh. Bullet SM can be nerfed, so can syndie payload become untriggereable without the syndie bomb on a 90 second timer. How many times have you seen someone delam SM in this way anyway? Medbay blowing up is extremely annoying, I agree, but SM being delammed in this way is a non-issue as it happens pretty rarely IMO.Armhulen wrote:If we were trying to preserve the generic low level solo antagonist with open ended goals, how would you fix:Flatulent wrote:a basic bitch solo antagonist with a wide variety of tools at his disposal.
1. Traitors sabotaging the station beyond belief, before station progresses and without counterplay (see problem 2). A traitor can, within 30 seconds of the round starting, purchase a revolver and dump it into the SM, triggering an instant delamination. They can also purchase a syndiebomb + c4 kit and instantly turn medbay into a huge hole.
problems this makes:
* more important round antagonists do not have time to progress, their rounds are essentially hijacked by a low level antag role (i'll talk a bit more about "low level antagonist") later
* security had no power to stop this, only damage control
* crew doesn't get to progress to counter antagonists, as the round won't go on that long
* creates a "tainted" round where people will stop trying to do anything interesting and instead rushing to call the shuttle. people want a round with a medbay/engine and do not consider having to put in the time to fix those areas worth it vs a restart
2. Traitors not having a paper trail behind their antagonism. Since they can purchase anywhere, anything, and at any time, traitors are free to use the syndiebomb + c4 trick after 50 minutes of doing nothing to turn the shuttle into a hole
problems this makes:
* the amount of work security gets at stopping antagonists is directly dependent on how much they decide to actually antagonize, if they decide to do nothing but evaporate the shuttle then there was no possibility of being able to "catch" the traitor setting up for this (think someone that makes bombs in toxins leaves the paper trail of them working in toxins, but one who buys from the kit doesn't have that.)
* another case of a low level antagonist very possibly hijacking the roundend for more important ones. i'm not saying in the end that a traitor shouldn't be able to become the big focus of a round but rather that a traitor doing that to majorly switch how the round ends is entirely unearned.
Mothblocks, winter 2020, “successfully” preventing bagil death with relevant data wrote:You seem to be under the fallacy that reinforcing that Bagil is a TDM shithole where you must carry bolas and spears on you at all times, while looking for the next valid to hunt down is a positive change to the server. I don't. The data suggests other people don't.
imsxz wrote:I give up there’s too many furries
cacogen wrote:i asked oranges how often he plays and he deleted the post
cybersaber101 wrote:Welp, you guys let a terrymin become a headmin, thousand years of darkness.
Vekter wrote:I jerk off Nist a bit too much but he's honestly one of the best silicon players on the server. B.O.R.G.O. is also pretty good.
I'm inclined to agree with some, but not all, of this, I think.Flatulent wrote:You can nerf traitor without removing him all-together. We already have contraband uplink that lets you buy dumb crap with money and its transported to a random location on the station, you could have traitors use this mechanic to acquire the most overpowered gear they have. Obviously it won’t tell the crew where the (immovable) box with shit will land, but traitors will have to do some legwork to recover their property. Boning traitors could definetly use a speed bump, but nuking all traitors over this seems too harsh. Bullet SM can be nerfed, so can syndie payload become untriggereable without the syndie bomb on a 90 second timer. How many times have you seen someone delam SM in this way anyway? Medbay blowing up is extremely annoying, I agree, but SM being delammed in this way is a non-issue as it happens pretty rarely IMO.Armhulen wrote:concernsFlatulent wrote:a basic bitch solo antagonist with a wide variety of tools at his disposal.
As for traitors not having any paper trail, if a person bombs the shuttle at minute 50, who cares? Unless it’s revolution or blob, the round has already ended anyway. It’s their round and if they want to waste their antag on bombing the shuttle and just bar rp for fifty minutes, let them do that. We already have sec call shuttle when they eliminate every antagonist, making antags weaker would lead to shorter rounds.
Not to mention that we also have LATEJOIN traitors. Would you have them do objectives when most are already grabbed? How will they have time to do much anyway?
In 50 minutes of gameplay, you could make multiple maxcaps to blow the fucking shuttle up. You don’t even need to know how to do that initially with this amount of time. You can just repeat a guide and end up with multiple bombs. A blood brother could do this. A cultist could do this. Any concievable antagonist is capable of collecting massive amounts of “gamer gear” by minute 50, be the source xenobiology, toxins, mining or a full crate of cargo autorifles.
Mothblocks, winter 2020, “successfully” preventing bagil death with relevant data wrote:You seem to be under the fallacy that reinforcing that Bagil is a TDM shithole where you must carry bolas and spears on you at all times, while looking for the next valid to hunt down is a positive change to the server. I don't. The data suggests other people don't.
imsxz wrote:I give up there’s too many furries
cacogen wrote:i asked oranges how often he plays and he deleted the post
cybersaber101 wrote:Welp, you guys let a terrymin become a headmin, thousand years of darkness.
Vekter wrote:I jerk off Nist a bit too much but he's honestly one of the best silicon players on the server. B.O.R.G.O. is also pretty good.
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