Turn on the exp job restrictions
- oranges
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 9:16 pm
- Byond Username: Optimumtact
- Github Username: optimumtact
- Location: #CHATSHITGETBANGED
Turn on the exp job restrictions
Byond account age restrictions do not require actual game time, so are not a good reflection of actual ability.
Enable the following configs on sybil/basil but not terry (due to pop issues)
## Unhash this to enable playtime requirements for head jobs.
#USE_EXP_RESTRICTIONS_HEADS
## Unhash this to override head jobs' playtime requirements with this number of hours.
#USE_EXP_RESTRICTIONS_HEADS_HOURS 15
## Unhash this to change head jobs' playtime requirements so that they're based on department playtime, rather than crew playtime.
#USE_EXP_RESTRICTIONS_HEADS_DEPARTMENT
## Unhash this to enable playtime requirements for certain non-head jobs, like Engineer and Scientist.
#USE_EXP_RESTRICTIONS_OTHER
## Allows admins to bypass job playtime requirements.
#USE_EXP_RESTRICTIONS_ADMIN_BYPASS
Why: it means you have some actual in game time before getting advanced roles, we're doing a disservice to players who connect and don't have play time, as well as the people who have to play with those people in those roles
Also I want to extend this to senior antags like the nuke captain, rev and cult leaders, so that they require time as a nukeop, cultist or revolutionary to be rollable for.
actually exempt terry from these restrictions
Enable the following configs on sybil/basil but not terry (due to pop issues)
## Unhash this to enable playtime requirements for head jobs.
#USE_EXP_RESTRICTIONS_HEADS
## Unhash this to override head jobs' playtime requirements with this number of hours.
#USE_EXP_RESTRICTIONS_HEADS_HOURS 15
## Unhash this to change head jobs' playtime requirements so that they're based on department playtime, rather than crew playtime.
#USE_EXP_RESTRICTIONS_HEADS_DEPARTMENT
## Unhash this to enable playtime requirements for certain non-head jobs, like Engineer and Scientist.
#USE_EXP_RESTRICTIONS_OTHER
## Allows admins to bypass job playtime requirements.
#USE_EXP_RESTRICTIONS_ADMIN_BYPASS
Why: it means you have some actual in game time before getting advanced roles, we're doing a disservice to players who connect and don't have play time, as well as the people who have to play with those people in those roles
Also I want to extend this to senior antags like the nuke captain, rev and cult leaders, so that they require time as a nukeop, cultist or revolutionary to be rollable for.
actually exempt terry from these restrictions
- iamgoofball
- Github User
- Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 5:50 pm
- Byond Username: Iamgoofball
- Github Username: Iamgoofball
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
Players better be getting grandfathered in on the antag ones and definitely the head ones
- oranges
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 9:16 pm
- Byond Username: Optimumtact
- Github Username: optimumtact
- Location: #CHATSHITGETBANGED
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
Of course you fucking muppet, player tracking has been enabled for ages, so it's very unlikely you would not meet any of the criteria assuming you pla-- oh wait
Last edited by oranges on Thu Jan 04, 2018 7:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
- MrStonedOne
- Host
- Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2014 10:56 pm
- Byond Username: MrStonedOne
- Github Username: MrStonedOne
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
Nope.iamgoofball wrote:Players better be getting grandfathered in on the antag ones and definitely the head ones
- iamgoofball
- Github User
- Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 5:50 pm
- Byond Username: Iamgoofball
- Github Username: Iamgoofball
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
Great, so we're penalizing players who can't fucking spend every waking hour logging in hoping for an antag role.
I know how to click spaceman and now I'm blocked from playing CMO despite coding the current medical system because I don't have time to marathon ss13 while paying my bills on time, unlike kevin.
I know how to click spaceman and now I'm blocked from playing CMO despite coding the current medical system because I don't have time to marathon ss13 while paying my bills on time, unlike kevin.
- oranges
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 9:16 pm
- Byond Username: Optimumtact
- Github Username: optimumtact
- Location: #CHATSHITGETBANGED
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
your time doesn't decay buddy, you just have to show up.
- iamgoofball
- Github User
- Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 5:50 pm
- Byond Username: Iamgoofball
- Github Username: Iamgoofball
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
Blocking nuke ops leader is even dumber, revs and cults I understand because you can get converted into them and they're complex with special rules and toys, but the percentage chance of getting nuke op in an 80 player round with every other gamemode is incredibly low, and the nuke leader is whoever actually takes point, when I play if I get nuke it tends to get handed to whoever has the plan.
Make an exception for long time players or add some kind of whitelist or something, because expecting long time vets to grind just because they have an irl life and job is fucking dumb
Yeah, time doesn't decay but I know when we added the system and I know how much I play. I can sit down and do every job in the game right now by the book and I don't qualify for every xp locked thing now.
Make an exception for long time players or add some kind of whitelist or something, because expecting long time vets to grind just because they have an irl life and job is fucking dumb
Yeah, time doesn't decay but I know when we added the system and I know how much I play. I can sit down and do every job in the game right now by the book and I don't qualify for every xp locked thing now.
- iamgoofball
- Github User
- Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 5:50 pm
- Byond Username: Iamgoofball
- Github Username: Iamgoofball
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
What I'm trying to say is this system works great for new players but just fucks over the motivation for older players. Considering how much we love sucking said older player dongs, this surprises me.
Provided I don't get stickybanned for PRing config options again I'll just code a cutoff date system to automate this.
Provided I don't get stickybanned for PRing config options again I'll just code a cutoff date system to automate this.
- Cobby
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Sat Apr 19, 2014 7:19 pm
- Byond Username: ExcessiveUseOfCobby
- Github Username: ExcessiveUseOfCobblestone
- iamgoofball
- Github User
- Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 5:50 pm
- Byond Username: Iamgoofball
- Github Username: Iamgoofball
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
Read the post you spoiled admin brat.Cobby wrote:Then play the game?
- Grazyn
- Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2014 11:01 am
- Byond Username: Grazyn
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
This is an excellent idea, sadly I've not been playing much since tracking was enabled so I still have to grind 2 hours in supply to unlock HoP but I have all other heads already unlocked except for CMO (not a problem 'cause I utterly despise medical). I've been playing on /tg/ since 2012 but I don't mind not been grandfathered in, if anything it will provide an incentive for old players to go back to menial jobs and bring their expertise there, even if it's just to unlock a head role. After all, I complained a lot about incompetent cargo techs in the past and it's only fair that I am now forced to play cargo.
- Dax Dupont
- In-Game Admin
- Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2014 9:07 pm
- Byond Username: DaxYeen
- Github Username: DaxDupont
- Location: Belgium
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
I wouldn't enable it for other, it's not like science is anything but time gate memes anymore.
Engineering, you only learn to work with the SM as an engineer. If you fuck up you will still have like 10 minutes to fix the SM.
Though for security officer it's needed. Also make the AI have playtime as a cyborg so they know policy.
Aside from those I completely agree, I'm tired of incompetent CMOs.
Engineering, you only learn to work with the SM as an engineer. If you fuck up you will still have like 10 minutes to fix the SM.
Though for security officer it's needed. Also make the AI have playtime as a cyborg so they know policy.
Aside from those I completely agree, I'm tired of incompetent CMOs.
- Lumbermancer
- Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2014 3:40 am
- Byond Username: Lumbermancer
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
Ye what we need is even less security.Dax Dupont wrote:Though for security officer it's needed.
-
- Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2014 10:13 pm
- Byond Username: Feemjmeem
- Github Username: feemjmeem
- Contact:
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
I am 100% for enabling this for heads and silicons
I am 0% for enabling this for anyone else
I am 0% for allowing goof to make PRs to impose his personal view on config changes
I am 0% for enabling this for anyone else
I am 0% for allowing goof to make PRs to impose his personal view on config changes
Last edited by feem on Thu Jan 04, 2018 3:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.
- Saegrimr
- Joined: Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:39 pm
- Byond Username: Saegrimr
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
Is this time spent alive? What if I get smashed 5 minutes into the round?
Does Chef/Janitor/Botanist count as "Supply" time?
Does AI/Cyborg have a time requirement?
Apparently I have a few hours to spend as medical, but I have captain unlocked, and i'm not sure where to view antag unlock time if that does exist because all appear to be available to me in game prefs.
Does Chef/Janitor/Botanist count as "Supply" time?
Does AI/Cyborg have a time requirement?
Apparently I have a few hours to spend as medical, but I have captain unlocked, and i'm not sure where to view antag unlock time if that does exist because all appear to be available to me in game prefs.
tedward1337 wrote:Sae is like the racist grandad who everyone laughs at for being racist, but deep down we all know he's right.
- Oldman Robustin
- Joined: Tue May 13, 2014 2:18 pm
- Byond Username: ForcefulCJS
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
I'd actually play Sec more if I knew I would have a halfway competent team. But even with XP restrictions thats probably a pipe dream.
The most dangerous thing to a sec officer is having an incompetent colleague/superior. I honestly can't remember the last time I died to a revolver/ebow/esword but its a daily occurrence to get gunned down by security guns thats have fallen into antag hands.
Anyway there's really no argument against enabling this for Heads and seeing how it goes.
The most dangerous thing to a sec officer is having an incompetent colleague/superior. I honestly can't remember the last time I died to a revolver/ebow/esword but its a daily occurrence to get gunned down by security guns thats have fallen into antag hands.
Anyway there's really no argument against enabling this for Heads and seeing how it goes.
-
- Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 10:26 pm
- Byond Username: KorPhaeron
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
Having to grind to unlock roles, especially when your timer stops going up after you die*, sounds really unfriendly to new players in a game that is already very unfriendly to new players.
And not only new players, but anyone who wants to switch from another server or return from a period of absence. We're a tiny niche game where we lose 90% of our players within the first week already(according to erros old stat tracker), dont put more hurdles up.
*Don't think I can fully express how distasteful I find it that the system penalizes new players for being killed given how it is already highly unpleasant for them when some burned out veteran player decides to wipe out the station
And not only new players, but anyone who wants to switch from another server or return from a period of absence. We're a tiny niche game where we lose 90% of our players within the first week already(according to erros old stat tracker), dont put more hurdles up.
*Don't think I can fully express how distasteful I find it that the system penalizes new players for being killed given how it is already highly unpleasant for them when some burned out veteran player decides to wipe out the station
- BeeSting12
- Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2016 1:11 am
- Byond Username: BeeSting12
- Github Username: BeeSting12
- Location: 'Murica
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
The game is about dying terribly you shouldn't be penalized outside of the current round for dying terribly
- Dax Dupont
- In-Game Admin
- Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2014 9:07 pm
- Byond Username: DaxYeen
- Github Username: DaxDupont
- Location: Belgium
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
if this only counts alive time then no fuck this shit
- cedarbridge
- Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 12:24 am
- Byond Username: Cedarbridge
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
We already hardlock the head roles behind account age since first seen. We get players who complain that they're locked out of roles because they're using a new acount. I'm less convinced by that sort of thing than I am convinced by the fact that we do enforce minimum levels of command role competence. Requiring players to actually play the departments they want to be head of before playing the head roles for that department seems pretty obvious. If new players are being turned away because they can't play as RD without knowing how science works or HOS without knowing how a tazer works then we're not honestly losing much. They were in it for the access and the toys and they'd be out as soon as the novelty wore off or as soon as their lack of actual player knowledge caught up to them anyway. We restrict head and command roles for important reasons. These roles have expectations of minimum competence so requiring a player to spend the time required in a department to acquire minimum competence is a natural progression and its something we have had players and admins asking for for years.
- iamgoofball
- Github User
- Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 5:50 pm
- Byond Username: Iamgoofball
- Github Username: Iamgoofball
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
Whoa holy shit this is the version that only counts alive time?
Jesus christ are you people autistic
Jesus christ are you people autistic
- Cobby
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Sat Apr 19, 2014 7:19 pm
- Byond Username: ExcessiveUseOfCobby
- Github Username: ExcessiveUseOfCobblestone
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
I'm not a big fan of this either but how can someone be competent in a position when they're dead? Antag leader roles should definitely not be affected by life/death though since those require game knowledge as oppose to using departmental features.Dax Dupont wrote:if this only counts alive time then no fuck this shit
If you don't play because you have a job/life then you're not going to be affected at all by any changes made to the server because you do not engage in said server. There is nothing wrong with that until you start trying to dictate policy on a hypothetical that you might play again ****eventually**** when our code is constantly changing in minor and major ways.iamgoofball wrote:Read the post you spoiled admin brat.Cobby wrote:Then play the game?
In the instance you do play you should take the time to get accustomed with some of it's newer features (assuming there are any) in both the game as a whole and the particular department you're going in instead of taking up a role to someone who is well versed in most/all newer features.
There is nothing wrong with you having a life/job/etc. to the same degree there shouldn't be anything wrong with having players who haven't played the role(s) since the system got added get accustomed to the current features before playing roles pivotal to the progression of the round again.
Can I ask what's to be gained though by putting new players in leadership roles or roles with strict auxiliary rules (drone/silicons) though? Players who are currently playing shouldn't be penalized for having people who don't know what they're doing signing up for jobs that require a good grasp of the game, and newer players are definitely not going to come back if they get banned from a role by admins.Kor wrote:b
For the server-hoppers, they could just pick their favorite job of that department and bypass restrictions (since they know how to play the game) by asking the selected head/hop. We just need to make it clear that's not a bad thing I guess.
To quell some of your concerns and goofs though, I think playtime in general should count partially towards departmental heads meaning if you play a bunch but not engineer you can still eventually play CE.
Voted best trap in /tg/ 2014-current
- Grazyn
- Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2014 11:01 am
- Byond Username: Grazyn
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
If they were competent, they wouldn't be dead. Players both old and new should look at it this way: it doesn't punish you, it rewards you for surviving by unlocking more game content. It offers a challenge.Dax Dupont wrote:if this only counts alive time then no fuck this shit
As a bonus, it makes life harder for permabanned people who somehow manage to cheat the ban because it prevents them from using a new account to sign up as captain and fuck everything up.
- iamgoofball
- Github User
- Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 5:50 pm
- Byond Username: Iamgoofball
- Github Username: Iamgoofball
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
You're fucking retardedGrazyn wrote:If they were competent, they wouldn't be dead. Players both old and new should look at it this way: it doesn't punish you, it rewards you for surviving by unlocking more game content. It offers a challenge.Dax Dupont wrote:if this only counts alive time then no fuck this shit
As a bonus, it makes life harder for permabanned people who somehow manage to cheat the ban because it prevents them from using a new account to sign up as captain and fuck everything up.
Oh my god you're even more retardedCobby wrote:I'm not a big fan of this either but how can someone be competent in a position when they're dead? Antag leader roles should definitely not be affected by life/death though since those require game knowledge as oppose to using departmental features.Dax Dupont wrote:if this only counts alive time then no fuck this shit
If you don't play because you have a job/life then you're not going to be affected at all by any changes made to the server because you do not engage in said server. There is nothing wrong with that until you start trying to dictate policy on a hypothetical that you might play again ****eventually**** when our code is constantly changing in minor and major ways.iamgoofball wrote:Read the post you spoiled admin brat.Cobby wrote:Then play the game?
In the instance you do play you should take the time to get accustomed with some of it's newer features (assuming there are any) in both the game as a whole and the particular department you're going in instead of taking up a role to someone who is well versed in most/all newer features.
There is nothing wrong with you having a life/job/etc. to the same degree there shouldn't be anything wrong with having players who haven't played the role(s) since the system got added get accustomed to the current features before playing roles pivotal to the progression of the round again.
Can I ask what's to be gained though by putting new players in leadership roles or roles with strict auxiliary rules (drone/silicons) though? Players who are currently playing shouldn't be penalized for having people who don't know what they're doing signing up for jobs that require a good grasp of the game, and newer players are definitely not going to come back if they get banned from a role by admins.Kor wrote:b
For the server-hoppers, they could just pick their favorite job of that department and bypass restrictions (since they know how to play the game) by asking the selected head/hop. We just need to make it clear that's not a bad thing I guess.
To quell some of your concerns and goofs though, I think playtime in general should count partially towards departmental heads meaning if you play a bunch but not engineer you can still eventually play CE.
>loool if they play for 3 hours then die from an rng disease those 3 hours just get tossed
>>HAHA GOOF DOESN'T PLAY LOL PLAY MORE FAGGOT
I'm sorry I'm busy working multiple minimum wage jobs to pay college debt while barely making ends meet on bills and that I can't fucking play 24/7 like a shut in admin like yourself you fucking pig.
- Grazyn
- Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2014 11:01 am
- Byond Username: Grazyn
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
The timer just stops when you die, it doesn't reset. If not, well yes that's retarded.
- Deitus
- Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2015 5:26 pm
- Byond Username: Deitus
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
I very much agree with this idea but goof is already on full shitpost mode in the forums so you can bet he'll shitpost on the pr hard enough that it wouldn't get merged
- SpaceInaba
- Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2016 1:03 pm
- Byond Username: SpaceInaba
- Location: everyone's favorite sjw
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
maybe if you did less shitposting and trolling you wouldn't have to work so many jobs goof
Spoiler:
- cedarbridge
- Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 12:24 am
- Byond Username: Cedarbridge
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
I don't know how he has the time with all of those minimum wage jobs he has to work to pay for a degree that isn't paying for itself.SpaceInaba wrote:maybe if you did less shitposting and trolling you wouldn't have to work so many jobs goof
- Armhulen
- Global Moderator
- Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2016 4:30 pm
- Byond Username: Armhulenn
- Github Username: bazelart
- Location: The Grand Tournament
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
It's a headmin setting thing you RETARDED IDIOTDeitus wrote:I very much agree with this idea but goof is already on full shitpost mode in the forums so you can bet he'll shitpost on the pr hard enough that it wouldn't get merged
- Cobby
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Sat Apr 19, 2014 7:19 pm
- Byond Username: ExcessiveUseOfCobby
- Github Username: ExcessiveUseOfCobblestone
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
I was under the impression dying didn't delete your progress but rather stopped the timer??? Yes if you randomly die you can't do <job> so naturally your progression in <job> should stop. As I mentioned earlier though, you should be able to play other aspects of the game (including observe) and still be rewarded partial <job> experience since you know how they work, if indirectly.iamgoofball wrote: Oh my god you're even more retarded
>loool if they play for 3 hours then die from an rng disease those 3 hours just get tossed
>>HAHA GOOF DOESN'T PLAY LOL PLAY MORE FAGGOT
I'm sorry I'm busy working multiple minimum wage jobs to pay college debt while barely making ends meet on bills and that I can't fucking play 24/7 like a shut in admin like yourself you fucking pig.
No one is bashing you for doing what you need to do IRL goof which is why I haven't stooped to your level of name-calling. All i'm saying is between when you last got on and your hypothetical return there's going to be lots of changes of varying degrees to the game. You should play a minor role to get accustomed to the new features (both general and the department-specific changes) before going into a pivotal role and negatively impacting the round (negatively) for those involved.
Voted best trap in /tg/ 2014-current
- Saegrimr
- Joined: Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:39 pm
- Byond Username: Saegrimr
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
I just picked med doctor and went afk in the dorms.
tedward1337 wrote:Sae is like the racist grandad who everyone laughs at for being racist, but deep down we all know he's right.
- MrStonedOne
- Host
- Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2014 10:56 pm
- Byond Username: MrStonedOne
- Github Username: MrStonedOne
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
Holy fucking shit the goofball has gotten even more retarded!iamgoofball wrote: >loool if they play for 3 hours then die from an rng disease those 3 hours just get tossed
You dumbass dieing stops ticking the timer up, it doesn't reset it for the round.
or to be more precise every 10 minutes you earn 10 minutes of exp if you are alive.
-
- Joined: Fri May 02, 2014 3:01 am
- Byond Username: Incomptinence
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
76 - 90 hours (if you dare play non main 5 dept roles your you are making less unlock exp this includes service) of living participation based grinding for any new player coming in today to unlock all the head roles.
Not even sure time spent playing hop previously counts toward unlocking hop because the role is in code under captain rather than cargo_service.
Not even sure time spent playing hop previously counts toward unlocking hop because the role is in code under captain rather than cargo_service.
Last edited by Incomptinence on Thu Jan 04, 2018 9:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- iamgoofball
- Github User
- Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 5:50 pm
- Byond Username: Iamgoofball
- Github Username: Iamgoofball
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
I checked my logs, not only is my job exp (610 minutes total) not the same as my Living exp (580~ minutes), but I've definitely played more than 10 hours in the last 8 months. And definitely way more than 10 minutes alive as a revolutionary.MrStonedOne wrote:Holy fucking shit the goofball has gotten even more retarded!iamgoofball wrote: >loool if they play for 3 hours then die from an rng disease those 3 hours just get tossed
You dumbass dieing stops ticking the timer up, it doesn't reset it for the round.
or to be more precise every 10 minutes you earn 10 minutes of exp if you are alive.
Something is dropping time, and I've been fucked by it.
- Durkel
- Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2014 5:14 pm
- Byond Username: Durkel
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
I spend 80% of my time admining now because I'm usually the only admin on and now I'm locked out of the head roles.
What a fucking kick in the balls. "Thanks for my wasting your time telling everyone else how to play the roles, oh by the way even though you've been here for over six years and are now trusted enough to enforce game policy and let others know how to play roles you're now locked out of them. What an absolutely great gift to wasting my time admining.
What a fucking kick in the balls. "Thanks for my wasting your time telling everyone else how to play the roles, oh by the way even though you've been here for over six years and are now trusted enough to enforce game policy and let others know how to play roles you're now locked out of them. What an absolutely great gift to wasting my time admining.
Last edited by Durkel on Thu Jan 04, 2018 10:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- PKPenguin321
- Site Admin
- Joined: Tue Jul 01, 2014 7:02 pm
- Byond Username: PKPenguin321
- Github Username: PKPenguin321
- Location: U S A, U S A, U S A
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
Terrible system thenMrStonedOne wrote:Nope.iamgoofball wrote:Players better be getting grandfathered in on the antag ones and definitely the head ones
i play Lauser McMauligan. clown name is Cold-Ass Honkey
i have three other top secret characters as well.
tell the best admin how good he is
i have three other top secret characters as well.
tell the best admin how good he is
Spoiler:
- Dax Dupont
- In-Game Admin
- Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2014 9:07 pm
- Byond Username: DaxYeen
- Github Username: DaxDupont
- Location: Belgium
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
Maybe make the time required shorter?
- Grazyn
- Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2014 11:01 am
- Byond Username: Grazyn
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
That would ruin the sense of pride and accomplishment
-
- Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 10:26 pm
- Byond Username: KorPhaeron
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
The problem with short timers is that it would he quick to get to a particular head role and allow the player in question to mess everything up, defeating the goal of the system. Even with relatively short timers you have to multiply that by 6 or 8 or whatever so it ends up being a big grind for long time players who just want to bounce around.Dax Dupont wrote:Maybe make the time required shorter?
Cobby wrote:things
Yeah sure in an ideal world itd be nice if people knew what they were doing before playing certain jobs but this is a clumsy way to do it with too much collateral.
It's also a fucking pipe dream. A pretty consistent experience in online multiplayer games is that everyone considers their team incompetent garbage. If games with millions of players and millions in funding still run into this, what makes you think our game where you get permabanned for using a mic and not enough players for matchmaking is gonna give you your MLG experience?
Sometimes the captain is just a comdom. That's how our game is. We simply do not have enough players who
1) Are friendly/rule abiding
2) Robust
To fill every security/head slot in every round across 3 servers 24 hours a day. They're stressful roles to play and half the old players who complain about incompetent heads are rolling assistant every round.
- oranges
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 9:16 pm
- Byond Username: Optimumtact
- Github Username: optimumtact
- Location: #CHATSHITGETBANGED
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
It's unfriendly to new players to dump them into roles they are clearly not prepared for, new players are not going to find this unfriendly, spending time to unlock more jobs is a well understood paradigm, they will have plenty of roles to play from already.Kor wrote:Having to grind to unlock roles, especially when your timer stops going up after you die*, sounds really unfriendly to new players in a game that is already very unfriendly to new players.
And not only new players, but anyone who wants to switch from another server or return from a period of absence. We're a tiny niche game where we lose 90% of our players within the first week already(according to erros old stat tracker), dont put more hurdles up.
*Don't think I can fully express how distasteful I find it that the system penalizes new players for being killed given how it is already highly unpleasant for them when some burned out veteran player decides to wipe out the station
On top of that, what new player is actually wanting to play head roles anyway? If someone is new they will not be touching those roles because our wiki explicitly says NOT to do this with very strict wording. Someone who jumps in as a new player and tries to play head or AI is just going to fuck up the round or the other 70 players online, who also don't `deserve` to have their round ruined because the new player set a button without understanding the impact.
The fact you're raising some spectre of losing players when we have ~150/160 players across three servers is also somewhat odd.
Also what do you mean by penalising people for getting killed? This is about ensuring they have some actual real playtime in a department before getting the head roles, they're not suddenly going to lose the ability to be a cargo tech because they died?
These aren't very high barriers to entry, I'm thinking maybe an hour or two of play time in each role before allowing departmental head roles.
This isjust encoding policy we already encourage new players to follow on the wiki and when we give them advice, which is to start in smaller roles and work your way
Again we're already tracking play time for some time, so any regular player on /tg/ is very unlikely to beaffected unless they rarely play, in which case that's their problem, if this non issue really bothers you I can just set a cap on the time they arrived at our server so it only applies to new connections so durkel doesn't spit his dummy.
-
- Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 10:26 pm
- Byond Username: KorPhaeron
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
Also saying returning players need to grind for hours before they can understand cyborg or AI or HoP or CMO is nonsense. The only job that takes a serious amount of understanding and that has significantly changed in five years is the CE. The game would not collapse if Phoebe Lotsu started playing CMO again after a year but had to check the wiki for a chem recipe, but the game is gonna be noticeably worse for a ton of people who have been around for years who suddenly cant play the roles they want.
Easier to just jobban people who get in over their heads then pre-emptively punish everyone.
Apparently enough of them are doing it that we need to lock players like Saeg or Durkel out of parts of the game.On top of that, what new player is actually wanting to play head roles anyway?
Easier to just jobban people who get in over their heads then pre-emptively punish everyone.
- oranges
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 9:16 pm
- Byond Username: Optimumtact
- Github Username: optimumtact
- Location: #CHATSHITGETBANGED
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
it's a non issue you're just using it to deflect, I can easily make it apply only to accounts that have not been seen before on tg.
-
- Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 10:26 pm
- Byond Username: KorPhaeron
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
You're the first person who has offered to fix it rather than saying "lol play the game" or "dont be poor goof" so it does not feel like a non issue (and it isnt like its a new concern, I brought this up months ago before the PRs were merged and nobody showed willingness to change it then either)
I'd still think this alleged plague of completley new people who have never touched ss13 before rushing captain to not be worth fucking over server hoppers though
I'd still think this alleged plague of completley new people who have never touched ss13 before rushing captain to not be worth fucking over server hoppers though
- Lazengann
- Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:26 pm
- Byond Username: Lazengann
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
The cargo requirement should be reduced to six minutes for obvious reasons
- MrStonedOne
- Host
- Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2014 10:56 pm
- Byond Username: MrStonedOne
- Github Username: MrStonedOne
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
One, unlike the old system, admins actually have a button to exempt people from the exp requirements, its the player panel.
Two, server hoppers have always had to deal with waiting to be able to do anything, this gives less time of waiting than the old system that required 21 days to get borg or 30 to get AI. (those are the only two I actually remembered)
Three, the age requirement thing created a value to maintaining an account, this expands and more properly defines thats. Everybody here likely knows how much of a stubborn little shit I can be at times. As a player before I became host, there were been times where a ruling came out I didn't agree with. You know kept me in line? Knowing that If I got banned and ban evaded I'd lose access to the roles I unlocked on my new account. In fact I assumed that was the whole point of the account age system.
edit: and I do think that people coming here from other servers might need to understand our rules better before they can access head roles.
Two, server hoppers have always had to deal with waiting to be able to do anything, this gives less time of waiting than the old system that required 21 days to get borg or 30 to get AI. (those are the only two I actually remembered)
Three, the age requirement thing created a value to maintaining an account, this expands and more properly defines thats. Everybody here likely knows how much of a stubborn little shit I can be at times. As a player before I became host, there were been times where a ruling came out I didn't agree with. You know kept me in line? Knowing that If I got banned and ban evaded I'd lose access to the roles I unlocked on my new account. In fact I assumed that was the whole point of the account age system.
edit: and I do think that people coming here from other servers might need to understand our rules better before they can access head roles.
- oranges
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 9:16 pm
- Byond Username: Optimumtact
- Github Username: optimumtact
- Location: #CHATSHITGETBANGED
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
to be clear I don't think there's any value in turning it on for the base jobs
cargo/engineer/science/sec (yes even sec)/atmos/borg should all be accessible
this is purely head roles and the AI (I would even exempt QM from head roles)
cargo/engineer/science/sec (yes even sec)/atmos/borg should all be accessible
this is purely head roles and the AI (I would even exempt QM from head roles)
-
- Joined: Fri May 02, 2014 3:01 am
- Byond Username: Incomptinence
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
Why not have a system where meeting a req like the 15 hour threshold just makes you first pick ahead of less experienced players.
If no highly experienced player wants to play the head role the department just shrunk by one as it currently stands.
If no highly experienced player wants to play the head role the department just shrunk by one as it currently stands.
Last edited by Incomptinence on Thu Jan 04, 2018 11:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- MrStonedOne
- Host
- Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2014 10:56 pm
- Byond Username: MrStonedOne
- Github Username: MrStonedOne
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
That was actually my suggestion.Incomptinence wrote:Why not have a system where meeting a req like the 15 hour threshold just makes you first pick ahead of less experienced players.
If no hughly experienced player wants to play the head role the department just shrunk by one as it currently stands.
Lock it so they can only set it to low,
- MrStonedOne
- Host
- Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2014 10:56 pm
- Byond Username: MrStonedOne
- Github Username: MrStonedOne
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
Anywho, i'll be running a sql query to exempt anybody who had 2000 connections in the time before the system was added
-
- Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 10:26 pm
- Byond Username: KorPhaeron
Re: Turn on the exp job restrictions
I guess if there is an exemption button and MSO is grandfathering people thats most of my major concerns met and I'll stop making bad posts. Thanks for reaching a middleground. I agree it shouldnt apply to borg though, its one of the easiest roles to learn with.
The PR had 15, but the server is at 5 last I checked. 15 was insane.Incomptinence wrote:Why not have a system where meeting a req like the 15 hour threshold just makes you first pick ahead of less experienced players.
If no hughly experienced player wants to play the head role the department just shrunk by one as it currently stands.
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], dendydoom