[Discord][Nervere] The_Silver_Nuke#0735

[The_Silver_Nuke]

User:The_Silver_Nuke#0735
Admin: Nervere
Time: 07/12/19 est 3:40PM MTN time
Ban Reason: Challenging an admin warning
Your side of the story: Nervere gave me a warning for posting suspected fringe content on the Discord. I didn't feel that it was in violation at the time but I decided to just let it be and continue toeing the line. I mistakenly posted it immediately after but he saw this as me challenging his authority and banned me over it, despite me stating that it was an honest mistake. To this day I still insist that it was a mistake, because it was genuinely unintentional.
Why you think you should be unbanned: I'm tired of being given crap IG over not being able to join the discord. It hasn't been a part of my life for just under a year but people still feel the need to bring it up and throw shade for little reason.

Previous thread: https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic ... 34&t=23293

[Nervere]

Your ban reason isn't for "challenging an admin warning". That's ridiculous.
It's because you posted lolicon. The first time you did it, I gave you a warning, which is probably way too easy on you because it's my opinion that shit is enabling pedo's. Second time, you got banned.
Quoting my response to your previous thread:

Whether or not the character is clothed, posting pictures of little girls all the time is weird as fuck and definitely violates Discord's TOS, which specifically mentions lolicon.

Considering the frequency with which you posted that content, I really don't believe you when you say it was accidental.

After all this time, you'd think you'd understand that shit is gross and you shouldn't have done it.
Instead, you say the ban was because, "he saw this as me challenging his authority".
That's stupid. Lolicon is disgusting, people who post it are pedophiles, and it's saddening you're still surprised you got banned for posting it a second time.

I resigned a long ass time ago. This ban falls to the headmins. Your appeal sucks though.

Info/Resources:
Image posted twice that The_Silver_Nuke says is "SFW" (it's weird/creepy and not really SFW):

Spoiler:

Discord policy on content involving minors:

Spoiler:

[The_Silver_Nuke]

I'm surprised you're still so passionate about this even a year later. I already mentioned that the second time was unintentional, regardless of my personal opinion on it. I had never intended to ignore your warning, and I tried to make that clear. All I had wanted to do at the time was socialize, and so as a result I was more than willing to stay within the bounds of the rules. In fact I still am. You doubted my sincerity, and you gave a reasonable reason during the first appeal. I'd hope that since I'm maintaining that it was unintentional after all this time maybe you would believe me.

[Nervere]

I don't think there should be room for forgiveness for grown men who post creepy images of young girls. It's fucking weird, dude.
Regardless, not up to me. It's up to the headmins to review the facts of the case from this thread and the previous one and make a judgement. I've said my part.

[The_Silver_Nuke]

I am aware. I'd like to mention that after you had determined that it was unacceptable that I immediately fell in line and was not going to post anything like that again. The fact that I made a mistake almost immediately afterwards and got banned for it is a tragedy. I'd hope my sincerity is clear, and that if my appeal is approved that I would not even come close to posting content that others could be offended by.

I only wish you were more forthcoming when I had asked you about the subject.

[Cobby]

This does not abide by the perma reapplication year rule as both the ban and the appeal were done in july.

[The_Silver_Nuke]

This does not abide by the perma reapplication year rule as both the ban and the appeal were done in july.

This is a fair point. I wasn't going to appeal at all to be honest, but after repeated proddings and people bringing it up on a consistent basis I decided to make a post about it, thinking maybe 11 months would have been close enough.

[Cobby]

I was told this was ok so dont worry about it.

[The_Silver_Nuke]

Unfortunately by creating this appeal it seems to have drawn out more harassment. I'm going to have to start taking screenshots of every time this business gets brought up in BYOND or Discord. You post one questionable image accidentally that could have been easily forgotten about and the next thing you know people take it to the extreme and start attacking you personally over it.

I've had my fair share of salty hissy fits but I don't think I've ever gone after anyone like the way others seem to feel free to.

-Update- Here's some screenshots as an example:

https://imgur.com/a/lnBPKIF

So while I've been banned some rumors seem to have spread that are absolutely 100% incorrect. Yes, I do like anime girls. Yes, I thought the image was cute. No, I didn't think it was sexually attractive. In fact I agree that pedophiles are disgusting and should be flogged. This whole fiasco has caused me to garner a reputation that Nervere has only inflamed and I don't really appreciate it. I just want to play spessmans in peace without having to worry about someone harassing me.

[bobbahbrown]

I'm uncertain if this falls under the peanut policy or not, but I am attempting to aid the silver nuke in providing information about what they posted above.

I have gone ahead and searched for OOC messages including the string 'pedo' in rounds in which the silver nuke was connected to, and in which they also sent a message to OOC within the 2 minutes prior to the message including pedo. I also attempted to do the same search using 'child', but the results were generally uninteresting and unrelated to this user or incident. All of this data comes from Scrubby, and as a result is subject to no guarantee of certainty; however, I hope you find this useful.

The results can be found here, or seen in the picture below. I have also included the query I ran for transparency sake below the image.

Please note that the results do not indicate that a message below was directed at the silver nuke, rather they serve as a jumpoff point for the silver nuke to look into if they so choose.

Spoiler:

Code: Select all

WITH rounds AS (
    SELECT
        DISTINCT c.round
    FROM
        ckey ck
        LEFT JOIN connection c ON c.ckey = ck.id
    WHERE
        ck.ckey = 'thesilvernuke'
)
SELECT
    m.timestamp,
    m.type,
    m.message,
    m.x,
    m.y,
    m.z,
    m.origin_name,
    m.parent_file,
    r.round
FROM
    rounds r
    LEFT JOIN public.round_file rf ON rf.round = r.round
    LEFT JOIN public.log_message m ON m.parent_file = rf.id
WHERE
    m.type = 'OOC'
    AND m.message ILIKE '%"%pedo%'
    AND EXISTS(
        SELECT
            1
        FROM
            log_message m2
        WHERE
            m2.parent_file = m.parent_file
            AND m2.type = 'OOC'
            AND m2.timestamp BETWEEN m.timestamp - INTERVAL '2 minute'
            AND m.timestamp
            AND m2.message LIKE 'The_Silver_Nuke%'
        LIMIT
            1
    )
ORDER BY
    m.timestamp ASC

[The_Silver_Nuke]

...thanks. While I do appreciate you pulling logs reading through all these just makes me feel sorta crappy. There's at least a few that I remember that aren't listed there as well. Search for the term "loli" or "lolicon" and you may find a lot more. Most of the time they're few and far between but they certainly sting every time.

-Update- Some users have suggested that I change my ckey now that this has been a problem for some time in an attempt to help me be able to play the game normally. I don't intend on doing this and would rather face these baseless accusations head on, because I hate losing to jerks.

[Nervere]

It has been two weeks without an answer from headmins. Can this appeal be decided upon, please?

[oranges]

I don't think we will

[wet socks]

I'm gonna go ahead and pick this one up.

It appears to me that you were warned multiple times about posting this sort of stuff before you were banned, so I believe that nerv's decision to ban you was right.
I also don't believe that you posted these things unintentionally.
You're last appeal was also rejected, and this... is pretty much the same as the last one.
Given these points, I don't see any good reason to lift this ban, so your appeal is denied.

[The_Silver_Nuke]

I'm sorry to hear that. I was only warned the one time literally five minutes before he placed the ban, and I had no precedent of posting *suspected fringe content. This appeal is the same because my opinion on it is the same. Posting it the second time was genuinely unintentional and I'm not sure how many times I can say that before someone decides to start to believe me. It sorta hurts considering that it's coming from you, and that this whole thing was blown out of proportion and led to my harassment on the servers which wouldn't have existed otherwise. Additionally, I'm also now excluded from partaking in not only the Discord community, but also hampered in reaching out to admins in regards to any ahelps I may generate.

I'm not sure why I feel like I might get treated like a normal person on Git or these forums, despite how clearly I love the game. In the past year I've sunk over 3000 hours into it since I first heard of it then. That being said I place a request for something here or on the Git and refresh the page every day (not even kidding, I had this tab open this whole time and refreshed it every time I hopped on) hoping that someone might consider what I have to say worth hearing, only for it to be ignored for a month and ultimately rejected. I'm not going to wait another year to place another appeal, only for it to get rejected because nobody wants to listen to me. Quite frankly it's humiliating that I have to prostrate myself in front of just under 3000 people, if you combine the views from this appeal and the other. I'm just going to wash my hands of this and pretend the Discord doesn't exist, then block anyone who even borders on harassment on the servers since I can't count on anyone to support me.

[Gigapuddi420]

Additionally, I'm also now excluded from partaking in not only the Discord community, but also hampered in reaching out to admins in regards to any ahelps I may generate.

Admins shouldn't really be dealing with in-game ahelps on the Discord outside of asking other admins for help in the admin-bus. If you need to reach out to a admin regarding a ahelp or a ban you should do it in-game or on the forums. Mostly this is due to logging purposes so when a problem occurs others can review what was said, Discord's logging is pretty bad.

[The_Silver_Nuke]

I'm up early in the mornings, and there aren't usually admins on then. It says that it goes to IRS or Discord, but ultimately unless multiple people start spamming ahelps nobody will show up.

[oranges]

I'm gonna go ahead and pick this one up.
I also don't believe that you posted these things unintentionally.

Hanlons Razor says don't attribute to malice that which can be explained by stupidity.

I don't recall their name ever coming up in response to admin disrepect or ignoring admin rulings in a deliberate malicious fashion. It seems unlikely they would be told not to post something by the sitting headadmin, and then immediately post the *exact* same thing on purpose, seems more like they were in fact stupid to me and their story about fucking up scans to me.

Of course, they still haven't accepted responsibility for what they did posting it the first time, so I'd still refuse their appeal, but not because they posted it a second time on "purpose"

[The_Silver_Nuke]

I definitely was going to follow what Nerv said after he had mentioned it the first time. I didn't feel that it was in violation, but since he had determined it to be then I was going to listen and not upload any content that could be construed as being a rule breaking post. If I do get approved then I'd not upload anything that could get me in trouble again.

For example, people might think that weed shouldn't be illegal in most states yet it is. If you're a normal human being you'd listen to the law and not buy or sell any despite your personal opinion. That's the stance I would take on this subject as well, as a law abiding citizen (In this case the law being TG and Discord rules).

[Coconutwarrior97]

The headmin team will take over this appeal. Its good you've stated you won't post this sort of thing if you are unbanned. However before we're willing to unban you we'd also like you to explicitly state that the things you posted, which led to this ban, were also wrong.

[The_Silver_Nuke]

I agree that posting potentially fringe content was wrong. I wasn't aware it was at the time, as I thought it was fine. I'll be more scrupulous in the future.

[Coconutwarrior97]

Unbanned.