[Delaron] Brayd - 4noraisin

[Brayd]

b]BYOND account:[/b] Brayd
Character name: Iron golem (505)
Ban type: Server
Ban length: 2 days
Ban reason: As an iron golem got into an altercation with a crew member that resulted in them lethally killing the crew member. Proceeded to go on a self defense rampage killed 4 others (1 was traitor that fired gun) 2 day ban for 2 murders that were a result of trying to stop the golem. Please do not abuse ghost roles.
Time ban was placed: 2021 - 01 - 28 22:31:45
Server you were playing on when banned: Sybil
Round ID in which ban was placed:155209
Your side of the story: Me and Agartha forsythe got in to a space push fight which turned deadly. Delaron said me killing Agartha was valid, but me killing the 2 crew members (Manuel Kiefer and Cassanova) who attacked me (harmed first) was not.
Why you think you should be unbanned: Manuel Kiefer and Cassanova both attacked me first, i shoved only until they used lethals, therefor it was in self defense. If I was not supposed to fight back, I'd like to know what the correct response would have been so I don't make this mistake next time :)

[Brayd]

I can organize some of the logs to show who attacked first and what not if y'all want.

[delaron]

This will likely require a headmin to overrule as I reviewed the logs and spoke to Brayd during the round after.

They were not disrespectful but somewhat dismissive of the idea that self defense collateral to multiple others was ok.

At the end of the day a Iron Golem got into it with a crew member and it ended deadly for the crew member. Two additional crew members died trying to fight the killer golem. This could have been avoided with restraint and common sense when playing a ghost role. I will not be over turning the 2 day ban. This is in the hands of the headmin to overturn. Your previous notes played a part in my decision but the ban stands alone on merit of death count.

[Malkraz]

Relevant policy discussions:
https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic ... 33&t=15714
https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic ... 33&t=17737
https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic ... 33&t=19007

Relevant snippet from Lavaland Rules:

Follow the flavour text you receive upon spawning to the best of your abilities. Unlike the rest of the rules, these roles are very much defined and guided by roleplay rather than a system of "valid" or "not valid."

Your life is cheap though, and escalation rules are greatly relaxed both for you and any crewmembers interacting with you.

[keepforgettingpw]

As someone who spectated the entire thing (after whatever happened with the initial thing with the miner), everyone that died deserved it.
They each one by one on the shuttle for no real discernable reason kept attacking one golem over and over who was not doing anything on the shuttle but walking around. A random chef came up to him with a knife and kept stabbing him over and over so he defended himself. Someone saw him defending himself and tried attacking him with a KPA, so he defended himself. The next person was literally a traitor that screamed that he was a syndie and tried to shoot him with a laser gun that had no charge and then started beating him with it repeatedly in another corner of the shuttle so he defended himself.

If you start aggressing on someone for no reason and lose the fight, you don't then get to complain to have the guy that beat you banned.

[Coconutwarrior97]

We've taken the time to look over the logs relating to this appeal, the initial scuffle with Agartha Forsythe was valid as stated by Delaron. Here you can see Agartha shoving first, and eventually escalating to lethal force.

Spoiler:

[2021-01-28 21:46:49.181] ATTACK: RussellTalbott/(Agartha Forsythe) has shoved brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) (NEWHP: 100) (Space (157,62,2))
---multiple shoves---
[2021-01-28 21:46:52.253] ATTACK: RussellTalbott/(Agartha Forsythe) has shoved brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) (NEWHP: 100) (Space (157,61,2))
[2021-01-28 21:46:54.228] ATTACK: brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) has shaken RussellTalbott/(Agartha Forsythe) (NEWHP: 97.5) (Space (157,59,2))
[2021-01-28 21:46:56.548] ATTACK: RussellTalbott/(Agartha Forsythe) has shoved brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) (NEWHP: 100) (Space (157,60,2))
[2021-01-28 21:46:59.571] ATTACK: brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) has shoved RussellTalbott/(Agartha Forsythe) (NEWHP: 97.5) (Space (157,60,2))
[2021-01-28 21:46:59.571] ATTACK: brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) has shoved RussellTalbott/(Agartha Forsythe) (NEWHP: 97.5) (Space (157,60,2))
[2021-01-28 21:47:06.484] ATTACK: brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) has kicks RussellTalbott/(Agartha Forsythe) with onto their side (paralyzing) (NEWHP: 97.5) (Space (157,58,2))
[2021-01-28 21:47:09.425] ATTACK: brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) has grabbed RussellTalbott/(Agartha Forsythe) aggressive grab (NEWHP: 97.5) (Space (157,61,2))
[2021-01-28 21:47:11.060] ATTACK: brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) has thrown RussellTalbott/(Agartha Forsythe) grab from tile in Space (157,61,2) towards tile at Space (162,56,2) (NEWHP: 97.5) (Space (157,61,2))
[2021-01-28 21:47:26.861] ATTACK: brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) has shoved RussellTalbott/(Agartha Forsythe) (NEWHP: 97.5) (Space (159,54,2))
[2021-01-28 21:47:39.746] ATTACK: RussellTalbott/(Agartha Forsythe) has attacked brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) with sharpened kitchen knife (INTENT: DISARM) (NEWHP: 93.8) (Space (158,61,2))

Now, on to the other individuals involved, who also initiated with lethal force:

Spoiler:

[2021-01-28 21:53:33.053] ATTACK: Thefallout/(Manuel Kifer) has attacked brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) with dark blessing (INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 88.8) (Emergency Shuttle (173,57,2))
[2021-01-28 21:53:34.823] ATTACK: brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) has grabbed Thefallout/(Manuel Kifer) passive grab (NEWHP: 31) (Emergency Shuttle (174,57,2))
[2021-01-28 21:53:36.266] ATTACK: brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) has shoved Thefallout/(Manuel Kifer) with knocking them down (NEWHP: 31) (Emergency Shuttle (173,57,2))
[2021-01-28 21:53:38.497] ATTACK: Thefallout/(Manuel Kifer) has attacked brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) with dark blessing (INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 72.6) (Emergency Shuttle (173,57,2))
[2021-01-28 21:53:38.764] ATTACK: brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) has kicks Thefallout/(Manuel Kifer) with onto their side (paralyzing) (NEWHP: 31) (Emergency Shuttle (174,57,2))
--More attack logs, Manuel Kifer dies-
[2021-01-28 21:55:25.758] ATTACK: Bigmaneatchip555/(Jed Durstine) has fired at brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) with the laser from Emergency Shuttle (NEWHP: 72.6) (Emergency Shuttle (218,140,12))
[2021-01-28 21:55:35.822] ATTACK: Whirlsam/(Cassanova Gieaton) has attacked brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) with mounted chainsaw (INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 62.7)
[2021-01-28 21:55:38.304] ATTACK: brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) has shoved Whirlsam/(Cassanova Gieaton) (NEWHP: 66.5) (Emergency Shuttle (213,138,12))
[2021-01-28 21:55:39.473] ATTACK: brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) has shoved Whirlsam/(Cassanova Gieaton) with knocking them down (NEWHP: 66.5) (Emergency Shuttle (213,136,12))
[2021-01-28 21:55:41.754] ATTACK: brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) has attacked Whirlsam/(Cassanova Gieaton) with sharpened kitchen knife (INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 55) (Emergency Shuttle (213,136,12))
---More attack logs, Cassanova dies---
[2021-01-28 21:56:00.600] ATTACK: LargeFrii/(Travis Higgman) has shoved brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) with into Unknown (NEWHP: 62.7) (Emergency Shuttle (213,139,12))
[2021-01-28 21:56:06.375] ATTACK: LargeFrii/(Travis Higgman) has shoved brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) with knocking them down (NEWHP: 62.7) (Emergency Shuttle (214,140,12))
Bigmaneatchip555/(Jed Durstine) has attacked brayd/(Iron Golem (505)) with energy gun (INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 62.2) (Emergency Shuttle (222,139,12))

Logs: https://tgstation13.org/parsed-logs/syb ... nd-155205/

This continues into a large brawl with multiple involved people, Brayd's actions here are completely justified as self defense and as such we will be overturning this ban and removing the associated note.

Headmin Votes:
Coconutwarrior97: Accept appeal.
Domitius: Accept appeal.
Naloac: Accept appeal.