[Pumpkin0] Thranos - Ban Reason Clarity Request

[Thranos]

BYOND account: Thranos
Character name: Laura Winters
Ban type: Server
Ban length: 48 Hours
Ban reason: As the warden, took down the AI due to being suspicious of them after it was trying to help a human heretic not get surgery on them. While the armory did get siphoned, it was not due to the AI. After being told this and informed that a day ban was probably in the cards, went up to the HoS and assaulted them with a bottle of alcohol to light them on fire due to claiming the HoS as a 'fucking idiot'.
Time ban was placed: 2023-04-11 22:54:50
Server you were playing on when banned: Manuel
Round ID in which ban was placed: 203593

Your side of the story: The first half of the ban reason (the AI) is, while not in my opinion entirely accurate, accurate enough for a middle ground in the usual "he said she said" of most ahelps. The second half (the HoS), however, I have several issues with. First and foremost being that the molotov and the day ban were completely unrelated (and yes it was a molotov)- After the AI incident, I had been "demoted" (command just... never bothered to demote me for real???), I spent a lot of time on comms badmouthing command, especially the HoS. I even encouraged people to riot after command and security wound up letting at least two heretics run around unchecked, leading to the abduction of one of the only officers trying to keep people safe. It was only after a while of doing this that I was told about a potential dayban, which had no influence over my decision to molotov the HoS. In addition, I reached out to the player of the HoS that round, and they made it clear they had no issue with the incident, nor did they ahelp it. I feel that a single molotov throw against someone who stood there and casually ignored it is an unfair reason for a doubling of a ban's time, and in addition, I was not given any time to explain myself, nor asked to do so after throwing the molotov. I was immediately teleported into the admin prison while the HoS was standing in front of me, no longer on fire, and was very shortly banned with no attempt at further communication with me- which I mention due to the response I got when I attempted to get clarification from the banning admin on discord, which was roughly "I gave you lots of chances to talk to me in the ticket". I'm unsure how I could have talked to them about the second half of the ban given that I wasn't even made aware of it until the ban dropped, only that something was clearly not good due to being whisked away to admin prison abruptly.

Why you think you should be unbanned: The dayban over the AI incident is justified. The 24 hours tacked on over something that didn't even happen in the order implied, less so.

[Pumpkin0]

Hi, thanks for making this appeal.

The reason there's another 24 hours is since, when I told you about the dayban, you wordlessly walked up to the HoS and threw a molotov cocktail at him and continued to assault him. I couldn't really see that as good faith, since it really appeared to me like you were taking the opportunity I was providing you to reply to me as a way to get revenge on another player. I had sent you two messages which did not get a reply, so I assumed that the communicating was ending there. If you needed a moment to chat, you could've let me know. To me, it really just appeared like you were using the moments before getting banned as an excuse to assault the HoS for being a fucking idiot. Because the HoS has little issue with it (and could be considered IC), I'm willing to take off the 24 hours but I am not going to remove it from the ban reason. The reason for this particular decision is because I think it's important for other admins to remember how it went down, if anything like this (assault while a ban is being discussed) takes place in the future.

Hope that clears things up.

[Lacran]

I was the A.I this round.

I had locked down the brig to prevent the CMO entering to replace a human heretic's heart after the HoS requested it (I had helped them capture his heretic, the surgery was requested after they had their radio removed and were in cuffs in an attempt to not alert me.) The warden did not know this as the request was made over command. I did inform them of the situation more than once but they chose to not believe me and started cutting cams. they unbolted the brig, and the surgery was called off. After they went into the armoury to get an ion gun they declared over comms that I was MALF and had attempted to siphon their armoury. (They were human.) I let them know after they had started cutting cams I couldn't siphon them had I wanted to. My assumption is they fired their ion rifle by accident and the EMP hit the air alarm causing a siphon.

The Captain, HoP and RD checked my laws, everything was cleared up. about 5-10 minutes later I hear my turrets go off. The warden had teleported into my core and had been stunned by my turrets. I asked them to leave, but they kept trying to pick up the ion gun inbetween stuns, I called for help on the radio and the captain and HoS both told them to stand down. they ignored these requests and inbetween stuns thermited one of my walls, welded it, ioned me multiple times. this was a drawn out ordeal taking probably 2+ minutes happening between the stuns so the captain had managed to arrive on scene to see the warden beating me to death with a welder.

The Captain and HoS demoted the warden who then spent the rest of the round insulting me, security and command, insisting they riot because security was not handling the heretics fast enough. Eventually they attacked the HoS with a molotov.

Considering they as a warden left the armoury to kill an A.I alone without speaking to anyone about the situation, they then kept attempting to kill me through stuns while I called for help (which an actual MALF A.I wouldn't do, they'd just turn lethals on them), then ignored orders to stop, then attacked their boss after being demoted during an ahelp I find the two day ban pretty generous. A mitigating circumstance pumpkin likely took into consideration is the siphoning of the armory, which did occur and the source/reason was unkown as neither Thranos nor I were on the logs as the source of the issue.

[Thranos]

I didn't get any more messages from you after you informed be about the dayban- I suppose it's possible BYOND ate them? As far as the HoS molotov, I would again like to stress that this was led up to in a series of events that went down prior to you informing me of the imminent dayban (the calls for a riot and so on, meeting up with someone who was going along with it on comms outside of the brig (Marianne Catlay IIRC?) etc).

I can't prove the lack of messages on my end seeing as how my client has been closed for a while, unfortunately, but it wouldn't be the first time BYOND has failed to deliver me messages. When approximately did you send them? On my end, the last I got from you was the message about how this was going to lead to a dayban (which I was also under the impression generally didn't get applied until roundend unless someone's been being particularly heinous).

EDIT: Also, Lacran, I'm not appealing the whole thing that went down with you, I'm trying to figure out the second half with the HoS.
EDIT 2: Also I was confused at your saying people were telling me to stand down when I was in the core, and now that I'm thinking about it I'm pretty sure I couldn't hear people telling me to stand down because I ioned my headset like an idiot, which explains why when you were talking to someone on comms about me being in there, I only saw you say it locally.

EDIT 3: GOD DAMN IT MY CKEY GOT AUTOCORRECTED TO "THANOS"

[Pumpkin0]

It just felt in bad faith for you to be informed that you're probably going to get a day ban and then continue pursuing the HoS to wordlessly molotov them. It seemed odd, it still strikes me as strange and I don't think it should happen again. In the moment I interpreted it as you using the moment before you were banned to grief, but upon consideration that's probably not what happened. I was under the expectation that you were going to at least reply to my message about a day ban before continuing your IC stuff, if you were going to be able to continue it at all.

Still, I have bumped the ban down to just one day. The ban note, I think, will probably remain the same - though I might edit it to better reflect that the HoS had no ill will against it, or something to that effect, if you'd like?

[Thranos]

I didn't reply to your message about the day ban because I assumed there was another message coming after it, my apologies. I got the particulars of the ticket and I apparently didn't miss any messages after the one about the dayban, which is what I saw on my end- I thought maybe I'd missed something after I was raptured into adminjail, where I waited a couple minutes expecting you to ask me what I was doing or explain how I'd fucked up, but that never came. That was why I wanted to get my side of the whole HoS Molotov incident over to you, because I missed my window to do so before the ban was dropped, and wasn't even 100% on if that was why I was adminjailed until I saw the ban reason.
If possible, I'd like the ban reason to be modified so it doesn't imply I'm someone who's going to go "oh thirty seconds until the ban drops? time to welderbomb" or the like.

[Pumpkin0]

I can accept that. I'll change it to reflect upon the previous note you got recently about similar silicon interactions instead.

[Thranos]

Thank you.

[Timberpoes]

Resolved amicably between the parties. Everything seems fine here on a brief review.