Vote of no Confidence Peanut

[mrmelbert]

viewtopic.php?p=694835

I appreciate that they highlighted all the important parts

[dendydoom]

LOL

[Jacquerel]

This was about a 1 hour long ban which expired (if I am reading correctly) 15 minutes after posting the initial appeal thread.

[Turbonerd]

He wasted this much time on a 1 hour ban lmao.

[dendydoom]

he still hasn't answered the question that was posed multiple times:

why did you choose to shoot them?

if you don't answer that question we don't have enough information to make a ruling, hence why it's upheld, because you've made it impossible to resolve.

goodness gracious...

EDIT: oh my god he (barely) answered it, nevermind what i said. it only took a headmin complaint to get it out of him. good luck getting him to answer any subsequent investigative questions, though!

[Riggle]

1700+ word complaint for an hour ban

[kieth4]

Complaints have a purpose, someone has to watch the watchmen. It's just determining if there is validity or not to the claims that he makes.

[Misdoubtful]

1700+ word complaint for an hour ban

Too many people take this game way too seriously. Its a game smh who cares.

[Tastycasey]

man is digging his heels in so hard he is doing a favor by plowing the fields for future peanuts

[Sightld2]

[Timberpoes]

Let's be real here.

The madlad/madlass/madthey just can't get enough of longform forum posts. All they want is the appeal re-opened and re-decided so that they can do even more minor essays!

And if they want the appeal re-opened so that Kieth and Misdoutbful can come up with their own much nicer way of phrasing things - hell, maybe even overturn the ban and note in its entirety if they take the very short time needed to read his concise posts and dive through the logs to verify facts and information - well, who are we to deny this person their greatest desires?

[dendydoom]

the crux of this whole thing is that they don't like having a note on their account. we should let them know that almost every single admin (headmins included) have notes on their accounts. it's just part of the game and a way to keep track of what you've been told by admins, that's literally it.

even if we accept his FACTS about lag and communication issues, then it would still be worth a note, because what if these FACTUAL lag and communication issues happen regularly? it would shit up the game for everyone and we'd have no formal record of it.

unless the note is inaccurate or misleads admins, there's no reason to remove it. change it to be more accurate based on new information, sure! but the only reason to remove it is if he didn't shoot someone in the back 5 times with incendiary shells, which he did. (see, sinful? I can keep it to 3 paragraphs! i hope you're proud of me!)

[Vekter]

I think he's hoping that he does a long enough complaint that someone just goes "oh my god fuck it" and removes the note.

Anyway this is just a skill issue, he very obviously fucked up.

[Jacquerel]

I can guarantee that this process has given them a much more outsized reputation among the game admins than the note for a one hour ban would have done.

[Super Aggro Crag]

hi

[Epoc]

this guy's a fucking moron

[kinnebian]

can i get a tldr? me no read good.

[WineAllWine]

I find it genuinely hilarious how much time will have been spent on this one hour ban. If 20 people spent the, what, 3 minutes required to read the ban appeal and have thoughts about it we're already in the negative. Now there's an admin complaint which would take I guess 4 mins to read properly? I've already taken at least a couple of minutes typing up this response and you've taken maybe 20 seconds reading it.

My conclusion is this was written by a delighted Reaper, intent on wasting as many of our finite seconds on this planet as possible

[Chadley]

[Kendrickorium]

lol wtf

[WineAllWine]

If I received an appeal/ complain like this I think I would genuinely say "Cool, I didn't read all that, can you surmise your main point in 200 words or fewer please?" We're admins in a 2D space game not lawyers

[conrad]

He died on the hill, was put in a cave, woke up three days later beelined for the same hill and promptly died again.

Like a peanut jesus.

[ekaterina]

Timberpoes screwed up closing the appeal without posting all 3 headmins' votes. That's the extent of the validity I see in a complaint about Timberpoes.

[WineAllWine]

Timberpoes screwed up closing the appeal without posting all 3 headmins' votes. That's the extent of the validity I see in a complaint about Timberpoes.

Power corrupts.
Absolute Power corrupts Absolutely.

I don't think timber has done anything wrong on this case I just want to look clever by quoting someone clever

[Timberpoes]

Good news.

This complaint is now, by both word count and character count, longer than my academic research paper on trade mark law that was published in my University's student research journal; minus abstract and bibliography.

I have been thoroughly unravelled and there is a new King of Timberposting.

[Riggle]

1700+ word complaint for an hour ban

I checked the word count again and it has doubled

[mrmelbert]

can i get a tldr? me no read good.

they went out of their way to highlight the important parts and you still want a tl;dr? jeez...

[mstachife]

TLDR:

I don't have to "work " with the head admin. I present REASONS with FACTS AND LOGS to JUSTIFY my IC actions. I have no desire and never will shape events on a certain way nor make excuses just to please or satisfy certain conditions that weren't even presented to me and EVEN IF THEY WERE, I would completely DISREGARD them. Regards this as a waste of time.

The rest of it was just "rule 1 everyone must be nice to me" over and over again.

[Sightld2]

can i get a tldr? me no read good.

TLDR OF THE TLDR:
He found Timber's tone too aggro. When Xemo and Timber pointed out that his reasons weren't good enough. He thought they were dismissing them entirely and not listening.

And now a slightly more detailed analysis

Ok so, this will include no direct quotes in the interest of keeping it short. Also, he numbers his own arguments weirdly. Mine are one ahead because of this. Also, I'm probably biased as hell.

There are three rules our hero is accusing Timber of breaking, when I reference them below, these are the numbers keyed to them:

• 1.No Attacks/harassment towards players
  2. No threats of banning specific players in public channels.
  3. All posts by admins in FNR should be meaningful and contribute to the discussion

Lets start off Post-TheBibleMelts so we don't have to talk about the ban itself. Our hero in his current state agrees to disagree with Xemo, however finds Timberpoes' interjection and guidance to be unhelpful, insulting and or threatening. One by one:

• 1. Timberpoes asked a guiding question and Instructed our hero not to rely on assumption to answer it. Our hero (ironically) assumes this statement to mean that Timberpoes has already made up his mind and intends to disregard his arguments. Finding them a breach of rule 3.
  
  2. Timber tells him he is responsible for his decisions and that his justifications aren't good enough to bypass the rules. He thought the verbiage with which Timber said this constituted harassment, as well being unhelpful. Citing rules 1&
  
  3. Timber says lagging is not an excuse for excessive friendly fire. Our hero disagrees and thereby calls it a rule 3 violation.
  
  4. Timber used the word "seemed" Implying uncertainty and assumption. A rule 3 violation.
  
  5. Timber says IC disability are not an excuse either. Once again he found the words timber used to be insulting and disagreed. A rule 1 and 3 violation.
  
  6. Again, Timber says something he disagrees with. Rule 3 violation.
  
  7. Timber accuses him of using lag and IC disabilities to bypass his responsibilities to the rules. A rule 1 and 3 violation. Even I agree the language here is a touch hostile.
  
  8. Again, Timber says something he disagrees with. Rule 3 violation.
  
  9. Timber says he would have banned him for a day instead. Our hero takes this to be a threat and it is a rule 2 violation.
  
  10. Timber says that our hero didn't work with him or Xemo. That he wasted everyone's time. Our hero finds this insulting and a rule 1 violation.
  
  11. Timber tells him to think before he acts next time. Rule 1 and 3 violation.
  
  12. Timber is practically begging for him to stop blaming lag or IC disabilities, just so they can wrap the damn appeal up. But our hero finds these valid reasons for his decision making. So he calls this a rule 1 and 3 violation.

His conclusion: Timber's guidance wasn't helpful and was overly condescending/rude. He believes his own reasoning was ignored and/or dismissed unfairly.

[Sightld2]

Xemo's ban can be summarized with: "You are still responsible for your lag and IC disabilties."

Our hero's Complaint can be summarized with: "Firstly, I disagree. Secondly, watch yo tone mf"

[dirk_mcblade]

Ban him for longer next time given that he's going to appeal hella long regardless

[TypicalRig]

Personally Timber replies tl;dr so often that the only way to wean him out of this is to reply with a post of double, no... TRIPLE length every single time he says that. Beat away at the Headmin's weakness or let him perish.

[AsbestosSniffer]

He just...keeps going! And going! And going!

[conrad]

Xemo's ban can be summarized with: "You are still responsible for your lag and IC disabilties."

Our hero's Complaint can be summarized with: "Firstly, I disagree. Secondly, watch yo tone mf"

Honestly, it's basically this.

This entire argument and discussion has nothing to do with with the ban, the note or w/e. It's 'cos he got banned (and incidentally noted) due to fucking up on lag. Every else was objectively put down (the IC disabilities, in this case, and the general lack of awareness as to who was the ghoul). Dude is fixated on the lag 'cos "it's not fair" or smth.

It then escalated 'cos Timber, like anyone in this community, pokes people with a needle when they talk. Which is fine, dude just has membrane thin skin.

This entire complaint is fucking dumb. If someone needs four 19" laptop screens to justify their point, the point isn't very good to begin with, since the person doesn't even know why they think they're right.

Not my problem if you think that was a "thesis". Not surprised that you think it is though.

It's next level Karen energy. Ya ain't gonna topple the ocelot like that son.

[BONERMASTER]

This was about a 1 hour long ban which expired (if I am reading correctly) 15 minutes after posting the initial appeal thread.

"I didn't hear no bell."
- Legendary Ban Appeal Poster


With epic regards
-BONERMASTER

[NoxVS]

Hello, once again, thanks for the heads up. I have changed it quite a bit to be more concisive and listed point by point which conducts were broken, where exactly and why I thought so. Hope it's better now. Apologies

How the fuck do you start with a 1788 word complaint and after editing it down to be more concise end up with 3279 words.

[WineAllWine]

Hello, once again, thanks for the heads up. I have changed it quite a bit to be more concisive and listed point by point which conducts were broken, where exactly and why I thought so. Hope it's better now. Apologies

How the fuck do you start with a 1788 word complaint and after editing it down to be more concise end up with 3279 words.

If I had more time I would have written a shorter peanut

[WineAllWine]

And please don't post another thesis in reply to this if you disagree. My co-headmins are liable to throw themselves off a bridge if that happens.

I burst out laughing at this response

[Lacran]

Timbers behaviour is very self indulgent in appeals. Though I wouldn't say it breaks admin conduct in this example especially as while cringe timber is genuinely trying to help players for the most part.

This dude is refusing to learn. I've played with him and he's a generally bad sec player. I would've preferred the ban be a job ban instead of an hour ban.

He's not going to learn as long as he has the option to argue or fight it I think.

[dendydoom]

when even i think your posts are getting too long you know shit is fucked up.

against my better judgement i read the entire essay.

he's fighting it on the basis of lag because he's under the impression that if he can convince us that these circumstances were totally out of his control, like a lag demon entered his sanctum, shoved him out the way and grabbed his mouse to shoot his fellow sec officer 5 times in the back with incendiary shells, then we'll be obligated to remove the note. unfortunately, we'd still note this. at most it would just include the important context that the player admits to oftentimes experiencing lag which can make gameplay difficult so that we can factor it into any further rulings if this becomes a common occurrence.

his point about not being told what the alternative is also isn't true. he's been told multiple times that he should've examined the heretic and the secoff before gunning them both down, because it would've given him enough information to know that he didn't need to break out the pump action in a blind panic-stricken fury and use it so incompetently that he killed his own comrade instead of the stationary, supine, cuffed and helpless target. you're responsible for the collateral you cause, especially when you can't be bothered to examine the situation properly before using violence.

timber was trying to throw him a bone the entire appeal by spoonfeeding him the exact questions he'd need to answer to have a chance of overturning the note but he was too busy digging his own grave on the smallest hill in the world to notice.

finally, just because someone isn't saying what you want to hear doesn't suddenly mean it's not contributing to the discussion. that's just silly. we're a video game community, not the united nations. we're entitled to a little sassiness every now and then.

[WineAllWine]

Timbers behaviour is very self indulgent in appeals.

I agree with this but honestly I love it. It makes brilliant peanuts and that "ocelot plays with his food" appeal was one of the funniest things to happen on these forums

[conrad]

Timbers behaviour is very self indulgent in appeals.

I agree with this but honestly I love it. It makes brilliant peanuts and that "ocelot plays with his food" appeal was one of the funniest things to happen on these forums

Eh, it's funny until he gets something wrong. I don't like the idea of how much you can bend conduct hinging on how witty you are. He's headmin tho, and all we can do is sit and watch.

I do hope that if he gets a complaint with actual solid ground, he conducts himself accordingly.

I'm saying this because:

Lol

I don't see how this helps anything. If I'm a player and I'm seeing this from an outside perspective, or if I'm a new forumite learning the ropes, kinda comes off like the material from the tusks of elephants.

[Timberpoes]

I cannot take that complaint seriously at this point. There's no way. No how. No chance.

Am I sassy and could I have toned the sassiness down? Sure.

Will I engage seriously with them after they're this Internet outraged? I'm not in that arc. The only response to them after thay latest post was lol.

It says everything that needs to be said about the entire setup to this.

We've gone from ca/tg/irls to /tg/ (touch grass).

There is no de-escalation willpower in me for this person. I tried to guide them through a denied appeal to genuinely help them express the information we needed to do anything at all except deny it.

Now they've burned through enough of my goodwill I'm lolposting them.

[ekaterina]

1. Yes they were. When you're trying to guide someone, you don't use that kind of language or tone, regardless being read fully or not. Words like "shitty", "ignorance", "stubborn" are just not necessary for that purpose. Sentences that implies intentional misconduct, call outs for it being a "waste of time" and ultimatums are also out of place and not required. More examples above on the "thesis".

LOL. Bro really thinks Timberpoes should be forced to put on a fake consumer service smile and treat him with "kid gloves". Why not appreciate the honesty instead?

To be fair, it did seem to me initially as well that Timberpoes was ignoring his arguments on the facts, not addressing them, and just repeating what the banning admin had already said. Complaining about the content could possibly be legitimate. Complaining about Timber's form, though, is lol-worthy. "yOUr ToNE"

[Timberpoes]

Wait, is this a rare hinged ekat post with a balanced and sensible take on both sides?

Damn.

[dirk_mcblade]

Honestly I'd probably be more courteous than timber but I'd definitely be writing less because this debacle is a waste of time. This guy got a whole lot of attention and explanation concerning his case but he's bitchy about politeness for something he's receiving for free. Honestly he's a snowflake.

[Timberpoes]

Also I'm fully aware that I could have tone policed myself way better in the appeal (and this complaint) and if I sincerely apologised they'd probably be sorta okay with that and the complaint would probably go away.

But this is way, way more entertaining as it is now.

[Jacquerel]

Wait, is this a rare hinged ekat post with a balanced and sensible take on both sides?

Surely if nothing else this should be the cue for this guy to pack it in, there is literally no devil's advocate in this thread.

[nickup9]

Goddammit I’m too drunk to read all this bullshit

Jackasses on manuel have 200x times the notes of this guy assuming it’s his first and get along fine

All parties are advised to chill

[Vekter]

You would think that, eventually, he would see that so many people disagree with him and something in his brain would make him go "Wait, am I actually wrong here?".