[i don't know] Biluzao12345 - Chemist/CMO Jobban

[Biluzao123456]

Post Content:
Byond account and character name: Biluzao12345 - Cuban Pete
Banning admin: I don't know
Ban type (What are you banned from?): Chemist and CMO
Ban reason and length: 1 week, as an admin told me.
Time ban was placed (including time zone): I don't know.
Server you were playing when banned (Sybil or Bagil): Terry
Your side of the story: I was a chemist, I was making a syringe that had Stabilized Phlogiston, Black Powder and Napalm. Which would cause my target to burn and ignite the black powder which would blow him up. When I was walking around, and then came back to my lab, the HOS was killing someone inside my lab (which is obviously against space law and his SoP), so I shot him with the syringe to stop that shit, because there was no other way to defend that person except from my syringe. But, the fucking chaplain was in the ground, and I aimed like, behind the HOS, so it should've hit him, not the fucking chaplain (which was in the ground), but the game decided that the chaplain was the fucking target while he wasn't. So while he was burning, he was killing someone, until he blew up, and I healed the person he was killing. And I was banned because I didn't revive him, because I didn't know the "context of the story", so tell me, isn't that against fucking space law? killing someone? isn't that a capital crime, that goes perma and execution? well, I didn't know the context, but I thought the chaplain was just some assholish murderer. Then I got banned for 12 hours for not reviving him, which admin said that I should've, because I didn't know the context of the story. But after my ban was gone, I came back to the server and tried to play as chemist, but for some reason I am fucking jobbanned from CMO and Chemist for 1 fucking week without my knowledge of why.

Why you think you should be unbanned: 1 week is fucking unfair for someone who killed a person that was killing another person, he was KILLING someone, so I saved her and didn't revive him, thought he was a murderer. Just saying, 1 week jobban is fucking stupid and unfair for that reason. Simply stupid, simply unfair.

(Also, I do not remember the name of the admin that jobbanned me, but he will probably answer this appeal.)

[oranges]

Admin in question is gigapuddi420, I'll ask them to look at this.

[Gigapuddi420]

Both bans were applied at the same time. A half-day server ban and a week chemist/CMO ban because you were irresponsible with chemistry tools that resulted in the death of another member of the crew. You openly admitted you accidentally killed the guy, that you had no conflict with them and that you chose not to revive them because you saw them fighting someone you like (but didn't understand why). My main issue here is that you made no effort to fix your mistake after the fact. Accidentally killing them and then choosing not to fix that mistake is the same as choosing to kill them. Next time I recommend you be more careful with lethal syringes and make some effort to rectify a mistake when you kill someone by accident.

I won't be lifting the role ban early. If any headmin wants to come and look at this and lift it then be my guest.

[Biluzao123456]

I don't really killed him because he was killing someone I "like", I didn't even know her, I just felt that, if I shot the chaplain, and he was killing another person while he was dying, he didn't deserve to live if he's gonna live to kill.

Again, it doesn't matter if I don't understand why, he was KILLING someone. Which is against the Space Law. The person he was killing, as I record, was also in the ground, or if not, she was disarmed. So if I shot him by mistake, and then saw him killing another person, I left him to die, as he no longer deserved to live if he was killing another person. The context doesn't matter, he was KILLING a person. You could've told me what was happening, you could've revived him. I'd learn a lesson. But you instead decide to place a ban of a fucking week. I play TG and SS13 a fucking lot, like, every fucking day, and 1 week Chemist jobban is unfair, unfair as a ton of big fuck.

[Gigapuddi420]

Firstly, space-law is irrelevant here, it has no place in rules and only serves as a guideline for security to base their sentences and justice on. This isn't particularly hard to understand; you killed someone unintentionally, as a non-antagonist, while in conflict with security. You are now trying to justify leaving that unintentional victim to die because they too, were fighting someone but you didn't understand why. You are justifying your mistake with 'oh he was probably an asshole so it's ok I accidentally killed him'. I'm telling you it isn't ok and when you kill some uninvolved party during your IC conflict you should at the very least try to rectify that if you want to mitigate your mistake.

A week ban on a role you fucked up on isn't unusual. We give those out to silicons who fail to follow their laws. In this case you as a chemist got into a fight with security, a fight we decided was acceptable in character conflict, and killed someone who wasn't involved. Be more careful with your tools. Engineers who mess up making a bar singularity and kill people by accident get a day serverban for each victim. Usually this is matched with a role ban because they didn't show due diligence. You haven't shown due diligence and fail to understand why killing someone not involved in your conflict is bad. I stand by my decision. Play some other role for a week. There is plenty to do in game.

[iamgoofball]

I aimed like, behind the HOS, so it should've hit him, not the fucking chaplain (which was in the ground), but the game decided that the chaplain was the fucking target while he wasn't.

hey, just want to chime in here, this sounds like it was a literal bug that caused the chaplain to get murdered, projectiles aren't supposed to hit targets that are on the ground unless you outright click them, this was likely a collision issue and something you should yell at Kevin about since he did the recent projectile refactors

i don't really think it's a good idea to make a habit of banning people for bugs, but you're going to deny my post anyways because lol

[Timonk]

I don't think I can 100% say, why the game targeted the chap, but, the HoS is armored and that wouldn't have worked in first place, so maybe it targeted the chap for it?

[zxaber]

I vaguely recall a PR shortly after crawling was added that made people lying down get hit by shots, because there was a meta for a short time where people would just lie down during gunfights to dodge all shots that weren't direct clicks. Positioning isn't really specified, but if the chap was in front of the HoS, they probably would have been hit first. If they were sharing the tile, then who knows? Without actually looking up the code, I could equally believe the target selection is random, or that the order of the code for that PR just happened to make lying people priority for same-tile target selection.

This is neither here nor there for this appeal, though. The bottom line is that the chap died to an action made by Cuban, and Cuban took no effort to clone him or even figure out the story. Though, really, I would also question the whole "attempting to use a death mix on the HoS for beating someone to death" just because they happened to be in your workplace.

[Gigapuddi420]

This is neither here nor there for this appeal, though. The bottom line is that the chap died to an action made by Cuban, and Cuban took no effort to clone him or even figure out the story. Though, really, I would also question the whole "attempting to use a death mix on the HoS for beating someone to death" just because they happened to be in your workplace.

This is my line of thinking. Projectiles have been kind of iffy about people on the ground since the latest projectile PR and mistakes do happen when lead is being fired in the air. I fully believe the death caused here was accidental and it wouldn't have mattered too much if he used buckshot instead of a syringe. The point is that during a person conflict with the Head of Security he killed a uninvolved party then for the rest of the round made no effort to fix that.

[confused rock]

I don't think I can 100% say, why the game targeted the chap, but, the HoS is armored and that wouldn't have worked in first place, so maybe it targeted the chap for it?

Currently people resting are counted as standing up for being hit with projectiles, and only stunned people have them pass over them.

[iamgoofball]

The point is that during a person conflict with the Head of Security he killed a uninvolved party then for the rest of the round made no effort to fix that.

If someone is in the medbay dead as a corpse, it is perfectly normal and safe to assume someone will drag that corpse to the cloning pods.

When "chuck them in medbay/botany for plant reviving" is the normal criteria for "making an attempt to get someone revived" to count as accomplished, if they're already in medbay you'd think it was fine.

[Gigapuddi420]

Low population Terry and he's already one of the medical staff (albeit a chemist) he made quite clear in admin PM and this thread he chose not to try and revive the guy. The same player was still dead much later on a server that typically has two hour long rounds. It stands to reason if you kill innocent bystanders in your IC conflict you should make the effort to see they are revived. He made no effort and chose to write the whole thing off.

Regardless, I don't think we're going to break any new ground here. I'm going to lock this and see if any headmins want to step in.

[Arianya]

There's clearly more wrong in this situation then just the accidental murder and refusal to clone of a chaplain, but I'm not here to judge the player, just to oversee the bans.

This ban seems accurate and in line with others. If you kill someone (accidentally or on purpose!) while being the instigator you must make an effort to get them revived. The reason this rule doesn't spell out what an effort is, is because this will vary wildly depending on context, situation, etc. In this instance I wouldn't accept "leaving their corpse where it fell without so much as dragging them towards cloning" as being an effort. To reiterate, the kill itself wasn't the action that got you banned, it was refusing to even attempt to revive the person after the accidental kill.

This appeal is denied.