/tg/Station 13

Zybwivcz

Given that what's the minimum bar someone has to clear to escalate against SEC? Escalate and kill aren't the same thing here, Escalation has tiers, if the offier is arresting non lethally, you don't have grounds to escalate to lethally unless you have reasonable grounds to assume the arrest is inju...

Zybwivcz

If no-one ever mentions the sentence, who can say it's excessive. An admin, who claims it could have been implied . Also if when asked 'why did you do that to the sec officer' they make no mention of thinking its due to an excessive sentence then they'd better probably add that in the appeal In the...

Zybwivcz

I actually wrote a long winded list of hypotheticals, think i've been answering too many headmin election questions :D As ever the context is the key. The short form is if the tider played absolute best faith, i'd be between noting through to role and even server banning the sec who started it all ...

Zybwivcz

The version you write as "don't deserve to be arrested for" literally means people can tide engi storage and then forcefully resist the 2 minute brig sentence because, in their opinion, they don't deserve to be arrested, at all, for any length of time. The last part is where my concerns a...

Zybwivcz

Shitsec is the murderhobo who ruins the DMs game Exactly, shitsec is the saviour who fights against DM railroading. Like someone who only randomname randomface sec mains so that people can't reliably peg him as a shitter, that barely speaks all round except for the purpose of hunting/pursuing antag...

Zybwivcz

The ban was because you killed the mime for being pulled from brig by a simple mob after they nonharmfully tided in brig. Hey buddy bring it up with the headmins not with me. It was Timberpoes who said it was because the mime must've not understood tramstation brig precisely the same way Timberpoes...

Zybwivcz

add all of these concepts together to one sentence and you have: my guy, all you had to do was not execute the mime just because someone tried to grab them while you were taking them to the brig Timberpoes upheld the ban because the mime wasn't valid. He sez mime wasn't valid because the mime was r...

Zybwivcz

NoxVS wrote: ↑Wed Aug 17, 2022 6:45 am not execute the mime

I understand those words individually but that sentence makes no sense.

Zybwivcz

Some monster closed my ban appeal peanut. It's hard to top that you said more during your ban appeal than you did during your entire in game career but the peanut should have stayed open regardless. When the ban issuing admin has already had two of his actions against you overturned on appeal, admi...

Zybwivcz

the common situation of "I've committed a crime but I don't think it's worth being arrested over" SS13 on TG is an RP game and e.g. breaking into armory, caps office, etc, are all valid arrestable offences. However tickets come up very regularly that show some players simply don't get thi...

Zybwivcz

Some monster closed my ban appeal peanut.

Zybwivcz

That's why I included the phrase "that are also on board with the idea" except I spelled board wrong so that may have been where you got confused. So with a dead antag who can't be questioned SEC is supposed to revive them, and ask if they consent to being borged, and then just re-kill th...

Zybwivcz

But I actually think that goal is the antithesis of SS13. I think the game is at its best if you're not playing optimally and you get your fun from the setting, story and narrative of shifts over mechanical wins like RRing antags. To me, sec borging antags (that are also on baord with the idea) is ...

Zybwivcz

the common situation of "I've committed a crime but I don't think it's worth being arrested over" SS13 on TG is an RP game and e.g. breaking into armory, caps office, etc, are all valid arrestable offences. However tickets come up very regularly that show some players simply don't get thi...

Zybwivcz

In case it is not obvious--"valid arrest" refers to an arrest placed on you when you have not committed a crime. This can easily happen when the security officer is playing in good faith given the dynamics of Space Station 13. It would be nice if this policy covered the common situation o...

Zybwivcz

If a headmin appeal goes unanswered for a week then it should automatically be approved. Or just this one, I don't care.

Is the problem I need to add more detail? Because I can do that.

Zybwivcz

I'm going to stop trying to get the last word in this argument because it is wasting both of our times. Fine. I invoke the ancient ritual of Headmin Review. To summarize: the ban completely ignores the fully justified reason I had to consider the mime a dangerous antag. The reason I acted as I did ...

Zybwivcz

The mime is not allowed to resist a valid arrest , by your own admission they were guilty at an absolute minimum of trespassing into the brig which is a valid reason for arrest. Non-antagonists should not harmfully resist or retaliate against valid arrests, but do not have to simply give up and all...

Zybwivcz

Shellton(Mario) wrote: ↑Tue Jul 19, 2022 6:55 am Just get sec to arrest them and give them time

*bwoink* I notice you arrested an innocent assistant who did nothing wrong can you explain why you're such a monster?

Zybwivcz

So you threaten the Mime with perma-brigging for the crime of trespassing into the Brig and you decide to initiate an arrest. In this process the Mime is still allowed to resist the arrest. The part where it becomse improper is if they start stripping you or physically harming you, which they did n...

Zybwivcz

greenshift btw You say this like it's remotely predictable from the behavior of the usual permashitters. get out of your own peanut you clown I can't post in the appeal thread to say "If you start a fight with SEC and lose and get killed as a result you shouldn't be able to ahelp" until s...

Zybwivcz

I didn't know this at the time but the mime was Lucy Cicero which instantly makes both the self-antagging and the prompt admin interest much clearer. I would post in policy discussion a suggestion to give the sybil metagang special ingame HUD icons so SEC knows who they can actually enforce station ...

Zybwivcz

BYOND account: zybwivcz Character name: Cristopher Power Ban type: Server/Role Ban length: 3 Days/Permanent Ban reason: Executed and stripped an arrested player because an admin spawned mob interferred briefly with their arrest. Killed this player behind brig doors where the mob could no longer rea...

Zybwivcz

RaveRadbury wrote: ↑Mon Jun 06, 2022 1:55 pm Every time I see the appeal update I know I'm in for a good chuckle.

Zybwivcz wrote: ↑Mon Jun 06, 2022 10:19 am I rest my case.
What do you think guys, has he actually rested his case? Will this be his last post in the appeal? I look forward to the thrilling conclusion.

I only stopped posting because they made me.

Zybwivcz

Upon discussing it with the team, we agree to remove the final sentence in the note: "Was talked to and told if they continued this behavior it would likely result in a large ban, hold them to it." The intent of the note is to provide a strong impression and reminder for how you choose to...

Zybwivcz

You were asked to show that the note was factually wrong by providing evidence that you habitually talk with your crewmembers beyond the end-goal of validhunting. You placed a note for "constant validhunting" but you've failed to explain what you consider "validhunting" or provi...

Zybwivcz

I finally figured this out: From Ticket #8 during round 183737 on Sybil Ticket opened at 2022-05-25 01:07:29 by coffeedragon16 Log: 01:07:29: Ticket Opened by-coffeedragon16: hey there, why'd you kill junaiper values? she was cuffed, unarmed and in perma it's ridiculously unfun to do that 01:07:41: ...

Zybwivcz

However, to establish the accuracy of their claim it would require Coffee to go through every single shift in the past month or two and compile a complete dossier on your conduct as a player. Not every single shift. Just one. That's all. A single shift. I'm saying if Coffee wants to give me a note ...

Zybwivcz

show evidence of shifts where you interact with the crew more meaningfully It would help to have a more precise idea of what this means, and what sort of evidence would satisfy you. That's the problem with trying to prove a negative. And if you ask me to show evidence of interacting "more mean...

Zybwivcz

If CoffeeDragon16 thinks I'm "constant[ly] validhunting as security while almost never talking" then it should be trivial for them to note me for that sort of conduct when it actually happens. That's what "constant" means. That something is happening constantly. Especially becaus...

Zybwivcz

That might make sense if the incident which caused CoffeeDragon to bwoink me was "close to breaking Rule 12". It pretty clearly was not. That's my point. It wasn't toeing the line, it wasn't even in the ballpark. Walking into the brig and seeing someone wearing a heretic focus is not valid...

Zybwivcz

From a recent policy discussion thread, "Rule 12 and Security": https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=31248 2) Is security allowed to execute captured antagonists who are at high risk for posing a future threat (e.g., .357 in bag, cult dagger, heretic focus, etc.), but who...

Zybwivcz

Again, it's not rule breaking. It's not adjacent to rule breaking. It's not adjacent to adjacent to rule breaking. It's entirely the expected resolution of finding a heretic. It's normal, acceptable, advisable conduct. Correct. This is not why I gave you the note, and it is not relevant. There was ...

Zybwivcz

As I said in both the ticket and the appeal, the situation with the heretic was not rule-breaking. I was missing information when I ahelped you, and told you this once I realized my mistake. I made the note because of your history as security, and not because of the heretic. Again, it's not rule br...

Zybwivcz

You are misunderstanding what I said here. I said that if you never saw them use the spell, I found that unreasonable, as traitors and changelings still get brigged even though they could have an implant or an armblade. Nobody permabrigs changelings because that would be stupid. When a changeling i...

Zybwivcz

BYOND account: Zybwivcz Character Name: Josh Meyers Ban type: Note Ban length: N/A Round Number: 183740 Time ban was placed: 2022-05-25 02:10:27 Server you were playing on when banned: Sybil Your side of the story: I caught a heretic in the brig, they were wearing one of those eyeball amulets, I st...

Zybwivcz

Some miner brought several gibtonite onto a BYOS shuttle, while trying to pick one up I(engineering SEC officer) used the wrong hand and hit it instead of grabbing it with an empty hand, which started it blinking. I tried to toss it out the door but they had been sealed shut with windows by someone...

Zybwivcz

BYOND account: Zybwivcz Character Name: Jeb Jerome Ban type: Server Ban length: 1 day Ban reason: Detonated gibtonite on the escape shuttle that resulted in a sizeable hole(round id was 183448) Time ban was placed: 2022-05-20- 04:47:32 Server you were playing on when banned: Sybil Round ID in which ...

Zybwivcz

I did not tide and release you because you made it abundantly evident to me that you were going to kill me the moment you got loose. How? Body language? I didn't say anything remember? [2022-05-01 02:52:20.612] SAY: Zybwivcz/(Kolton Fischer) "Brick bad" (Lesser Aft Maintenance (112,72,2))...

Zybwivcz

Zyb, having dove into the logs I have absolutely no clue how any parts of your story line up with the logs so I want you to walk us through what happened. If my reading of the logs is correct, you weren't actually arresting Scriptis (Brick Mortar). You were chasing Shadowflame909 (Owen Kimple) in a...

Zybwivcz

Zyb, can you explain to us why throughout all of this you basically didn't communicate with Brick/Scriptis after you said "brick bad"? I think a fair bit of weight is being placed on the fact that you could have diffused this incident ICly by just explaining what was going on, which prolo...

Zybwivcz

When and where this incident occured (Game Server, forums, Discord): Sybil Byond account and character name OR Discord name: Zybwivcz / Kolton Fischer Admin: AwkwardStereo ROUND ID HERE IF APPLICABLE: 182416 Detailed summary: Start of the round. I'm a SEC officer. I come across Brick Mortar, an engi...

Zybwivcz

Those are the ones. To reiterate my general complaint: An admin giving their permission for someone to be removed from the round is an admin punishment. Admins should not mete out punishment without having a valid reason to do so. Even when they do, they should do their best to communicate to the pu...

Zybwivcz

When and where this incident occured (Game Server, forums, Discord): Sybil Byond account and character name OR Discord name: Zybwivcz / Maddox Ali Admin: AwkwardStereo ROUND ID HERE IF APPLICABLE: 180605 Detailed summary: I was HoS. Station was IceBox. Midway through the round a couple of SEC office...

Zybwivcz

Driven by extreme frustration Yes, you got salty so you killed and then tried to round remove me over it, nobody's contesting that's what happened. At issue is the admin response that a purged silicon being ex-Asimov means it has valids that a silicon that had started out lawless didn't have, which...

Zybwivcz

I think the question can be narrowed down to: Can a purged AI use a lawset-specific grievance for escalation even after it no longer has that law, or does it have to be something that would qualify as a valid reason had it happened to the AI post-purge? To reuse the example from earlier, if an Asimo...

Zybwivcz

From Silicon Policy > Other Lawsets: Rule 4. Purged silicons must not attempt to kill people without cause, but can get as violent as they feel necessary if being attacked, being besieged, or being harassed, as well as if meting out payback for events while shackled Can we get a clarification on wha...

Zybwivcz

My example was about lings; I recently had an admin bitch at me for twenty minutes because as SEC, in a round with lings on the station, I killed a sentient monkey caught breaking into permabrig and then shuttlecrushed it with the gulag shuttle. That's my ling/secpolicy story. Exactly, aside from b...

Zybwivcz

The problem is that when it takes ten seconds or less to break through any door and combat is mostly who stuns/slips who first then anti-tiding your department is a full time job. Engineers can't simultaneously set up the SM and deal with tiders breaking doors to steal gloves and tools, doctors can'...

Zybwivcz

what the fuck are you talking about it's explicit in the rules that you can't dunk sec if they're arresting you for a crime you actually did commit, nobody's proposing to allow greytide to escalate to dunking security when they try to arrest them for stealing the cap's laser, they're talking about ...

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