PR: Adds option to only spawn if antag. #19471

[MrStonedOne]

https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/pull/19471

The idea is to keep antag rollers from taking up job slots

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They can late join in the remaining job slots if they want, or ghost, or whatever.

It will just send you to lobby other wise. (this can and will most likely be changed to ghosting them)

The fact of the matter is, this issue isn't gonna get solved administratively, and the only reason it is even an administrative issue is people stealing job slots. Antag Rollers are always going to exist, and with even the assistant slot being limited, we can't have them taking up job slots.

On top of that, players will also antag roll but not suicide, instead just barely playing thru the motions. I'd rather see those players ghost then bog up the crew manifest and just be unproductive while calling for a shuttle so they can re-roll.

[Lumbermancer]

This seems like a bad idea.

[Cheridan]

Just seems like enabling and encouraging bad behavior.

[Saegrimr]

Now its gonna be REALLY easy to meta the static name fags.

[Davidchan]

Treating a symptom and not the problem.

[MrStonedOne]

The problem is cancer, and i don't have to energy to code chemo.

Sometimes symptom management is the only viable answer.

[oranges]

The answer is we die instead.

[Shaps-cloud]

Terrible, I'd rather have some bored guy go through the motions of of playing as a lawyer (where he still might be engaged with the round later on) than outright support roll for antag or bust shit.

[peoplearestrange]

As I said on the PR, I'd go for the HG option and forcetry it for a week. See what actually happens. at the end of the week we revert whatever happens, even if we decide to keep it we revert and asses.
Rather than just right out deny a change based on massive assumption or oranges deciding that its not how he wants his game to go.

[Drynwyn]

I'm not sure a one-week trial would reveal many of the supposed problems with this- the issue to me is less with the short-term effects of players turning the option on; and more with the long-term effects of legitimizing playing only when you get to be an antagonist. Those wouldn't really be apparent in a one week trial.

[Shaps-cloud]

Not everything needs to be test trialed, if people don't want to play as non-antag I'd rather they roll and kill themselves so we can see it rather than them silently backing out

[Lumbermancer]

Shaps is right. This is just legitimizing the cancer.

If someone doesn't give a fuck about game and community, and plays only for the masturbatory satisfaction of ruining fun for others, why should yu cater to them?

[Steelpoint]

This is a poor idea. If you want a roll of the dice to be a antagonist you should accept you may end up not getting the role.

[peoplearestrange]

Not everything needs to be test trialed, if people don't want to play as non-antag I'd rather they roll and kill themselves so we can see it rather than them silently backing out

Hmmm, fair, but we can't simply all deny any alternative solution to this problem. People are very quick to jump on the "lets not change" band wagon, which can be intimidating for anyone even suggesting a new idea.

However I can agree that it will probably only further the mindset of antag or nothing.

[Gamarr]

Awful idea, it's enabling a bad problem. There is some etiquette regarding people who faff off on the job but this is relegated to very few positions, such as engineering. It would be nice to have a fix, but this is not it. This is not a problem we can fix by code either imo.

If someone is doing this in a shitty job, I want to see who these fucks are. If they are doing it and are in an important job, then you try to change that situation (by doing it) or by policy (non-engineering job you feel important being wasted by this? Bring it up and get admins to look at it).

[Wyzack]

All this does is legitimize behavior that we have rightfully banned for in the past. This would also enforce the meta of people that you know are always an antag. If no one plays crew roles as a non antag then what separates us from traitor deathmatch?

[Alex Crimson]

If you have been banning people for it then make it a separate rule so people know not to do it. Right now you are just banning people under rule 1.

[Shaps-cloud]

I refuse to think that our playerbase is dumb enough to think that it's okay or sustainable for no one to play unless they were antag, this doesn't need a specific rule

[MMMiracles]

I refuse to think that our playerbase is dumb enough to think that it's okay or sustainable for no one to play unless they were antag, this doesn't need a specific rule

I think you need to lower your standards.

[paprika]

I refuse to think that our playerbase is dumb enough to think that it's okay or sustainable for no one to play unless they were antag, this doesn't need a specific rule

I think you need to lower your standards.

this, shaps you are like a sweet puppy

[ShadowDimentio]

Shaps is right and this is a bad idea

[Shaps-cloud]

I refuse to think that our playerbase is dumb enough to think that it's okay or sustainable for no one to play unless they were antag, this doesn't need a specific rule

I think you need to lower your standards.

this, shaps you are like a sweet puppy

It's the exact opposite, I think its much more likely that people are going to ignore the very clear rules for their own benefit and then do a 180 when they get caught and complain "OH WELL I NEVER KNEW IT WAS A BAD THING". I think it's orders of magnitude more likely that someone would be malicious and lie about not understanding the concept of taking turns than truly not getting it, as hilarious as pretending the issue is that "everyone but me is dumb!" is

[Wyzack]

Guys it is the ultimate honeypot. Merge the PR and then ban anyone who enables it to purge the shitters from our midst

[Aloraydrel]

>being so burnt out you can't play the game unless you have antag

Hmm...

[TehSteveo]

Guys it is the ultimate honeypot. Merge the PR and then ban anyone who enables it to purge the shitters from our midst

We then ban the server till all that remains is Reed Glover.

[Jacough]

Better idea, just antag ban people who constantly suicide/quit if they don't get antag. Maybe implement some way to track if someone dies/suicides regularly in the first ten minutes of the round so admins can weed out who's doing it. If you can't be bothered to play the game unless you're allowed to murder indiscriminately go find another server where that's allowed or play a different game.

[TehSteveo]

Better idea, just antag ban people who constantly suicide/quit if they don't get antag. Maybe implement some way to track if someone dies/suicides regularly in the first ten minutes of the round so admins can weed out who's doing it. If you can't be bothered to play the game unless you're allowed to murder indiscriminately go find another server where that's allowed or play a different game.

We actually do get a log of deaths for the beginning of the round, so we can see who suicides right at roundstart.

[Davidchan]

Anyway to have that suicide log flag players who suicide alot, so it tracks what rounds they are playing (and if they have antag status when not suiciding)