Locked Nukeop Hardsuits

[PKPenguin321]

Bottom post of the previous page:

This thread is turning into a screaming match about explosive implants, which isn't the point. The point is that locked op hardsuits have managed to nerf both the ops (can't heal others, very helpful in combat) and the crew (can't fight back). What was wrong with implants with a TC cost? If not enough people were using them, lower the TC cost -- traitor won't be affected much as it is only useful there for DIE A GLORIOUS DEATH or creative traitoring.

The main issue is that without hardsuit locking, the ops don't have anything to completely deny the crew their gear, unless they spend 20-25 TC. This effectively nerfs ops by giving them less tc at roundstart (unless they want to pass up on buying implants and lose almost guaranteed).

[lumipharon]

Because no matter how cheap you make it, the implant is still ony useful when you're defeated. Therefore anything else is a better use of your TC's, since they help you win.

Paying tc's planning to lose vs paying tc's planning to win.

Implants are relevent to the OP because the hardsuit problem only arose because they no longer have implants, thus had to make their hardsuits unremovable (which doesn't actually work).

Also Cheri no one is saying your opinion is worth less then anyone elses.
The difference?

There is a hell of a lot of people that disagree with you, and very few people that agree with you.

[Amelius]

Removing locked hardsuits was a needed change, but this doesn't fix the core problem that you are in denial about.

No one will EVER buy explosive implants because they cost TC. TC is your lifeblood, and the only reason you'd ever buy an implant, is if you're planning on having your team die (similar to how you'd never buy one as a traitor - you're effectively planning your own death). Otherwise, it's rationally ALWAYS better to spend your TC on equipment to help everyone survive.

Your central concern is that nuke op teams would pressure each other into injecting themselves with explosive implants, why is that a fucking concern in the first place? It entails that everyone on the team would believe that it's a good idea and can back it up, so you're effectively aquiescing that you know explosive implants are exclusively a beneficial instrument for the operatives. If they're exclusively a beneficial instrument by your own charge, then how can you justify removing a crucial given, from an antag with a sub-25% winrate, when it was never a concern for anyone but yourself? As others have said, that may as well be a flat 20 TC nerf if you wanted explosive implants, or a straight nerf with no replacement, by your own admission. You claim it's for roleplaying purposes, but I have yet to see anyone, crew and op alike, bother roleplaying in an op round, or, in the latter case, cloning and/or not killing an operative in any circumstance.

In other words, you're delusional, just like Pap. You're even acting like him by disregarding the thread, and acting like a child, entailing that your own opinion outweighs that of the entire community. Your change is shit, and your attitude is shit.

[Not-Dorsidarf]

Removing locked hardsuits was a needed change, but this doesn't fix the core problem that you are in denial about.

No one will EVER buy explosive implants because they cost TC. TC is your lifeblood, and the only reason you'd ever buy an implant, is if you're planning on having your team die (similar to how you'd never buy one as a traitor - you're effectively planning your own death). Otherwise, it's rationally ALWAYS better to spend your TC on equipment to help everyone survive.

Your central concern is that nuke op teams would pressure each other into injecting themselves with explosive implants, why is that a fucking concern in the first place? It entails that everyone on the team would believe that it's a good idea and can back it up, so you're effectively aquiescing that you know explosive implants are exclusively a beneficial instrument for the operatives. If they're exclusively a beneficial instrument by your own charge, then how can you justify removing a crucial given, from an antag with a sub-25% winrate, when it was never a concern for anyone but yourself? As others have said, that may as well be a flat 20 TC nerf if you wanted explosive implants, or a straight nerf with no replacement, by your own admission. You claim it's for roleplaying purposes, but I have yet to see anyone, crew and op alike, bother roleplaying in an op round, or, in the latter case, cloning and/or not killing an operative in any circumstance.

In other words, you're delusional, just like Pap. You're even acting like him by disregarding the thread, and acting like a child, entailing that your own opinion outweighs that of the entire community Almost every single person in this thread and contacted in OOC. Your change is shit, and your attitude is shit.

It's important to avoid hyperbole. Otherwise people can latch onto 1-line quotes for their arguments.

[Amelius]

So, why was this thread silently locked in the first place?

[Scones]

>cheridan not replying to the 'community feedback PR' anymore

[Steelpoint]

I tend to operate on the ideology of not attributing to malice what can equally be attributed to stupidity. However in this case its clear that Cheridan is simply avoiding the issue because he know's he's in the wrong/minority, either that or he simply really believes that his ideology is really true and everyone else is wrong or deluded.

[oranges]

>treat cheridan like shit

>why don't you listen to me anymore

Should've got a coderbus prime subscription losers.

[Steelpoint]

To be fair oranges what else did you expect? This change has been detested and disliked by a majority of people with a very flimsy justification of why it was implemented, not to mention that its very dubious as to if the change actually 'fixed' the issue it was attempting to resolve.

Now the only indication of anything being allowed/done to (months after the fact) fix the issue is a minor change that does not even address the core complaint of the playerbase, as well as a statement that another person is possibly going to do something with the explosive implants at a future date.

[lumipharon]

I'm not really sure what relevence goof's change to explosive implants (whatever that maybe) is.

Explosive implants need to gib the person they're implanted in.
Anything else is purely of secondary concern.

[CPTANT]

>treat cheridan like shit

>why don't you listen to me anymore

Should've got a coderbus prime subscription losers.

Seriously, stop acting like its completely normal to ignore the entire playerbase because some people talk shit. There is MORE than enough constructive talk on why this should be reverted and the old explosive implants be reintroduced.

[RG4]

>treat cheridan like shit

>why don't you listen to me anymore

Should've got a coderbus prime subscription losers.

Not to sound like an asshole here, but what does ignoring a fairly reasonable argument against you(Cheri), get you?

The only real people who treated him like shit were probably OMR and Bomb, but they had their points in their anger no doubt. Abit hostile but what's a way to actually drive your damned point across against a codebase that is notoriously known amongst /tg/ players(maybe outside of /tg/ too) to be amazing stubborn? I've said this argument many,many,many times.

What give the coders rights to decide what the playerbase wants?
If the players want a change reverted and you have replies from veteran players and regulars, then you suck it up and revert it. No bitching, no moaning over the codebase being shit and you avoid most these hostile arguments. Defending your reasoning which is perfectly fine, but when there are counter points to the argument then it shouldn't be allowed to stick around, Mr.Person did this is a spectacular fashion if you remember.

His space change was good, but nobody likes that he gimped space movement so harshly for the sake of realism or nuke ops getting lost.It was a non-issue to "fix" and it did anger a decent amount of players too, just like this. Which ever it was nobody likes that space was slow because it servilely gimped who could fuck around in space. So when players new and old began providing arguments against why the space movement should go back to it's original values. Mr.Person himself told people to go off and fix it themselves if they want to change it back so bad. Cheridan is essentially doing the same thing and is becoming Paprika 2 when he gets so upset that valid criticism is being presented to something he believed was a good idea. It's reasonable to get upset of it, but Jesus fucking Christ the more he acts like a whiny asshole, putting his fingers in his ears yelling, "La-la-la-la-la not listening! La-la-la-la!" the more the players seem him as another paprika.

[Not-Dorsidarf]

I have a coderbus prime subscription, where's my attention.

[Bombadil]

Whatever happened to Tunguska implants or shit like that. I really want to see explosive implants back in action. Were pr's immediately deleted or some shit

[John_Oxford]

[Bombadil]

I waited for PR's to be put up to reimplement explosive implants no one did it after the freeze so I revived this thread

[Bombadil]

I waited for PR's to be put up to reimplement explosive implants no one did it after the freeze so I revived this thread

https://github.com/tgstation/-tg-station/pull/9510

Funnily enough this got merged an hour before I revived this ancient thread.


So now hardsuits are removable and implants cost 4 tc.


So now if you want to prevent gear from getting in the hands of nanotrasen employees thats 20 tc just fucking gone in the wind

[Steelpoint]

20 TC Ops can ill afford. Ops have a hard enough time affording standard equipment for everyone already let alone the TC's for explosive implants.

[John_Oxford]

Bump that shit up to 50?

EDIT:

Obviously moving dangerous shit
(See: Maurauder, Syndi Borg, L6)
Obviously making dangerous shit more expensive to scale up with it
IE: Maurader is now 150 TC.
L6 is now 75
Syndiborg is 100
Syndi Gygax is now 125


EDIT 2.0:

Syndis now spawn with implants on round start, robust syndies will detonate before their 50 TC worth of gear is stripped from them.
If you are stupid enough/slow enough/not robust enough to not *deathgasp the second you are stunned.
Your syndicate team deserves to get shot with their own tech.

[iamgoofball]

https://github.com/tgstation/-tg-station/pull/10117

this is relevant

[NoahGoldFox]

Now what are they? Guy's who's hardsuits are 2 sizes too small and who can CHOOSE to roleplay as a dedicated syndicate operative if they FEEL LIKE IT? Why not add fucking clown horns, furry suits, dragon dildos, and goddamn latex spacesuits so we can let ensure that EVERY PLAYERS GET TO ROLEPLAY NUKEOPS IN THEIR OWN SPECIAL WAY. [/b]

That would be awsome ;3

[Shaps-cloud]

Did you search the entire forum for anything that mentions furries just so you could necro it

[Saegrimr]

Really, Noah?

[John_Oxford]

[Zilenan91]

DELETE THIS

[John_Oxford]

EDIT: Everyone knows its only acceptable to post 4chan relevant memes on a private board on a 4 month old necro'd post.