Make the Detective a full officer
- iamgoofball
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- Github Username: Iamgoofball
Make the Detective a full officer
quite frankly "detective isn't an officer" stops being a thing about 1 nanosecond into the round because
1. sec officers never follow up on your leads
2. sec officers will never come help you with arrests
3. if you want to have any fun as detective you have to break the rules and play detective as a security officer
1. sec officers never follow up on your leads
2. sec officers will never come help you with arrests
3. if you want to have any fun as detective you have to break the rules and play detective as a security officer
- Mothblocks
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2018 9:33 am
- Byond Username: Jaredfogle
Re: Make the Detective a full officer
Can you elaborate more on what you mean WRT policy? The word "detective" doesn't come up once in security policy.
Head Coder of /tg/station, hi!Shaps-cloud wrote: ↑Mon Dec 07, 2020 7:59 am May eventually become one of the illusive maintainer-headmins if they choose to pursue that path, having a coder in the senior admin leadership has usually been positive for both sides in the past.
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- iamgoofball
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Re: Make the Detective a full officer
i'm pretty sure that admins enforce including on LRP that the detective is not allowed to make arrests if there's a reasonable way to get security officers to do so
- AwkwardStereo
- Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2021 8:24 am
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Re: Make the Detective a full officer
I don't think I've seen anyone ahelp being arrested by the detective and no admins on Sybil that I've seen have bwoinked a detective for doing so either.iamgoofball wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 6:20 am i'm pretty sure that admins enforce including on LRP that the detective is not allowed to make arrests if there's a reasonable way to get security officers to do so
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- sinfulbliss
- Joined: Thu Apr 04, 2019 8:53 am
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- Location: prisoner re-education chamber
Re: Make the Detective a full officer
You should set the person who you're investigating to arrest and include a reason with your findings, that way officers see the red W and will absolutely followup.iamgoofball wrote:1. sec officers never follow up on your leads
Detective has a baton and can easily acquire cuffs. If you really wanted to arrest someone it wouldn't be much harder than it is for an officer to do it.iamgoofball wrote:2. sec officers will never come help you with arrests
This is definitely false.iamgoofball wrote:i'm pretty sure that admins enforce including on LRP that the detective is not allowed to make arrests if there's a reasonable way to get security officers to do so
Making det a full officer would just make it officer + wooden baton + revolver, and it'd be even less distinct as its own role.
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- NamelessFairy
- In-Game Game Master
- Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2020 8:40 pm
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Re: Make the Detective a full officer
This isn't true, on the standard ruleset there is no rule or policy mandating that only security can detain people. You appear to be confusing the roleplay rule 10 with the standard ruleset which is not applicable on our standard servers. I also personally don't think forbids detectives from making arrests on our roleplay servers if the situation calls for it but obligatory "I'm not a MRP admin".iamgoofball wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 6:20 am i'm pretty sure that admins enforce including on LRP that the detective is not allowed to make arrests if there's a reasonable way to get security officers to do so
Anyways as for the main policy you are discussing. Point 1 and 2 are not things that can be solved with rule changes, your suggestion of making them "full security" would also not solve these.
Point 3 appears to be based on incorrect assumptions. You can have fun as a detective without breaking rules, else nobody would ever play detective, the rulebreak that you are insinuating also doesn't exist as we have no rules against detectives acting as security.
I'd also like to echo Mothblocks request again.
What actual policy changes are you trying to make, making the detective a "full officer" doesn't seem to imply any rule or config changes.Mothblocks wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 6:13 am Can you elaborate more on what you mean WRT policy? The word "detective" doesn't come up once in security policy.
- Farquaar
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- Location: Delta Quadrant
Re: Make the Detective a full officer
It might not be policy, but I think clarification would be nice. Years ago on Sybil (well before Manuel was a thing), I recall a rather unpleasant round where I needed help to arrest someone as sec. Security was understaffed, so I asked the detective to help and was met with "I'm a detective. I don't arrest people. GLHF". Ended up getting murdered when the perp's metafriends ganked me. Not sure if the admin follow-up ended with any bans/notes, but the whole situation would have been avoided if said detective wasn't under the impression that participating in arrests was outside the scope of his duties.NamelessFairy wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 9:03 am This isn't true, on the standard ruleset there is no rule or policy mandating that only security can detain people. You appear to be confusing the roleplay rule 10 with the standard ruleset which is not applicable on our standard servers. I also personally don't think forbids detectives from making arrests on our roleplay servers if the situation calls for it but obligatory "I'm not a MRP admin".
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- Helios
- Joined: Mon May 05, 2014 5:07 pm
- Byond Username: Shodansbreak
Re: Make the Detective a full officer
I always enjoyed Detective being a unique role, like Warden.
Detective has a unique sidearm, and a unique tool, the fingerprint scanner. Detective used to start with thermals, and on some servers had the chance of being round-start antags.
Detectives are different. They should be treated as such.
Them not having full access to sec can be annoying, and that would be arguable on a map by map basis.
Detective has a unique sidearm, and a unique tool, the fingerprint scanner. Detective used to start with thermals, and on some servers had the chance of being round-start antags.
Detectives are different. They should be treated as such.
Them not having full access to sec can be annoying, and that would be arguable on a map by map basis.
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Re: Make the Detective a full officer
I just don't agree with your assessment Goof, Detective is the only security role that I play because it isn't a sec officer. If I am watching the cams and I see something, radio it in, If we have other sec they are going to check into it.
- sinfulbliss
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- Location: prisoner re-education chamber
Re: Make the Detective a full officer
Clarification on what?? "Yes, roleplay rule 10 only applies to roleplay servers"? There's nothing to clarify.Farquaar wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 9:19 am It might not be policy, but I think clarification would be nice. Years ago on Sybil (well before Manuel was a thing), I recall a rather unpleasant round where I needed help to arrest someone as sec. Security was understaffed, so I asked the detective to help and was met with "I'm a detective. I don't arrest people. GLHF". Ended up getting murdered when the perp's metafriends ganked me. Not sure if the admin follow-up ended with any bans/notes, but the whole situation would have been avoided if said detective wasn't under the impression that participating in arrests was outside the scope of his duties.
Detectives can choose to play however they want. You'll get people mad at you for treating it like sec officer + gun, and you'll also get people mad at you for butting-out and only doing investigative work. I don't think that detective years ago was under any "impression" a headmin ruling would solve, they were just playing the role as they viewed it.
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- CMDR_Gungnir
- Joined: Tue May 04, 2021 11:11 am
- Byond Username: CMDR Gungnir
Re: Make the Detective a full officer
Detective should absolutely not be a full officer and if anything the policy around it should be restricted further. What's the point of having Detective be a different role if it's just Sec Off With A Revolver?
And it's a role that offers so much actual variety, that to just absorb it into standard SecOff would be an absolute waste of it. If you want to be an Officer, play Officer.
And it's a role that offers so much actual variety, that to just absorb it into standard SecOff would be an absolute waste of it. If you want to be an Officer, play Officer.
- Pandarsenic
- Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 11:56 pm
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- Location: AI Upload
Re: Make the Detective a full officer
It mostly just has a reputation for Cowboy Cop Detectives, sometimes with the revolver modified for .357, shooting people until decapitation as their "arrest"iamgoofball wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 6:20 am i'm pretty sure that admins enforce including on LRP that the detective is not allowed to make arrests if there's a reasonable way to get security officers to do so
(2:53:35 AM) scaredofshadows: how about head of robutts
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Re: Make the Detective a full officer
Have you actually seen any admin enforce this?iamgoofball wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 6:20 am i'm pretty sure that admins enforce including on LRP that the detective is not allowed to make arrests if there's a reasonable way to get security officers to do so
I've never seen any admin give a shit on LRP about the detective arresting people unless he's using excessive force and never made a distinction between him and any other member of security
- Mothblocks
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- Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2018 9:33 am
- Byond Username: Jaredfogle
Re: Make the Detective a full officer
I don't see any strong policy this is pointing at removing, and I've never seen the issues of admins forbidding detectives arresting, so I'm just going to close this thread now unless another headmin wants it lifted.
Head Coder of /tg/station, hi!Shaps-cloud wrote: ↑Mon Dec 07, 2020 7:59 am May eventually become one of the illusive maintainer-headmins if they choose to pursue that path, having a coder in the senior admin leadership has usually been positive for both sides in the past.
Head Admin of /tg/station Feb 2022.
Mothblocks everywhere, >>> Say nice things about me <<<
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